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Old
08-06-2012, 09:34 AM
  #226
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Originally Posted by SnapVirus View Post
HAHAHAHA 300K enough for the rest of your life?

Dude I'm making 200K a year and if one year i'd do less tha 150K I'd be screwed.

300K isn't even a house god damnit. What are you talking about?
Well, cut the hookers down from M-W-F to just Friday, and lay off the blow.

But seriously, I lived an extremely social/active life in Japan (not exactly a cheap place to live, when apples are $2/3 a piece, etc.) and traveled SE Asia for 3+ weeks every year on $40K/year, so... all about lifestyles that we get ourselves used to.

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08-06-2012, 10:03 AM
  #227
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I hate the "spoiled athlete" comment.

They are human beings just like the rest of us and if you or I were as talented as they are, we would have lived very different lives thus far.

They have been treated differently than most people from a very young age. The reason that American athletes can be so obnoxious is because they are put on a pedestal at a very young age.

Hockey players tend to be a little more grounded but they are still people who are employed by a business that pays very, very well. Like the rest of us who are in the workplace, we are always very aware of our relative value to our employer and want to be compensated accordingly. The CEO earns more than the other execs; the execs earn more than the managers; the managers earn more than the supervisors; the supervisors earn more than the skilled labour; the skilled labour earn more than the custodians etc. Any deviation in this order is seen as in insult to the employee who sits higher in the organizational hierarchy.

Hockey players aren't any different. Money is important but so is respect and the acknowldgement of their value.
Well thought out post, and saved me considerable time in timing.

Subban will be compensated for what he's worth, just like Price did. To anyone saying "Oh but Price got 2.75M for 2 years after his ELC", well that may be true but Subban has been far more consistent among his peers and the best at his position in his two years while Price was experiencing extreme highs and extreme lows and was removed from the starting position altogether in 2010.

Subban is worth at minimum 3.5M per year on a short-term deal.

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08-06-2012, 10:10 AM
  #228
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Well, cut the hookers down from M-W-F to just Friday, and lay off the blow.

But seriously, I lived an extremely social/active life in Japan (not exactly a cheap place to live, when apples are $2/3 a piece, etc.) and traveled SE Asia for 3+ weeks every year on $40K/year, so... all about lifestyles that we get ourselves used to.
Good for you. But Subban will live a lifestyle comparable to that of his peers.

He's our star dman.

We don't want him sleeping on a $20 mattress he picked up from Craigslist and then have him develop back problems and suffer diseases due to bed bugs. He should probably buy a very expensive bed and mattress, $5,000 every 2 years sounds reasonable for a pro athlete. If I found out that any Habs player wasn't buying a very expensive mattress I would be pissed.

We don't want him to be in a $250/month apartment that will be full of mold, such that his stamina and alertness go down to zero.

We don't want him to live in the deep suburbs so he can save money on rent. It would be a waste of time for him to spend 2 hours a day in traffic.

If he wants expensive workout equipment in his apartment, he should have them. A good elliptical trainer can be $3000 easy. If he wants a trainer to come to his place that's $400/hour easy. He's not going to get some high school student from Nautilus gym who took a 4 week course to become a trainer.

He also represents the team. He needs to wear expensive clothes at social events, not $10 dress shirts from Goodwill. Otherwise people will complain that "he's a punk". A public celebrity like him needs a full rotation of $1000 suits and $300 dress shoes.

We don't want him to buy cheap meat, such that he develops cancer at age 28. He should be buying the healthiest groceries and eating in the best restaurants. For lunch, think $35 salmon steak in the old port, not $7 whopper at burger king.

Finally, we don't want him to spend 2 hours a day clipping coupons and scouring the internet for deals.

Give the man his due for crying out loud.


Last edited by DAChampion: 08-06-2012 at 10:28 AM.
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08-06-2012, 10:44 AM
  #229
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Good for you. But Subban will live a lifestyle comparable to that of his peers.
But see, that was my point - kind of. All I was saying to SnapVirus is that if anyone were to be "screwed" making $150K/year it would be because of lifestyle, and not the wider/greater economic environment.

