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The MLD 2012 Thread I

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Old
07-19-2012, 10:59 PM
  #276
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
I didn't know players needed individual trophies at the MLD level to be considered good picks. And team accomplishments? Since when has that had much more than minimal bearing on a player's all-time status?
I'm talking about offsetting factors that might justify drafting a guy who has played just a 3.5 year career, only two of which are significant. For example, in his third year, Crosby was a MLD pick.

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07-19-2012, 10:59 PM
  #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Oh! If we apply that to players from other eras, man some great short careers just seem twice as long! Hell, even my MacDougall pick isn't just a 5-year top scorer in the top league of his time, add in all those Stanley Cup goals he scored and I guess you could say he had a 8 or 9 year equivalent great career!
I'm not adding years to his resume.

It's a recognition that he hit star status in the 2010 playoffs and rather than being a fluke, maintained star status into the next 2 seasons.

His 2010 playoffs were good enough not to completely dismiss the season, IMO.

Even so, 2 seasons and change of relevance is pretty thin

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:01 PM
  #278
Dwight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
I'm talking about offsetting factors that might justify drafting a guy who has played just a 3.5 year career, only two of which are significant. For example, in his third year, Crosby was a MLD pick.
So is Giroux, so its cool.

EDIT: Actually, you're wrong. Crosby was an ATD pick in his 3rd year (2008).

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:07 PM
  #279
VanIslander
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Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
So is Giroux, so its cool.
ARE YOU KIDDING?

Giroux does not compare to Crosby in terms of the staret of his career. Here is what a Crosby pick in the MLD could boast after his first two years:

Youngest player to record 100 points in a season (18 years, 253 days) [34]
Youngest player to record 200 career points (19 years and 207 days)[101]
Youngest player to record 2 consecutive 100 point seasons (19 years, 215 days).[102]
Youngest player voted to the starting lineup in an All-Star Game[103]
Youngest Art Ross Trophy and Lester B. Pearson Award winner[6][43]
Youngest player to be named to the First All-Star Team[45]

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:12 PM
  #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
ARE YOU KIDDING?

Giroux does not compare to Crosby in terms of the staret of his career. Here is what a Crosby pick in the MLD could boast after his first two years:

Youngest player to record 100 points in a season (18 years, 253 days) [34]
Youngest player to record 200 career points (19 years and 207 days)[101]
Youngest player to record 2 consecutive 100 point seasons (19 years, 215 days).[102]
Youngest player voted to the starting lineup in an All-Star Game[103]
Youngest Art Ross Trophy and Lester B. Pearson Award winner[6][43]
Youngest player to be named to the First All-Star Team[45]
So if we take away all the bells and whistles (the "youngest" BS)...

2x100 point seasons (when scoring was higher!)
Art Ross Trophy
Hart Trophy
LBP Trophy
1st Team All-Star

That's fine. I'm not saying they're the same player. I'm saying you're overreacting.

In fact, I'll do one better: compare "first two years of relevance"

Crosby: 6th, 1st in points
Giroux: 11th, 3rd

Crosby: 7th, 2nd in Assists
Giroux: 8th, 2nd

Crosby: 1st team all-star
Giroux: "3rd team" all-star

The only big thing Crosby has over Giroux are, of course, his awards, though Giroux has a 4th in Hart, a 3rd in Art Ross, and who knows what in the Linsday (probably a top 5). Other than that, they aren't far off, but no, I know Crosby's better.

So yeah.

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:16 PM
  #281
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
I'm not saying they're the same player. I'm saying you're overreacting.
You made the comparison, saying it's okay for Giroux to be drafted in the MLD because Crosby was drafted in the MLD.

If you wanna now make a new point about my reaction to your pick, then fine. I'll start underreacting.

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:19 PM
  #282
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The latest Maniac is Jimmy Ward, RW

Ward was a strong two-way player who spent much of his career on the Montreal Maroons' checking line with Hooley Smith and Baldy Northcott. He was quite effective at checking the star left wings Aurel Joliat and Busher Jackson, as he was one of the few players in the league fast enough to skate with them. He was also larger than average for his era.

Despite often being used as a checker, Ward's offensive resume is among the best among wingers in the MLD:

Points 9th(1929), 11th(1932), 15th(1936), 16th(1933)
Goals 8th(1929), 10th(1932), 12th(1933), 19th(1934)
Assists 7th(1936), 8th(1929), 10th(1932), 16th(1933)

He was named MVP of the Montreal Maroons in 1931, a season in which he didn't finish top 20 in scoring.

