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Stefan Noesen - top 6 upside?

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Old
08-08-2012, 07:37 AM
  #51
Dr.Sens(e)
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There may be a few similarities to Noesen and Foligno, but I don't think it's really an apt comparison.

Noesen, as noted, is a much better playmaker with excellent vision. Foligno isn't much of a playmaker at all, and is at his best in the open ice taking it to the net. Foligno probably has better one-on-one moves and might be a bit better skater, but I think Noesen is better in most other areas offensively. I also think Noesen is a tad meaner and better in the corners, although Foligno was a solid shift disturber at times, even if it meant a few too many goalie interference penalties.

I actually think Noesen is a much better potential fit long-term as a complimentary winger on a scoring line than Foligno, as he makes the players around him better. Foligno was kind of a black hole if you passed it to him, and always was hurt by the fact he had a below average shot and no real one-timer. Foligno would be a 25 goal scorer plus if he had a better shot - a way too high % of his goals are highlight reel types for a guy who never scored 20 goals.

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08-08-2012, 08:17 AM
  #52
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As long as Noesen can skate better than Foligno and can stay on his feat a little better than Foligno along with Foligno's top 9 hands, you have a top 6'er. If his skating/balance is not very good he may top out as a top 6 but will always be considered top 9.

Name of the game now a days is speed. Look at Stone, if he could skate well we would not even question his ability and say he's top 6, but he cant skate super well which will prob limit him to a top9 player. Still good though.

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08-08-2012, 08:19 AM
  #53
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Using two guys mentioned on this thread as comparisons:

He skates better than Perry, but (from what I've seen) Perry has superior offensive skills. Both have that nice edge to their game so I can see why he came up as a comparison.

Similarly, Foligno plays that similar style, but I think Noesen has better skills.

So I guess I think his upside is somewhere between Foligno's (50 points) and Perry's (100 points). I'd say that is definitely top 6, so I guess my answer is YES, Noesen's upside is top 6.

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08-08-2012, 09:17 AM
  #54
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If Noesen is another Foligno I'll poke my eyes out. Foligno was such a frustrating player to watch, and although he did start putting up some decent numbers, I can't help but watch the guy and always think he could do more...

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08-08-2012, 09:18 AM
  #55
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Further, with Alfies imminent retirement (next 1-2 years) we need one of Silfverberg, Noesen or Zibby to take off and fill in that top-6 role.

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08-08-2012, 10:22 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by corksens View Post
Further, with Alfies imminent retirement (next 1-2 years) we need one of Silfverberg, Noesen or Zibby to take off and fill in that top-6 role.
...Stone, Puempel, Hoffman.

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08-08-2012, 10:23 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
...Stone, Puempel, Hoffman.
Peltz.

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08-08-2012, 11:11 AM
  #58
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...Stone, Puempel, Hoffman.
Forgot about Stone.

Don't see the other two with quite the same all-around potential.

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08-08-2012, 11:36 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by corksens View Post
Forgot about Stone.

Don't see the other two with quite the same all-around potential.
Potential?

Maybe they won't realize it, but Puempel will either be a top 6 forward or he will be an AHLer. He'll never be a bottom 6er. His potential is certainly a Top 6 Sniper, that cannot be denied.

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08-08-2012, 11:38 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
...Stone, Puempel, Hoffman.

Hoffman will not be a top 6 player on this team. He may get a chance for a few months ala Butler, Bochenski etc.
If he becomes a regular top 6, the Sens are in trouble.

Small guy who got 21 goals, 49pts in the AHL. Nothing special at all.

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08-08-2012, 12:35 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Prajna View Post
Hoffman will not be a top 6 player on this team. He may get a chance for a few months ala Butler, Bochenski etc.
If he becomes a regular top 6, the Sens are in trouble.

Small guy who got 21 goals, 49pts in the AHL. Nothing special at all.
Let's see if Prince, Pageau, Da Costa, Cannone, Petersson, Filatov or Caporusso can do that?

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08-08-2012, 02:02 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Prajna View Post
Hoffman will not be a top 6 player on this team. He may get a chance for a few months ala Butler, Bochenski etc.
If he becomes a regular top 6, the Sens are in trouble.

Small guy who got 21 goals, 49pts in the AHL. Nothing special at all.
If he becomes a legit top 6 scorer we're in trouble just because he's small?

Not likely. We'll just be lucky that he beat the odds.

