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Old
07-30-2012, 01:24 PM
  #1
Fire Sather
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Gymnastics

USA good stuff last night.. stupid 2 per country rule, Jordyn Wieber should be in the all around.

My favorite olympic event. Hopefully they can win gold and bring back memories of 1996

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07-30-2012, 01:30 PM
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Shrimper
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Britain won Silver and was demoted to Bronze as Japan lodged a protest on their final score.

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07-30-2012, 01:49 PM
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Ceremony
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Right I was away when Japan were moaning? What was their appeal about?

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07-30-2012, 01:52 PM
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GKJ
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Sounding off on that dumb rule. Just seems to be put in place to ensure gymnasts from lesser countries can find lightning in a bottle. They already compete against each other to get on to the Olympic team, they shouldn't then be competing against their 'teammates' to get into the all-around.

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07-30-2012, 01:53 PM
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Germans botched and botched left and right

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07-30-2012, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceremony View Post
Right I was away when Japan were moaning? What was their appeal about?
Made an appeal about there final score. Was given more for the landing. Joke.

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07-30-2012, 02:26 PM
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Results spoiled.

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07-30-2012, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
Made an appeal about there final score. Was given more for the landing. Joke.
If it was the guy who slipped off the pommel horse who got his scored bumped up that really is a joke.

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07-30-2012, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
Made an appeal about there final score. Was given more for the landing. Joke.
I think the issue was more a handstand just before the dismount that the judges didn't count. Shaky landing, but if you add the difficulty of the handstand prior to it, I guess that's what gave them the edge.

Sucks for Ukraine.

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07-30-2012, 10:54 PM
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I hate the point scrounging from coaches to try to secure a medal. It's distasteful. I couldn't see Canada or Great Britain begging judges to change their scoring. Take defeat like an athlete. You made a mistake your handstand/dismount barely registered as a stand at all. It was a handstand motion that didn't mount to anything other than a continual fall to the ground. Sick. I don't like gymnastics and didn't watch the full competition but I don't like poor sports.

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07-30-2012, 10:56 PM
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I'm no expert but that looked like a load of **** to me.

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07-30-2012, 11:02 PM
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I'm not an expert either, but this is the 2nd day in a row where we're sitting here saying how some rule is stupid.

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07-30-2012, 11:06 PM
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Japan went from not having a medal to silver, you're damned right I would've appealed too. Instead of blaming them like some people are doing cause they did what is in their right to do, maybe people should talk about the judges.

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07-30-2012, 11:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
Japan went from not having a medal to silver, you're damned right I would've appealed too. Instead of blaming them like some people are doing cause they did what is in their right to do, maybe people should talk about the judges.
CTV mentioned the introduction of replay going back to 2004 on Athens, when a similar controversy (I guess, can't recall) was not overturned due to lack of video review. So now that video review is possible, people are still having a problem with a judge's final decision.

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07-30-2012, 11:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modo View Post
CTV mentioned the introduction of replay going back to 2004 on Athens, when a similar controversy (I guess, can't recall) was not overturned due to lack of video review. So now that video review is possible, people are still having a problem with a judge's final decision.
It was Paul Hamm who won all around and the FIG appealed for a South Korean. It took a few months and a bunch of crap to finally get a decision that the score would stay what it was.
Here it is on Wiki

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07-31-2012, 01:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
Sounding off on that dumb rule. Just seems to be put in place to ensure gymnasts from lesser countries can find lightning in a bottle. They already compete against each other to get on to the Olympic team, they shouldn't then be competing against their 'teammates' to get into the all-around.
The rule was put after after Romania swept all 3 medals in 2000. One of the countries leading the charge for the rule change was the U.S.

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07-31-2012, 02:07 AM
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China gonna China.

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07-31-2012, 02:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
Made an appeal about there final score. Was given more for the landing. Joke.
What's a joke is people who haven't watched gymnastics in 4 years suddenly becoming experts and deciding that they know more about the sport than the judges.

