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Poll: Doan Vs. Semin

View Poll Results: Doan or Semin
Doan 132 58.41%
Semin 62 27.43%
Neither of Them 32 14.16%
Voters: 226. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-26-2012, 11:04 AM
  #126
Kjell Dahlin
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
You should have stopped at #1. This is how it was intended ;-)
I know... it was funny... sorry to ruin your party!

I was just curious about how Naggy ended up being the one making the comments. Who accused Naggy?

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Old
07-26-2012, 11:42 AM
  #127
Andy
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the more I read about him the more I think his reputaiton is not fully fair. The big thing that sticks out is how Hunter has said he never had a problem, and that Semin worked hard for him to adapt to his system.
From another poster.

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Old
07-26-2012, 12:14 PM
  #128
shamrun
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We need to sign Semin so that i can make a "defence getting penetrated by Semin" joke...


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Old
07-26-2012, 12:55 PM
  #129
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Subban76 View Post
Semin is a 30g/year average, not 35. He scored 40 goals once only. He accumulated all these great stats while playing a run and gun, no defense, type of hockey with great talented players. Look at is stats, its up and down all the time. No consistency.
197G/469GP=0.4200...x 82GP=34.4Goals per year.
Very simple math. Considering you can't score .4 goal, you round it up to the highest number, 35.
Semin averages 35 goals per year. I don't care how or in which system he scored them, FACT is he's averaging about 35 goals per year.
Really, I have no idea why you're still arguing about this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Subban76 View Post
Funny how you never responded to my posts where I clearly state that when Washington adopted a more defensive style 2 years ago, is stats went down and when Hunter took over and put in an even more defensive system, is stats went way down and he produced less than Doan in a similar system, but Doan was playing with less talented players. I find this to be a very important fact that all Semin lovers are ignoring because you have no response to it. Keep closing your eyes and ignore the facts, keep hoping that is bad reputatioon is overblown, that's a great way to build a team.
It's not really funny, more lame on your part because not only did I answer your post but so did DAChampion, you didn't answer to either of our responses.
I won't waste my time re-writing it, so here it is:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Actually, that run and gun style brought them to the most GF/G since the lockout all teams combined. It also lead them to the President's trophy win, by almost 10pts.
As DA just brought up, in the POs, they faced a brick wall by the name of Halak. Despite dominating us, they lost. Same thing applied to the Pens in the following round, shall we crap on Crosby and Malkin for not beating the little 8th place team?
Despite their early PO exit, that was their most successful season (since the lockout at least). They only lost 15 regular season games that year! They were a force to be reckon with.
Unfortunately, they took something that worked for them, tried to switch it around and has lead to worse results. You seem to single out Semin, but Backstrom, Ovechkin and Green ALL saw their production dropped. But no, it's Semin the lazy evil russian. You take a bunch of full out attack guys and tell them to play defense, and you find it surprising their production dropped? Really? It's surprising to you?? It's freaking normal.
Last year, playing under Hunter, they looked very similar to us when we went to the ECF. They got dominated, had timely goals, and a hot keeper.

So, to begin with, their run and gun style was appropriate for them. They needed better goaltending and one stronger top 4 defensive D, and mainly, patience. Telling a team that has Ovie, Semin, Backstrom, Green, to focus on defense is just retarded. It was a bad decision.
It's not because they didn't win a cup or got to the finals that it wasn't the right system.


As for our team, no clue what our system will be, but in Pittsburgh, Therrien didn't have that much of a responsible system going on. They focused on offense, and rightfully so, with guys like Crosby, Staal and Malkin.
My guess is Therrien will preach a hard working, aggressive offensive system, with smart defensive decisions (obviously). But aggressive physical forecheck will be the primary focus and if you put a Semin with Plekanec and Cole, then I fail to see how the ceiling for Semin is lower than his career average.

I have no problem with Doan. I think he'd be a good addition, but I think we need more of a skilled winger than a gritty winger now. We have MaxPac-Cole-Gionta, Plek-DD are also gritty with strong forechecking skills, Eller as well. So a guy like Semin would fill a void.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Subban76 View Post
Its too funny people thinking Semin could score 40 with the Habs and their defensive system. I'm not even sure he would score 30. Say he does to be nice. Doan would give at least 20. So the extra 10 goals, at best, probably less, are worth more than Doan's character and leadership, grit, playoffs appaearance, etc. NOT EVEN CLOSE!
What defensive system do we have??? Martin was fired and RC didn't have any system going on. He was also let go. If you know anything about Therrien, then you know he isn't a defensive coach. He likes aggressive and physical forechecking teams, we will be aiming towards the offense more so than the defense.
Now, if we didn't already have strong forecheckers, I'd say Doan might be the better option, but we already have them on our team. What we don't have is raw talent like Semin.
Are the 10 goals more important? Tough to know. What if 4 of those are GWG? What if those goals make us get in the POs? What about in 3 years when Doan will be 39? How many goal differential will we be at??

For so many reasons, Semin is the better option. The only reason you have to bring Doan over him is ''character''.


