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Roster Thoughts and Offseason Speculation for the 2012-2013 Season III

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Old
08-17-2012, 04:14 PM
  #76
Johnny Utah
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Kings just won the Stanley Cup, tons of players want to come here now. Sutter did Gagne a huge favor and gesture by putting him in the last couple games even though he didn't contribute.

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08-17-2012, 04:17 PM
  #77
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Clifford, King and Nolan will rotate on the 4th line with Fraser until there are injuries. Gagne is a lock for the top 9 and will be needed for injuries/slumps in the top 6.

You don't trade depth to get ice time for unproven rookies; you force the rookies to beat the current roster player before you think about a trade. If Toffoli or Pearson outperforms Gagne in camp and pre-season, then you can think about moving Gagne. Depth is what wins championships and the Kings have it. Gagne, Scuderi and Penner are all UFA in 2013. No reason to move them before another player is ready to take their spot.

I'm not worried if the organization loses prospects to waivers/trades because the LA Kings are too stacked for them to break in. That is the best problem to have and it is the Detroit model for long term success.

Quote:
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Kings just won the Stanley Cup, tons of players want to come here now. Sutter did Gagne a huge favor and gesture by putting him in the last couple games even though he didn't contribute.
I don't agree at all. The same large issues that keep players away from the Kings are still here: most players don't have family on the West coast, more travel (and time away from families) and less exposure/recognition.

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08-17-2012, 04:26 PM
  #78
Johnny Utah
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I love how everyone hates on SoCal still...I think some of you need go on twitter....Lupol, Bissonette, O'Brien, and Upshall have all spent part of this summer and last in LA/OC. I see pics of them all between Newport and LA....Avery was still out here until last year when he sold his house after his dust up with police, Igor Larionov and his family is out here, Valeri Bure is out here...Some of these guys never played a game for the Kings in there lives. I see Sheldon Souray and Chris Chelios around all the time. Kip Brennan is in Hermosa. Ethan Moreau lives in SoCal. Gretzky is back out here full time. Parros is in Hermosa. I saw O'Donnell a few summers ago out here as well. Rob Blake lives here. I can keep going and going....


Last edited by Johnny Utah: 08-17-2012 at 04:33 PM.
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08-17-2012, 04:31 PM
  #79
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brown penner king clifford and richardson should be our lws. I agree gagne should be traded for a young upgrade on rw and a pick. Nolon can be put in the ahl without having to clear waviers. the team will look like this on forwards
brown kopitar williams
penner richards carter
king stoll (upgrade in gagne trade) or toffoli if he makes team in camp
clifford frazer lewis
richardson westgarth extras with nolon in the ahl to start frist call up if someone injuryed

on defense i would trade /wave drewiski
winner of muzzin and hickey gets the 7 th spot maybe the other 8th ( i would carry 2 extra d rather then see the loser of hickey and muzzin try to clear waviers id rather wave westgarth

bernier will be traded after quick back 100% im sure theres a goalie out there we can get with the trade of bernier. Btw he will also get at least a 1st pick in the trade.

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08-17-2012, 06:18 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
I love how everyone hates on SoCal still...I think some of you need go on twitter....Lupol, Bissonette, O'Brien, and Upshall have all spent part of this summer and last in LA/OC. I see pics of them all between Newport and LA....Avery was still out here until last year when he sold his house after his dust up with police, Igor Larionov and his family is out here, Valeri Bure is out here...Some of these guys never played a game for the Kings in there lives. I see Sheldon Souray and Chris Chelios around all the time. Kip Brennan is in Hermosa. Ethan Moreau lives in SoCal. Gretzky is back out here full time. Parros is in Hermosa. I saw O'Donnell a few summers ago out here as well. Rob Blake lives here. I can keep going and going....
That's great, but it's the offseason(choice of lifestyle); you named a lot of players that have played on the west coast or train here..


Who was the Last big time free agent, that picked a West Coast team ?

Hell I can't remember any. Bottom Six guys, or Fighters are not Big time FA's.

Scott Niedermayer ? Teemu Selanne? (Both had a personal reason for signing with the Ducks).


