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Max Pacioretty and the Search for a Superstar

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Old
07-17-2012, 04:14 PM
  #26
Agnostic
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Always believed in pacioretty. I hope Eller will follow in a similar journey of adding strength and confidence.

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07-17-2012, 04:24 PM
  #27
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He's turned into my favorite Habs player. Not just for his talent and playing style but for his attitude on and off the ice. You build championship teams around players like this.. Good for you Max. Good for us too...

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07-17-2012, 04:28 PM
  #28
Estimated_Prophet
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Very good article!

The only thing that bothered me is the often incorrectly used term, "superstar"

He will not be a superstar, not because he won't be very good but because the term superstar refers to players who are stars relative to other stars........the truly elite.

Anyways, enough of my whining, well done!

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07-17-2012, 04:31 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Very good article!

The only thing that bothered me is the often incorrectly used term, "superstar"

He will not be a superstar, not because he won't be very good but because the term superstar refers to players who are stars relative to other stars........the truly elite.

Anyways, enough of my whining, well done!
I hear you . Habs last superstar was Patrick , and I don't mean Poulin.

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Old
07-17-2012, 04:36 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anguscertified View Post
Hey Habs fans,

Wrote a column on Pacioretty that was published yesterday. Probably not a ton of new information to you, but I took a look at both the qualitative and quantitative. Got some quotes from a few Habs bloggers, too.

Hope you enjoy:

http://thehockeywriters.com/overtime...r-a-superstar/
What does "Corsi" mean

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Old
07-17-2012, 04:43 PM
  #31
Estimated_Prophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
I hear you . Habs last superstar was Patrick , and I don't mean Poulin.
Exactly!

Price and Galchenyuk are the only two with superstar potential in the organization. Subban has a very remote chance but will have to learn to think the game at a much higher level.

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07-17-2012, 05:02 PM
  #32
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I'm happy with my Patches Jersey I had since the centenial

Every one was laughing at me.

Now who's laughing ?

I'm doing the same for Eller and Leblanc now.

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Old
07-17-2012, 05:12 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by NHL12refrigerator View Post
What does "Corsi" mean
Essentially +/- for shots directed towards the net. In advanced hockey stats its used as a proxy for puck possession and a way to measure play with finer detail than you can with simple goal measurements.

Pacioretty is dominant by shot based/puck possession metrics.

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Old
07-17-2012, 05:15 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Beaker View Post
Pacioretty is one of the few bright spots on our team. With the work ethic he has, the attitude, and the skill, I don't see how he won't hit 40 goals at least once during his tenure with us.
few bright spots?


Pacioretty, Subban, Price, Galchenyuk, lol even if there is a lockout its lottery again for us



think positive, dude.

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07-17-2012, 05:32 PM
  #35
Vi Nc E x13x
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Originally Posted by Rscorpio View Post
few bright spots?


Pacioretty, Subban, Price, Galchenyuk, lol even if there is a lockout its lottery again for us



think positive, dude.
If there is a lockout how does the lottery work?

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Old
07-17-2012, 05:57 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
I hear you . Habs last superstar was Patrick , and I don't mean Poulin.
You must mean Traverse!

Pacioretty isn't a superstar, nor do I think he will be.. But he's a damn good first-line forward today and going forward IMO.

I firmly believe he has the potential to put up 70pt+ seasons if the team does better and he gets even more ice time.

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07-17-2012, 06:23 PM
  #37
anguscertified
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NHL12refrigerator View Post
What does "Corsi" mean

http://www.fiveholefanatics.ca/2010/02/on-corsi.html

Quote:
What it is

Let's start with a simple definition. "Corsi" is the difference between all shots directed at net for and against at even strength. That is (shots+blocked shots+goals+missed shots FOR - SH+BLK+G+MS AGAINST). The purpose of the stat is to determine possession. It is, in fact, a proxy for "zone time". A positive corsi rate = more offensive zone time. Negative = more defensive zone time.

Here's an analogy that might help. Let's say a hockey game is a tug of war. Corsi is the how far right or left of center the rope is. On an individual level, it's an expression of which players are really pulling the rope. Therefore, if your team has a positive corsi rate, it means they are spending more time in the offensive zone at even stregth. It means they are pulling the rope harder than the opposition.

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Old
07-17-2012, 06:26 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Exactly!

Price and Galchenyuk are the only two with superstar potential in the organization. Subban has a very remote chance but will have to learn to think the game at a much higher level.
Subban and Pacioretty can be high level players as well. ''Stars'', maybe not ''Superstars''. Then again its mostly a question of definition. For some people ''superstar'' means top tier NHLers in which case Pacioretty&Subban are definitely part of. For others ''superstar'' is reserved for the likes of Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos and Ovechkin on a good year.

