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What is your "let Shea go" package?

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Old
07-23-2012, 01:03 AM
  #26
Readyrock
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
Neither is happening. Poile won't get a trade for any of those three here. Preds would be better off matching if at all possible.
Regardless of whether it's going to happen or not - the Couturier deal he mentioned is completely reasonable in terms of value. (Sean even looks a little like a catfish, to boot).

The entire discussion is sad, though. Things like this aren't supposed to happen in a salary cap league.

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07-23-2012, 01:15 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Readyrock View Post
Regardless of whether it's going to happen or not - the Couturier deal he mentioned is completely reasonable in terms of value. (Sean even looks a little like a catfish, to boot).

The entire discussion is sad, though. Things like this aren't supposed to happen in a salary cap league.
Couturier is 19 and already an NHL regular and asset, he's worth more than what would be two late first rounders, or even four. Thr Flyers have an asset and won't bite, even if it means Nashville matches.

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07-23-2012, 01:44 AM
  #28
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Match the offer. Eat the 26 million bonus, then trade his sorry ass next year to Edmonton, or C'bus, or whoever sucks the most for the next 5-7 years. The Oil have plenty of young talented top 6 forwards. My let Shea go package involves sending him somewhere he has the lowest chance to win the cup.

What happened to the guy who donned the Captains jersey two years ago at the Skate of the Union? Remember that guy.

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07-23-2012, 01:46 AM
  #29
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I'm not an expert on the situation, but could Nashville throw an offer sheet at Jake (Voracek) as kindof an f u to Philly? Philly are gonna have limited space to sign Giroux too, throw one at him too

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07-23-2012, 02:20 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HalifaxDucks View Post
I'm not an expert on the situation, but could Nashville throw an offer sheet at Jake (Voracek) as kindof an f u to Philly? Philly are gonna have limited space to sign Giroux too, throw one at him too
Voracek would have to willingly sign the contract so Nashville would likely have to overpay him (unless Jake has Nashville on his wishlist). In doing so the Predators would have to send Philly compensation picks likely a 1st and a 3rd. If Philly gets Weber they likely trade Voracek's rights anyway for much less so stealing Voracek like that probably benefits Philly. Even if Philly doesn't get Weber and Nashville takes him that way he doesn't hold a major role in the Flyers offense.

Giroux is a RFA in 2 years. Even with Weber the Flyers would have enough to resign him. Keep in mind even with Weber contracts will end freeing up money. For example at the end of this season the Flyers have approx 16 million coming off the books likely resigning Hartnell and Simmonds, Timonen likely retires. The year Giroux is a FA they have nearly 14.5 million coming off the books noteworthy resigns are Giroux, Couturier, Schenn. Of course keep in mind this doesn't even include possible salary cap increases which has happened every season since the lockout. Oh and of course Briere will have 1 year left on his contract likely allowing them to trade him for next to nothing to a team of his choice for cap relief at a low risk.

Not to mention when Giroux is a RFA the contract rules as far as length and format will likely be much different keeping them more reasonable likely meaning any offer he could accept wouldn't put the Flyers in an awkward situation like the Flyers did to the Preds with Weber.

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07-23-2012, 04:22 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
Couturier is 19 and already an NHL regular and asset, he's worth more than what would be two late first rounders, or even four..
When it comes to Weber, the only untouchable on the Flyers roster is Giroux.

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07-23-2012, 07:44 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Gnashville View Post
My thought exactally Philly owes nothing to the Preds except 4 very late 1st's (which are useless IMO)
It's rare to find draft year ready talent in the 20-30 overall slots, but it happens. It's not uncommon to find decent performers in those slots who play in year 2 or 3 after draft. Markus Johansson, Tyler Ennis, Eberle, John Carlson, Perron (year one NHL player), Pacioretty. ... that's just looking back over the past few years. Those picks do nothing to help the roster in 2012-13, slight chance of anything for 13-14, but from then on should pay dividends.

What gets me is the match Weber, then trade him as soon as humanly possible theory I keep seeing popping up through this thread. My take is that if the owners see matching as an acceptable financial risk that any trade return would have to be as unprecedented as this offer sheet. By the time we could potentially trade Weber we'll have paid him at least $27mil ... roughly one quarter of what he's due for the entire contract. If the owners can weather the storm of the first 11-23 months of this contract, they're probably going to be ok. If the asset is valuable enough to take such risk to keep, it's valuable enough to keep long term. Risking everything financially to keep him now then hoping to flip him on the trade market in a year or two is subprime housing market thinking.