See my response to Estimated_Prophet re: our opinion that salaries (should) rightfully acknowledge a player's value relative to his peers.

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08-06-2012, 03:38 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Good for you. But Subban will live a lifestyle comparable to that of his peers.

He's our star dman.

We don't want him sleeping on a $20 mattress he picked up from Craigslist and then have him develop back problems and suffer diseases due to bed bugs. He should probably buy a very expensive bed and mattress, $5,000 every 2 years sounds reasonable for a pro athlete. If I found out that any Habs player wasn't buying a very expensive mattress I would be pissed.

We don't want him to be in a $250/month apartment that will be full of mold, such that his stamina and alertness go down to zero.

We don't want him to live in the deep suburbs so he can save money on rent. It would be a waste of time for him to spend 2 hours a day in traffic.

If he wants expensive workout equipment in his apartment, he should have them. A good elliptical trainer can be $3000 easy. If he wants a trainer to come to his place that's $400/hour easy. He's not going to get some high school student from Nautilus gym who took a 4 week course to become a trainer.

He also represents the team. He needs to wear expensive clothes at social events, not $10 dress shirts from Goodwill. Otherwise people will complain that "he's a punk". A public celebrity like him needs a full rotation of $1000 suits and $300 dress shoes.

We don't want him to buy cheap meat, such that he develops cancer at age 28. He should be buying the healthiest groceries and eating in the best restaurants. For lunch, think $35 salmon steak in the old port, not $7 whopper at burger king.

Finally, we don't want him to spend 2 hours a day clipping coupons and scouring the internet for deals.

Give the man his due for crying out loud.
And what due is that?

If the rumors I keep hearing are right he wants 5m, just not sure for how long. Thats a little high in my opinion. Give him a short term mid ranged contract and extend him for more, exactly how we treated Price.

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08-06-2012, 03:44 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by SnapVirus View Post
HAHAHAHA 300K enough for the rest of your life?

Dude I'm making 200K a year and if one year i'd do less tha 150K I'd be screwed.

300K isn't even a house god damnit. What are you talking about?
With 300K of investments anybody can live off a 50-55K salary and live wealthy the national average is 35K a year 50K is upper-middle class, if you're screwed making 150K you live on another planet from the majority of western society and of course the rest of the world.

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08-06-2012, 03:46 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
With 300K of investments anybody can live off a 50-55K salary and live wealthy the national average is 35K a year 50K is upper-middle class, if you're screwed making 150K you live on another planet from the majority of western society and off course the rest of the world.
PK Subban is a star professional hockey player in Montreal.

He figuratively does live on another planet.

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08-06-2012, 03:50 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by Saint Patrick View Post
And what due is that?
To be paid in a manner comparable to other young dmen around the league on their 2nd contract performing at his level, which is approximately 5 years and 4 million a year.

It's been posted in this thread that:

Marc Staal got 3.975 million per for 5 years.
Luke Schenn got 3.6 million per year for 5 years.
Drew Doughty got 7 million per year for 8 years.
Tylers Myers got 5.5 million per year for 7 years.
Erik Karlsson got 6.5 million per year for 7 years.
Duncan Keith got 5.58 million per year for 13 years.

All of which were signed as 2nd contracts when the cap was lower than it is now.

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08-06-2012, 03:59 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
To be paid in a manner comparable to other young dmen around the league on their 2nd contract performing at his level, which is approximately 5 years and 4 million a year.

It's been posted in this thread that:

Marc Staal got 3.975 million per for 5 years.
Luke Schenn got 3.6 million per year for 5 years.
Drew Doughty got 7 million per year for 8 years.
Tylers Myers got 5.5 million per year for 7 years.
Erik Karlsson got 6.5 million per year for 7 years.
Duncan Keith got 5.58 million per year for 13 years.

