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Old
07-31-2012, 07:39 PM
  #26
MikeModano9
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The way Klefbom looked in Dev. camp I'm almost certain if he wasn't committed to the SEL he would make the Oil and have a positive impact. Amazingly smooth skater and very good positionally. That being said Simmonds is the type of player that wins you the cup. Works extremely hard and plays with an edge that the Oilers top 6 desperately needs. I think the value is there, but Philly can't be letting go of Wayne for a gut who won't make an instant impact this season.

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Old
07-31-2012, 07:42 PM
  #27
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want Ryan Jones instead of Belanger?

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Old
07-31-2012, 08:20 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BowDangles View Post
What about a proposal based around Hemsky for Simmonds?
Sure. Hemsky & Eberle for Simmonds.

It works for the Flyers just like the OP worked for the Oilers.

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Old
07-31-2012, 08:55 PM
  #29
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Simmonds would be a nice addition but we need dman more than another top fwd.

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Old
07-31-2012, 09:02 PM
  #30
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Some people are seriously underrating Klefbom if they think this isn't fair value. That said, fair value doesn't make it a good deal

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Old
07-31-2012, 09:19 PM
  #31
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As much as I like Simmonds, I don't think the Oilers can trade Klefbom. The kid is going to be amazing.

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Old
07-31-2012, 10:37 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPStoEberletoHall View Post
To Oilers:
Simmonds
Rinaldo
2nd in 2013


To Flyers:
Klefbom
Belanger

I love Klefbom but I think Simmonds is a big powerforward the Oilers lack. Oilers are much more complete after this trade. Rinaldo is also young and can grow with the kids in Edm. Also makes Hemsky more available at the deadline

Simmonds-RNH-Eberle
Hall-Gagner-Yakopov
Smyth-Horcoff-Hemsky/Paajarvi
Hartikainen/Eager-Rinaldo-Jones


Thoughts?
I think?



Less I think!
More fact!

Klefbom was a WJC allstar.
They play the next year in the NHL.
You Know, Letang, Suter, Doughty, Pietrangelo, Hedman, Subban, karlsson, J. Carlson.

Trade him?
you do know mgmt is offering him guaranteed minutes next year.
Something they did not offer Schultz.

There is only one prospect I would want from philly for Klefbom.
He was the best defensive center in the game last year @ age 19.
So I think Philly would say no.

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Old
07-31-2012, 10:52 PM
  #33
oilerbear
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jepprey View Post
Big Simmonds fan, but Can't say Oilers should give up on Klefbom just yet. Philly won't be interested on going backwards.
Some oiler fans are ......... uh.......!
He just turned 19.

Lets do that with the other WJC allstars @ 19.

Can't say NSH should give up on Suter just yet.
Can't say LA should give up on Doughty just yet.
Can't say PIT should give up on Letang just yet.
Can't say Tampa should give up on Hedman just yet.
Can't say WSH should give up on J. Carlson just yet.
Can't say Ottawa should give up on Karlsson just yet.
Can't say STL should give up on Pietrangelo just yet.
Can't say MTL should give up on Subban just yet.

Kind of gives you an idea of the quality of the thought in this trade.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:02 PM
  #34
Roo Mad Bro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerbear View Post
I think?



Less I think!
More fact!

Klefbom was a WJC allstar.
They play the next year in the NHL.
You Know, Letang, Suter, Doughty, Pietrangelo, Hedman, Subban, karlsson, J. Carlson.

Trade him?
you do know mgmt is offering him guaranteed minutes next year.
Something they did not offer Schultz.

There is only one prospect I would want from philly for Klefbom.
He was the best defensive center in the game last year @ age 19.
So I think Philly would say no.
Klefbom is not even close to those players that you listed. Almost all of them were on a whole different stratosphere compared to him.

Couturier >>>>>>> Klefbom AINEC.

Simmonds >>> Klefbom. Guys who score almost 30 goals at the age of 23 don't grow on trees. He's a legit top 6 winger, who is lethal around the net, especially on the powerplay. Not to mention he's one hell of a grinder, and can throw absolute haymakers when he drops the gloves.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:21 PM
  #35
thadd
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Dammit this guy needs to stop making proposals. What a joke. Klefbom is the best d-man we've got in our system and he's likely to be the best d-man on our team in 3-4 years.

I think this guy enjoys making proposals which fellow members of his team hate.

