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Kesler to Detroit

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Old
08-15-2012, 10:57 PM
  #226
Moore Money
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeersHockey View Post
The comparison is that there is small production, and then BIG production, and everyone is expecting that is the norm going forward. People cannot call Kesler a 40 goal scorer after that one year. That he has fallen off is OK, and he is still a good player. If he gets back there, then we can talk, but I think it unlikely.
No but we could call him a 70 point forward after doing it in back to back years with 3rd/4th line wingers.

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Old
08-15-2012, 11:01 PM
  #227
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Kesler isn't coming to Detroit. He is too injured too often to be worth Datsyuk or Zetterberg(btw Zetterberg is the next Captain so hands off, he isn't available) and it would require probably one of those two to move him at this juncture.

Dumb thread.

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Old
08-15-2012, 11:04 PM
  #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quat View Post
I'd also like to say that both Pavel and Henrik are better than Kesler. While there are certain overlaps between all three, both Wings are quite superior most aspects of the game. Nothing wrong in admitting that from a Canucks perspective.

However, it makes no sense as a Canucks fan to trade Kesler to Wings without one of those two coming back, as they get worse with any of the Wings other players in a return. I doubt the Wings organization is chomping at the bit to unload either of their remaining marque players for Kesler.
This. You might disagree with a lot of the directions this thread has gone but I agree. Now the Canucks would look like the smartest people in the league if they swapped him for Filppula and he never returned to health. Right now that makes no sense. That is the reason this trade cannot be made. The Canucks need a second line center in the deal, is Fil that guy? Maybe. But for them to do it they need one of the big two going back who might be better and in my opinion are. But it is not hard to see why the Canucks would never consider this.

Kesler brings a lot more to the table than just points, just like Datsyuk and Zetterberg. He might not have their high end skill, but he has their heart and plays the game everywhere on the ice. You can whine about his diving all you want and some of the other antics some of which are overblown but I never watch Kesler and think he won't do anything to win for his team and shoulders an enormous load. The Canucks are a weaker team right now if they trade him without the big 2 coming back, even if he never returns that is a chance they must take and cannot swap him out.

For the guy saying Zetterberg is unlikely to hit 75 points. He was the Wings best player over the whole second half and then the best player at the Worlds in my opinion. He had a rough start, but I expect huge things out of Zetterberg and Datsyuk next year. They have never really needed to go full tilt and carry a team. I think this year you see that out of both guys and it sounds like by initial reports that is how they look at the Wings now. Both players want to step their games up to an even higher level and I don't doubt either. I would put money on Z staying healthy and going north of 80 points because the Wings desperately need it and he gets that and is a leader.

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Old
08-15-2012, 11:09 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoolChamp View Post
No but we could call him a 70 point forward after doing it in back to back years with 3rd/4th line wingers.
People have been running around calling Rick Nash a 40 goal scorer all off-season and he has done it twice and been regressing in that department since. You don't fluke 40 goals, really one of the things that makes Kesler so attractive to me is people undervalue his net front presence on the PP. He would be perfect with Homer retiring, but it is never going to happen.

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Old
08-16-2012, 12:22 AM
  #230
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I like kesler. Good young 2 way playa!

Kindl + 2nd rounder for kesler?

Keep in mind that 2nd rounder might be a 40-50th pick.

Also, do not underestimate kindl. Will be a top 4 in a few years.

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Old
08-16-2012, 01:49 AM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoolChamp View Post
No but we could call him a 70 point forward after doing it in back to back years with 3rd/4th line wingers.
So now suddenly Kesler is playing 3rd/4th line...?

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Old
08-16-2012, 02:02 AM
  #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JATT187 View Post
Hahahahaha Fillpula better than Kesler, that's a good one.

Kesler missed the first 10 games of the season and played the entire season injured, with crappy players such as Raymond and Booth. And yes I know he plays on the powerplay with the Sedins, but you can't get all your points on the power play..

The only reason Fillpula got 60 points is because he played with Zetterberg and Franzen. If Kesler played on the same line as Zetterberg they could both get 85+ points.