All of which were signed as 2nd contracts when the cap was lower than it is now.

Salary is good, but let's not forget another huge source of income, endorsements. I'm sure PK gets bigger deals than those guys and part of it comes from playing in Mtl.

In any event, I don't think he should accept less because he (likely) gets more out of endorsements. I'm just saying there's probably a ton of things that play a role, salary is only a part of it.

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08-06-2012, 04:00 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
PK Subban is a star professional hockey player in Montreal.

He figuratively does live on another planet.
You obviously don't want to see my point. Any professional athlete of any sport being paid more than 1M$ a year is overpaid for the job they do and even what they bring to society. I'm not making the case that NHL players should be paid like in the 1970s, all that I'm saying is that if PK Subban decides to leave MTL for another team offering more $ over making 4M$ a year rather than 3M$ than we're just witnessing another case of spoiled athletes thinking that they are the most valuable things in our society over doctors, teachers, firefighters, policemen...

There is no way anyone can justify athletes making these astronomical salaries especially when most olympic athletes don't make 50K a year. The only reason to it is the fact that sports sells and people are willing to pay for it I admit that between owners making a few more billions or players I prefer to see players getting their cut. Just don't tell me PK subban deserves more $ than any doctor or nurse working 80 hours a week because he's living a high valued life with a lot of money to use on vacations, bars & clubs, sports cars etc.

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08-06-2012, 04:04 PM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
You obviously don't want to see my point. Any professional athlete of any sport being paid more than 1M$ a year is overpaid for the job they do and even what they bring to society. I'm not making the case that NHL players should be paid like in the 1970s, all that I'm saying is that if PK Subban decides to leave MTL for another team offering more $ over making 4M$ a year rather than 3M$ than we're just witnessing another case of spoiled athletes thinking that they are the most valuable things in our society over doctors, teachers, firefighters, policemen...

There is no way anyone can justify athletes making these astronomical salaries especially when most olympic athletes don't make 50K a year. The only reason to it is the fact that sports sells and people are willing to pay for it I admit that between owners making a few more billions or players I prefer to see players getting their cut. Just don't tell me PK subban deserves more $ than any doctor or nurse working 80 hours a week because he's living a high valued life with a lot of money to use on vacations, bars & clubs, sports cars etc.
Somewhere in a Habs negotiating Room:

Don Meehan: My client, PK Subban, would like to be paid a little higher than Marc Staal, as he is a marginally better player. Here's a detailed statistical comparative study completed by my research assistant. We suggest 5 years, 4.5 million per.

Marc Bergevin: How can you justify such an astronomical salary? Nurses working 80 hours a week make less.

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08-06-2012, 04:14 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Good for you. But Subban will live a lifestyle comparable to that of his peers.

He's our star dman.

We don't want him sleeping on a $20 mattress he picked up from Craigslist and then have him develop back problems and suffer diseases due to bed bugs. He should probably buy a very expensive bed and mattress, $5,000 every 2 years sounds reasonable for a pro athlete. If I found out that any Habs player wasn't buying a very expensive mattress I would be pissed.

We don't want him to be in a $250/month apartment that will be full of mold, such that his stamina and alertness go down to zero.

We don't want him to live in the deep suburbs so he can save money on rent. It would be a waste of time for him to spend 2 hours a day in traffic.

If he wants expensive workout equipment in his apartment, he should have them. A good elliptical trainer can be $3000 easy. If he wants a trainer to come to his place that's $400/hour easy. He's not going to get some high school student from Nautilus gym who took a 4 week course to become a trainer.

He also represents the team. He needs to wear expensive clothes at social events, not $10 dress shirts from Goodwill. Otherwise people will complain that "he's a punk". A public celebrity like him needs a full rotation of $1000 suits and $300 dress shoes.

We don't want him to buy cheap meat, such that he develops cancer at age 28. He should be buying the healthiest groceries and eating in the best restaurants. For lunch, think $35 salmon steak in the old port, not $7 whopper at burger king.

