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Old
08-14-2012, 12:10 PM
  #126
Blueshirt Believer
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Originally Posted by jskramer83 View Post
No problem really have no ill will towards you. I would of had no problem if you just called my idea stupid, but the bellow comments are insults attacking me personally by calling my a hypocrite or lazy, not the idea you don't like.

"Yeah ok.

You going to do that before or after you buy your Rick Nash Ranger jersey?"

or

"Your never going to do what you say, so why bother spouting fairy tales?"
Fine, I apologize for what you interpreted as a personal attack. My intent was to merely mock your stance.

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08-14-2012, 12:12 PM
  #127
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Thanksgiving.

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08-14-2012, 12:16 PM
  #128
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Wow guys, maybe spare us the drama and whine in PM?

It's not surprising that this is going on and on. In labor negotiations, things are frequently done at the last minute. Until the sides feel the absolute pressure of a real deadline, no one is ever willing to bend on anything.

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08-14-2012, 12:18 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
It still creates a problem of for the small market teams. They still won't be able to compete with the big markets due to tax penalties. They will never spend over the soft cap. It still doesn't create the parity that those teams want.

But, I will say that is probably the only realistic way you could implement a luxury tax in the NHL.
There's not much of a difference to the current system with the cap floor. There's no full parity in either system.

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08-14-2012, 12:21 PM
  #130
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Early word from RDS is that the NHLPA is not pitching a luxury tax system, but keeping to the existing cap system

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08-14-2012, 12:24 PM
  #131
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Early word from RDS is that the NHLPA is not pitching a luxury tax system, but keeping to the existing cap system
Good news. Makes me interested what Fehr has planned? Could it be player shares in the league?

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08-14-2012, 12:24 PM
  #132
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It still creates a problem of for the small market teams. They still won't be able to compete with the big markets due to tax penalties. They will never spend over the soft cap. It still doesn't create the parity that those teams want.

But, I will say that is probably the only realistic way you could implement a luxury tax in the NHL.
There isn't parity in any league other than the NFL and the only reason it exists there is that the national TV $$ is so astronomical that you can just divide it up and that basically covers expenses.

I think the current system (hard cap & floor) could be enhanced in a new CBA to level the playing field. Eliminate these front loaded contracts only the rich teams can afford. Eliminate the ability to send a player on a multi year one way contract to the AHL and have his salary come off the cap. There aren't too many franchises who could afford to have $6.5M in "dead" dollars the way the Rangers do for Redden. That is an unfiar advanatge to larger teams. You could even come up with a "max contract" the way the NBA has

Luxury tax does not work in baseball and probably would not in hockey. There is no way to mandate they spend the money. A team like Columbus who will be bad anyway is going to pocket their payments from dolan, snider, & Co. in lieu of signing a couple of UFAs.

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08-14-2012, 12:25 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
Good news.
Now with link:

https://twitter.com/RenLavoieRDS/sta...22166378741760


Quote:
Renaud P Lavoie ‏@RenLavoieRDS

NHLPA won't ask the NHL to get rid of the salary cap system. Important step to make sure they'll be hockey at one point this season.
though to be fair, I guess that doesn't explicitly say they aren't asking for a modification of the cap system to include a luxury tax but keeping the cap idea in general. So, depends on how he's defining the system

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08-14-2012, 12:45 PM
  #134
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From: @CraigCustance
Sent: Aug 14, 2012 1:44p

Still a chance Red Wings host annual Sept. prospect tourney in TC. Conference call this week w/participating teams to determine fate.

sent via web
On Twitter: http://twitter.com/CraigCustance/sta...31626002288640

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Old
08-14-2012, 12:49 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Cliffy1814 View Post
There isn't parity in any league other than the NFL and the only reason it exists there is that the national TV $$ is so astronomical that you can just divide it up and that basically covers expenses.

I think the current system (hard cap & floor) could be enhanced in a new CBA to level the playing field. Eliminate these front loaded contracts only the rich teams can afford. Eliminate the ability to send a player on a multi year one way contract to the AHL and have his salary come off the cap. There aren't too many franchises who could afford to have $6.5M in "dead" dollars the way the Rangers do for Redden. That is an unfiar advanatge to larger teams. You could even come up with a "max contract" the way the NBA has

Luxury tax does not work in baseball and probably would not in hockey. There is no way to mandate they spend the money. A team like Columbus who will be bad anyway is going to pocket their payments from dolan, snider, & Co. in lieu of signing a couple of UFAs.
The new Luxury tax for Baseball starts 2014 (i believe) and its 50% penalty. Its going to work because no team will pay a 50% penalty for how much over, so it essentially becomes a hard cap

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Old
08-14-2012, 12:52 PM
  #136
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Kind of off topic....

When do you think we'll be able to order Gamecenter live? Not until the lockout is resolved probably?

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Old
08-14-2012, 12:58 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by BroadwayHustle View Post
The new Luxury tax for Baseball starts 2014 (i believe) and its 50% penalty. Its going to work because no team will pay a 50% penalty for how much over, so it essentially becomes a hard cap
What do you base this absolute statement on? Do you really believe a wealthy team would worry about a few million dollars if they thought spending the extra money would bring them a championship?

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08-14-2012, 01:07 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by BroadwayHustle View Post
The new Luxury tax for Baseball starts 2014 (i believe) and its 50% penalty. Its going to work because no team will pay a 50% penalty for how much over, so it essentially becomes a hard cap
Yes, very true. I should have specified that it has never worked in the past. I believe the Yankees have already stated they will not exceed the threshold under any circumstances. That will be a nice trick with againg ARod, CC, and Tex eating up about 40% of the payroll.