And don't even get me started on Keslers defensive ability.
U truly are funny! "Played the entire season injured"

That would make Vancouvers managment the worst in NHL! U dont play your 2C the whole season injured - no team does. Playoffs is different. Kesler also had more icetime/game avg than the Sedins! Canucks fans claim he plays 3rd, 4th line...




2011-2012 - PLAYOFFS 2011-2012 - 2010-2011 ›
GAME G A P +/- PIM PP SH S S% SHIFTS TOI FO%
22 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 29 23:16 52.9
18 APR '12 VAN @ LAK 0 1 1 -1 2 0 0 1 0.0 28 19:05 31.6
15 APR '12 VAN @ LAK 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 32 21:58 68.0
13 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 2 0 0 6 0.0 27 22:52 52.0
11 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 2 2 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 32 23:08 55.62011-2012 - REGULAR SEASON 2011-2012 - 2010-2011 ›
GAME G A P +/- PIM PP SH S S% SHIFTS TOI FO%
07 APR '12 EDM @ VAN 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 20 19:41 55.6
05 APR '12 VAN @ CGY 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 6 0.0 26 20:24 40.0
03 APR '12 ANA @ VAN 0 0 0 -3 2 0 0 3 0.0 27 23:04 44.4
31 MAR '12 CGY @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 2 0.0 21 18:52 50.0
30 MAR '12 DAL @ VAN 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 22 18:11 66.7
28 MAR '12 COL @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 25 19:41 66.7
26 MAR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 22:09 50.0
24 MAR '12 VAN @ COL 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 27 19:06 54.6
22 MAR '12 VAN @ DAL 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 26 20:32 43.8
21 MAR '12 VAN @ CHI 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 30 20:23 65.0
19 MAR '12 VAN @ MIN 0 0 0 -1 2 0 0 4 0.0 22 21:17 33.3
17 MAR '12 CBJ @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 22 19:15 50.0
14 MAR '12 PHX @ VAN 1 0 1 -1 0 1 0 4 25.0 28 21:33 38.9
10 MAR '12 MTL @ VAN 1 0 1 -1 0 0 0 3 33.3 21 19:11 50.0
08 MAR '12 WPG @ VAN 1 0 1 1 2 0 1 6 16.7 23 20:20 52.9
06 MAR '12 DAL @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 6 0 0 2 0.0 23 18:42 70.0
03 MAR '12 BUF @ VAN 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 23 19:56 53.8
01 MAR '12 STL @ VAN 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0.0 24 19:23 66.7
28 FEB '12 VAN @ PHX 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 26 22:14 38.1
26 FEB '12 VAN @ DAL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 3 33.3 24 20:58 52.4
24 FEB '12 VAN @ NJD 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 27 20:01 60.0
23 FEB '12 VAN @ DET 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 3 0.0 28 22:24 70.6
21 FEB '12 VAN @ NSH 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 25 21:05 56.2
19 FEB '12 VAN @ EDM 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 7 0.0 24 17:39 66.7
18 FEB '12 TOR @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 20 15:15 64.3
15 FEB '12 COL @ VAN 0 1 1 2 0 0 0 1 0.0 22 16:56 41.2
13 FEB '12 PHX @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 27 20:56 50.0
11 FEB '12 VAN @ CGY 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 32 19:51 47.6
09 FEB '12 VAN @ MIN 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 3 33.3 23 18:59 70.6
07 FEB '12 VAN @ NSH 1 0 1 -1 0 1 0 4 25.0 28 20:10 58.8
04 FEB '12 VAN @ COL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 4 25.0 30 24:21 34.6
02 FEB '12 DET @ VAN 1 0 1 1 2 0 0 4 25.0 27 21:23 28.6
