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Offer Sheet Matched. Weber signed to Nashville for 14 years

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07-23-2012, 07:13 AM
  #301
triggrman
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Philly signed Weber to the offer sheet because Philly is desperate. Last years playoff exposed them defensively. My question is this; if Nashville does match, then where does Philly go?

I think adding Weber would help Philly but their problem isn't talent, their system is too aggressive defensively, adding Weber will helpl because he's a beast but their system is broken, Weber's not the cure.

I actually hate this because prior to this I liked Philly probably the most out of all the Eastern teams, now I'd like to throw batteries at them, like they did Santa...

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07-23-2012, 07:25 AM
  #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
Philly signed Weber to the offer sheet because Philly is desperate. Last years playoff exposed them defensively. My question is this; if Nashville does match, then where does Philly go?

I think adding Weber would help Philly but their problem isn't talent, their system is too aggressive defensively, adding Weber will helpl because he's a beast but their system is broken, Weber's not the cure.

I actually hate this because prior to this I liked Philly probably the most out of all the Eastern teams, now I'd like to throw batteries at them, like they did Santa...
False. Our defense was exposed in the regular season. What you saw in the playoffs was actually our defense playing better than how we were in the regular season.. It just didn't show too well because Bryz was playing on a broken foot and hurt hip

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07-23-2012, 07:58 AM
  #303
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triggr, you dont buy the 'Holmgren did us a favor' theory?

Desperate? Now thats a huge stretch.

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07-23-2012, 08:02 AM
  #304
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Originally Posted by MSSLYNX View Post
triggr, you dont buy the 'Holmgren did us a favor' theory?

Desperate? Now thats a huge stretch.
i thought you were a philly fan...

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07-23-2012, 08:05 AM
  #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
Philly signed Weber to the offer sheet because Philly is desperate. Last years playoff exposed them defensively. My question is this; if Nashville does match, then where does Philly go?

I think adding Weber would help Philly but their problem isn't talent, their system is too aggressive defensively, adding Weber will helpl because he's a beast but their system is broken, Weber's not the cure.

I actually hate this because prior to this I liked Philly probably the most out of all the Eastern teams, now I'd like to throw batteries at them, like they did Santa...
i know, i probably liked Philly also.... now, they are like the Canucks of the east as far as I am concerned... just want to see them fail, in a big way

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07-23-2012, 08:12 AM
  #306
triggrman
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Originally Posted by MSSLYNX View Post
triggr, you dont buy the 'Holmgren did us a favor' theory?

Desperate? Now thats a huge stretch.
Go read your own boards after the Suter/Parise strikeout, Philly was desperate to make a splash and to sure up their defense. Weber is their last hope at both.

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07-23-2012, 08:25 AM
  #307
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I'm with you Trigg, I'm probably the biggest Flyers fan among Preds fans... but I think i'm done with them. I'll root for Kimmo and Harts out there, but that's about it.

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07-23-2012, 08:40 AM
  #308
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
False. Our defense was exposed in the regular season. What you saw in the playoffs was actually our defense playing better than how we were in the regular season.. It just didn't show too well because Bryz was playing on a broken foot and hurt hip
Didn't you lose Carle to Tampa as a FA and with Pronger looking like he might never return, I do believe your homer colors are showing.

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07-23-2012, 08:42 AM
  #309
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Didn't you lose Carle to Tampa as a FA and with Pronger looking like he might never return, I do believe your homer colors are showing.
I was never a fan of carle

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07-23-2012, 08:44 AM
  #310
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It's $52mil in bonuses across the first four years, with an additional $4mil in paragraph one salary in that time frame, with another $16mil in bonuses across years five and six with $8mil of insurable salary those years .... $68million in "signing bonus". 92% of the money for the first four years is uninsurable bonus money, 61.8% of the overall money. I can't think of a single contract where the "bonus" is over half of the total compensation.
That is crazy. The more I look at that contract, the more Im not sure we should even match. If he were to have some catastrophic injury in year 4, all that money in bonus is gone

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07-23-2012, 08:54 AM
  #311
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At this point, I don't really care. I just want it to be over one way or another. If we match, fantastic. If we don't, I really really hope Poile trades those picks back to Philly for players.

