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Your 3rd line center to NYR

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Old
07-31-2012, 01:37 AM
  #176
Rangerfan4life90
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Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
Cullen had his chance to play in NY. He underachieved.

Boyle had a chance to maybe play 4th line in NY but he was on the outside looking in. He seized opportunity and earned a spot on the team. I'll take that guy any day of the week.
He didn't underachieve. Guy was put in a role he wasn't suited for.

As an actual 3rd line center, Cullen would be amazing.

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07-31-2012, 01:57 AM
  #177
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Watch them all the time actually, if they were that good then they would have easily won the east and the cup. They play a great defensive shut down system but they dont transition the puck that well and they have a world class goaltender behind them. There forwards support the puck tremendously well and always back check hard. I am not saying that Girardi is bad by any stretch he is a very good defenseman but O Reilly has way more value he is a selke level forward that is 21 years old scored 50 plus points and already has 3 full seasons in the NHL.

Girardi is the 3rd best D man on your team. If I am the Rangers I make this trade in a heartbeat.
And yet strangely, you're not the Rangers and the Rangers wouldn't make it. If the Rangers were really looking for a third line center (they're not), there's no reason they would look into any deal that would cost them Girardi. It would open up a massive hole on the right side of the blueline. We'd have Stralman, Bickel, and Sauer if he's healthy. Or it would force them to rush McIlrath. And that's not even considering how hard it is to add defensemen and the massive contracts mediocrities like Wideman and Carle have been getting.

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Never have I seen a more arrogant fanbase with such a small sample size of good hockey by there home team. I watched enough hockey to see Two series wins against the 7th and 8th seed where if the bounces went the other teams way they would have been out in the first or second round. Lundqvist is a rock, it allows all the players infront of him to play a more confident game and Tortorella knows that. He knows the types of players he has, he is a smart coach he plays to his teams strenghts. Block shots, clog up all areas of the ice get the puck in deep and ware down the opposition.

Girardi plays a perfect style hockey for how his team is set to operate so he thrives in it. Why do you think it took him this long to break out exactly? Atleast when I watch the rangers its not with rose colored glasses therefore I can give an unbiased evaluation.
What ever would we do without your ingenious insights into our team and fanbase?

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You're out of your mind, if that's a garbage offer what do you suggest just happened when the Rangers landed Nash for spare parts a journyman prospect and a late first.
Yeah, it's not like Howson told the world Nash wanted out and Nash had a NMC that he took full advantage of. Nope. Clearly there's absolutely no difference in leverage between that scenario and a hypothetical where teams are trying to convince the Rangers to deal Staal.

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Old
07-31-2012, 10:31 AM
  #178
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Watch them all the time actually, if they were that good then they would have easily won the east and the cup. They play a great defensive shut down system but they dont transition the puck that well and they have a world class goaltender behind them. There forwards support the puck tremendously well and always back check hard. I am not saying that Girardi is bad by any stretch he is a very good defenseman but O Reilly has way more value he is a selke level forward that is 21 years old scored 50 plus points and already has 3 full seasons in the NHL.

Girardi is the 3rd best D man on your team. If I am the Rangers I make this trade in a heartbeat.
Anyone who watched the Rangers last year could tell you that we play a great shutdown system with relatively good puck moment. What we didn't do well was that our forwards, being the chippy, gritty ******** they are, seemed absolutely intent on dump-and-chase style play. It wasn't the transition game that was bad, it was the forward thought process.

Furthermore, anyone who watched the Rangers and honestly thought that Girardi was our third best defender is nuts. He was our ROCK last year. Find me another defender who can do what he does that consistently that isn't already wearing our sweater. Ain't happening.

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Never have I seen a more arrogant fanbase with such a small sample size of good hockey by there home team. I watched enough hockey to see Two series wins against the 7th and 8th seed where if the bounces went the other teams way they would have been out in the first or second round. Lundqvist is a rock, it allows all the players infront of him to play a more confident game and Tortorella knows that. He knows the types of players he has, he is a smart coach he plays to his teams strenghts. Block shots, clog up all areas of the ice get the puck in deep and ware down the opposition.
Ah, so the fanbase is wrong because we happen to rate Girardi highly. Go ****ing whine to the Norris committee. He finished 5th in Norris voting for a reason.