31 JAN '12 CHI @ VAN 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 4 25.0 28 18:50 70.6
24 JAN '12 EDM @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 4 0.0 28 20:51 42.9
21 JAN '12 SJS @ VAN 1 0 1 2 0 0 0 3 33.3 25 19:22 55.0
17 JAN '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 30 23:15 66.7
15 JAN '12 ANA @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 23 19:14 59.1
12 JAN '12 VAN @ STL 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 0 25 18:54 56.2
10 JAN '12 VAN @ TBL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 2 50.0 27 23:24 31.6
09 JAN '12 VAN @ FLA 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 22 21:32 61.1
07 JAN '12 VAN @ BOS 1 0 1 0 4 1 0 4 25.0 33 22:21 57.7
04 JAN '12 MIN @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 5 0.0 26 20:22 35.7
02 JAN '12 SJS @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 27 23:17 63.6
31 DEC '11 VAN @ LAK 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 27 20:01 62.5
29 DEC '11 VAN @ ANA 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 29 19:29 38.5
28 DEC '11 VAN @ SJS 1 0 1 0 4 1 0 4 25.0 27 19:23 41.2
26 DEC '11 EDM @ VAN 1 1 2 2 2 0 0 5 20.0 27 19:01 50.0
23 DEC '11 CGY @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 23 20:15 50.0
21 DEC '11 DET @ VAN 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 28 19:44 40.0
19 DEC '11 MIN @ VAN 1 0 1 0 2 1 0 2 50.0 22 17:41 55.0
17 DEC '11 VAN @ TOR 0 1 1 2 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 18:54 55.6
15 DEC '11 VAN @ CAR 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 30 20:39 57.1
13 DEC '11 VAN @ CBJ 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 1 0.0 29 21:45 33.3
10 DEC '11 VAN @ OTT* 2 1 3 1 0 1 0 6 33.3 32 21:31 54.2
08 DEC '11 VAN @ MTL 0 1 1 0 2 0 0 4 0.0 35 24:35 66.7
06 DEC '11 COL @ VAN 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 24 19:57 61.5
04 DEC '11 CGY @ VAN 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 1 0.0 25 20:54 77.8
01 DEC '11 NSH @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 5 0.0 24 18:53 57.9
29 NOV '11 CBJ @ VAN 1 1 2 2 0 0 0 3 33.3 28 20:55 54.6
26 NOV '11 VAN @ SJS 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 29 20:10 54.6
25 NOV '11 VAN @ PHX 1 1 2 2 0 0 0 4 25.0 22 19:07 58.8
23 NOV '11 VAN @ COL 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 4 25.0 26 19:21 60.0
20 NOV '11 OTT @ VAN 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 22:08 36.8
16 NOV '11 CHI @ VAN 0 0 0 -2 2 0 0 2 0.0 25 17:28 40.0
13 NOV '11 NYI @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 20 19:08 45.4
11 NOV '11 VAN @ ANA 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 26 20:25 73.7
10 NOV '11 VAN @ LAK 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 26 20:32 53.3
06 NOV '11 VAN @ CHI 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 31 19:08 54.2
04 NOV '11 VAN @ STL 1 0 1 1 4 1 0 3 33.3 26 20:20 53.8
03 NOV '11 VAN @ MIN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 23 17:32 30.8
01 NOV '11 VAN @ CGY 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 26 17:35 70.6
29 OCT '11 WSH @ VAN 0 2 2 0 2 0 0 4 0.0 24 16:59 76.9
26 OCT '11 STL @ VAN 0 0 0 -2 0 0 0 2 0.0 25 18:09 42.1
25 OCT '11 VAN @ EDM 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 24 20:59 50.0
22 OCT '11 MIN @ VAN 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 29 21:56 66.7
20 OCT '11 NSH @ VAN 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 4 25.0 23 18:09 50.0
18 OCT '11 NYR @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 3 0.0 22 19:07 58.8

