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If handing out long term contracts carry over to the new CBA

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Old
07-22-2012, 08:50 AM
  #101
WG
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
I hate these comments. You have no idea if that are true.

Lecavalier already is past his prime but is still pretty young. You think he'll retire anytime soon?
Not soon, of course, as Vinny is still nowhere near the low-salary portion of his contract. He is owed 48.5M over the next 5 years so I expect he'll stick around to 37. Thing wth these really long contracts is that none of them have actually made it to the low-dollar portion yet, but I'll be very surprised if VL is still playing for Tampa at ages 38-40. I'd imagine he'd pack it in but if not, three years, $6.5M cash for about $23M in cap would be pretty attractive to a cap floor team.

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07-22-2012, 11:01 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by BallHockeyLegend View Post
Which teams signed UFAs to a long term deal which put them over the top and made them contenders?

The bruins had Zdeno Chara, but he wasn't on a long cap circumventing contract when they took him out of free agency.

Chicago had Marian Hossa, but IMO he didn't put them over the top. They were already stacked.

Penguins, nope. Wings, nope.

So basically there's been Ilya Kovalchuk, Brad Richards, Zach Parise and Ryan Sutter that the leafs "lost out" on. Which one of those do you both want and would have wanted to come to Toronto? Ilya kovalchuk, would you want to beat that contact? Could the Leafs have beat that contract knowing it was enough to even get penalized by the league? The other three clearly wanted to go to the teams they signed with.

Burke has said unless it's a very special player, he's not willing to hand out the long contracts. Players like Phaneuf and Kessel, I'm pretty sure he considers them special enough to go longer than 5 years. Perhaps 7 or 8 years.

If Getzlaf and Perry make it to UFA and they're considering Toronto, those are the kinds of players that Burke would go over 5 years for in my opinion. I think the players that Burke isn't willing to go super long on the contracts are the players like Ville Leino, Christian Ehrhoff, etc who are secondary players. Are the Leafs really losing out on anything by not offering second tier players life time UFA contracts?

I'm glad Burke is staying away from free agents, he has a terrible free agent track record. He's drafted guys like Pronger, the Sedin twins, Getzlaf, Perry etc. He's traded for guys like Pronger, Bertuzzi, Phaneuf, etc. He's also signed entry level free agents like Dustin Penner, Gustavsson, Bozak etc.

Basically UFA is only one way a GM can add players to his roster, Burke doesn't have much luck doing it and he'smuch better at other avenues and he's reluctant to give out monster contracts to secondary players. Anyone who has a problem with that needs to give their head a shake.
You just give excuses. Stop it. You sound ridiculous. Toronto deserves to have some of the best players in the world playing. Here. Stop it. I don't see a problem signing long term front loaded contracts to players in their twenties like a Suter or Parise..even a Kovalchuk. Leave out the NMC....there is the key. A team like the Leafs can afford those deals. They can afford to spend to the cap and then some. They can afford to send overpaid, underperforiming vets to the Marlies or simply say...waivers or buy out. They can afford to do what they want. But younger impact players on long term front loaded deals should not be a problem, IMO.

Even Sid got one (long term deal) and he is probably as risky as they come. As great as he is.

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07-22-2012, 01:26 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
You just give excuses. Stop it. You sound ridiculous. Toronto deserves to have some of the best players in the world playing. Here. Stop it. I don't see a problem signing long term front loaded contracts to players in their twenties like a Suter or Parise..even a Kovalchuk. Leave out the NMC....there is the key. A team like the Leafs can afford those deals. They can afford to spend to the cap and then some. They can afford to send overpaid, underperforiming vets to the Marlies or simply say...waivers or buy out. They can afford to do what they want. But younger impact players on long term front loaded deals should not be a problem, IMO.

Even Sid got one (long term deal) and he is probably as risky as they come. As great as he is.
I don't mind seeing those players in our roster, but I'm not sure we sign those contracts with them. Ok, if offensive core would have been little bit different(bigger), I would have gone after Parise. Now why bother? Though we have to play better, before we can lure those players to our premises. Brad Richards really wasn't worth it, good center, but not good enough. Kovalchuk I don't want. Suter is great dman but is on the verge of big overpayment. Let's see two seasons with Wild and re-evaluate that contract after that.

We could have used Suter or Richards but it was painfully clear that they're not going to come here. Suter would have gotten more money from Flyers and Richards was tied up to Rangers from get go.