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Girardi plays a perfect style hockey for how his team is set to operate so he thrives in it. Why do you think it took him this long to break out exactly? Atleast when I watch the rangers its not with rose colored glasses therefore I can give an unbiased evaluation.
Probably because it takes defenders longer to develop and barring absurd offensive seasons (ie, Erik Karlsson putting up 75 points, Shea Weber/Dion Phaneuf scoring 20 goals), two way players take longer to recognize as studs. Girardi's been solid for years now, he's gotten even better at what he does and added a pinch of offense on top.

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You're out of your mind, if that's a garbage offer what do you suggest just happened when the Rangers landed Nash for spare parts a journyman prospect and a late first.
Different situations. Last I checked, the Avs aren't actively shopping Ryan O'Reilly. Ryan O'Reilly doesn't have a NMC. Ryan O'Reilly hasn't been singlehandedly doing the Avs heavy lifting since 2002. Ryan O'Reilly hasn't requested a trade.

If the question boils down to "Would you trade Dan Girardi, straight up, for Ryan O'Reilly?" - I say no. You don't break up a good thing like the Rangers D - it would be foolhardy to break the backbone of your team for what would be our 3rd line center.

I still can't believe we're having this ass ****ing backward stupid conversation.

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Old
07-31-2012, 12:20 PM
  #179
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The problem with Boyle is not that he is a bad player but that he does not distribute the puck well, which is a big problem if Richards or Stepan go down considering Nash and Gaborik thrive with players who can get themthe puck. It also limits our flexibility and potentially the balance on our lines if we want to put Kreider on the third line, which may happen for a variety of reasons such as his confidence, needing to work on his defense or due to chemistry that Hagelin has show with Richards and Gaborik. Having Boyle center Kreider would really handicap him offensively in my opinion and would be a waste of his talent.
I really think Tim Connolly could be a good fit with the Rangers.

People talk poorly of him because his contract is somewhat inflated, he has a history of injuries, and people had unrealistic expectations of him.

HOWEVER, if you actually take a step back and look at it from an unbiased opinion, he's not a bad option.

He's not the top line player the Leafs were hoping for when they signed him.
But at this point in his career he's a pretty good 2nd/3rd tweener.

Judging from the Rangers fans worried about a potential Richards/Stepan injury, this is the type of player you are looking for.

He is responsible defensively, blocks a TON of shots (something Torts loves), and is a pretty decent PK-er.
The people who bash him often overlook these qualities.

He also still has the slick hands to be able to step up and fill in as #2 C in the case of injury, and the versatiliy to play on the wing if needed.

Yes, his $4.75M cap hit is hefty, but there's only 1 year left on it (perfect placeholder until JT Miller is ready) and the Rangers are WAY below the cap this year - even after the Nash deal - so they would have no problem absorbing it.

Also, he's averaged over 70 games a season for the past 3 years, so his severe injury history appears to be well behind him.

Finally, the best part for the Rangers is that he would come cheap, without giving up anything significant from their roster.

The Leafs have a ton of 2nd/3rd tweener C's, so someone has to go (now a #1 C... that's a different story...).
They'd likely be willing to give him up for a very reasonable return.

And don't reply with "7th Rounder!", because anyone who is being realistic knows he is worth more than that.
He'll fetch what I would call a "modest return".

3rd rounder? Mid-level Prospect? Depth Player with size/Grit?



(Sorry for the long post, it's just frustrating when people automatically dismiss a proposal without actually thinking it through because they've been conditioned to automatically say "(player x) is garbage", or "No way! (player y) has $$$$ Cap Hit!")


Last edited by ColePens: 07-31-2012 at 12:31 PM.
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Old
07-31-2012, 12:30 PM
  #180
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I really think Tim Connolly could be a good fit with the Rangers.

People talk poorly of him because his contract is somewhat inflated, he has a history of injuries, and people had unrealistic expectations of him.

HOWEVER, if you actually take a step back and look at it from an unbiased opinion, he's not a bad option.