There is your "injured" 3rd, 4th liner, playing 20+ min/g.


Last edited by spiny norman: 08-16-2012 at 11:13 AM. Reason: not needed
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Old
08-16-2012, 02:42 AM
  #233
Al Swearengen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBuddha View Post
I like kesler. Good young 2 way playa!

Kindl + 2nd rounder for kesler?

Keep in mind that 2nd rounder might be a 40-50th pick.

Also, do not underestimate kindl. Will be a top 4 in a few years.
Ouch. I thought the Buddha was supposed to be compassionate?

Counter offer:

Tanev + 2nd rounder for Zetter?

Keep in mind that 2nd rounder might be a 50th pick.

Also, do not underestimate Tanev. Will be a top 4 in a few years.

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Old
08-16-2012, 02:43 AM
  #234
Al Swearengen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
This. You might disagree with a lot of the directions this thread has gone but I agree. Now the Canucks would look like the smartest people in the league if they swapped him for Filppula and he never returned to health. Right now that makes no sense. That is the reason this trade cannot be made. The Canucks need a second line center in the deal, is Fil that guy? Maybe. But for them to do it they need one of the big two going back who might be better and in my opinion are. But it is not hard to see why the Canucks would never consider this.

Kesler brings a lot more to the table than just points, just like Datsyuk and Zetterberg. He might not have their high end skill, but he has their heart and plays the game everywhere on the ice. You can whine about his diving all you want and some of the other antics some of which are overblown but I never watch Kesler and think he won't do anything to win for his team and shoulders an enormous load. The Canucks are a weaker team right now if they trade him without the big 2 coming back, even if he never returns that is a chance they must take and cannot swap him out.

For the guy saying Zetterberg is unlikely to hit 75 points. He was the Wings best player over the whole second half and then the best player at the Worlds in my opinion. He had a rough start, but I expect huge things out of Zetterberg and Datsyuk next year. They have never really needed to go full tilt and carry a team. I think this year you see that out of both guys and it sounds like by initial reports that is how they look at the Wings now. Both players want to step their games up to an even higher level and I don't doubt either. I would put money on Z staying healthy and going north of 80 points because the Wings desperately need it and he gets that and is a leader.
This guy.

Kesler isn't going anywhere, and the only way he would get moved would be as part of a package for a better C.

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Old
08-16-2012, 02:44 AM
  #235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonlin View Post
U truly are funny! "Played the entire season injured"

That would make Vancouvers managment the worst in NHL! U dont play your 2C the whole season injured - no team does. Playoffs is different. Kesler also had more icetime/game avg than the Sedins! Canucks fans claim he plays 3rd, 4th line...

There is your "injured" 3rd, 4th liner, playing 20+ min/g.
That's actually the main reason I want the coach fired. He followed up over playing him to win the President's trophy by calling him out for using injuries as an excuse....

AV has called out injured players before (Willie Mitchell and Cody Hodgson) and has always been wrong.


Last edited by spiny norman: 08-16-2012 at 11:14 AM. Reason: qep
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Old
08-16-2012, 02:47 AM
  #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonlin View Post
U truly are funny! "Played the entire season injured"

That would make Vancouvers managment the worst in NHL! U dont play your 2C the whole season injured - no team does. Playoffs is different. Kesler also had more icetime/game avg than the Sedins! Canucks fans claim he plays 3rd, 4th line...




