HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Free Agent Talk (Part XV): The Non-Frenzy Edition

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-09-2012, 10:24 AM
  #176
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Anisimov is a better player than Boyle.

Boyle was the 4th line center entering camp and on Opening Night. Anisimov was the 2nd line center.
Who the **** cares where they were on opening night? Right now Brian Boyle is our 3rd line center and Anisimov got traded. During the season, Boyle got consistent 3rd line minutes, assumed a role as a shutdown type of player, and performed admirably.

Im sure the occasional dangle and flash of offensive brilliance from Anisimov sent tingles up your leg, but - much like Dubinsky, I dont think Anisimov knows the type of player he is.

I will rarely shed a tear when a confused player gets shipped out, and Anisimov/Dubinsky were confused hockey players. Worst of all, Anisimov was the softest player on the Rangers outside of Gaborik (who gets a pass with his 40 goals).

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:26 AM
  #177
Leetch3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,315
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I know many will disagree with me, but I think JBo to Detroit makes A LOT of sense and I think he can regain his 40-50 point form there.
not sure about the 40-50 point level and not a big fan of jbo but it absolutely makes a ton of sense for the wings simply based on the fact that he can play 25:00/game and they need a top pair guy to replace lidstrom's minutes.

Leetch3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:28 AM
  #178
jskramer83
Registered User
 
jskramer83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Where is PHX going? You keep hearing about the team moving. Where? Quebec doesn't have a new building ready to go. Quebec City is a small city. Can they afford to support an NHL team? The building in Markham,Ontario won't be ready until late 2014. Doan wants to stay in PHX. He would have signed somewhere in July if he didn't care about staying in PHX. With the impending lockout,Doan can wait for a while until Jamison completes the sale of team. Its going to take a miracle for the season to open on time. Is the stuff with other teams in the East real or is the agent using them to drive up the price on Vancouver if PHX doesn't get sold. Dave Maloney said on the EDM station podcast(Nash trade and Sauer was discussed) he didn't see Doan as a fit in NY from people he has spoken with which probably includes brother Don. Maloney said Weber wanted no part of NY and he couldn't see Doan playing here. Suter wanted no part of NY or any big market US teams. Not many people believed it when Poile and Eaves said it. Doan owns a ranch in PHX. Not a lot of room for horses in Manhattan. Family? Lifestyle? They will be more comfortable in PHX or in British Columbia than moving to the east. If its about the family or lifestyle and not one last money grab if PHX doesn't work out? Cerny had a chat yesterday. He felt the asking price and Doan's desire to stay in PHX were reasons why Doan won't be here. The pro-Doan crowd haven't explained how fits into the cap in the next CBA. The cap drops and is set at $64.3M using the NBA model and is kept there for 2 seasons,where are the Rangers finding the space to keep their group IIs next summer? The season beginning in late December will still have enough time for 60 game season. The Rangers will need to shed a big contract to keep their current players.
You posted some good stuff, just piece of advice spread it out more it is kind of an eye sore and tough to read.

1. Moving; there were a lot of rumors about Seattle as well as Quebec City. I'd be willing to bet that part of the conditions of Phoenix moving to Quebec would be that a new stadium needs to be finished in 3 years or so.

2. The pro-Doan crowd haven't explained how fits into the cap in the next CBA:

You have two types of people on this board, the people you are referring too at type 1, there are just as many that are type 2 that want nothing to do with Doan. But here is a good HF Board overview of the two groups;

1) What Have You Done For Me Lately Group:

This group cares about winning now so bad that they are willing to overlook the future ramifications, in order to have the best chance of winning the cup as soon as possible. They are willing to risk loading the cap now and praying that the cap goes up.

