And all the replies here don't scream of people that care about the rankings much.
I didn't say they were
Its an observation of my time here, before I posted & people I know that live in Vancouver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigcaulks
You have more posts in this thread than anyone and you've said nothing. The issue/obsession with the study seems to be your problem.
Because I am replying to people who have quoted me.
I don't have an obsession with the study, just an obsession with the people that think these studies matter. People who bring these kind of studies up to explain why UFA's would chose the Canucks over some other team...etc
...just an obsession with the people that think these studies matter. People who bring these kind of studies up to explain why UFA's would chose the Canucks over some other team...etc
Ahh, I see. But you decided to make a general comment about Canucks fans and Vancouverites. That makes sense.
I suggest you work on the obsession. Most of us do not need a study to tell us how great we are. We live in a problem-free city.
I don't have an obsession with the study, just an obsession with the people that think these studies matter. People who bring these kind of studies up to explain why UFA's would chose the Canucks over some other team...etc
Err... but they do matter? Vancouver gaining the reputation of being a World class city was an important development for the franchise. It's certainly not the sole reason, but it is a factor.
Err... but they do matter? Vancouver gaining the reputation of being a World class city was an important development for the franchise. It's certainly not the sole reason, but it is a factor.
I agree its a factor but I've seen a lot of people saying its a bigger factor then it really is.
Go through the Justin Schultz thread on the main boards & you'll see... it was kind of pathetic seeing fan bases argue who had the nicer city.
Seeing Calgary with those other cities just doesn't feel right. It's an average city. Very vanilla.
The thing about Calgary that sucks is that you need a car. The whole mess of sprawl is connected by freeways. There's a lot of cool stuff in Cow town, but the layout blows.
Weird list. This is my rough impression of canadian cities. The most important factors for me are aesthetic qualities of the city and surrounding landscape, park space, variety of culture, and overall vibrancy.
Top Tier:
Montreal
Vancouver
Quebec City
Toronto
Mid Tier:
Victoria
Halifax
Ottawa
Lower Tier:
Edmonton
Saskatoon
Calgary
Bottom Tier:
Winnipeg
Regina
I wasn't sure where to put Calgary. There is a fair amount to do but I can't stand the ridiculous sea of suburbs and the lack of trees and greenery -- I also am not attracted by cowboy conservative culture. Edmonton and Saskatoon were also flirting with the bottom tier but quality park space and solid universities gave them a boost. Both Edmonton and Calgary get large bonus points for being close to the rockies too, but both of the Albertan cities have serious design flaws and issues with general blandness.
The livability index doesn't really make sense if Vancouver, Toronto, and Calgary are on it. All three cities are very different in terms of cost of living and the available amenities.
Vancouver exceeds expectations in terms of natural beauty, walkability, things to do outdoors, and places you can go for a day trip. I would also take any of our burbs over just about any city in any other province. Affordability not so much.
Calgary is great in terms of jobs and cost of living. Things to do and winter climate. Not so much.
Toronto is great in terms of big city living. Affordability, not so much. Natural beauty, winter and summer climate, not so much.
Under the presumption that natural beauty can't be factored into statistical data, I don't know how Vancouver winds up so high on this list. The scenery is the first thing anyone says about Vancouver.
I guess I can see why Vancouver could top a "livable city" and also how Calgary could, but I don't understand how they made the same list with the same criteria.
I'm leaving Vancouver at the end of the month and frankly, I can't wait. It's the most beautiful place I've ever lived, it has an amazing laid-back vibe, and people are mostly not high-strung and keep to themselves; hopefully I can move back when I have an established career or at least a more steady income. But its whole "work just to live" vibe doesn't suit someone at my stage in life. My place is a dump and I'm always broke. There's little high-paying job opportunities (for me) and nothing on the horizon short of serving aging baby boomers as they retire here.
Basically, I hope I wind up happier some place uglier and less fun.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbean
Top Tier:
Montreal
Vancouver
Quebec City
Toronto
Mid Tier:
Victoria
Halifax Ottawa
I can't speak to its job market or cost of living, but I'd think Ottawa would have to crack the top tier. Perhaps it's a little low on natural beauty, but it's one of the tidiest towns I've ever been to. As the capital, it has lots to see and enough to do, and its location/bilingualism make its cultural background unique, even for Canada. The downtown has lots of character, and its architecture is a nice change from the faceless masses of glass that are Vancouver, Calgary, and Toronto. I definitely want to settle there one day.
I can't speak to its job market or cost of living, but I'd think Ottawa would have to crack the top tier. Perhaps it's a little low on natural beauty, but it's one of the tidiest towns I've ever been to. As the capital, it has lots to see and enough to do, and its location/bilingualism make its cultural background unique, even for Canada. The downtown has lots of character, and its architecture is a nice change from the faceless masses of glass that are Vancouver, Calgary, and Toronto. I definitely want to settle there one day.