I put this guy on my ignore list but the threads he starts still pop up. Talk about a bummer.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:23 PM
  #36
5RingsAndABeer
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Why the hell are we trading away one of the best defensive prospects in the league when the Oilers defense needs help so badly?

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:34 PM
  #37
Seedling
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Neither player is likely to be traded by either team for a few years at least IMHO. This trade doesn't work for the Oil because they see Klefbom as a potential 1,2 D. Doesn't work for Philly because they get Belanger and a D prospect for a proven top six power forward that is very hard to find. Just not gonna happen.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:42 PM
  #38
Roo Mad Bro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
Why the hell are we trading away one of the best defensive prospects in the league when the Oilers defense needs help so badly?
Why the hell are the Flyers trading away a 23 year old gritty winger who just scored 28 goals for an unproven dman?

Not to mention a 2nd round pick, even though the Oilers are getting the better/more valuable player by far.

No interest in Belanger either.

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Old
07-31-2012, 11:55 PM
  #39
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I'm going to be a homer here.

Simmonds > Klefbom now but Klefbom > Simmonds in 5 years.

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Old
08-01-2012, 01:38 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Klefbom is not even close to those players that you listed. Almost all of them were on a whole different stratosphere compared to him.

Couturier >>>>>>> Klefbom AINEC.

Simmonds >>> Klefbom. Guys who score almost 30 goals at the age of 23 don't grow on trees. He's a legit top 6 winger, who is lethal around the net, especially on the powerplay. Not to mention he's one hell of a grinder, and can throw absolute haymakers when he drops the gloves.
Says who? Klefbom is a top 25 prospect in the world in many experts eyes. It's not like all of those guys were top 5 prospects here. He needs to develop, but those players all did at one time as well.

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Old
08-01-2012, 02:00 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haute Couturier View Post
Simmonds > Klefbom + Belanger to me. Not sure why they have to give up a 2nd on top of it. Rinaldo is filler.

Klefbom is a good prospect, but the Flyers need help now so it wouldn't make sense to do that kind of deal.
this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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Old
08-01-2012, 04:08 AM
  #42
Darnell Nurse
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Both teams would pass

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Old
08-01-2012, 08:38 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Why the hell are the Flyers trading away a 23 year old gritty winger who just scored 28 goals for an unproven dman?

Not to mention a 2nd round pick, even though the Oilers are getting the better/more valuable player by far.

No interest in Belanger either.
Where in the post was it mentioned that it was a good deal for the Flyers? Your previous post was a gem as well, comparing Couts to Klefbom even though no one brought up Couts to begin with.

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Old
08-01-2012, 10:41 AM
  #44
MPStoEberletoHall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Dammit this guy needs to stop making proposals. What a joke. Klefbom is the best d-man we've got in our system and he's likely to be the best d-man on our team in 3-4 years.

I think this guy enjoys making proposals which fellow members of his team hate.

I put this guy on my ignore list but the threads he starts still pop up. Talk about a bummer.
It's just a proposal.... chill out

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Old
08-01-2012, 11:05 AM
  #45
SnS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerbear View Post
I think?



Less I think!
More fact!

Klefbom was a WJC allstar.
They play the next year in the NHL.
You Know, Letang, Suter, Doughty, Pietrangelo, Hedman, Subban, karlsson, J. Carlson.

Trade him?
you do know mgmt is offering him guaranteed minutes next year.
Something they did not offer Schultz.

There is only one prospect I would want from philly for Klefbom.
He was the best defensive center in the game last year @ age 19.
So I think Philly would say no.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Klefbom is not even close to those players that you listed. Almost all of them were on a whole different stratosphere compared to him.

Couturier >>>>>>> Klefbom AINEC.

Simmonds >>> Klefbom. Guys who score almost 30 goals at the age of 23 don't grow on trees. He's a legit top 6 winger, who is lethal around the net, especially on the powerplay. Not to mention he's one hell of a grinder, and can throw absolute haymakers when he drops the gloves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Intense Rage View Post
Where in the post was it mentioned that it was a good deal for the Flyers? Your previous post was a gem as well, comparing Couts to Klefbom even though no one brought up Couts to begin with.

Yes, Oilerbear did bring up Couts.


As for this deal, I'd say Philadelphia says no rather quickly and easily.

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Old
08-01-2012, 12:11 PM
  #46
Krishna
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
Yes, Oilerbear did bring up Couts.


As for this deal, I'd say Philadelphia says no rather quickly and easily.
Oh snap!