Popular Responses are, "The Cap will go up" and "we will worry about that when it comes"



2) Home Grown Talent Love Fest Group:

This group claims to see the light at the end of the tunnel, and feels that almost every prospect we have is close to NHL ready and is a better substitute then any veteran we can pick up either by free agency or trade. They tend to overvalue their teams prospect and homegrown talent while under valuing other teams assets. They strongly believe that every year they are 2 - 3 years away from having a dynasty, and dislike the idea of bringing in any player which involves giving up the prospect they like, no matter how good

Popular Responses: "He is a top 6 talent", "that trade is over payment he will be a star", and "he is way to old, and on the decline"

jskramer83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:37 AM
  #179
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,686
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by jskramer83 View Post
2. The pro-Doan crowd haven't explained how fits into the cap in the next CBA:
Of course not. Neither can the anti-Doan crowd explain the specific impact of Doan on the cap of a CBA that does not yet exist.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:39 AM
  #180
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 23,899
vCash: 145
Awards:
Why does my defense of Boyle equate to me being too attached, or having a poster in my room? He's nowhere near one of my favorite players, and outside of him being a Ranger and rooting for him, I have no attachment whatsoever. I think he's a good bottom six player and appreciate what he brings to the table. End of story.

I'm done though. We've all wasted far too many keystrokes trying to convince one hard-headed poster that Brian Boyle isn't crappy. Let GWOW cling to his dubious opinion and let's move on.

__________________

It's just pain.
nyr2k2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:47 AM
  #181
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Why does my defense of Boyle equate to me being too attached, or having a poster in my room? He's nowhere near one of my favorite players, and outside of him being a Ranger and rooting for him, I have no attachment whatsoever. I think he's a good bottom six player and appreciate what he brings to the table. End of story.

I'm done though. We've all wasted far too many keystrokes trying to convince one hard-headed poster that Brian Boyle isn't crappy. Let GWOW cling to his dubious opinion and let's move on.
Because when a poor argument is pushed against the wall, it usually results in that poster resorting to ridiculous absolutes.

"Brian Boyle is your favorite player eva!"

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:49 AM
  #182
pld459666
Registered User
 
pld459666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Danbury, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 16,683
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
Dubinsky and Anisimov were also playing on the top two lines at various points. Playing on a third line, they aren't getting those assists. Which means the offensive gap is even smaller. Heck playing in the different roles, they barely managed more goals, which is the point that keeps getting brought up. Essentially, it comes down to this: despite playing with more talented linemates, and in more offensive situations, those two guys BARELY managed more goals than Boyle. They clearly managed more assists, which considering the difference in linemates and roles, isn't terribly surprising. Put consistently in the same role, I think that assist output, like the goals, becomes almost neglible.

Frankly, I just don't think there's a whole lot to back up the anti-Boyle claims, at least not to the high levels we see around here (and mostly around here).

I think it comes down to two principles - Boyle isn't considered "home grown" and he isn't a "beast" out there, which will always be two strikes on this board. With two strikes, people go looking for number three.

Again, I don't believe Boyle is a "great" third liner. But I also think some are probably going a bit too much to the other end of the spectrum. However, one area I strongly agree with you about is the sample size. I believe this will be a very telling season for Boyle. But just as you don't have faith in him, I'm not sure it will ever be enough for some on these boards.
I will be a believer in Boyle if he give this Rangers team another 30+ point season.

Be that 15-15 or 10-20 or 20-10.

I would love to see that line post similar totals in the sense of 30 or better per guy.

If we get that from that line, then we have ourselves a very dangerous 3rd line.

I want 65+ from the top line
I want 50+ from the 2nd line
getting 30+ from the 3rd line means thsi team is very very dangerous.

I'm not one of those guys that is stuck on any one player. Homegrown to me is a distant 2nd to what i think can help this team.

If trading Callahan/Staal/Lundqvist can help this team win, I have no issues with any of that.

I'm a fan of the Rangers, the names on the back of the jersey's could be left blank for all I care.

I know you were not talking specifically to me about the home grown comment, I just wanted to make that clear.

In my opinion, anyone on the roster is tradable as long as it helps the team.

pld459666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:56 AM
  #183
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,686
vCash: 420
30 points = good
26 points = GET OFF THE THIRD LINE!!!!!!

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:56 AM
  #184
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I will be a believer in Boyle if he give this Rangers team another 30+ point season.

Be that 15-15 or 10-20 or 20-10.

I would love to see that line post similar totals in the sense of 30 or better per guy.

If we get that from that line, then we have ourselves a very dangerous 3rd line.

I want 65+ from the top line
I want 50+ from the 2nd line
getting 30+ from the 3rd line means thsi team is very very dangerous.

I'm not one of those guys that is stuck on any one player. Homegrown to me is a distant 2nd to what i think can help this team.