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08-08-2012, 02:11 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Prajna View Post
Hoffman will not be a top 6 player on this team. He may get a chance for a few months ala Butler, Bochenski etc.
If he becomes a regular top 6, the Sens are in trouble.

Small guy who got 21 goals, 49pts in the AHL. Nothing special at all.
Yeah I dont agree with this either. Hoffman has a great release and can skate like a beast. If Regin can play on this team then why not Hoffman? Ennis plays on Buffalo and is productive.

I agree with aragorn, lets see some of our other prospects in the A before we rank them higher than Hoffman. The guy is probobally gonna be one of our last cuts this year. I'll even say he lasts longer than Zibby (BOOM)

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08-08-2012, 02:29 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by playasRus View Post
If he becomes a legit top 6 scorer we're in trouble just because he's small?

Not likely. We'll just be lucky that he beat the odds.


I am just trying to sat odds are against him.
If he beats the odd, great for us!

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08-08-2012, 02:31 PM
  #65
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Yeah I dont agree with this either. Hoffman has a great release and can skate like a beast. If Regin can play on this team then why not Hoffman? Ennis plays on Buffalo and is productive.

I agree with aragorn, lets see some of our other prospects in the A before we rank them higher than Hoffman. The guy is probobally gonna be one of our last cuts this year. I'll even say he lasts longer than Zibby (BOOM)


I think Silf, Stone, Zibby, Noesen, have a a better chance than Hoffman.
Hoff is further along in his delevopment so he may have a better shot this year.
It won't last long IMO. Hopefully I am wrong.

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08-08-2012, 03:10 PM
  #66
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Yeah I dont agree with this either. Hoffman has a great release and can skate like a beast. If Regin can play on this team then why not Hoffman? Ennis plays on Buffalo and is productive.

I agree with aragorn, lets see some of our other prospects in the A before we rank them higher than Hoffman. The guy is probobally gonna be one of our last cuts this year. I'll even say he lasts longer than Zibby (BOOM)
I wanna talk to guys that don't have to see it in plain sight before they can see it coming, scouting isn't 100% science and no one has come close to perfecting it. But some people here do watch enough and know enough to make informed opinions on prospects that rarely hit the same as each other.

I mean let's hold on a sec, nail Yakupov has only played in the chl, let's wait a sec before saying he's better than Hoffman. Pretty black and white with that example but it applies to all cases.

I expect Hoffman to be around late and possibly even make it, but zib stuck 9 games last year and the difference between 18-19 as opposed to 22-23 is much larger.

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08-08-2012, 04:39 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
I wanna talk to guys that don't have to see it in plain sight before they can see it coming, scouting isn't 100% science and no one has come close to perfecting it. But some people here do watch enough and know enough to make informed opinions on prospects that rarely hit the same as each other.

I mean let's hold on a sec, nail Yakupov has only played in the chl, let's wait a sec before saying he's better than Hoffman. Pretty black and white with that example but it applies to all cases.

I expect Hoffman to be around late and possibly even make it, but zib stuck 9 games last year and the difference between 18-19 as opposed to 22-23 is much larger.
I would love to talk to those guys as well. Unfortunately I don't know anyone that has watched SEL hockey, AHL hockey, and OHL hockey regularly. But unfortunately we don't, all we have is ppl that have opinions.

And you have always been a little too optimistic IMO on how our prospects will end up. If you feel thats fair then cool, however I don't think thats fair...

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08-08-2012, 04:45 PM
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I would love to talk to those guys as well. Unfortunately I don't know anyone that has watched SEL hockey, AHL hockey, and OHL hockey regularly. But unfortunately we don't, all we have is ppl that have opinions.

And you have always been a little too optimistic IMO on how our prospects will end up. If you feel thats fair then cool, however I don't think thats fair...
Well I'd love for you to tell me who I've been wrong on...most of the time I don't speak in terms of absolutes as in "this WILL happen" or "this WONT happen". Shouldn't be anything wrong with a little optimism but nothing's been that crazy and there's a big difference to the way I post now and the way I posted when I first started. The player I've been most optimistic for since day 1 just won the Norris at 21, a player I told people to have caution with got traded and is having an adjustment like I imagined he would. I told the 95% of people that hated the Turris deal that it was a good deal for us, and it appears it was.

I've also been overly optimistic on non-Sens players like RNH when many doubted him and his size and thought he was overrated, I just don't waste time talking about guys I don't really like.

Just because I say something like Jared Cowen could be a #1 doesn't mean I don't see the likelihood that he ends up a #3. Just because I like a prospect doesn't mean I think he's gonna be a star or even a scoring line player.