Back to hockey though...50% tax or anything close to that is not realistic for this CBA given the fact tghere already is a hard cap. Large market owners will argue that is all that is needed.

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08-14-2012, 01:36 PM
  #139
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I truly believe they will get a deal done rather quickly, and hockey will start on time. Too much to lose. When push comes to shove, they will do it.

It might go to the 11th hour, but I really believe when humans put their minds together to accomplish a goal, and resolve differences for a greater purpose, they will be able to come to an agreement.

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08-14-2012, 01:55 PM
  #140
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The NHLPA proposal is reportedly for three seasons with an option for a fourth.

This is my problem with all of this. The NFL agreed on a ten year deal. That means no lockouts for at least another 10 years.

What the hell does a three year deal accomplish? It's gonna lead to yet another lockout. Give us a 7+ year deal.

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08-14-2012, 01:59 PM
  #141
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The NBA has a cap of $58M. Teams can go over the cap. If a team is over the cap,they can only make a trade matching up money. The luxury tax begins at $70M.

The PA offered a 3 year CBA with an option for 4th. Are they going to do this again dance in three years? Come on people.

Quote:
Two notes about players offer: SURPRISE: hard cap would stay (for the most part). NOT SURPRISED: more comprehensive revenue sharing.
https://twitter.com/JSportsnet/statu...48444238573570

Quote:
Fehr said offer was after 3 yrs of working under their proposal an option to revert to current CBA in 4th year
https://twitter.com/dshoalts/status/235446062637277184

Quote:
Players propose there be no changes to player contracts under existing rules
https://twitter.com/dshoalts/status/235444990954860544

One good thing

Quote:
Fehr says players will take reduced HRR for next three seasons
https://twitter.com/reporterchris/st...43666834042880

Quote:
Fehr says revenue-sharing could reach $250 million per year.
https://twitter.com/reporterchris/st...43946761891840

If the top 10 teams contribute,$25M per team? The maximum is $14M now. Bettman wants a cap. Its his job to convince the Rangers,Leafs,Habs,Flyers,Bruins,Pitt,Van,Chicago, LA and Detroit to contribute more money to revenue sharing.

Quote:
NHL won't want 3 or 4 year CBA; longer deals bring stability and sell sponsorships etc - just ask NFL execs
https://twitter.com/EricOnSportsLaw/...50317678977024

Who wants to deal with Bettman and Fehr's replacement again in 3 years? Fehr is going to do this CBA and help find his replacement.

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Old
08-14-2012, 02:02 PM
  #142
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What's HRR

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08-14-2012, 02:03 PM
  #143
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What's HRR
Hockey Related Revenue (?)

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Old
08-14-2012, 02:07 PM
  #144
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Can anyone speculate how much the cap would decrease? Would the Rangers technically still have mostly the same amount of breathing room, considering the players seem to be fine with taking a pay cut?

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08-14-2012, 02:08 PM
  #145
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I'm told a luxury tax is part of the NHLPA's new proposal. Cap won't move much under the deal, but some teams can go above and others below
https://twitter.com/reporterchris/st...52509777428481

Flat cap. Where is set? How much is the tax?

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08-14-2012, 02:11 PM
  #146
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Most labor deals are in the 3-5 year range. The union isn't going to lock itself into a long agreement unless they're positive they're getting an excellent deal. Long labor contracts are always a gamble. And with Fehr at the table, who actually knows what he's doing, I'd bet the league is hesitant to agree to anything too long as well.

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08-14-2012, 02:15 PM
  #147
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https://twitter.com/reporterchris/st...52509777428481

Flat cap. Where is set? How much is the tax?
I just read that quote on the main board, I'm curious how that works out.

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08-14-2012, 02:20 PM
  #148
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The players accepting a cut in HRR % is not a pay cut. Their salaries won't be rolled back. NBA players took a cut from 57% to 49%-51%. Their salaries weren't rolled back. The cap is flat at $58M which is the same number as the last season of the previous CBA. Its $58M in 10-11 when the players were making 57% and it was $58M in 11-12 and will be $58M in 12-13 with the players getting 49%-51%. NBA players got 51.15% in 11-12. Fehr is proposing a flat cap. Who knows the number is? It won't increase every year like it does right now.

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08-14-2012, 02:24 PM
  #149
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The players accepting a cut in HRR % is not a pay cut. Their salaries won't be rolled back. NBA players took a cut from 57% to 49%-51%. Their salaries weren't rolled back. The cap is flat at $58M which is the same number as the last season of the previous CBA. Its $58M in 10-11 when the players were making 57% and it was $58M in 11-12 and will be $58M in 12-13 with the players getting 49%-51%. NBA players got 51.15% in 11-12. Fehr is proposing a flat cap. Who knows the number is? It won't increase every year like it does right now.
So could it be that you have that flat cap, and then a luxury tax for those who go over due to inflation?

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08-14-2012, 02:28 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Most labor deals are in the 3-5 year range. The union isn't going to lock itself into a long agreement unless they're positive they're getting an excellent deal. Long labor contracts are always a gamble. And with Fehr at the table, who actually knows what he's doing, I'd bet the league is hesitant to agree to anything too long as well.
The NFL CBA is a 10 year agreement. NBA CBA is a 10 year agreement. The MLB CBA is a 5 year agreement. A short term CBA is not good for business.

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