Anyways Pacioretty is good enough that he's part of the core of players we need to build the team around.

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07-17-2012, 07:08 PM
  #39
Estimated_Prophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Subban and Pacioretty can be high level players as well. ''Stars'', maybe not ''Superstars''. Then again its mostly a question of definition. For some people ''superstar'' means top tier NHLers in which case Pacioretty&Subban are definitely part of. For others ''superstar'' is reserved for the likes of Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos and Ovechkin on a good year.

Anyways Pacioretty is good enough that he's part of the core of players we need to build the team around.
This is not a matter of opinion, those people are just wrong.

There are stars and superstars......they are not the same. The term "superstar" has become a staple of fanboy hyperbole. The use of the word "super" as a prefix to "star" infers that a superstar is greater than a star.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion just as they are entitled to be wrong.

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07-17-2012, 07:33 PM
  #40
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Wow, funny reading my old posts doubting him...


I think he's good for 40 goals with a good centre. The numbers he put up last season are unreal considering the circumstances.

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Old
07-17-2012, 08:42 PM
  #41
Madam Kadri
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One thing about Pacioretty is his "compatibility". He has gone through three centers and have not had any "chemistry" issues with Gomez, Pleks, or DD. In fact, he might be Gomez's only savior. You won't see this on the stat sheet, but sometimes wingers can't handle a different center(i.e Kostitsyn-Gomez).

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07-17-2012, 08:49 PM
  #42
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Oh, and I can see an offensive juggernaut forming here in Montreal in the future for Montreal. Pacioretty being a Rocket Richard Trophy candidate is not out of the question as long as his feeder is an elite one(DD or Galchenyuk) and he doesn't get another BS suspension.

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07-17-2012, 08:56 PM
  #43
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Lol, the terms star and superstar refer to a player's marketability, not his skill level.

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07-17-2012, 10:17 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
This is not a matter of opinion, those people are just wrong.

There are stars and superstars......they are not the same. The term "superstar" has become a staple of fanboy hyperbole. The use of the word "super" as a prefix to "star" infers that a superstar is greater than a star.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion just as they are entitled to be wrong.
well aren't you semantically belligerent today?

on topic: pacioretty is EXACTLY the reason why eller will never be more than a third line center and palushaj will never make it in the NHL.

no sir

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07-17-2012, 10:56 PM
  #45
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LOL @ FotS

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Old
07-18-2012, 02:52 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Vi Nc E x13x View Post
If there is a lockout how does the lottery work?
Not like the guy you replied to obviously thinks. Although technically he's right as all teams would be involved in a lottery if the same method as last time was used. Last time Habs had one ball in the lottery out of 48 balls total and would have one ball again this time if there was a lock out and the same method was used (start with three balls, lose one for every playoff appearance in the last three years or number one overall pick in the last four years to minimum of one). Can't be bothered to work out exactly what every team would have, but on that basis for example, off the top of my head Toronto would have three balls, Edmonton wouldhave one (but no doubt still win the lottery )

Pittsburgh were advantaged last time by losing the lottery when finishing last in 2004. By having the second pick (and consolation prize of Evgeni Malkin) in 2004 that meant they had three balls in 2005 rather then the two they would have had with the first overall in 2004. They won the lottery to pick Sydney Crosby.


Last edited by Corncob: 07-18-2012 at 03:04 AM.
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Old
07-18-2012, 06:36 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by All-Star View Post
Lol, the terms star and superstar refer to a player's marketability, not his skill level.
That makes no sense. It's called hockey not marketing. I think Pac is definitely a star on our offense, but I will reserve the term superstars to players like Stamkos, etc.

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07-18-2012, 07:58 AM
  #48
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That makes no sense. It's called hockey not marketing. I think Pac is definitely a star on our offense, but I will reserve the term superstars to players like Stamkos, etc.
You use terms like generational talent, top line left wing, etc to describe talent, you use star to describe the level of a player's mass appeal (drawing power).

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07-18-2012, 08:02 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by All-Star View Post
You use terms like generational talent, top line left wing, etc to describe talent, you use star to describe the level of a player's mass appeal (drawing power).
Well I never really thought of it that way, but interesting point of view none the less. I'll keep it in mind but I don't know if ultimately I can get used to that theory. The generational tag is the ultimate compliment to an athlete, reserved for the Gretzki's and Rocket's of this world, I'm not even sure Crosby is one.

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07-18-2012, 10:53 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Very good article!

The only thing that bothered me is the often incorrectly used term, "superstar"

He will not be a superstar, not because he won't be very good but because the term superstar refers to players who are stars relative to other stars........the truly elite.

Anyways, enough of my whining, well done!
He's not a superstar, but if Evander Kane is referred as a superstar, then I think Patches is in his class

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