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Old
08-10-2012, 12:38 AM
  #51
Hawkey39
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I want em to kick ass in Dallas.

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08-10-2012, 10:06 AM
  #52
Hawkaholic
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Originally Posted by UsernameWasTaken View Post
another elite forward with questionable defensive skills? i'd prefer jones, thanks.
Ya, because we have so many of those.

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08-10-2012, 02:18 PM
  #53
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HITS alone do not mean much--hits that take you out of position AND failure of team-mates to cover for you when you do get out of position because you left a spot to go make a hit are a deadly combination -I mean we do not want a PHANEUF --he hits a ton,but gets caught out of position AND with team-mates not covering for him the result is often goals into the Leafs net --we cannot have that especially with no elite goalie to bail us out...hits can also back-fire if they incurr charging or roughhing penalties..


RUBBING GUYS OFF THE PUCK is far more important than mere hits that could be counter-productive if team-mates do not work together in proper coverages after the hit ...NOT RUBBING GUYS OFF THE PUCK in our own end, leads to longer possessions for opponents in our end,leads to more plays opponents can make in our own end ,leads to us 'running around ' or to us getting lazy and watching instead of working harder to get pucks out --NOT RUBBING GUYS OFF THE PUCK in our own end leads to disatrous consequences...


SO I'd first rather have us improve on RUBBING GUYS OFF THE PUCK than just pumping up our hit stats...HIts alone do not do much ...rubbing guys off pucks accomplishes a lot more..

RUbbing guys off pucks requires both bigger stronger d-men (in short supply on a Stan Bowman PMD priority-first D-corps ) AND forwards strong enough and/or not lazy such that they are willing to do the hard work of battling on the boards and have the will to effectively rub opponents off pucks ..THAT is the greater physical and mental improvement we need rather than mere mindless and ill-timed hitting...

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08-10-2012, 03:12 PM
  #54
BobbyJet
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/\ This post is right on the money HF50. And Oduya is the worst culprit for this type of soft play in our back end. He looked particularly bad in the POs last spring, as opps had their way along the boards. This team has way too many fly-bys in a typical game.

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08-10-2012, 03:56 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by BobbyJet View Post
/\ This post is right on the money HF50…. And Oduya is the worst culprit for this type of soft play in our back end. He looked particularly bad in the PO’s last spring, as opps had their way along the boards. This team has way too many fly-bys in a typical game.
hossa was the one of the worst culprits at the end of the year. I can think of at least 3 instances towards the end of the season where he tried to poke the puck away while skating past the guy at the point and failed which opened a huge space for the pointman on the other team.

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08-10-2012, 05:06 PM
  #56
Hawkaholic
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Originally Posted by BobbyJet View Post
/\ This post is right on the money HF50. And Oduya is the worst culprit for this type of soft play in our back end. He looked particularly bad in the POs last spring, as opps had their way along the boards. This team has way too many fly-bys in a typical game.
I would say Leddy and Hammer looked a lot worse than Oduya in this area.

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08-10-2012, 05:58 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
I would say Leddy and Hammer looked a lot worse than Oduya in this area.
absolute ********. Do you have a crush on oduya? Good god, you refuse to acknowledge anything negative about him. The way you talk about him, I'd swear he was the best dman on the team and got signed to a steal of a contract.

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08-10-2012, 06:06 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
Ya, because we have so many of those.
Elite Forwards with questionable/average D at best on the Hawks Roster:

Kane


I agree that we have too many of them on the roster already

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08-10-2012, 07:34 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
absolute ********. Do you have a crush on oduya? Good god, you refuse to acknowledge anything negative about him. The way you talk about him, I'd swear he was the best dman on the team and got signed to a steal of a contract.
I wasnt defending Oduya, he was bad in the playoffs, but Leddy and Hammer were worse.

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08-10-2012, 07:55 PM
  #60
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you just claimed that oduya plays more physically and is better around the boards than hammer.

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08-10-2012, 07:57 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
you just claimed that oduya plays more physically and is better around the boards than hammer.
No, I said in the playoffs Hammer was worse with that than Oduya. I only remember Hammer doing 1 good thing that series, a hit on Klesla.

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08-10-2012, 07:58 PM
  #62
madgoat33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyJet View Post
/\ This post is right on the money HF50…. And Oduya is the worst culprit for this type of soft play in our back end. He looked particularly bad in the PO’s last spring, as opps had their way along the boards. This team has way too many fly-bys in a typical game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
I would say Leddy and Hammer looked a lot worse than Oduya in this area.
wut?

And not only that, but if anything, leddy had to cover for all of oduya's mistakes. Oduya pretty much just hung around the net flailing his stick around and sprayed **** passes all over the ice the entire series.

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08-10-2012, 08:10 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
wut?

And not only that, but if anything, leddy had to cover for all of oduya's mistakes. Oduya pretty much just hung around the net flailing his stick around and sprayed **** passes all over the ice the entire series.
Indeed, he did. It was most disappointing as he wasn't nearly that bad leading up to the playoffs, but he pretty much folded his tent when the wick was turned up.

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08-10-2012, 08:13 PM
  #64
madgoat33
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Originally Posted by BobbyJet View Post
Indeed, he did. It was most disappointing as he wasn't nearly that bad leading up to the playoffs, but he pretty much folded his tent when the wick was turned up.
I don't know, he looked pretty bad towards the end of the regular season too.