He's not the top line player the Leafs were hoping for when they signed him.
But at this point in his career he's a pretty good 2nd/3rd tweener.

Judging from the Rangers fans worried about a potential Richards/Stepan injury, this is the type of player you are looking for.

He is responsible defensively, blocks a TON of shots (something Torts loves), and is a pretty decent PK-er.
The people who bash him often overlook these qualities.

He also still has the slick hands to be able to step up and fill in as #2 C in the case of injury, and the versatiliy to play on the wing if needed.

Yes, his $4.75M cap hit is hefty, but there's only 1 year left on it (perfect placeholder until JT Miller is ready) and the Rangers are WAY below the cap this year - even after the Nash deal - so they would have no problem absorbing it.

Also, he's averaged over 70 games a season for the past 3 years, so his severe injury history appears to be well behind him.

Finally, the best part for the Rangers is that he would come cheap, without giving up anything significant from their roster.

The Leafs have a ton of 2nd/3rd tweener C's, so someone has to go (now a #1 C... that's a different story...).
They'd likely be willing to give him up for a very reasonable return.

And don't reply with "7th Rounder!", because anyone who is being realistic knows he is worth more than that.
He'll fetch what I would call a "modest return".

3rd rounder? Mid-level Prospect? Depth Player with size/Grit?



(Sorry for the long post, it's just frustrating when people automatically dismiss a proposal without actually thinking it through because they've been conditioned to automatically say "(player x) is garbage", or "No way! (player y) has $$$$ Cap Hit!")
I wouldn't be opposed to the idea of a mid-range prospect or a 3rd/4th for Connolly.

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07-31-2012, 12:35 PM
  #181
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I wouldn't be opposed to the idea of a mid-range prospect or a 3rd/4th for Connolly.
Same here. Although, he has glass bones and sucks in the playoffs.

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07-31-2012, 12:40 PM
  #182
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Same here. Although, he has glass bones and sucks in the playoffs.
Well....at least we didn't burn him out!!!

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07-31-2012, 03:22 PM
  #183
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Anyone who watched the Rangers last year could tell you that we play a great shutdown system with relatively good puck moment. What we didn't do well was that our forwards, being the chippy, gritty ******** they are, seemed absolutely intent on dump-and-chase style play. It wasn't the transition game that was bad, it was the forward thought process.
If the Rangers were transitioning the puck well then the players wouldnt be dumping it in. If an NHL hockey player dumps the puck on an odd man rush or an attempt to get a quality shot then he probably shouldnt be in the NHL. However knowing that these players are in the NHL and you do have a quality group id be willing to bet that the transition game isnt great. You cant have it all Ranger fans, yes you have a good team yes your team is good at what it does. But if they were that good at everything they would have been better last season with more dominating play and better results. A non high stick by Ward or a complacent senators team in game 6 when they had the lead and they are done early then what?

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Furthermore, anyone who watched the Rangers and honestly thought that Girardi was our third best defender is nuts. He was our ROCK last year. Find me another defender who can do what he does that consistently that isn't already wearing our sweater. Ain't happening.
Well yes I agree he had the best regular season of your defenders, however as the playoffs went along I believe your fanbase agrees and most of the posters on here McDonough started to outplay him and Staal is on the road to recovery and being one of the top defenseman in the NHL. Staals skating, size, gap control, transition game and escapability is just flat out better then Girardi he just came off a career threatening injury there is an adjustment period.

So wait you think that Girardi is the best defenseman in the NHL? Atleast based on what I bolded that would prove to be your belief? Yes or no?

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Ah, so the fanbase is wrong because we happen to rate Girardi highly. Go ****ing whine to the Norris committee. He finished 5th in Norris voting for a reason.



Probably because it takes defenders longer to develop and barring absurd offensive seasons (ie, Erik Karlsson putting up 75 points, Shea Weber/Dion Phaneuf scoring 20 goals), two way players take longer to recognize as studs. Girardi's been solid for years now, he's gotten even better at what he does and added a pinch of offense on top.