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07-23-2012, 07:47 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
It's rare to find draft year ready talent in the 20-30 overall slots, but it happens. It's not uncommon to find decent performers in those slots who play in year 2 or 3 after draft. Markus Johansson, Tyler Ennis, Eberle, John Carlson, Perron (year one NHL player), Pacioretty. ... that's just looking back over the past few years. Those picks do nothing to help the roster in 2012-13, slight chance of anything for 13-14, but from then on should pay dividends.

What gets me is the match Weber, then trade him as soon as humanly possible theory I keep seeing popping up through this thread. My take is that if the owners see matching as an acceptable financial risk that any trade return would have to be as unprecedented as this offer sheet. By the time we could potentially trade Weber we'll have paid him at least $27mil ... roughly one quarter of what he's due for the entire contract. If the owners can weather the storm of the first 11-23 months of this contract, they're probably going to be ok. If the asset is valuable enough to take such risk to keep, it's valuable enough to keep long term. Risking everything financially to keep him now then hoping to flip him on the trade market in a year or two is subprime housing market thinking.
exactly.

the only way a "trade him in one year" scenario is feasible is if the new CBA allows cash to be exchanged in trades and someone wants to fork over several assets and $15 million or so in cash...

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07-23-2012, 08:38 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
What gets me is the match Weber, then trade him as soon as humanly possible theory I keep seeing popping up through this thread. My take is that if the owners see matching as an acceptable financial risk that any trade return would have to be as unprecedented as this offer sheet. By the time we could potentially trade Weber we'll have paid him at least $27mil ... roughly one quarter of what he's due for the entire contract. If the owners can weather the storm of the first 11-23 months of this contract, they're probably going to be ok. If the asset is valuable enough to take such risk to keep, it's valuable enough to keep long term. Risking everything financially to keep him now then hoping to flip him on the trade market in a year or two is subprime housing market thinking.
How much value is there to a player who doesn't want to be a part of the organization that holds his rights? How valuable was Carter last year in C'bus? If Weber wants out, I think he gives a half ass effort on and off the ice -- lousy captain. And of course I'm being petty and vindictive by wanting him traded to a horrible team. I honestly don't think Poile lays down 26 million in a bonus and then trade him, unless the offer is staggering.

From everything I've read, the organization can't loose Weber (and essentially Suter) for 4 low end 1st rounders. The owners are trying to find a way to pay the bonus. But there is bound to be raw feelings from the owners and upper management over this. The organization has done everything asked of them by the two and they still want out.

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07-23-2012, 09:00 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
Match the offer. Eat the 26 million bonus, then trade his sorry ass next year to Edmonton, or C'bus, or whoever sucks the most for the next 5-7 years. The Oil have plenty of young talented top 6 forwards. My let Shea go package involves sending him somewhere he has the lowest chance to win the cup.

What happened to the guy who donned the Captains jersey two years ago at the Skate of the Union? Remember that guy.
Indeed. A friend of mine who sings at a downtown bar on weekends met him, and shyly asked to have his picture taken with him. Afterwards, my friend thanked him for all he has done for Nashville, and Shea thanked HIM for all he's done for downtown. It really sounds like he would want to stay here, but between his new sorry-a##ed agent AND management's lack of bringing in REAL scoring help, he doesn't see a bright future in Gold.

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07-23-2012, 09:42 AM
  #36
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I just want this drama over. I'm ready for Thursday morning.

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07-23-2012, 09:53 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
Match the offer. Eat the 26 million bonus, then trade his sorry ass next year to Edmonton, or C'bus, or whoever sucks the most for the next 5-7 years. The Oil have plenty of young talented top 6 forwards. My let Shea go package involves sending him somewhere he has the lowest chance to win the cup.

What happened to the guy who donned the Captains jersey two years ago at the Skate of the Union? Remember that guy.
What happened to the ownership/GM that promised the fans that the Preds would begin spending to the cap and would lock up the big 3 longterm?

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07-23-2012, 10:15 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Shea Weber View Post
What happened to the ownership/GM that promised the fans that the Preds would begin spending to the cap and would lock up the big 3 longterm?
That changed when 2 of the 3 decided they were only concerned with how rich they could get as individuals instead of wanting to stay together and build a team in Nashville.

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07-23-2012, 10:39 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Shea Weber View Post
What happened to the ownership/GM that promised the fans that the Preds would begin spending to the cap and would lock up the big 3 longterm?
Signed Rinne to a contract that most pundits deemed an overpayment. Offered to match any offer Suter received, but weren't given the chance. And though it hasn't been publicly disclosed, I'll wager the Preds offered Weber something along the lines of what Suter was offered. Ownership went all out at the trade deadline and has given every indication that they are trying to be a cap team. Offering 8+ million to both Suter and Weber refects an organization that is ready to spend to the cap.