The only solution that I would not be ok with is us not matching and only getting picks pack. At any rate though, regardless of the outcome, I think Poile should be fired. The amount of money we still have to spend to get to the floor is unbelievable and his inability to sign Weber or Suter is shameful. Time for a new direction.

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07-23-2012, 09:25 AM
  #312
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obviously as a ranger fan i hope you guys match. having said that i hope poile waits till the last second to do it just to keep the flyers sweating and keep them from making other moves.

i think nashville has the money. i think the biggest problem is does weber want to stay there

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07-23-2012, 09:32 AM
  #313
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Originally Posted by Hustlechuck24 View Post
At this point, I don't really care. I just want it to be over one way or another. If we match, fantastic. If we don't, I really really hope Poile trades those picks back to Philly for players.

The only solution that I would not be ok with is us not matching and only getting picks pack. At any rate though, regardless of the outcome, I think Poile should be fired. The amount of money we still have to spend to get to the floor is unbelievable and his inability to sign Weber or Suter is shameful. Time for a new direction.
Way past time for a new direction. Hopefully the loss of assets for chump change or the extreme amount of money that is going to immediatly come out of pocket will open some eyes.

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07-23-2012, 10:29 AM
  #314
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Personally, I hope they have the money and match. If Weber really wants out, make him play the first two years of the contract out then shop him to the entire league. You'd get a massive return on Weber in his prime with 12 years remaining at a very reasonable cap hit and only two years of the highest salary remaining. Or at least I expect that they would.

But if the money isn't there and this turns into a question of the long-term viability of the franchise, I'd rather see Weber walk for draft picks than to have the team lose so much money trying to save face that they end up folding. I'd prefer to keep him, though.

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07-23-2012, 11:11 AM
  #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hustlechuck24 View Post
At this point, I don't really care. I just want it to be over one way or another. If we match, fantastic. If we don't, I really really hope Poile trades those picks back to Philly for players.

The only solution that I would not be ok with is us not matching and only getting picks pack. At any rate though, regardless of the outcome, I think Poile should be fired. The amount of money we still have to spend to get to the floor is unbelievable and his inability to sign Weber or Suter is shameful. Time for a new direction.
Wouldn't you be better off trading them to another team for players and not give Philly any 1st rounders for 4 years or any additional cap relief?

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07-23-2012, 11:15 AM
  #316
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Wouldn't you be better off trading them to another team for players and not give Philly any 1st rounders for 4 years or any additional cap relief?
If our objective was to screw Philly for what they have done, then yes... but if he is unable to match, poile will try to salvage whatever will be best for the team and if that means getting players from philly for their own picks, if thats the best deal, he will take it...

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07-23-2012, 11:17 AM
  #317
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Wouldn't you be better off trading them to another team for players and not give Philly any 1st rounders for 4 years or any additional cap relief?
Yes, or keeping them. 1st round picks under the new CBA could be priceless, especially if the UFA age is pushed up to 30.

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07-23-2012, 11:18 AM
  #318
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That is crazy. The more I look at that contract, the more Im not sure we should even match. If he were to have some catastrophic injury in year 4, all that money in bonus is gone
it's horrific if he was to have that injury THIS year...brutal.

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07-23-2012, 11:26 AM
  #319
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MOD WARNING

If you cannot stay on topic, you will be hit with infractions. I just deleted 24 posts that were complete junk adding nothing to the discussion. Thread/Fourm bans will be handed out like candy in a stranger's van at Halloween.

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07-23-2012, 11:33 AM
  #320
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If our objective was to screw Philly for what they have done, then yes... but if he is unable to match, poile will try to salvage whatever will be best for the team and if that means getting players from philly for their own picks, if thats the best deal, he will take it...
Fair enough, but Philly wouldn't be my first call.

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07-23-2012, 11:33 AM
  #321
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I deleted even more on top of that. There are now two warnings on this page, and one that I brought from the first thread to the OP of this one. NO MORE WARNINGS.

If you are an outsider with an opinion, fine. Express that opinion. If it isn't received well you are not to start talking about how we should be more open to the other side of the issue. I don't care how thorough an argument you can create to show why having multiple sides to an argument is the best way to discuss something. This is our forum. If you want multiple angles go somewhere else. Don't try to force them on us because you feel so strongly about being heard. We are reasonable people, but too many posters too often this summer have stopped by to try to explain to us why we shouldn't be upset, or trying to tell us against whom we should focus our vitriol. How about you all just leave those decisions to us?