Different situations. Last I checked, the Avs aren't actively shopping Ryan O'Reilly. Ryan O'Reilly doesn't have a NMC. Ryan O'Reilly hasn't been singlehandedly doing the Avs heavy lifting since 2002. Ryan O'Reilly hasn't requested a trade.

If the question boils down to "Would you trade Dan Girardi, straight up, for Ryan O'Reilly?" - I say no. You don't break up a good thing like the Rangers D - it would be foolhardy to break the backbone of your team for what would be our 3rd line center.

I still can't believe we're having this ass ****ing backward stupid conversation.
I donít blame your fanbase at all for valuing Girardi one bit he is a good defender, I think its evident that he thrives in the Rangers system and he is coming off a career year. Hence the Norris voting, however no he is not a top 5 D man in the NHL. I also understand your point in not wanting to break up a contending team. I just think you over valuate Rangers and undervalue well every other team in the league. OíReilly in my opinion based on age, production, career path and value carries more in trade then Girardi. I also donít believe he is a third line center he is in the mold of a very good 2nd line centerman. I am not sure where you were going with the comparison of OíReilly deal and the Nash highway robbery so Iíll just leave it at that.

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Old
07-31-2012, 03:54 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by gdg9 View Post
I really think Tim Connolly could be a good fit with the Rangers.

People talk poorly of him because his contract is somewhat inflated, he has a history of injuries, and people had unrealistic expectations of him.

HOWEVER, if you actually take a step back and look at it from an unbiased opinion, he's not a bad option.

He's not the top line player the Leafs were hoping for when they signed him.
But at this point in his career he's a pretty good 2nd/3rd tweener.

Judging from the Rangers fans worried about a potential Richards/Stepan injury, this is the type of player you are looking for.

He is responsible defensively, blocks a TON of shots (something Torts loves), and is a pretty decent PK-er.
The people who bash him often overlook these qualities.

He also still has the slick hands to be able to step up and fill in as #2 C in the case of injury, and the versatiliy to play on the wing if needed.

Yes, his $4.75M cap hit is hefty, but there's only 1 year left on it (perfect placeholder until JT Miller is ready) and the Rangers are WAY below the cap this year - even after the Nash deal - so they would have no problem absorbing it.

Also, he's averaged over 70 games a season for the past 3 years, so his severe injury history appears to be well behind him.

Finally, the best part for the Rangers is that he would come cheap, without giving up anything significant from their roster.

The Leafs have a ton of 2nd/3rd tweener C's, so someone has to go (now a #1 C... that's a different story...).
They'd likely be willing to give him up for a very reasonable return.

And don't reply with "7th Rounder!", because anyone who is being realistic knows he is worth more than that.
He'll fetch what I would call a "modest return".

3rd rounder? Mid-level Prospect? Depth Player with size/Grit?



(Sorry for the long post, it's just frustrating when people automatically dismiss a proposal without actually thinking it through because they've been conditioned to automatically say "(player x) is garbage", or "No way! (player y) has $$$$ Cap Hit!")
Where is the cap being set in the next CBA? Maybe you know because the NHL teams don't know.

That $4.75M is a big number. The cap could easily decrease in the next CBA.

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Old
07-31-2012, 06:10 PM
  #185
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To ny
Belanger
Potter
Pelss

To edm
McIlrath

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07-31-2012, 06:12 PM
  #186
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To ny
Belanger
Potter
Pelss

To edm
McIlrath
This is very bad for NY. Put on your flame suit.

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07-31-2012, 06:34 PM
  #187
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Belanger for a face-off in the Offensive zone when Edm plays NYR and a 50$ gift card to subway.

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07-31-2012, 06:52 PM
  #188
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Pfft, 3rd line centers are very valuable. I'd even throw in Nash
Jordan Staal was a third line center?

As was Tyler Seguin,

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07-31-2012, 06:55 PM
  #189
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I wouldn't be opposed to the idea of a mid-range prospect or a 3rd/4th for Connolly.
Honestly give us a 3rd round pick and some body who is in the minors eating up a contract or if you want to be kind we will gladly take a 4th and the free contract slot.

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07-31-2012, 06:59 PM
  #190
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Gomez is a 3rd line C, how about him?