Last edited by Kriss E: 07-26-2012 at 01:02 PM.
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Old
07-26-2012, 12:57 PM
  #130
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
No he's not. Since day one, Bergevin has said that he wants character players. As talented as he may be, Semin definitely doesn't have that attribute.

Careful now... there are skillful character players. Let's not fall in the mold that it's one or another, like the notion that all tough guys are goons and vice-versa.
You mean you don't want the Russian guy?

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Old
07-26-2012, 01:52 PM
  #131
Subban76
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
197G/469GP=0.4200...x 82GP=34.4Goals per year.
Very simple math. Considering you can't score .4 goal, you round it up to the highest number, 35.
Semin averages 35 goals per year. I don't care how or in which system he scored them, FACT is he's averaging about 35 goals per year.
Really, I have no idea why you're still arguing about this.



It's not really funny, more lame on your part because not only did I answer your post but so did DAChampion, you didn't answer to either of our responses.
I won't waste my time re-writing it, so here it is:





What defensive system do we have??? Martin was fired and RC didn't have any system going on. He was also let go. If you know anything about Therrien, then you know he isn't a defensive coach. He likes aggressive and physical forechecking teams, we will be aiming towards the offense more so than the defense.
Now, if we didn't already have strong forecheckers, I'd say Doan might be the better option, but we already have them on our team. What we don't have is raw talent like Semin.
Are the 10 goals more important? Tough to know. What if 4 of those are GWG? What if those goals make us get in the POs? What about in 3 years when Doan will be 39? How many goal differential will we be at??

For so many reasons, Semin is the better option. The only reason you have to bring Doan over him is ''character''.
Very simple math indeed. I'm a CPA, you won't win this one buddy. You divided by games played, problem is Semin as NEVER played a full season. He averages 30 goals per year, not 35. He would have averaged 35 per year if he had played 82 games per year every year, but that's not the case!

Which highlights another Doan dominance. He's never injured, While Semin almost always misses 10 game per year on average.

As for your response to the goals difference. That's your reponse? A blurb on non sense? Habs were defensive. Martin had no system Please, can you make more stuff up to try and validate your point. I like when you dig your hole deeper.

Therrien will be defensive, because he does not have Crosby and Malkin on this team. You can have a strong forecheck while playing a good defensive system, or is that too complex for you?

As for the 10 goals. Please. 1 extra goal every 8 games won't make much of a difference. But keep digging.

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Old
07-26-2012, 02:01 PM
  #132
Paul Dipietro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subban76 View Post
Very simple math indeed. I'm a CPA, you won't win this one buddy. You divided by games played, problem is Semin as NEVER played a full season. He averages 30 goals per year, not 35. He would have averaged 35 per year if he had played 82 games per year every year, but that's not the case!

Which highlights another Doan dominance. He's never injured, While Semin almost always misses 10 game per year on average.

As for your response to the goals difference. That's your reponse? A blurb on non sense? Habs were defensive. Martin had no system Please, can you make more stuff up to try and validate your point. I like when you dig your hole deeper.

Therrien will be defensive, because he does not have Crosby and Malkin on this team. You can have a strong forecheck while playing a good defensive system, or is that too complex for you?

As for the 10 goals. Please. 1 extra goal every 8 games won't make much of a difference. But keep digging.
That dominance will soon come to an end as "retirement" is the ultimate injury...

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Old
07-26-2012, 02:10 PM
  #133
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Subban76 View Post
Very simple math indeed. I'm a CPA, you won't win this one buddy. You divided by games played, problem is Semin as NEVER played a full season. He averages 30 goals per year, not 35. He would have averaged 35 per year if he had played 82 games per year every year, but that's not the case!

Which highlights another Doan dominance. He's never injured, While Semin almost always misses 10 game per year on average.

As for your response to the goals difference. That's your reponse? A blurb on non sense? Habs were defensive. Martin had no system Please, can you make more stuff up to try and validate your point. I like when you dig your hole deeper.

Therrien will be defensive, because he does not have Crosby and Malkin on this team. You can have a strong forecheck while playing a good defensive system, or is that too complex for you?

As for the 10 goals. Please. 1 extra goal every 8 games won't make much of a difference. But keep digging.
Semin avg 35G per 82GP. FACT. Simple and clear. Over the course of a full season(82GP), that is his current average. FACT.

Doan isn't injured as often, okay. He will also be 36 next year and retire in a couple of years.

A blurb of nonsense? Was it too hard for you to understand COLD HARD FACTS?
Or is that your counter argument when you have nothing else to say? You don't know what to answer so your resort to childish comments like ''blurb of nonsense'' and ''keep digging''?

Caps had the most dominant record and goal scoring touch since the lock out that year where Semin scored 40G and they kept the ''run and gun'' style. FACT.
They won the President trophy that year. FACT.
They did lose in the POs to us, but so did the defending Stanley Cup Champs. FACT.
Ovie, Green, Backstrom and Semin, all regressed offensively after that season. FACT.
Caps never looked as good or as dominant since that year. FACT.
Since after that season, they resorted to a more defensive style of play? FACT.

I know it's crazy, but, could there be a link between playing more defensively and less production??? Crazy stuff I know!
That's all a blurb of nonsense.