Finally, we don't want him to spend 2 hours a day clipping coupons and scouring the internet for deals.

Give the man his due for crying out loud.
You have to make five million dollars a year to get this stuff?

He can accept what every other comparable player on the team accepted (what Pacioretty, Gorges, and Price accepted), that two year, 3.5-5.5 million dollar contract).

They might not do it in other places, but here in Montreal they do the middle contract and that IMO is a great policy. They probably want a bigger sample size before they throw the huge contract at a player, and seeing all the bad contracts around the league you can see why.

And in my opinion, Subban was not THAT outstanding this past year. I don't know what everyone else' opinion is.

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08-06-2012, 04:39 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Andros777 View Post
You have to make five million dollars a year to get this stuff?

He can accept what every other comparable player on the team accepted (what Pacioretty, Gorges, and Price accepted), that two year, 3.5-5.5 million dollar contract).

They might not do it in other places, but here in Montreal they do the middle contract and that IMO is a great policy. They probably want a bigger sample size before they throw the huge contract at a player, and seeing all the bad contracts around the league you can see why.

And in my opinion, Subban was not THAT outstanding this past year. I don't know what everyone else' opinion is.
My point exactly, Subban still has alot to learn and prove. I also believe he wasnt that amazing last year. He deserve the same treatment Price had, and trust me when I say this Price is leagues ahead of Subban when it comes to importance on this team.

How easily people forget how the Gomez/Sather contract came to be and are willing to repeat that mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
You obviously don't want to see my point. Any professional athlete of any sport being paid more than 1M$ a year is overpaid for the job they do and even what they bring to society. I'm not making the case that NHL players should be paid like in the 1970s, all that I'm saying is that if PK Subban decides to leave MTL for another team offering more $ over making 4M$ a year rather than 3M$ than we're just witnessing another case of spoiled athletes thinking that they are the most valuable things in our society over doctors, teachers, firefighters, policemen...

There is no way anyone can justify athletes making these astronomical salaries especially when most olympic athletes don't make 50K a year. The only reason to it is the fact that sports sells and people are willing to pay for it I admit that between owners making a few more billions or players I prefer to see players getting their cut. Just don't tell me PK subban deserves more $ than any doctor or nurse working 80 hours a week because he's living a high valued life with a lot of money to use on vacations, bars & clubs, sports cars etc.
Couldn't have said it better myself, I applaud you.

Unfortunately we will always have people saying "pay the man his due" and then complain that ticket prices have become inaccessible. Yes I know its not all on the players...

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08-06-2012, 04:40 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
You obviously don't want to see my point. Any professional athlete of any sport being paid more than 1M$ a year is overpaid for the job they do and even what they bring to society. I'm not making the case that NHL players should be paid like in the 1970s, all that I'm saying is that if PK Subban decides to leave MTL for another team offering more $ over making 4M$ a year rather than 3M$ than we're just witnessing another case of spoiled athletes thinking that they are the most valuable things in our society over doctors, teachers, firefighters, policemen...

There is no way anyone can justify athletes making these astronomical salaries especially when most olympic athletes don't make 50K a year. The only reason to it is the fact that sports sells and people are willing to pay for it I admit that between owners making a few more billions or players I prefer to see players getting their cut. Just don't tell me PK subban deserves more $ than any doctor or nurse working 80 hours a week because he's living a high valued life with a lot of money to use on vacations, bars & clubs, sports cars etc.
Bring yourself back to Earth my friend.

Every employee regardless of profession is paid their relative market value. To call professional athletes overpaid is both ignorant and absolutely incorrect. Do you really believe that the owners should pocket all of the revenues and pay the players $40.00/hr. Well then I guess the owners are overpaid.......

The NHL creates huge revenues which are divided between ownership and players through a negotiated CBA.

If you want to look for people who are overpaid you won't have to look any further than your local government or hospital CEO. These are mainly borderline criminals who pilfer public funds through shady backroom deals and self serving interests that undermine the intended goal of their employment.