2011-2012 - PLAYOFFS 2011-2012 - 2010-2011 ›
GAME G A P +/- PIM PP SH S S% SHIFTS TOI FO%
22 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 29 23:16 52.9
18 APR '12 VAN @ LAK 0 1 1 -1 2 0 0 1 0.0 28 19:05 31.6
15 APR '12 VAN @ LAK 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 32 21:58 68.0
13 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 2 0 0 6 0.0 27 22:52 52.0
11 APR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 2 2 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 32 23:08 55.62011-2012 - REGULAR SEASON 2011-2012 - 2010-2011 ›
GAME G A P +/- PIM PP SH S S% SHIFTS TOI FO%
07 APR '12 EDM @ VAN 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 20 19:41 55.6
05 APR '12 VAN @ CGY 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 6 0.0 26 20:24 40.0
03 APR '12 ANA @ VAN 0 0 0 -3 2 0 0 3 0.0 27 23:04 44.4
31 MAR '12 CGY @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 2 0.0 21 18:52 50.0
30 MAR '12 DAL @ VAN 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 22 18:11 66.7
28 MAR '12 COL @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 25 19:41 66.7
26 MAR '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 22:09 50.0
24 MAR '12 VAN @ COL 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 27 19:06 54.6
22 MAR '12 VAN @ DAL 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 5 0.0 26 20:32 43.8
21 MAR '12 VAN @ CHI 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 30 20:23 65.0
19 MAR '12 VAN @ MIN 0 0 0 -1 2 0 0 4 0.0 22 21:17 33.3
17 MAR '12 CBJ @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 22 19:15 50.0
14 MAR '12 PHX @ VAN 1 0 1 -1 0 1 0 4 25.0 28 21:33 38.9
10 MAR '12 MTL @ VAN 1 0 1 -1 0 0 0 3 33.3 21 19:11 50.0
08 MAR '12 WPG @ VAN 1 0 1 1 2 0 1 6 16.7 23 20:20 52.9
06 MAR '12 DAL @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 6 0 0 2 0.0 23 18:42 70.0
03 MAR '12 BUF @ VAN 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 23 19:56 53.8
01 MAR '12 STL @ VAN 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0.0 24 19:23 66.7
28 FEB '12 VAN @ PHX 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 26 22:14 38.1
26 FEB '12 VAN @ DAL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 3 33.3 24 20:58 52.4
24 FEB '12 VAN @ NJD 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 27 20:01 60.0
23 FEB '12 VAN @ DET 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 3 0.0 28 22:24 70.6
21 FEB '12 VAN @ NSH 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 25 21:05 56.2
19 FEB '12 VAN @ EDM 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 7 0.0 24 17:39 66.7
18 FEB '12 TOR @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 20 15:15 64.3
15 FEB '12 COL @ VAN 0 1 1 2 0 0 0 1 0.0 22 16:56 41.2
13 FEB '12 PHX @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 27 20:56 50.0
11 FEB '12 VAN @ CGY 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 32 19:51 47.6
09 FEB '12 VAN @ MIN 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 3 33.3 23 18:59 70.6
07 FEB '12 VAN @ NSH 1 0 1 -1 0 1 0 4 25.0 28 20:10 58.8
04 FEB '12 VAN @ COL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 4 25.0 30 24:21 34.6
02 FEB '12 DET @ VAN 1 0 1 1 2 0 0 4 25.0 27 21:23 28.6
31 JAN '12 CHI @ VAN 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 4 25.0 28 18:50 70.6
24 JAN '12 EDM @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 4 0.0 28 20:51 42.9
21 JAN '12 SJS @ VAN 1 0 1 2 0 0 0 3 33.3 25 19:22 55.0
17 JAN '12 LAK @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 3 0.0 30 23:15 66.7
15 JAN '12 ANA @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 23 19:14 59.1
12 JAN '12 VAN @ STL 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 0 25 18:54 56.2
10 JAN '12 VAN @ TBL 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 2 50.0 27 23:24 31.6
09 JAN '12 VAN @ FLA 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 22 21:32 61.1
07 JAN '12 VAN @ BOS 1 0 1 0 4 1 0 4 25.0 33 22:21 57.7
04 JAN '12 MIN @ VAN 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 5 0.0 26 20:22 35.7
02 JAN '12 SJS @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 27 23:17 63.6
31 DEC '11 VAN @ LAK 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 27 20:01 62.5
29 DEC '11 VAN @ ANA 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 29 19:29 38.5
28 DEC '11 VAN @ SJS 1 0 1 0 4 1 0 4 25.0 27 19:23 41.2
26 DEC '11 EDM @ VAN 1 1 2 2 2 0 0 5 20.0 27 19:01 50.0
23 DEC '11 CGY @ VAN 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 23 20:15 50.0
21 DEC '11 DET @ VAN 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 28 19:44 40.0
19 DEC '11 MIN @ VAN 1 0 1 0 2 1 0 2 50.0 22 17:41 55.0
17 DEC '11 VAN @ TOR 0 1 1 2 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 18:54 55.6
15 DEC '11 VAN @ CAR 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 30 20:39 57.1
13 DEC '11 VAN @ CBJ 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 1 0.0 29 21:45 33.3
10 DEC '11 VAN @ OTT* 2 1 3 1 0 1 0 6 33.3 32 21:31 54.2
08 DEC '11 VAN @ MTL 0 1 1 0 2 0 0 4 0.0 35 24:35 66.7
06 DEC '11 COL @ VAN 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0.0 24 19:57 61.5
04 DEC '11 CGY @ VAN 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 1 0.0 25 20:54 77.8
01 DEC '11 NSH @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 5 0.0 24 18:53 57.9
29 NOV '11 CBJ @ VAN 1 1 2 2 0 0 0 3 33.3 28 20:55 54.6
26 NOV '11 VAN @ SJS 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 29 20:10 54.6
25 NOV '11 VAN @ PHX 1 1 2 2 0 0 0 4 25.0 22 19:07 58.8
23 NOV '11 VAN @ COL 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 4 25.0 26 19:21 60.0
20 NOV '11 OTT @ VAN 0 1 1 -1 0 0 0 2 0.0 27 22:08 36.8
16 NOV '11 CHI @ VAN 0 0 0 -2 2 0 0 2 0.0 25 17:28 40.0
13 NOV '11 NYI @ VAN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0.0 20 19:08 45.4
11 NOV '11 VAN @ ANA 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0 4 0.0 26 20:25 73.7
10 NOV '11 VAN @ LAK 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 3 0.0 26 20:32 53.3
06 NOV '11 VAN @ CHI 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 31 19:08 54.2
04 NOV '11 VAN @ STL 1 0 1 1 4 1 0 3 33.3 26 20:20 53.8
03 NOV '11 VAN @ MIN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 23 17:32 30.8
01 NOV '11 VAN @ CGY 0 1 1 1 2 0 0 2 0.0 26 17:35 70.6
29 OCT '11 WSH @ VAN 0 2 2 0 2 0 0 4 0.0 24 16:59 76.9
26 OCT '11 STL @ VAN 0 0 0 -2 0 0 0 2 0.0 25 18:09 42.1
25 OCT '11 VAN @ EDM 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.0 24 20:59 50.0
22 OCT '11 MIN @ VAN 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 0.0 29 21:56 66.7
20 OCT '11 NSH @ VAN 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 4 25.0 23 18:09 50.0
18 OCT '11 NYR @ VAN 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 3 0.0 22 19:07 58.8