Players will generally produce less in a defensive system as opposed to an offensive one. Is that also non-sense?? And you dare criticize someone's understanding of the game after such moronic comments? Please man, your post is full of fail.

I also never said Martin didn't have a system. He actually did, and produced better results than I'd imagine. I said he was fired. FACT.
I said RC didn't have a system. All he did was tell the defense to dump it out of the zone by the boards, and tell our offensive guys to dump it in the zone. Not what I consider a system.

You think we will preach a defensive system next year? How does this make any freaking sense to you. Because we don't have two superstars we need to play defense?? Mike was not hired for his strong defensive structured system. He never employed one because he doesn't have one. We will be a physical aggressive forechecking team aimed towards the offense. We have a bunch of puck moving Dmen, and fast forwards, but yea, we'll play defensive with a non-defensive coach after 3years of failure under a defensive system. Makes a whole lot of sense to me.


As for the 10 extra goals. Thanks for telling me it won't make a difference. I feel much better now..


Last edited by Kriss E: 07-26-2012 at 02:16 PM.
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Old
07-26-2012, 02:15 PM
  #134
DAChampion
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Semin averages 31 goals and 33 assists in his 6 seasons following his rookie year, largely playing on the 2nd line.

He does miss 10 to 15 games per year. However, that's not a complete loss. Somebody else gets that roster spot in those 10 to 15 games. Eller getting a 15 game tryout on the 1st line wing next year sounds like a good plan.

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Old
07-26-2012, 05:00 PM
  #135
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With Semin signed by the Canes, we're down to Doan or no one.

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07-26-2012, 05:01 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
With Semin signed by the Canes, we're down to Doan or no one.
Arnott would be a solid late-signing... not Doan/Semin caliber, but also no where near as costly.

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07-26-2012, 05:05 PM
  #137
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Really shoulda signed Semin...

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07-26-2012, 05:16 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Semin averages 31 goals and 33 assists in his 6 seasons following his rookie year, largely playing on the 2nd line.

He does miss 10 to 15 games per year. However, that's not a complete loss. Somebody else gets that roster spot in those 10 to 15 games. Eller getting a 15 game tryout on the 1st line wing next year sounds like a good plan.
Semin had his biggest years playing with Ovechkin and Backstrom when they were playing run and gun, no way he comes close to those numbers in Carolina regardless of who or how much they play him. He'll probably play around 70-75 games and put up 25-30 goals and 60 points.

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07-26-2012, 05:17 PM
  #139
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Well, at least, we're not getting Semin.

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07-26-2012, 05:36 PM
  #140
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Kirk Means Work wanted Semin so that confirms what all of us who wanted him seen. Going to a Kirk Muller Coached team confirms he's no slouch.

Oh well I guess we just stay put and hope for the best

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07-26-2012, 05:52 PM
  #141
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Poor Canes fans...at least it's only a year. But $7 millions??

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07-26-2012, 06:05 PM
  #142
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Good signing by Carolina.

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07-26-2012, 06:07 PM
  #143
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On a one year deal, I would have brought in Semin. Can't believe he wasn't even an option for us. Worst case scenario at one year, semin becomes an asset at the deadline. Sigh.

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07-26-2012, 06:17 PM
  #144
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People, maybe we tried, and Semin said no? People always assume it's a lack of effort from our management's end.

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07-26-2012, 06:21 PM
  #145
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People, maybe we tried, and Semin said no? People always assume it's a lack of effort from our management's end.
I do believe Bergevin openly admitted Semin was not a part of his plans.

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07-26-2012, 07:01 PM
  #146
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We would be a bubble team with Semin.

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07-26-2012, 07:04 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
From another poster.
No, no Subban76 is the authority here. Respect.

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07-26-2012, 09:14 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
You mean you don't want the Russian guy?
You don't pay much attention, do you? I've stated in a couple of occasions in the last few days that I would have taken a chance with Semin on a one or two year deal at $5M per season.

But in this thread, it's between Doan or Semin on same term, same contract. Yes, I pick Doan.

Here, I'll save you the trouble of searching... also to prove how wrong you are.

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=115
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...3&postcount=79


Last edited by Habsterix*: 07-26-2012 at 09:19 PM.
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07-26-2012, 10:42 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by LaTenderness View Post
Yep the second Semin stops skating full speed the entire team will throw in the towel. Anyone who's played hockey knows this.
I sense a bit if sarcasm here. Nothing more frustrating as a team mate than seeing someone so talented that plays with little emotion and passion. That is AK, that is semin! Wasn't semin benched in the press box a few times this year? Anyway, guess this debate can end with the signing

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07-26-2012, 11:02 PM
  #150
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Great signing for Carolina. Would have loved to see him on the Habs on those terms. Event at two years, 6 million, I would have gladly taken him.

Guy gets a bad rap because he's Russian. I think in the last 4 years combined there are only 3 or 4 players in the NHL with a better +/-.

Anyhow, good luck to him in Carolina.

And:
Semin way before Doan (assuming same contract terms). Considering the terrible year he (and the entire Capitals team had), he still outscored Doan, and Doan is not getting any younger.

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