Did I mention Ward was fast?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Howie Morenz, 1935
And while I'm on the subject of outstanding men, I might add that Harvey Jackson of Toronto is probably the best and fastest wing in the game. About the only way to stop Harvey is the close down the rink. Jimmy Ward of the Montreal Maroons is another player who scorches the ice. The same is true of King Clancy of the Toronto Maple Leafs and young Mush March of our Chicago Blackhawks, who also owns blistering speed; the boy is a fine competitor, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, 4-3-1928
Jimmy Ward uncorks more speed than Aurel Joliat, his check.
Here's nik jr's excellent profile of Ward that (among other things) goes into his checking in much more detail:

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=169

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Old
07-19-2012, 11:32 PM
  #283
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Chicago selects defenseman, Joe Jerwa



While I drafted Jerwa more for his defensive game to help out Brown the guy also was a solid offensive defenseman, twice leading all NHL defensemen in goals.

For more on Jerwa click the following:

http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...p?player=13101

I've pmed Hobnobs provided he's still in this:

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Old
07-20-2012, 04:46 AM
  #284
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The monarchs selects thestrong face-off man, Pete Stemkowski, C

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Old
07-20-2012, 07:51 AM
  #285
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btw am I andmy grandpa the only euros in this draft?

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Old
07-20-2012, 08:57 AM
  #286
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With pick #42 the Pittsburgh Hornets select:

Herb Cain, LW



Click for Leafs Forever's ATD #12 Bio

Can't find a lot of descriptive words on him in the newspaper archives, just that he scored goals -- which we knew.

Christian Science Monitor: Nov. 4, 1939
Quote:
The Bruins were met in Toronto by their newly acquired left winger, Herb Cain, speedy, good scoring forward who came from Les Canadiens in trade for XXXXXXX
Here's a quote that might indicate that he wasn't adverse to defending himself and may have had a bit of a mean streak.

The Montreal Gazette: Mar. 14, 1934
Quote:
... the fighting reached its climax in the dying minutes when Herb Cain and XXXXXXX XXXXXX used their sticks as battle axes on each other as a prelude to fisticuffs.
A Canada.com article from 2007 makes the case for Cain in the Hockey HOF
Quote:
Cain scored 36 goals and had 46 assists in 48 games during his league-leading year. Yes, the war had diluted the NHL, but this was a record that stood for seven seasons, until Detroit's Gordie Howe had 43 goals and 43 assists through 70 games in 1950-51.

Cain survived the mishap to win the Stanley Cup with the Maroons in his sophomore season of 1934-35, playing on Gorman's so-called Green Line with Bob Gracie and XXXXXXX. He won the Cup again with Boston in 1940-41, two seasons after having earned 27 points in 45 games with the Canadiens, picked up when the Maroons were dissolved.

With the Bruins, Cain became only the 13th NHLer since the league's 1917 birth to score 200 career goals.

Cain had 206 goals and 400 points in 571 NHL games, totals superior to many contemporaries who have been elected to the Hall of Fame.


Last edited by Selfish Man: 07-21-2012 at 10:56 PM. Reason: edited to add some bio info
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Old
07-20-2012, 09:27 AM
  #287
Canadiens1958
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Barry Pederson

The Montreal Orfuns adopt Barry Pederson, C/RHS, Boston Bruins, Vancouver Canucks.

http://www.hockey-reference.com/play...pederba01.html

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Old
07-20-2012, 09:51 AM
  #288
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Lokomotiv selects Frank "Moose" Goheen.

Bio to come.

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Old
07-20-2012, 09:53 AM
  #289
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Lokomotiv selects Frank "Moose" Goheen.

Bio to come.
Definitely a guy who could use a good bio. It's really hard to tell how good he was

Edit: I see you're planning on using him as a D. Didn't he spend most of his career as a LW?