There is your "injured" 3rd, 4th liner, playing 20+ min/g.
Some reading comprehension would be nice.
He said he's been playing with 3rd and 4th line mates. Like wingers. You know guys who don't belong on the 2nd line.

The best winger Kesler has played with since Demitra and Sundin left town is David Booth. Sure Samuelsson had one good year, but was invisible afterwards. Same story with Raymond.

I think pointing out Kesler's ice time to Canuck fans just makes us shake our heads. It proves exactly how valuable he is to us. He plays the most minutes of any of our forwards and in 1st unit key situations. The guy is the motor that keeps the Canucks turning. The Sedins are the offensive catalyst but Kesler is everything else.


Last edited by spiny norman: 08-16-2012 at 11:15 AM. Reason: qep
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08-16-2012, 06:18 AM
  #237
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Originally Posted by mstad101 View Post
Some reading comprehension would be nice.
He said he's been playing with 3rd and 4th line mates. Like wingers. You know guys who don't belong on the 2nd line.

The best winger Kesler has played with since Demitra and Sundin left town is David Booth. Sure Samuelsson had one good year, but was invisible afterwards. Same story with Raymond.

I think pointing out Kesler's ice time to Canuck fans just makes us shake our heads. It proves exactly how valuable he is to us. He plays the most minutes of any of our forwards and in 1st unit key situations. The guy is the motor that keeps the Canucks turning. The Sedins are the offensive catalyst but Kesler is everything else.
I wouldn`t exactly call Booth, Higging, Raymond etc. 3rd/4th liners! They are avg. 2nd/3rd-liners with 0.45-0.6 ppg. They also play around 15min/g with limited pp-time, whereas Kesler also get to play LOTS of pp with Sedins.
If theese guys are infact 3rd-4th liners it makes Vancouver look even more silly - What teams pay 4th liners 4.25mill/yr?