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07-31-2012, 03:02 AM
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To me, what makes it look even worse is the way the appeal process goes. They showed the Japan coach walk up to the judge with a handful of money. I believe NBC said that to appeal, you have to give the judges money and depending on which way they rule, they either keep your money or you get it back. Talk about looking shady. It seriously had the appearance of a bribe, especially when they overturned the score.

I still think that was some shady scoring giving him credit for that handstand. I know they've said in other events you need to hold a position for a certain length to get credit (like on the rings) or on the high bar or uneven bars for women they talk about needing to hit totally vertical to get full credit for handstands. So for the pommel horse I would guess it needs to be something similar and I'm not sure I'd say he hit totally vertical or if he did held the position for any real length of time.

As for Jordan Wieber, it is a stupid rule, especially with the change in scoring from other Olympics. I can understand it not looking great for the sport if one country is dominant and wins all the medals. To me, it looks worse when someone that finished over 6 points behind the top 4-5 qualifiers is in the competition due to a rule(because the US isn't the only country of course to have their 3rd best all around gymnast booted out of the final because of the rule). Russia, China, Great Britain also had 3 place in the top 24. So now you're looking at the 25-28th best qualifiers in the competition. The point of the Olympics is to find out who is the best in the world. This rule prevents that from happening.

It would seriously be like if all 5 teams in one division made the NHL playoffs and then the league saying, oh sorry, only 3 teams from one division can make them, wouldn't want the playoffs overrun by one division.

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07-31-2012, 03:16 AM
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The Americans have two fantastic chances in the all around and imo both Gabby and Aly have the same chance winning as Jordyn would.

The big question is whether or not she was underscored and I enjoy the sport but am not a judge so I can't answer that.

I can't wait for the competition later.

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07-31-2012, 03:45 AM
  #21
danaluvsthekings
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
The Americans have two fantastic chances in the all around and imo both Gabby and Aly have the same chance winning as Jordyn would.

The big question is whether or not she was underscored and I enjoy the sport but am not a judge so I can't answer that.

I can't wait for the competition later.
Even if Jordyn were underscored, then it would have been Gabby Douglas or Aly Raisman who missed out on the chance to compete, someone that finished top 5 in qualifying, knocked out of the chance to compete for a medal due to the 2 athlete per country rule.

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07-31-2012, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Rotter View Post
The rule was put after after Romania swept all 3 medals in 2000. One of the countries leading the charge for the rule change was the U.S.
That doesn't not make it dumb.

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07-31-2012, 10:12 AM
  #23
Eisen
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
That doesn't not make it dumb.
I agree it's a bit off for teams that can enter a lot of gymnasts into the competition, but the Olympics is supposed to be a celebration for everyone. I can understand though why some teams are miffed. They train hard to get where they are.

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07-31-2012, 10:13 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
Japan went from not having a medal to silver, you're damned right I would've appealed too. Instead of blaming them like some people are doing cause they did what is in their right to do, maybe people should talk about the judges.
Yeah, I don't blame them, either. You're allowed to appeal and they thought they were justified in doing so (and apparently the review panel agreed). With that said, when I saw the replays it didn't look like the japanese guy really did get into a full handstand...but i'm no expert, so

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Rotter View Post
The rule was put after after Romania swept all 3 medals in 2000. One of the countries leading the charge for the rule change was the U.S.
Which makes the US's current whining all the more ironic. It's funny that a rule only becomes unfair when it negatively impacts the United States...back when the rule was different and Romania benefited, then that rule was unfair to the US.

Incidentally, it's not at all unusual for a country to be limited in the number of athletes it can enter in an event...most sports don't involve a line up of the best athletes in the world, but of the best (fixed number of) athletes from various countries. The difference with gymnastics is that the cut is actually made at the Olympics. They could always tell the national federations to hold the competition at the national level to decide what two athletes will be entered then - but I don't know if that's much better.


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Old
07-31-2012, 10:16 AM
  #25
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Swimming has the same rule where only 2 swimmers per country can enter an event.

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