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08-06-2012, 04:47 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by Saint Patrick View Post
Unfortunately we will always have people saying "pay the man his due" and then complain that ticket prices have become inaccessible. Yes I know its not all on the players...
The ticket prices are not determined by the players salaries, they're determined by what consumers are willing to pay. Molson, like the other owners, has staff that estimate the most he can charge and still sell out every game.

I have lived in Columbus for 5 years. The Blue Jackets players get nearly the same salaries as Habs players yet tickets can be had for the maximum that people are willing to pay: $10/ticket.


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08-06-2012, 04:55 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Bring yourself back to Earth my friend.

Every employee regardless of profession is paid their relative market value. To call professional athletes overpaid is both ignorant and absolutely incorrect. Do you really believe that the owners should pocket all of the revenues and pay the players $40.00/hr. Well then I guess the owners are overpaid.......

The NHL creates huge revenues which are divided between ownership and players through a negotiated CBA.

If you want to look for people who are overpaid you won't have to look any further than your local government or hospital CEO. These are mainly borderline criminals who pilfer public funds through shady backroom deals and self serving interests that undermine the intended goal of their employment.
Did you ever hit the nail on the head there!!

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08-06-2012, 05:03 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by Andros777 View Post
You have to make five million dollars a year to get this stuff?

He can accept what every other comparable player on the team accepted (what Pacioretty, Gorges, and Price accepted), that two year, 3.5-5.5 million dollar contract).

They might not do it in other places, but here in Montreal they do the middle contract and that IMO is a great policy. They probably want a bigger sample size before they throw the huge contract at a player, and seeing all the bad contracts around the league you can see why.

And in my opinion, Subban was not THAT outstanding this past year. I don't know what everyone else' opinion is.
It's not my world man. I just gave out some examples that I could think of but there's no doubt more. The point is simply that the cost of living will be higher among pro athletes. They compete against other pro athletes who also invest their savings into themselves and set a standard that other athletes and celebrities have to live up to.

Personally I'd rather lock up Subban long-term. He was our no.1 D last year and will be no less than no. 2 going forward. He's part of our core. A lot of people don't like him based on "feeling" or whatever but the stats demonstrate his excellence. I think 6 years, 4.5 million, or approximately that is in the best interests of the team.

Price and Gorges had not proven themselves when they signed their second contract. Subban is much, much further in development than they were at that time. Pacioretty should be locked up long-term sometime in 2013.

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08-06-2012, 05:54 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Bring yourself back to Earth my friend.

Every employee regardless of profession is paid their relative market value. To call professional athletes overpaid is both ignorant and absolutely incorrect. Do you really believe that the owners should pocket all of the revenues and pay the players $40.00/hr. Well then I guess the owners are overpaid.......

The NHL creates huge revenues which are divided between ownership and players through a negotiated CBA.

If you want to look for people who are overpaid you won't have to look any further than your local government or hospital CEO. These are mainly borderline criminals who pilfer public funds through shady backroom deals and self serving interests that undermine the intended goal of their employment.
Are you joking with the bolded statement or are you the CEO of one of Canada's big banks? The second bold holds true for most owners of big companies all across this great nation of ours.

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08-06-2012, 06:13 PM
  #244
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Are you joking with the bolded statement or are you the CEO of one of Canada's big banks? The second bold holds true for most owners of big companies all across this great nation of ours.
Wrong CEOs literally have one of the hardest jobs on the planet.

Almost every decision they make impacts the entire company.

A good CEO can bring a company to prosperity while a bad one can cause bankruptcy and the loss of many jobs.

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08-06-2012, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Good for you. But Subban will live a lifestyle comparable to that of his peers.

He's our star dman.

We don't want him sleeping on a $20 mattress he picked up from Craigslist and then have him develop back problems and suffer diseases due to bed bugs. He should probably buy a very expensive bed and mattress, $5,000 every 2 years sounds reasonable for a pro athlete. If I found out that any Habs player wasn't buying a very expensive mattress I would be pissed.