If you notice that something you are saying is causing problems STOP SAYING IT. Do not engage in an argument to defend your original point if the original point stirred something up. The moment you begin to perpetuate a dispute that you caused, even unintentionally, you are trolling. Period. No arguments. If you start an argument stop participating -- change the subject or leave. Those are your two options. You have no freedom of speech here. If you don't believe me I'll gladly prove it to you.

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07-23-2012, 11:36 AM
  #322
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Fair enough, but Philly wouldn't be my first call.
Well...we definitely have Holmgren's attention. If the Flyers are also all-in on Doan, we can certainly be helping eachother out in the end.

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07-23-2012, 11:44 AM
  #323
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it's horrific if he was to have that injury THIS year...brutal.
The Flyers losing Pronger in a freak accident was terrible in many ways... such as paying his contract cash and losing banked Cap with him on LTI... but also is the fact that he has to be replaced in all facets of his exceptional game, and frankly Weber is how they wanted to go in that aspect... Thus, here we are.

That said, YES... Weber's loss would be horrific, and even to a Deep Pocketed Ownership Organization... and compounding that with the Pronger situation present on the Flyers, it would be disaster in the making... Bottom line is that the Contract is not quite Russian Roulette, since there isn't a sure disaster for some team, but it is flirting with danger... even after we all have seen how quickly a career can be derailed.

I would believe that Poile and the Nashville Organization has to consider what can happen worse case scenario... It is very possible Homer did in deciding to end up going this route to replace Pronger.

We must keep in mind however that Minny took on two such contracts with Suter and Parise to give them an upper hand, and other Organizations have offered similar contracts that would give players so much up front and front loaded Bonus dollars... The players are by no means blameless in all this, and there is enough blame to go around on so many fronts.

In the end I do feel sorry for the situation your Organization has been put in... much like Buffalo in the past, due to dragging their heels and not being proactive in protecting their top assets... but I am hoping that the Flyers can replace their Captain with such a great player... Good luck to all.


EDIT: This was posted before I was able to read your Mod's last warning... I hope I fall within the bounds an apologize if anyone feels I have not.


Last edited by Sawdalite: 07-23-2012 at 11:50 AM. Reason: if you truly are doing that then you shouldn't have to say it
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07-23-2012, 11:54 AM
  #324
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The players are to be blamed for signing the contracts they signed? I don't think that's what is happening, nor should it be. For instance, Suter is being blamed for the way he handled the whole situation, especially the part about how he agreed to a deal in November only to never sign it and move on to be with his bromance in Minnesota. If Weber is being blamed for anything it is his own handling of the situation leading back to last year.

The owners should be shouldering the blame here. I don't think anyone can argue that Snider is talking out of both sides of his mouth when he is both one of the cheapest owners in terms of CBA negotiations and quick to throw out such a ridiculous and irresponsible contract offer to a player. Weber should be blamed for realizing that, at any moment on the ice, he could take a career ending injury? What is he supposed to do? Ignore the offer, roll the dice, and just hope beyond hope that if next season is his last he can scrape by bagging groceries? No.

Flyers fans don't have to look down on their own team. They don't have to even agree, really. It's still quite obvious what happened here. Snider and Holmgren both wanted Weber, and they were going to do whatever they could to get him. A scheme was hatched to offer an unprecedented offer sheet knowing that the Predators might not have the money to match the ridiculous amount of "signing" bonus money offered over the course of the first six years. A business move? Sure. An attempt to screw a team over simply because they 1) have a player that Philly didn't have, and 2) aren't owned by someone who can just throw money around like it's nothing? Definitely.

Any way you look at it, this wouldn't be happening if the Flyers weren't positive that Nashville isn't financially strong enough to match. The blame goes on the shoulders of a hypocritical owner, and I think that's fair.

And if Preds fans want to go ahead and blame our owns, Poile, Weber, and his agent... well, that's fair, too.

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07-23-2012, 11:57 AM
  #325
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Kevin Alllen Why Predators must match Weber offer sheet:


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