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 07-20-2012 at 09:59 AM.
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Old
07-20-2012, 10:06 AM
  #290
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Didn't he spend most of his career as a LW?
I have never come across that reference. He has played most of his career on defense by past research I've seen before. Certainly he has played a lot of positions:

Quote:
he quickly established himself as a versatile and aggressive player. Starting out as a rover in the seven-man game, he moved to all forward positions, and then moved back on defense.
http://wild.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=512862

Quote:
A defenseman, Goheen was the master of the on-goal rush - a defensive style of hockey that would not be seen again until the arrival of Eddy Shore in the 1930s and later by Bobby Orr in the 1960s. A man ahead of his time, Goheen led the Americans in their quest for a medal with a 7-0 victory over Sweden, a 16-0 defeat of Czechoslovakia, and a 29-0 whitewash of Switzerland.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigadore/5244562167/

More to come later.

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Old
07-20-2012, 10:18 AM
  #291
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
I have never come across that reference. He has played most of his career on defense by past research I've seen before. Certainly he has played a lot of positions:


http://wild.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=512862


http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigadore/5244562167/

More to come later.
Now that I'm checking, Hockey reference (which is often wrong) calls him a LW. SIHR calls him a RW. Wikipedia calls him a forward, but wiki often just parrots SIHR.

Your first link mentions he played multiple forward positions and defense.
Your second link (good find) calls him a rushing D at the Olympics in Eddie Shore / Bobby Orr style.

Confusing to say the least

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Old
07-20-2012, 11:56 AM
  #292
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While we're on the subject of multi-positional guys (), how do we handle that in the voting phase? Do we dock a guy for playing defense if the majority of his career was at forward? What if we can't tell with certainty how strong he was at LW versus RW? I'm sure this has come up before, just want to know how to handle these guys if I end up with one.

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Old
07-20-2012, 11:58 AM
  #293
Rob Scuderi
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Pittsburgh selects D Doug Jarrett


AST voting record: 7, T11, 14, token vote during rookie year

More to come

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:02 PM
  #294
Mike Farkas
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Didn't realize Herb Cain was available. Seems like a good pick.

I had "Moose" Goheen on my watchlist, very high. But like TDMM said, I couldn't really get a good read on just how good he was, so I was a little reticent to make a selection.

If it helps your bio, I pulled this selection of quotes from Total Hockey on Goheen:

Moose Goheen "...it was hockey that brought him international acclaim as one of the first great players ever developed in the United States. Primarily a defenseman, he was known as 'the only individual three-man rush in hockey' and as a prolific scorer. He was one of the first players in the game to wear a helmet." "twice helping the team win the McNaughton Trophy (amateur hockey supremacy in U.S.)" Selected to 1920 Olympic team. Asked to play in 1924 Olympics but declined. Bruins claimed him, Leafs offered him a contract but he refused [in order] to stay home with Northern States Power Company. "...Minnesota Hall of Fame in 1958 as the finest hockey player ever produced in the state."

The last line I guess isn't totally unfair to say for the time (1958), though it would include Frank Brimsek, would it not?

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:23 PM
  #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bring Back Scuderi View Post
Pittsburgh selects D Doug Jarrett


AST voting record: 7, T11, 14, token vote during rookie year

More to come
Graduate of he London Minor Hockey Association. Go THUNDER!

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:25 PM
  #296
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It's a bit late, but I just realized Bill Thoms was selected in the ATD. He was listed as "Bill Thomas" in the ATD list.

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:25 PM
  #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post
While we're on the subject of multi-positional guys (), how do we handle that in the voting phase? Do we dock a guy for playing defense if the majority of his career was at forward? What if we can't tell with certainty how strong he was at LW versus RW? I'm sure this has come up before, just want to know how to handle these guys if I end up with one.
That's completely up to each idividual. Some people ignore part of their careers. Others take the non-positional years as extra longevity.

The problems come when guys played multiple positions during the same season. Unless we can figure out where his points came from, I'm sceptical.

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:28 PM
  #298
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Quote:
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It's a bit late, but I just realized Bill Thoms was selected in the ATD. He was listed as "Bill Thomas" in the ATD list.
Ghey

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:31 PM
  #299
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
It's a bit late, but I just realized Bill Thoms was selected in the ATD. He was listed as "Bill Thomas" in the ATD list.
How bloody hard is it to transcribe a drafted player's name correctly?

I'd rather have a slow to update OP that a faulty one

I guess we need to repick.

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Old
07-20-2012, 12:35 PM
  #300
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I would just like to point out that we officially got boned by the chode who can't spell.

We would have picked Dubbie Kerr if we knew Thoms wasn't available.

Anyway, enough whining. Will repick shortly

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