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Old
08-01-2012, 12:31 PM
  #47
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Klef hasn't played a game in the NHL and some oiler fans think he is worth more than a 22 year old 28 goal scorer. Sigh. Too many years of losing does this to you.

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Old
08-01-2012, 12:49 PM
  #48
5RingsAndABeer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Why the hell are the Flyers trading away a 23 year old gritty winger who just scored 28 goals for an unproven dman?

Not to mention a 2nd round pick, even though the Oilers are getting the better/more valuable player by far.

No interest in Belanger either.
I never said it was good for the Flyers. It doesn't make sense for either team

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Old
08-01-2012, 01:04 PM
  #49
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Nice try dudebrah, but...

(insert justification which has already been mentioned 9 times and imply that I have some sort of understanding or control over what happens in the NHL)

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Old
08-01-2012, 02:28 PM
  #50
oilerbear
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Klefbom is not even close to those players that you listed. Almost all of them were on a whole different stratosphere compared to him.

Couturier >>>>>>> Klefbom AINEC.

Simmonds >>> Klefbom. Guys who score almost 30 goals at the age of 23 don't grow on trees. He's a legit top 6 winger, who is lethal around the net, especially on the powerplay. Not to mention he's one hell of a grinder, and can throw absolute haymakers when he drops the gloves.
while you do seem to be mad? Angry?

rejecting a 6'4" 18 year old dman who took on the tough minutes in his teams playoffs. who was dominate at the WJC. Is idiotic bravado.

Known for shutting down and great skating for a big Dman. klefbom gave a sample of his ability at prospect camp. shutting down yakupov who dominated everyone else.

The couturier thing! he had the best defensive Fwd season last year @19.
But go Ahead be ANGRY!

Simmonds had 11 PPG last year. he is an 15 EVG/season player who faced third line competition last year. The sad thing is he had soft start at even 58% ozone and end up at 47% he yeilded 11%. one of the worst in the league. Some poor guys(we know who that was) had to come into there defensive zone to move the puck back to wear it had started.

I have looked at the affect of zone start and less than 40% guys facing first comp get 18 EVP a season. Guys in a 60+% zone start should get 51EVP/season 33PT diffrence because of were you start.

Simmonds played largely 3rd Comp in a 58% role He played 12.5 even minutes per game in 82 games. the average for that role is 41EVP he got 33. He was below average to add onto the 11% zone loss.
Facing protected thirds is not a grinder!

I would say that is ryan jones on our team but he faces harder zone start. does not yeild zone.
jones affect on specialty teams is greater
Jones #7 PK winger in the league.
Jones better scoring rate on the PP than Simmonds but Simmonds got 3min a night on his team.

krueger runs 4 fwd system on the PP.
-Two Goal scoring fwds.
-face off center who positions in front of the net
- PP side boards forward who does a rotation at point and down low.

The 2nd best scoring PP unit in the league was Hall, Eberle, Horcoff, RNH.
I do not see Krueger breaking that unit up.

On the seconfd unit:
the center is gagner. but he assumes the side board role. Jones was given a brief chance last year at the scoring forward role and produced better than simmonds on the PP.
Yakupov will be joining the team.
the 4th role will be between hemsky and Smyth.
Smith in front of the net when hemskyis not on. and Jones in front of the net when hemsky is on.

there is no room for Simmonds on our powerplay. all the other numbers are better.

So in Summary:

the guy is advocating trading a D prospect the swedish hockey communiting is saying is a generational shutdown talent.

For a Forward who faces sheltered 3rd Comp at even under produces against the soft comp at even. Rather see a line of Hartikainen-RNH-Hemsky get that soft parade.

Is great on the PP goal scoring wise but would be the 5th option for 4 places on our PP units.

Does not PK.

Edit: Simmonds is the perfect PP fit for Philly!

do not say a 28 goals scorer is a 30 goal scorer. potential 30.
He is a forward who averages 15 EVG a season and had a best of 11PPG.
That says 26G scorer.
Once simmonds moves up into 2nd comp role he will get 1.5 more even minutes and likely bump to 19 EvG/season.
then i would say a consistent 30G scorer.

Potential 30 goal scorers are rare.
there are only 30 30G guys a year.

But for us:
Hall
Eberle
RNH
Yakupov
Rieder

that is 5 potential that could cost us 5M+ each.


Last edited by oilerbear: 08-01-2012 at 02:44 PM.
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