Ottawa has a lot going for it that's for sure. My only knock against it (and I haven't spent that much time there, only about a week, but I hear similar things from friends who live there) is that I found it isn't exactly the most vibrant city. I felt there wasn't as much liveliness or any kind of "buzz" which cities such as Vancouver or especially Montreal have. This is mostly a concern for younger people though.
It is an absolutely fantastic city for things such as universities and mueseums. The national gallery is by far the best in Canada (one of the few in this country that might approach the quality of European galleries). Being able to see exhibitions of Caravaggio or Van Gogh is a huge attraction for people into that sort of thing and is a rarity in north america.
You are right though, Ottawa is quite possibly a "top tier" city in this country. I would probably rather live there than in Toronto.
It's a real head scratcher how Calgary is a top 5 city. It honestly takes me 30 minutes in decent traffic to cross the city from the NW country hills to SE Somerset. You can't rely on public transit the same way you can't rely on Calgary weather. This morning I went to work wearing a toque and it's mid summer!
Affordable houses? Well yes, but to afford one you still need to spend a pretty penny $450,000+.
This is by far the most boring, depressing city that I have lived in. If the windchill of -30 doesn't force you to hibernate, the boredom factor of doing nothing but visiting the local malls or the monthly Costco visit will get the better of you.
Calgary seems to be a dead city. It seems like an older folks, family type city.
They just line up a bunch of metrics, give them weights and add them all up. It's how boring places do well in these things year after year. These things don't measure how good a city is to actually live in. If cities were food a rissotto would lose to plain boiled white rice every time.
He's a tip. Being a cold, frozen wasteland is better than being a tropical paradise because the makers of these survey's don't have sweat glands and die if they stray far from the poles. The closest thing to "tropical" in the top 25 is Sydney.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luc
Affordable houses? Well yes, but to afford one you still need to spend a pretty penny $450,000+.
This is by far the most boring, depressing city that I have lived in. If the windchill of -30 doesn't force you to hibernate, the boredom factor of doing nothing but visiting the local malls or the monthly Costco visit will get the better of you.
Calgary seems to be a dead city. It seems like an older folks, family type city.
You just ticked all the boxes. There is no metric for measuring "interesting" or "enjoyable livability" - that's personal preference and is 10 times more valuable than anything actually in the survey. If you like winter sports like skiing - tropics probably aren't for you. If you like 10-25 degree winter days and hiking/tennis/etc maybe the subtropics (warm but not that humid) is your thing. Arts, clubs, human generated variety and excitement - NY. Hate concrete jungles and lack of space - NY might not be your thing.
blah blah lets measure roads, and incomes, how close it to the north pole.
Vancouver shouldn't even be in the same room as a discussion about livability, what with its absurd cost of living and utter lack of adequate transportation infrastructure.
It's a real head scratcher how Calgary is a top 5 city. It honestly takes me 30 minutes in decent traffic to cross the city from the NW country hills to SE Somerset. You can't rely on public transit the same way you can't rely on Calgary weather. This morning I went to work wearing a toque and it's mid summer!
Affordable houses? Well yes, but to afford one you still need to spend a pretty penny $450,000+.
This is by far the most boring, depressing city that I have lived in. If the windchill of -30 doesn't force you to hibernate, the boredom factor of doing nothing but visiting the local malls or the monthly Costco visit will get the better of you.
Calgary seems to be a dead city. It seems like an older folks, family type city.
You've hit all the spots on Calgary, read my post in page 2 about my experience.
And you're right about one thing, the boredom factor reaches the apex when you've seen the malls and the Costco. Not even Cross Iron Mills can save it, it's like the city itself...bland, boring and just another excuse to spend money.
Vancouver shouldn't even be in the same room as a discussion about livability, what with its absurd cost of living and utter lack of adequate transportation infrastructure.
Yet somehow it is EVERY year. Think about it.
What exactly is wrong with Vancouver's transit? Not talking about suburban whining, but VANCOUVER.
What exactly is wrong with Vancouver's transit? Not talking about suburban whining, but VANCOUVER.
Yeah, I wonder about that too. I can't see how they could reasonably improve downtown commuter transit in the lower mainland. The high pop areas such as Burnaby, Surrey, Vancouver, Richmond are served pretty well by Skytrain. Coquitlam, Maple Ridge, and Mission are served by the west coast express. If you live really far out from Vancouver what do you expect? We can't sustain 500 light rail stations over an area larger than NYC with only 2.5 million people.
I think people are seriously overestimating the cost of living in Vancouver. Home prices are absurd and likely due for a major correction, but rental prices aren't all that bad or out of line with most other major cities.