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08-16-2012, 07:05 AM
  #238
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David booth is the only one making 4.25 mil per season, and you conveniently miss how the other poster said he was the best winger that kesler has played with in a number of years. Higgins, raymond, samuelsson, hansen, etc are tweeners (all make much less than 4.25 yearly as well). Better suited as 3rd line players but can move up in a pinch.

If Kesler had some grade A 2nd line wingers to play with, his stats would only increase.

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08-16-2012, 10:31 AM
  #239
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Originally Posted by jonlin View Post
I wouldn`t exactly call Booth, Higging, Raymond etc. 3rd/4th liners! They are avg. 2nd/3rd-liners with 0.45-0.6 ppg. They also play around 15min/g with limited pp-time, whereas Kesler also get to play LOTS of pp with Sedins.
If theese guys are infact 3rd-4th liners it makes Vancouver look even more silly - What teams pay 4th liners 4.25mill/yr?
he didnt play with Booth when he put up his 70+ point seasons because he wasnt on the team.. he played mostly with Raymond, Samuelson maybe higgins can't remember exactly. None of those guys are close to being top 6 forwards. He carried his line both years. The year before he carried Sundins old slow ass as well.

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08-16-2012, 12:10 PM
  #240
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he didnt play with Booth when he put up his 70+ point seasons because he wasnt on the team.. he played mostly with Raymond, Samuelson maybe higgins can't remember exactly. None of those guys are close to being top 6 forwards. He carried his line both years. The year before he carried Sundins old slow ass as well.
More like Sundin taught Ryan how to play in the offensive zone.

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08-16-2012, 12:20 PM
  #241
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More like Sundin taught Ryan how to play in the offensive zone.
Sundin taught Kesler how to play a power game. Before Kesler was a playmaker who put up good assists but was never much of a scorer. He made Raymond and Samuelsson have career goal numbers when he put up 50 assists. Neither player has come close to those totals since Kesler came back from shooting 100 pucks a day for a summer.

Sundin taught Kesler there was more to the game than the perimeter.


And yes, I did say Booth has been the best winger he's had, and I did suggest the others were not of 2nd line quality. Please show me where I called them 4th liners. And please show me where I spouted off about costs per player before you spout your drivel?

If I posted a poll on where each winger is best suited, tell me now who you think out of Raymond, Hansen, Booth, Samuelsson and Higgins would be voted as 2nd liners. Not tweeners, not able to jump in a pinch, I mean proven quality 2nd line players. Guys who have no doubt in your mind that should always be on the 2nd line of any team.

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08-16-2012, 12:26 PM
  #242
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Thanks you! Yes, always look at the avatar, not the city! Honestly, I don't think he will pull a Cheechoo either, he is a very hard worker. But I agree that he is probably more an assist guy than scorer himself. I seek like 20-25 (not too shabby) and 30-35 assists is the range I see him hitting from here on (with great two-way play, of course). What do you think the current window is for the Nucks? Obviously they are in a longer (better) situation than the Wings, but I would not be surprised to see them in the WCF this year.
Their window depends on how long the Sedins continue to be good. Kesler is a young player, and he would be a 1a / 1b center on most teams. Even if both Sedins retired tomorrow I could see Van making the playoffs, albeit as a low scoring, grinding team. Our primary concern now is secondary scoring consistency, someone not named Kesler who can pot 50 - 60 points a season would be great. As it stands right now I give us 2 - 3 years, tops. (Then Edmonton starts clobbering us).

FWIW, I don't see Detroit's window closing anytime soon. Sure your top line guys are getting older, but the drafting is so good. With guys like Nyquist, Tatar and Smith waiting in the 'wings' , there is a perpetual supply of future stars on the way.

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08-16-2012, 12:29 PM
  #243
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No but we could call him a 70 point forward after doing it in back to back years with 3rd/4th line wingers.
This guy is talking about 3rd/4th liners...