If trading Callahan/Staal/Lundqvist can help this team win, I have no issues with any of that.

I'm a fan of the Rangers, the names on the back of the jersey's could be left blank for all I care.

I know you were not talking specifically to me about the home grown comment, I just wanted to make that clear.

In my opinion, anyone on the roster is tradable as long as it helps the team.
Boyle put up 26 points last season. Im still not sure why you're so skeptical that he cant put up 30 with a clearer role and, most importantly, better linemates.

Brad Richards would struggle to put up points playing strictly even strength minutes with Prust and Feds.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 10:57 AM
  #185
True Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 15,116
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Of course not. Neither can the anti-Doan crowd explain the specific impact of Doan on the cap of a CBA that does not yet exist.
Sure, but two things are known. We have less cap room. And it is reasoable to assume, judging by the talks, that the cap will be a lower number this year.

True Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:00 AM
  #186
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,987
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I will be a believer in Boyle if he give this Rangers team another 30+ point season.

Be that 15-15 or 10-20 or 20-10.

I would love to see that line post similar totals in the sense of 30 or better per guy.

If we get that from that line, then we have ourselves a very dangerous 3rd line.

I want 65+ from the top line
I want 50+ from the 2nd line
getting 30+ from the 3rd line means thsi team is very very dangerous.

I'm not one of those guys that is stuck on any one player. Homegrown to me is a distant 2nd to what i think can help this team.

If trading Callahan/Staal/Lundqvist can help this team win, I have no issues with any of that.

I'm a fan of the Rangers, the names on the back of the jersey's could be left blank for all I care.

I know you were not talking specifically to me about the home grown comment, I just wanted to make that clear.

In my opinion, anyone on the roster is tradable as long as it helps the team.
See, for me, I would like to see a set number of goals per line.

1st line = 90 goals
2nd line = 65 goals
3rd line = 35 goals
4th line = 15 goals

That is 205 goals total. Now, if the 1st line eventually is Nash-Richards-Gaborik and they score, collectively 105 goals, the other totals will most likely be lowered.

Pyatt, Boyle and Hagelin should shoot for around 12-13 goals each along with very strong defensive play.

NYR Viper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:03 AM
  #187
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,686
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
Sure, but two things are known. We have less cap room. And it is reasoable to assume, judging by the talks, that the cap will be a lower number this year.
Lower than 64.3, or 70.2?

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:16 AM
  #188
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,743
vCash: 500
Doan is obviously not leaving Phx. There is a reason he hasn't signed anywhere yet.. The sale seems to be over soon according to reports, that will put a cap on the Doan saga.

Lundsanity30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:27 AM
  #189
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Doan is obviously not leaving Phx. There is a reason he hasn't signed anywhere yet.. The sale seems to be over soon according to reports, that will put a cap on the Doan saga.
I certainly wouldnt go that far.

The ownership situation may be on its way to being worked out, but now that Doan has gotten a taste at some of the insane years/$ figures teams are willing to throw at him, you can bet that he'll put the screws to Phoenix when negotiating.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:38 AM
  #190
bobbop
Henrik's Pop
 
bobbop's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Suburban Phoenix
Country: United States
Posts: 4,842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I certainly wouldnt go that far.

The ownership situation may be on its way to being worked out, but now that Doan has gotten a taste at some of the insane years/$ figures teams are willing to throw at him, you can bet that he'll put the screws to Phoenix when negotiating.
The insane years and figures came from teams with no reasonable chance of signing him. He'll get a reall good deal in Phoenix. Unlike some of you, they (like me) watched him play every night this year and he's a much better player (and far more valuable) than many of you realize. There's no future cap concern here -- the only concern is getting to the cap floor.

bobbop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:49 AM
  #191
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
The insane years and figures came from teams with no reasonable chance of signing him. He'll get a reall good deal in Phoenix. Unlike some of you, they (like me) watched him play every night this year and he's a much better player (and far more valuable) than many of you realize. There's no future cap concern here -- the only concern is getting to the cap floor.
Define "real good" deal.

Im all about value beyond just stats. I realize Doan is a great leader and brings intangibles. Hell, I've been arguing about the positives that Brian Boyle brings.

Then again, if Brian Boyle was a 35 year old 50 point player who wanted 3+ years and $5M+, Id certainly have my reservations no matter what.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:52 AM
  #192
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 15,501
vCash: 500
Like I care what other people think. I'm not here for friends but I respect your opinions.