We don't want him to be in a $250/month apartment that will be full of mold, such that his stamina and alertness go down to zero.

We don't want him to live in the deep suburbs so he can save money on rent. It would be a waste of time for him to spend 2 hours a day in traffic.

If he wants expensive workout equipment in his apartment, he should have them. A good elliptical trainer can be $3000 easy. If he wants a trainer to come to his place that's $400/hour easy. He's not going to get some high school student from Nautilus gym who took a 4 week course to become a trainer.

He also represents the team. He needs to wear expensive clothes at social events, not $10 dress shirts from Goodwill. Otherwise people will complain that "he's a punk". A public celebrity like him needs a full rotation of $1000 suits and $300 dress shoes.

We don't want him to buy cheap meat, such that he develops cancer at age 28. He should be buying the healthiest groceries and eating in the best restaurants. For lunch, think $35 salmon steak in the old port, not $7 whopper at burger king.

Finally, we don't want him to spend 2 hours a day clipping coupons and scouring the internet for deals.

Give the man his due for crying out loud.
I LOVE THIS POST!
Was just pissing myself!

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08-06-2012, 08:45 PM
  #246
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Stop trying to justify multi-million $ earning athletes. It's the way it is and it's OK. But plz don't brag that their lifestyle should be comparable to other rich powerful people and that's necessary for them, just as much as breathing air and drinking clean water. Most good CFL players are paid barely more than the upper-middle class and same for MLS players and you don't see them waiting in line for food at a church on sunday mornings. I'm not saying give him 75 000$ for the next season and if he doesn't accept he's a capitalist flesh eating vampire, he's just not worth more than 3/3.5 M$ for the moment and if he doesn't realize that he's overestimating himself and anyone that believes the same is also overestimating him. He played only two seasons and still does lots of costly mistakes.

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08-06-2012, 09:02 PM
  #247
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Originally Posted by SnapVirus View Post
HAHAHAHA 300K enough for the rest of your life?

Dude I'm making 200K a year and if one year i'd do less tha 150K I'd be screwed.

300K isn't even a house god damnit. What are you talking about?
Just by judging from you're profile and your grammar I don't believe you're either a doctor or an executive in a big company. My uncle makes 950 000$ a year and he's the sells department director for astral media and he didn't make more than 100K a year before working for 18 years and I believe you are 18 years old.

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Old
08-06-2012, 09:53 PM
  #248
hockeyfan2k11
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Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
Stop trying to justify multi-million $ earning athletes. It's the way it is and it's OK. But plz don't brag that their lifestyle should be comparable to other rich powerful people and that's necessary for them, just as much as breathing air and drinking clean water. Most good CFL players are paid barely more than the upper-middle class and same for MLS players and you don't see them waiting in line for food at a church on sunday mornings. I'm not saying give him 75 000$ for the next season and if he doesn't accept he's a capitalist flesh eating vampire, he's just not worth more than 3/3.5 M$ for the moment and if he doesn't realize that he's overestimating himself and anyone that believes the same is also overestimating him. He played only two seasons and still does lots of costly mistakes.
You seem pretty naive.

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Old
08-06-2012, 10:36 PM
  #249
waffledave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexdaman View Post
Just by judging from you're profile and your grammar I don't believe you're either a doctor or an executive in a big company. My uncle makes 950 000$ a year and he's the sells department director for astral media and he didn't make more than 100K a year before working for 18 years and I believe you are 18 years old.
I know 18 year olds making 200k... Just go to Alberta and most tradesmen make that easy.

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Old
08-06-2012, 10:57 PM
  #250
Teufelsdreck
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Originally Posted by icerocket View Post
Wrong CEOs literally have one of the hardest jobs on the planet.

Almost every decision they make impacts the entire company.

A good CEO can bring a company to prosperity while a bad one can cause bankruptcy and the loss of many jobs.
Like Mitt Romney.

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