HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Redwings and Flames in talks about Bouwmeester.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-10-2012, 09:26 AM
  #276
Heaton
#disapointment
 
Heaton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Rochester, MI
Country: United States
Posts: 17,202
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Heaton
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladdy84 View Post
No he's not.
He arguably is. His last few years haven't looked as good, but he's had no talent. Scotty Bowman IS the greatest coach of all time, he's also had the best talent.

Heaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 10:16 AM
  #277
Snotbubbles
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyborg Yzerman View Post
Most organizational rankings for team's prospects across the internet frequently place Detroit in the top 10, including the one that you and I both post on.
This argument holds little water IMO. The Red Wings prospect rankings are over-inflated because of this sites definition of "prospect". Case in point, Brendan Smith. He's already 23 years old yet he's still included as a prospect for Detroit.

If you look at a team ranked at the bottom of the list, the Philadelphia Flyers. Their organization rankings don't include S. Couturier, J. Voracek, B. Schenn, L. Schenn or W. Simmonds all 23 years of age or younger. I think, if you would create a list based on age instead of NHL experience, the rankings might be a bit different.

Snotbubbles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 10:25 AM
  #278
The Zetterberg Era
Moderator
Nyquist Explosion!
 
The Zetterberg Era's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 19,396
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
He arguably is. His last few years haven't looked as good, but he's had no talent. Scotty Bowman IS the greatest coach of all time, he's also had the best talent.
He also said several times you cannot stay in one place for too long. I like Babcock a lot, but we are getting near the Scotty rule on how long a coaches shelf life really lasts.

The Zetterberg Era is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 11:07 AM
  #279
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
 
SmellOfVictory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 5,186
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
This argument holds little water IMO. The Red Wings prospect rankings are over-inflated because of this sites definition of "prospect". Case in point, Brendan Smith. He's already 23 years old yet he's still included as a prospect for Detroit.

If you look at a team ranked at the bottom of the list, the Philadelphia Flyers. Their organization rankings don't include S. Couturier, J. Voracek, B. Schenn, L. Schenn or W. Simmonds all 23 years of age or younger. I think, if you would create a list based on age instead of NHL experience, the rankings might be a bit different.
NHL experience is what defines a prospect, though. If you want to quantify the effect of youth in a team's NHL lineup just go by the average age of each team.

SmellOfVictory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 04:46 PM
  #280
Viqsi
carrying the flag
 
Viqsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Scary Internet
Country: United States
Posts: 21,117
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Viqsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Generally View Post
And that's exactly what I said, he's getting paid like a number one defenseman, was put in that role, and failed at it.
I think it would be more appropriate to say that he's getting paid like a #1D, and was put in the role of an elite team-carrying best-in-the-League defenseman, and was (shockingly ) found unequal to that task. Hell, Lidstrom didn't face the sort of competition and time that Bouwmeester did. The only folks who come close are McDonagh and Girardi.

The obvious answer is therefore not to treat him as though he's Shea Weber. (Although not even Shea faced that kind of competition...)

__________________
Remember - when you're a hockey fan, it's not "reckless driving", it's "good forechecking".
"Viqsi, you are our sweet humanist..." --mt-svk on the CBJ boards

Thanks, Howson, for cleaning up MacLean's toxic waste. Welcome, Kekalainen; let's get good things built!
Viqsi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:03 PM
  #281
probertrules24
Registered User
 
probertrules24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,784
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I think it would be more appropriate to say that he's getting paid like a #1D, and was put in the role of an elite team-carrying best-in-the-League defenseman, and was (shockingly ) found unequal to that task. Hell, Lidstrom didn't face the sort of competition and time that Bouwmeester did. The only folks who come close are McDonagh and Girardi.

The obvious answer is therefore not to treat him as though he's Shea Weber. (Although not even Shea faced that kind of competition...)
Shea Weber is not as good as Shea Weber because the stats never lie.

probertrules24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:07 PM
  #282
Puckgenius*
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: At the rink
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,558
vCash: 500
Actually Bouwmeester would fit in nicely in Babcocks system. Babcock knows how to get max potential from his defenseman - look at Stuart and White.