Can we move along now?

GWOW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 11:55 AM
  #193
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Like I care what other people think. I'm not here for friends but I respect your opinions.

Can we move along now?
I would love to - because theres much bigger problems than Brian Boyle playing 3rd line center.

Stu Bickel in our top 6 D-man is at #1 on the list, as far as Im concerned.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 12:34 PM
  #194
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 15,501
vCash: 500
You can't predict how Doan will react to being a lesser player. We see it happen to the Yankees and Mets all the time. They acquire the best player from Team X, thinking he'll be that player, and in the end, the player gets into a comfort zone that there are other players who can carry the workload and ends up slumping.

Of course, it can work the other way around, where a diminished role will allow an older guy to perform well or exceed expectations. But these are the Rangers we're talking about.

Doan isn't stupid. He know Phoenix can pay him what he wants and he can retire a Yote. That's what he wants. Maybe in the last year of his deal, he asks out for a shot at a Cup. But for now, I'd be shocked if winning a Cup trumped the lifestyle he leads in Arizona.

GWOW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 12:40 PM
  #195
CM Lundqvist
Best In The World
 
CM Lundqvist's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 8,815
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I would love to - because theres much bigger problems than Brian Boyle playing 3rd line center.

Stu Bickel in our top 6 D-man is at #1 on the list, as far as Im concerned.
Agreed.

The sooner he is a healthy scratch or full-time #7 defenseman, I'm happy.

CM Lundqvist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 12:45 PM
  #196
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,743
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I certainly wouldnt go that far.

The ownership situation may be on its way to being worked out, but now that Doan has gotten a taste at some of the insane years/$ figures teams are willing to throw at him, you can bet that he'll put the screws to Phoenix when negotiating.
Or those insane offers (if true), could have been what Doan was asking for because he really has no intention of leaving phx.

Lundsanity30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 12:45 PM
  #197
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,743
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I would love to - because theres much bigger problems than Brian Boyle playing 3rd line center.

Stu Bickel in our top 6 D-man is at #1 on the list, as far as Im concerned.
THIS.. unless we know for sure Sauer will be ready and there is no way of knowing that, we need a bottom pairing defensemen.

Lundsanity30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 12:46 PM
  #198
Matt4776
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Matt4776's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,663
vCash: 50
Do we really even need Doan?

We can run three balanced scoring lines that look like:

Hagelin-Richards-Gaborik
Nash-Stepan-Callahan
Kreider-Boyle-Pyatt
Rupp-Halpren-Asham

If Rupp can return to form, that's a formidable fourth line. Kreider gives our 3rd line a scoring threat. In addition, that 3rd line is ****ing huge.

We would also most likely add some sort of 2nd/3rd line tweener at the deadline ala Antropov.

Playoff roster:

Hagelin-Richards-Gaborik
Nash-Stepan-Callahan
Kreider-Boyle-tweener
Pyatt-Halpren-Rupp/Asham

If we sign Doan, that forces either a newly signed Pyatt, a newly signed Asham, or someone who Tortorella loves in Rupp to the bench. Do we really see that happening?

Matt4776 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 01:11 PM
  #199
Edge
Registered User
 
Edge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sin City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
See, for me, I would like to see a set number of goals per line.

1st line = 90 goals
2nd line = 65 goals
3rd line = 35 goals
4th line = 15 goals

That is 205 goals total. Now, if the 1st line eventually is Nash-Richards-Gaborik and they score, collectively 105 goals, the other totals will most likely be lowered.

Pyatt, Boyle and Hagelin should shoot for around 12-13 goals each along with very strong defensive play.
That last part is why I have to admit that I am not terribly concerned about the third line. Heck let's say each of them only pots 11 goals, that's still 33 goals. Which is exactly my point really, we're right there.

Push comes to shove, I just don't see what the fuss is about.

Edge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2012, 01:12 PM
  #200
pld459666
Registered User
 
pld459666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Danbury, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 16,683
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
30 points = good
26 points = GET OFF THE THIRD LINE!!!!!!
It's more

Can you make your line mates better?

Yes = good
No = GET OFF THE THIRD LINE

pld459666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:22 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.