But we do have people here that see enough of players and have enough of a clue that are worth listening to. The whole "lets wait and see" thing is kinda lame....of course we'll see, but in the mean time lets see who actually has a clue what they are talking about.


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08-08-2012, 05:03 PM
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Well I'd love for you to tell me who I've been wrong on...most of the time I don't speak in terms of absolutes as in "this WILL happen" or "this WONT happen". Shouldn't be anything wrong with a little optimism but nothing's been that crazy and there's a big difference to the way I post now and the way I posted when I first started. The player I've been most optimistic for since day 1 just won the Norris at 21, a player I told people to have caution with got traded and is having an adjustment like I imagined he would. I told the 95% of people that hated the Turris deal that it was a good deal for us, and it appears it was.

I've also been overly optimistic on non-Sens players like RNH when many doubted him and his size and thought he was overrated, I just don't waste time talking about guys I don't really like.

Just because I say something like Jared Cowen could be a #1 doesn't mean I don't see the likelihood that he ends up a #3. Just because I like a prospect doesn't mean I think he's gonna be a star or even a scoring line player.

But we do have people here that see enough of players and have enough of a clue that are worth listening to.
Dude being optimistic is good and all but all I'm saying is that to have a fair assessment of a player you have to notice both positives and negatives of a player. No player is without weaknesses and when discussing things with you its almost like they dont exist or they are so minimilastic that it's foolish to pay attention to them. I don't want to do a search so maybe I am wrong or I am right I just am too lazy to find proof but either way thats what I remember. If I'm wrong then I'll take this back.

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08-08-2012, 05:04 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prajna View Post
Hoffman will not be a top 6 player on this team. He may get a chance for a few months ala Butler, Bochenski etc.
If he becomes a regular top 6, the Sens are in trouble.

Small guy who got 21 goals, 49pts in the AHL. Nothing special at all.
I'm a little late to the game, but Hoffman's strength is not scoring, it's making the pass. I can't count how many missed opportunities there were last season when Hoff made the play but the forward on the other end couldn't finish. This season with some talent on every line in the AHL, if Hoffman is down in Bingo, expect that assist column to light up.

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Old
08-08-2012, 05:07 PM
  #71
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Dude being optimistic is good and all but all I'm saying is that to have a fair assessment of a player you have to notice both positives and negatives of a player. No player is without weaknesses and when discussing things with you its almost like they dont exist or they are so minimilastic that it's foolish to pay attention to them. I don't want to do a search so maybe I am wrong or I am right I just am too lazy to find proof but either way thats what I remember. If I'm wrong then I'll take this back.
This is coming straight out of left field dude.

Prettyyyyy unfair.

Guys like Karlsson, Lehner, Silfverberg, Stone don't leave much for anything BUT optimism...you're ****ing kidding yourself if you think I said they'd all turn out exactly the way we hope. They've all got a solid amount of potential...I put the negatives in my back pocket and have some patience. Most posters here thought it was the end of the world the way Jared Cowen skated in his first WJC, I said, give it some time....his skating did improve tremendously with time.

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08-08-2012, 05:14 PM
  #72
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According to various tweets he's playing like a beast in today's game against Finland. Already a goal and an assist. He stripped a defender of the puck and drove hard to the net to bang it in. Plays like that = success in the NHL. Willingness to drive hard to the net to crash in and score.

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08-08-2012, 05:16 PM
  #73
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i think that the thing with prospects is to look at their game objectively, analyze it and take out the strong and weak points.. but not to project them as nhl players, their chances, etc. hard to explain what i mean... basically tempering expectations and being very patient is what i try to do with prospects

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08-08-2012, 07:09 PM
  #74
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This is coming straight out of left field dude.

Prettyyyyy unfair.

Guys like Karlsson, Lehner, Silfverberg, Stone don't leave much for anything BUT optimism...you're ****ing kidding yourself if you think I said they'd all turn out exactly the way we hope. They've all got a solid amount of potential...I put the negatives in my back pocket and have some patience. Most posters here thought it was the end of the world the way Jared Cowen skated in his first WJC, I said, give it some time....his skating did improve tremendously with time.
kk it might be, I post here every now and then and your more reg so maybe I got the wrong idea. That is a good call about patience, I feel the same way.

So yeah I'm prob wrong which I'll admit.

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08-08-2012, 10:02 PM
  #75
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Noesen got 1g 1a in 5-3 win over Finland today btw.
Why Prince is not at camp?

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