I bet Jay puts up 15-30-45 if he plays in Detroit. Cause of his elite skating ability, he needs to be on a smooth transitional team to get the most out of him. Jay has one of the better first passes out of the zone in the league.

Puckgenius* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:08 PM
  #283
debonair399
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 286
vCash: 500
Did Bouwmeester get paired with Ian White when they were both with Calgary?

If so, was that pairing effective?

debonair399 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:11 PM
  #284
Puckgenius*
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: At the rink
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,558
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by debonair399 View Post
Did Bouwmeester get paired with Ian White when they were both with Calgary?

If so, was that pairing effective?
White played with Regehr most of the time which was pretty good pairing. Bouwmeester plays his best when hes with stay at home partner. Sarich, Butler, even Staios hes had some pretty good success with. Put him with a Stay at home dman cause that way Jay will carry the puck more and pinch in more.

Puckgenius* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:16 PM
  #285
FowlerFrenzy
Rookie User
 
FowlerFrenzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckgenius View Post
Actually Bouwmeester would fit in nicely in Babcocks system. Babcock knows how to get max potential from his defenseman - look at Stuart and White.

I bet Jay puts up 15-30-45 if he plays in Detroit. Cause of his elite skating ability, he needs to be on a smooth transitional team to get the most out of him. Jay has one of the better first passes out of the zone in the league.
I think you are overestimating Bouwmeester's shot. 3, 4, 5 goals in the last three seasons. 15 goals? Highly unlikely he gets close to that again.

FowlerFrenzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:20 PM
  #286
Puckgenius*
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: At the rink
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,558
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FowlerFrenzy View Post
I think you are overestimating Bouwmeester's shot. 3, 4, 5 goals in the last three seasons. 15 goals? Highly unlikely he gets close to that again.
Hes badly misused in Calgary. Flames dont have the right system for Jay to flourish. The reason why he has weak goal production is cause he has no confidence in his shot. You will always see it in flames games, he will often let up or pass on shots that he should be taking.

He did put up 15g and 45 pts I believe in his last year in FLA playing with snails. He was very good that year.

Puckgenius* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:48 PM
  #287
Viqsi
carrying the flag
 
Viqsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Scary Internet
Country: United States
Posts: 21,117
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Viqsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by probertrules24 View Post
Shea Weber is not as good as Shea Weber because the stats never lie.
More like Shea had the workload distributed with this one guy named Ryan Suter. But I at least acknowledge the wittiness of that line, if not its accuracy.

Viqsi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 06:55 PM
  #288
FowlerFrenzy
Rookie User
 
FowlerFrenzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckgenius View Post
Hes badly misused in Calgary. Flames dont have the right system for Jay to flourish. The reason why he has weak goal production is cause he has no confidence in his shot. You will always see it in flames games, he will often let up or pass on shots that he should be taking.

He did put up 15g and 45 pts I believe in his last year in FLA playing with snails. He was very good that year.
He had a career year (15G & 42 PTS). It doesn't mean that he can return to that shooting percentage (8.2%). I just don't see it happening. I think 7-10 goals and 35-40 points would be a more reasonable expectation.

FowlerFrenzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 08:14 PM
  #289
tempest2i
Feral
 
tempest2i's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Cowtown
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,553
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by debonair399 View Post
Did Bouwmeester get paired with Ian White when they were both with Calgary?

If so, was that pairing effective?
Effective at getting on the wrong end of the highlight reel.

White looked great last year because he played beside Lidstrom. That's it.

tempest2i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2012, 08:22 PM
  #290
King In The North
Sean Bennett
 
King In The North's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Hamilton, On
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
Effective at getting on the wrong end of the highlight reel.

White looked great last year because he played beside Lidstrom. That's it.
Clever, but the answer is no. The pairing was Regehr and White.

King In The North is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:20 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.