On a more serious note, would a Eller+ Yannick Weber (RFA)+ a pick for McDo make sense?

My first proposal here, hopefully it isnt too unbalanced.

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07-31-2012, 07:01 PM
  #191
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Gomez is a 3rd line C, how about him?

On a more serious note, would a Eller+ Yannick Weber (RFA)+ a pick for McDo make sense?

My first proposal here, hopefully it isnt too unbalanced.
Unfortunately, it is.

Nothing from Montreal is worth what McDonagh is to the Rangers.

There isn't much the Rangers could offer for Eller, although he would fit in nicely. Maybe something around McIlrath but I doubt MTL would be interested.

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07-31-2012, 09:50 PM
  #192
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Watch them all the time actually, if they were that good then they would have easily won the east and the cup. They play a great defensive shut down system but they dont transition the puck that well and they have a world class goaltender behind them. There forwards support the puck tremendously well and always back check hard. I am not saying that Girardi is bad by any stretch he is a very good defenseman but O Reilly has way more value he is a selke level forward that is 21 years old scored 50 plus points and already has 3 full seasons in the NHL.

Girardi is the 3rd best D man on your team. If I am the Rangers I make this trade in a heartbeat.
No, you don't watch them all of the time. If you did, you'd know that Girardi and McDonagh were the rocks that held up our defense all season.

The lack of offense was the team's undoing, as well as some untimely injuries to Gaborik and Stepan right before the playoffs that they played through.

Also, their transitional play is poor? What in the blue hell are you talking about? Their transitional game is actually very good, it's the offense that doesn't put the puck in the net on the power play and has trouble doing it sometimes in the offensive zone. They needed another game breaking goal scorer and got him, his name is Rick Nash.

O'Reilly is a 2nd/3rd line center, and wouldn't slot in at the #2 slot as Stepan is a far better playmaker and has chemistry with Gaborik, who will be playing with him most likely when he gets back.

Girardi is just below the level of Norris finalist defenders, and yet he doesn't put up the big points that the finalists do. That speaks volumes about his defensive play and two-way game.

This is what pisses me off about this site. People like you who come on here and try to tell me that they know more about my team and my team's players when I watched all 102 games and I can clearly tell that you've watched less than a handful.

I wish people would just stop attempting to be know-it-all's.

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07-31-2012, 10:23 PM
  #193
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I wonder if there's a case to be made for "you're both right" - i.e. Girardi may not be tops in the League, but when working with McD he gets to that level because they're just so effective together.

We saw a similar phenomenon over here with Tyutin-Nikitin; the advanced stat folks are putting them on a pedestal with Weber-Suter for their 5-on-5 play.

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07-31-2012, 11:11 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by bert View Post
if they were that good then they would have easily won the east and the cup. They play a great defensive shut down system but they dont transition the puck that well and they have a world class goaltender behind them. There forwards support the puck tremendously well and always back check hard. I am not saying that Girardi is bad by any stretch he is a very good defenseman but O Reilly has way more value he is a selke level forward that is 21 years old scored 50 plus points and already has 3 full seasons in the NHL.
Then keep O'Reilly, cause there's no chance in hell any Rangers fan moves Girardi for him. I'll take a physical, shutdown, blue-collar ironman dmen who's only missed 2 games to injury in the 5+ season's in the league. That's unheard of for players of his mold. 3.4m cap hit to boot.

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Girardi is the 3rd best D man on your team. If I am the Rangers I make this trade in a heartbeat.
So we should move him because he's our third best dman? Newsflash: He's a first pairing dmen, and the best RHD in our organization. You're not the Rangers, and if you were you wouldn't even think twice about moving Girardi with our current roster.

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Never have I seen a more arrogant fanbase with such a small sample size of good hockey by there home team. I watched enough hockey to see Two series wins against the 7th and 8th seed where if the bounces went the other teams way they would have been out in the first or second round. Lundqvist is a rock, it allows all the players infront of him to play a more confident game and Tortorella knows that. He knows the types of players he has, he is a smart coach he plays to his teams strenghts. Block shots, clog up all areas of the ice get the puck in deep and ware down the opposition.
Lundqvist's play has nothing to do with how exceptional a defender Girardi is. And if you want to label our entire fanbase as arrogant for refusing to move Girardi for a 50 point center, so be it. Teams would go ape-**** if he was available, and ultimately blow that offer away without even flinching. Truth.