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07-23-2012, 10:43 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
Signed Rinne to a contract that most pundits deemed an overpayment. Offered to match any offer Suter received, but weren't given the chance. And though it hasn't been publicly disclosed, I'll wager the Preds offered Weber something along the lines of what Suter was offered. Ownership went all out at the trade deadline and has given every indication that they are trying to be a cap team. Offering 8+ million to both Suter and Weber refects an organization that is ready to spend to the cap.

I agree - the owners have done the work. They've just been hit with poop luck and players that want to exercise their rights as a free agent.


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07-23-2012, 11:06 AM
  #41
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>>>What is your "let Shea go" package?

Four (4) 1st round picks, one (1) new general manager, and one (1) new head coach.

ETA: One (1) new Fisher-Price microphone for Crispy's color commentary/analysis.


Last edited by Reviled: 07-23-2012 at 11:17 AM.
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07-23-2012, 11:10 AM
  #42
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It's not poop luck it was poor handling by Poile, he was not aggressive enough.

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07-23-2012, 12:03 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
It's not poop luck it was poor handling by Poile, he was not aggressive enough.
Aggressive in terms of overall money vs term or aggressive in terms of huge frontloads that include unprecedented bonus structure?

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07-23-2012, 12:14 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by One and Done View Post
>>>What is your "let Shea go" package?

Four (4) 1st round picks, one (1) new general manager, and one (1) new head coach.

ETA: One (1) new Fisher-Price microphone for Crispy's color commentary/analysis.
Throw in a Fisher-Price telephone/fax machine for Poile Jr. to play with as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
Signed Rinne to a contract that most pundits deemed an overpayment. Offered to match any offer Suter received, but weren't given the chance. And though it hasn't been publicly disclosed, I'll wager the Preds offered Weber something along the lines of what Suter was offered. Ownership went all out at the trade deadline and has given every indication that they are trying to be a cap team. Offering 8+ million to both Suter and Weber refects an organization that is ready to spend to the cap.
Where was it ever written that the Preds offered to match any offer? There were reports as to what the Preds had offered, but nothing concrete. I think Poile just said, "I never had the chance to match", not that he necessarily would have.

As for what ownership did at the deadline, none of those additions cost that much, because their other team had already paid the bulk of their salary. Last year's salary was still no where near a "cap team", and I havenen't seen the final figures, but it doesn't appear last year's team was any more expensive than the previous years team, and it's certainly not because there was an infusion of talent, just raises for Weber and the other RFA's. Remember Sully, Lombo, Ward, etc all went off the books.

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07-23-2012, 01:09 PM
  #45
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http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...hea-Weber.html

this exposes the deal i recently put out there.

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07-23-2012, 01:10 PM
  #46
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4 1sts, a new gm, a new head coach
1 of brayden schenn, luke schenn & sean couturier, 2 first round draft picks, a new gm & a new coach
2 of brayden schenn, luke schenn & sean couturier, & a new coach
3 of brayden schenn, luke schenn & sean couturier & a new coach

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07-23-2012, 01:24 PM
  #47
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The Predators will not get B. Schenn, L. Schenn, or Couturier. If Homer was willing to give any of them up then Weber would already be a member of the Flyers. Homer's unwillingness to trade any of them is the reason he put in the offer sheet. As a Flyers fan the best package you receive is Voracek (sadly, my favorite player), Meszaros, Gustafsson or Bourdon, and obviously the picks and in return the Flyers get Weber and pick(s).

Personally I feel that Poile is bluffing and I feel that Homer should say if you can match it, then do it. But a trade wouldn't hurt the Flyers as they get Weber, pick(s), and they have some cap flexibility. Just my view on it all as a Flyers fan.

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07-23-2012, 01:30 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Voracek Fan Club View Post
The Predators will not get B. Schenn, L. Schenn, or Couturier. If Homer was willing to give any of them up then Weber would already be a member of the Flyers. Homer's unwillingness to trade any of them is the reason he put in the offer sheet. As a Flyers fan the best package you receive is Voracek (sadly, my favorite player), Meszaros, Gustafsson or Bourdon, and obviously the picks and in return the Flyers get Weber and pick(s).

Personally I feel that Poile is bluffing and I feel that Homer should say if you can match it, then do it. But a trade wouldn't hurt the Flyers as they get Weber, pick(s), and they have some cap flexibility. Just my view on it all as a Flyers fan.
Then Poile should be fired, if he doesn't get any of the first bolded group & has to settle on the second bolded package.

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07-23-2012, 01:48 PM
  #49
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In my opinion give us Voracek, Couturier, Gustafsson, and Meszaros and a pick. Then I would be be able to deal. Anything else is crap.

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07-23-2012, 02:00 PM
  #50
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Yeah, and Howson didn't help matters....

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