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08-16-2012, 12:50 PM
  #244
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Kesler is more valuable due to age. Talentwise they're on the same tier, imo(Kesler, Richards, Bergeron, Zetterberg).
That is quite a reach to say the least. Maybe at some point those players were as talented as Z, but apart from their defensive game (which is on par with Z's), they are not on the same tier as Zetterberg.

Especially when it counts...playoff time. Since 06-07, Henrik Zetterberg has been the best playoff performer in the NHL.

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08-16-2012, 01:17 PM
  #245
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This guy is talking about 3rd/4th liners...
And I again ask you can you honestly say without a doubt that all of Raymond Samuelsson Booth Higgins Hansen are 2nd line players? I'm saying proven 2nd line players on any team.
Not tweeners or guys who can play there in a pinch.

Honestly without a doubt call those players true 2nd line players?

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08-16-2012, 01:18 PM
  #246
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Keslers an untouchable ATM. He's a core cog in the wheel for this present incarnation of Vancouver and is only leaving as part of a package for a better centerman (ie, Kesler + Edler + pick for Malkin or something silly like that). Keslers strong personality and penchant for injuries (because he plays like a kamikaze) will likely result in some "down years" at some point and a potentially frayed relationship with Gillis. I wouldn't have my mind blown to see Kesler end up a Red Wing in 5+ years to finish his career as a productive3rd line center @ home on a competitive team. By then our center position probably looks like 1) Ironhook 2) Zetterberg 3) Helm(Kesler?) 4) Sheahan

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08-16-2012, 02:35 PM
  #247
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Filppula 81 games 66 points. Kesler 77 games 49 points. Both equally good defensively. I wouldn't even trade Filppula for Kesler straight up right now.
Why don't you take a look at the numbers a year before? When Kesler was healthy all year.

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08-16-2012, 03:31 PM
  #248
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Some of u guys here don`t understand that Keslers value has gone down! No offense, he was a selke caliber player a while ago, but injuries took hold of him.

I don`t claim that Filppula is better than Kesler(yet). I`m just under the impression that Filppula finally broke out last year and will improve, while Kesler is regressing because of injury or other reasons?

Still, I think Filppula at 3mill > Kesler at 5mill. If both would have a similar contract and Keslers injuries aside, I would definately take Kesler over Filppula. I`m just not sure Kesler will overcome his injuries? Filppula played his first year on the 2nd line with 66p .I c a late bloomer in him and he will hit 70+ next season.

As of now(without injuries):

Detroit get:

Kesler

Vancouver get:

Filppula(signed extension 18mill/4yrs)
2013 2nd

This is about same value IMO

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08-16-2012, 03:43 PM
  #249
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Quick summary for those who are late and lazy:

Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable

Dives, dives, dives

Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable,

Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow, Keith elbow,

Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable, Untouchable

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08-16-2012, 04:23 PM
  #250
mstad101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonlin View Post
Some of u guys here don`t understand that Keslers value has gone down! No offense, he was a selke caliber player a while ago, but injuries took hold of him.

I don`t claim that Filppula is better than Kesler(yet). I`m just under the impression that Filppula finally broke out last year and will improve, while Kesler is regressing because of injury or other reasons?

Still, I think Filppula at 3mill > Kesler at 5mill. If both would have a similar contract and Keslers injuries aside, I would definately take Kesler over Filppula. I`m just not sure Kesler will overcome his injuries? Filppula played his first year on the 2nd line with 66p .I c a late bloomer in him and he will hit 70+ next season.

As of now(without injuries):

Detroit get:

Kesler

Vancouver get:

Filppula(signed extension 18mill/4yrs)
2013 2nd

This is about same value IMO
Ah the classic I've been caught with my foot in my mouth so I'll post something to completely evade the questioning posts people who disagree with me post.
Maybe instead of trying to goad people into more posts against you, you actually answer my question. To completely pass it over makes it seem like you don't even know what you're talking about or don't really believe what you've been saying.

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