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Girardi plays a perfect style hockey for how his team is set to operate so he thrives in it. Why do you think it took him this long to break out exactly? Atleast when I watch the rangers its not with rose colored glasses therefore I can give an unbiased evaluation.
Girardi broke out years ago. If you watched enough Rangers hockey, you would clearly know this.

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You're out of your mind, if that's a garbage offer what do you suggest just happened when the Rangers landed Nash for spare parts a journyman prospect and a late first.
It's a garbage offer because it doesn't improve our team. And calling the package we sent for nash 'spare parts' further proves you don't know jack **** about anything Rangers related. Quite while you're ahead because you're embarrassing yourself.

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Watch them all the time actually
You don't watch ****. The fact that I'm not the only person to suggest so, further proves the obvious.

You're just another Hf poster who wants the board to believe you know what you're talking about, when all you're doing is proving you don't.

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I wonder if there's a case to be made for "you're both right" - i.e. Girardi may not be tops in the League, but when working with McD he gets to that level because they're just so effective together.
Girardi was just as effective with Staal. McDonagh didn't change Girardi's game one bit. He's played the same level of hockey for a half a decade now.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:36 PM
  #195
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
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Dan Girardi (For the noobs who don't know better)

*Amongst dmen*

2012
8th in hits
5th in blocked shots
10 minor penalty's all season long. 10. Just 10. Averaged 26min again against elite competition, and only took 10 minors all ****ing year long.

2011
9th in hits
1st in blocked shots
Averaged 24 minutes a game, took 16 minors. Look at how many penalties the elite players in this league draw, game after game.

2010
13th in hits
6th in blocked shots
21 minutes a game/19 minors. Worst ratio over the last three seasons, and it's still pretty impressive.

84 points over the last three season's. Two games missed to injury in his entire career, despite being a shot-blocking, and hitting machine. Dan Girardi, obviously he's overrated. Right. NYR fans overrate everyone.

Dan Girardi is a beast. And he has been. Works his ass off shift after shift, is mobile enough to regularly defend against the Crosby's, Ovechkin's, Malkin's, Stamkos's, and Kovalchuk's of the league, and he's been relied upon to do so for years now. Rarely loses a battle 1-on-1. Rarely takes minors. Is a leader. Makes a measly 3.4M.

The only people here who have 'just discovered how solid he is' are wannabe know-it-all's who should avoid discussing players they know very little about. He's a warrior, who's a 1st pairing NHL dmen and isn't being moved unless it's a no-brainer type of deal that's simply too good to pass up on. O'Reilly does not have the value to fetch you an all-star dmen like Danny G. Nor does any second/third line center.

And away we go. Another thread on Hf where foolish fans think they can acquire a stud for pony. Shop elsewhere if you don't like it. No Rangers fan wants to see him terrorizing our forwards shift after shift on another team.


Last edited by Boom Boom Geoffrion*: 07-31-2012 at 11:45 PM.
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07-31-2012, 11:46 PM
  #196
glasses91
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so is connolly for thomas a go!

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07-31-2012, 11:54 PM
  #197
GregSirico
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nailor Hopberle View Post
Shawn Horcoff is available for McDonough.
lulz!!!!

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07-31-2012, 11:56 PM
  #198
Zil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glasses91 View Post
so is connolly for thomas a go!
For Christian Thomas? The Rangers have no interest in Connolly and they're certainly not dealing Thomas for him.

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07-31-2012, 11:56 PM
  #199
GregSirico
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LupulMania View Post
You're going to think that this is a random Leafs fan dumping bad players, but the following are actually 3rd line quality/type centres that are out of place on the fall roster:

Tim Connolly
Matthew Lombardi
Tyler Bozak

While I'd love for Bozak to stick in TO I think he'd be a great fit at NYR
Bozak would interest me at the right price.

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07-31-2012, 11:59 PM
  #200
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I also would not mind Dominic Moore

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