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08-10-2012, 08:17 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
I don't know, he looked pretty bad towards the end of the regular season too.
True ... as the playoffs approached, JO's game went backwards. In his defence, he was the new guy. Hopefully that will not be a trend, cause we're stuck with him.

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08-10-2012, 08:24 PM
  #66
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True ... as the playoffs approached, JO's game went backwards. In his defence, he was the new guy. Hopefully that will not be a trend, cause we're stuck with him.
I hope so, but I certainly won't hold my breath. I personally think that the coaching staff preaches this soft, stick checking style. Pretty much anyone who's spent extended time on this teams plays softer now than they did when they started.

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08-10-2012, 08:47 PM
  #67
BobbyJet
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
hossa was the one of the worst culprits at the end of the year. I can think of at least 3 instances towards the end of the season where he tried to poke the puck away while skating past the guy at the point and failed which opened a huge space for the pointman on the other team.
This is true also, and Q did nothing about it, which absolutely sends the wrong message. Considering the youth on the club, to treat a vet like Hossa (and Keith, Kane at times) differently is a major fail by Q, imo.

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08-10-2012, 09:06 PM
  #68
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LOL @ Leddy covering for Oduyas mistakes.

Leddy not covering Hanzal out front on a GWG
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rffa9pg31G0
I don't see Oduya

Leddy getting beat 1on1 against the great Boedker

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coyHQ_MZSMI

No Oduya

Leddy beaten on the boards, Oduya has to try and block the shot because Leddy was beat, tips off Oduya and in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy4Jma_EKjY

Leddys man scores, again...no Oduya
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ0OHiT8iIs

I saw 2 goals that were directly caused by Oduya, I admit...but Leddy was fsr worse in that series.

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08-10-2012, 09:36 PM
  #69
BobbyJet
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The bigger question is: Why would Q play 8 and 27 as a tandem and continue to do so after they were repeatedly dominated physically.

Watching those goals brought back some awful memories of our ineptness at many aspects of the defensive game: losing key faceoffs, poor point coverage, no board presence, no coverage in front and very good at screening our own goalie. Sorry to say so, but pretty pathetic.

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08-10-2012, 09:49 PM
  #70
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Leddy was paired with OD a lot of the time
Oduya started being paired with Hammer so somebody could cover for him since Leddy was doing a crap job of it.

But I agree, lots of bad memories watching that, didn't help that our goalie NEVER saved their ass.

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08-10-2012, 10:35 PM
  #71
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It was a crap series. The team wasn't ready, the coaches weren't ready. The only ones that seemed ready for a series were Keith, Crawford, and Toews, but they weren't special either (I said "ready" not "good"). Seabrook had some great shifts but had too many brainfarts for me to give him credit. Even his puck decisions cost the Hawks a few matchups over the course of the series. He got way too many free passes from fans the last 2 years compared to the rest of the blueline. Other than effort, there wasn't much to commend from that series, and effort without good preparation usually loses anyway.

Leddy, Oduya, Hjalmarsson, whatever,...none of them did enough and any one of them was only marginally more guilty than the next.

Tippett was awesome, except for some of his interviews.

They were so unprepared as a team that I find it difficult to project anything from that series to next year. They would have to try really hard to get caught with their pants down so often for a 6 game series again.

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08-11-2012, 04:10 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyJet View Post
Theres also more to physicality than the number of hits we register. This team has been terrible in the grit department and lose most of the board battles. That and the opps allowed to roam around in our end, especially in the slot with no worries. As a direct result, Id venture to say this team is near the top in allowing goals from tip-ins or screen shots from the point. That needs to be fixed with a fundamental system change, and I am not confident that it will. Q needs to get out of the mindset that what worked 2+ years ago is not always going to work going forward, but hes stuck there it seems.
I would agree with this 100% and have been saying it for most of last season and all offseason. It's why I don't like our defense. Only Seabrook is a physical, gritty player, willing to and has the body to go to the corners and win pucks, get in the crease and clear out bodies, separate puck from player. The rest of our D seems to be floaters, try to be near puck but not willing or capable of using their body positively. It's why I really want a phsyical D minded D-man and no more Leddy, Oduya types.

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Old
08-11-2012, 11:14 AM
  #73
Bubba88
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I don't get why Q split up Leddy & Hjammer to pair Leddy, the PMD with JO, the PMD

I blame Q for their failures too. Leddy needs a guy to cover for his mistakes and JO is not that guy

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08-11-2012, 05:31 PM
  #74
Sir Psycho T
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You can't blame Q when he don't have those players.

Yes Q has a lot of blame in this teams failures, mostly on the PP because we have the talent know get them in their right positions and having 5 guys along the outside and on the boards taking pot shots won't cut it.

However on the backend there really is nothing Q can do because there is no one to cover Leddy other then Seabrook. That's the issue when you have 5 guys with similar, games, bodies, and mentalities. We need some guys who are physical, can play with grit, and who think defense first.

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08-11-2012, 05:41 PM
  #75
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My specific goal I want accomplished is for people to lose their jobs when the same thing happens for the third season in a row.

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