Big question lies with new CBA, is there restrictions to prevent those huge contracts. If not, it's clear that those are acceptable and Burke will also offer those kind of deals. Though I think he won't ad those 1mill years that much. If there is a player who could help us it's Corey Perry and I think if he and Getzlaf will test market. Their going to sign together somewhere. They would be perfect for Toronto. I really dislike Getzlaf, but you can't complain if his there we have to go after him.

I really hate that Stamkos offer sheet topic, it was perfectly clear that they would have matched that offer. Even with front loaded money, only thing that would have prevented that would have been 10-12mil cap hit for 10-15 years or something. There was no sense of offer sheeting him, we don't know if Burke talked with Stamkos agency, they would not go public about that. Or would Stamkos have signed that kind of offer sheet with us. Stupid offers will prevent his chance of winning something in future. You have to be pretty selfish player to ruin your teams cap.

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07-22-2012, 01:51 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by deprw View Post
I don't mind seeing those players in our roster, but I'm not sure we sign those contracts with them. Ok, if offensive core would have been little bit different(bigger), I would have gone after Parise. Now why bother? Though we have to play better, before we can lure those players to our premises. Brad Richards really wasn't worth it, good center, but not good enough. Kovalchuk I don't want. Suter is great dman but is on the verge of big overpayment. Let's see two seasons with Wild and re-evaluate that contract after that.

We could have used Suter or Richards but it was painfully clear that they're not going to come here. Suter would have gotten more money from Flyers and Richards was tied up to Rangers from get go.

Big question lies with new CBA, is there restrictions to prevent those huge contracts. If not, it's clear that those are acceptable and Burke will also offer those kind of deals. Though I think he won't ad those 1mill years that much. If there is a player who could help us it's Corey Perry and I think if he and Getzlaf will test market. Their going to sign together somewhere. They would be perfect for Toronto. I really dislike Getzlaf, but you can't complain if his there we have to go after him.

I really hate that Stamkos offer sheet topic, it was perfectly clear that they would have matched that offer. Even with front loaded money, only thing that would have prevented that would have been 10-12mil cap hit for 10-15 years or something. There was no sense of offer sheeting him, we don't know if Burke talked with Stamkos agency, they would not go public about that. Or would Stamkos have signed that kind of offer sheet with us. Stupid offers will prevent his chance of winning something in future. You have to be pretty selfish player to ruin your teams cap.
What makes you think BB will offer up those kind of contracts after this CBA.

They have been perfectly legal to do for the past 7 years and he is yet to offer one up and has publicly come out against them.

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07-22-2012, 01:57 PM
  #105
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Burke's inability to hand out these contracts will be his undoing, he'll be fired eventually and say that he wasn't able to compete with other GMs and the ridiculous term contracts they were handing out.

This will take away from the ridiculous deals he did sign (connolly/komi/army, even grabbo to a lesser extent)

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Old
07-22-2012, 06:50 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
Dont like them. name me a forty year old worth 6-7m a year
Nicklas Lidstrom.

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Old
07-22-2012, 07:01 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
Nicklas Lidstrom.


Arguably the greatest defenseman to ever play the game of hockey is an exception.

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Old
07-22-2012, 08:15 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
Dont like them. name me a forty year old worth 6-7m a year
Who gets $6/7M at 40?

Salary at 40:

Kovalchuk: $3M

Parise: $1M

Suter: $1M

Zetterberg: $1M

Luongo: $1.618M

Hossa: $1M

Franzen: $1M

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Old
07-22-2012, 08:36 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
Who gets $6/7M at 40?

Salary at 40:

Kovalchuk: $3M

Parise: $1M

Suter: $1M

Zetterberg: $1M

Luongo: $1.618M

Hossa: $1M

Franzen: $1M
The point is for Kovy / Parise / Suter

if they decide to play out their contracts, their hit on the cap with be the same in 13 years as it is now.

Look how Scott Gomez / Vinny Lecavalier / Roberto Luongo have become virtually immovable for anything worth their value

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07-22-2012, 08:43 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by leafsfuture View Post
The point is for Kovy / Parise / Suter

if they decide to play out their contracts, their hit on the cap with be the same in 13 years as it is now.

Look how Scott Gomez / Vinny Lecavalier / Roberto Luongo have become virtually immovable for anything worth their value
If there's no NMC/NTC, they could be sent to the minors, or traded to a number of owners who would be more than happy to obtain a $6/7M cap hit and only have to dole out $1M in cash.

And I do not think there's an owner/GM stupid enough to give a NMC/NTC to someone for the last few years of these contracts.

I could be wrong though...

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