Last edited by damacles1156: 08-17-2012 at 06:25 PM.
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08-17-2012, 06:20 PM
  #81
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Gagne gives the Kings flexibility if there happens to be an injury in the top 6, he's not being moved. As far as the Kings being a hot spot for free agents, I refuse to believe it until a big time free agent actually signs out west

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08-17-2012, 08:06 PM
  #82
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Quick question, what's the average age of the Kings?

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08-17-2012, 08:29 PM
  #83
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I have 26.6

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08-17-2012, 08:30 PM
  #84
Gentle Ben Kenobi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
I love how everyone hates on SoCal still...I think some of you need go on twitter....Lupol, Bissonette, O'Brien, and Upshall have all spent part of this summer and last in LA/OC. I see pics of them all between Newport and LA....Avery was still out here until last year when he sold his house after his dust up with police, Igor Larionov and his family is out here, Valeri Bure is out here...Some of these guys never played a game for the Kings in there lives. I see Sheldon Souray and Chris Chelios around all the time. Kip Brennan is in Hermosa. Ethan Moreau lives in SoCal. Gretzky is back out here full time. Parros is in Hermosa. I saw O'Donnell a few summers ago out here as well. Rob Blake lives here. I can keep going and going....
I'll believe it when more players sign here.
What are our biggest free agent signings of the last 15 years?

Steve Duchesne- Luc convinced his biddy to come back here.

Mattheiu Schneider- few other people wanted him. We bought low and sold high- we just got a ****** return.

Rob Blake - over the hill + **** him

Gagne- his buddy Justin Williams convinced him to sign here and us getting Richards pushed him over the edge.

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08-18-2012, 12:23 AM
  #85
Puck U
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShattStar03 View Post
Quick question, what's the average age of the Kings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sw1tch View Post
I have 26.6
Yep ... 27 ...

http://forecaster.thehockeynews.com/...ey/tott.cgi?LA

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Old
08-18-2012, 12:32 AM
  #86
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How could anyone not want to keep Gagne? He got chances even though he had been out almost 6 months. He also was on pace to finish 5th in scoring(or 7th if King/Carter play full years at same pace). He still can play and is surely a great power play option let alone at 5 on 5.

Him with King/Penner and Stoll would be quite a 3rd line.

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08-18-2012, 12:44 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Moses Doughty View Post
How could anyone not want to keep Gagne? He got chances even though he had been out almost 6 months. He also was on pace to finish 5th in scoring(or 7th if King/Carter play full years at same pace). He still can play and is surely a great power play option let alone at 5 on 5.

Him with King/Penner and Stoll would be quite a 3rd line.
I don't get it either. He's not Moreau or Hunter. He was one of the Kings best players in Oct- Dec

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08-18-2012, 09:00 AM
  #88
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I don't get it either. He's not Moreau or Hunter. He was one of the Kings best players in Oct- Dec
Not to mention one of the best snipers in the game not all too long ago. That said I am really curious to see how his game comes back after three years of futility. If he comes back to his solid play we could have a really good year.

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08-18-2012, 10:06 AM
  #89
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Not to mention one of the best snipers in the game not all too long ago. That said I am really curious to see how his game comes back after three years of futility. If he comes back to his solid play we could have a really good year.
YOu have to remember this will be the first time in 3 years that he pain and pain killer free. For him to say he woke up 'every day' in pain and took 'lots of meds' says a lot about his condition. Also, don't forget mobility. That mass they removed affected his ability to turn his head all the way on the right, near his shoulder.

Despite that and the fact he didn't like the TB system and said he never adjusted to it, he was one of the best players on the ice for the Lightning in the deep playoff run they had.

He's a very skilled player, fast and smart. He didn't look all that rusty after being out six months in the devils games. That feed to Lewis was a beauty. He's really exicted about this year, because he's healthy for the first time in 3 years.
Sutter's a smart guy, and he knows hockey. He'll do the right thing here.

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08-18-2012, 10:25 AM
  #90
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YOu have to remember this will be the first time in 3 years that he pain and pain killer free. For him to say he woke up 'every day' in pain and took 'lots of meds' says a lot about his condition. Also, don't forget mobility. That mass they removed affected his ability to turn his head all the way on the right, near his shoulder.

Despite that and the fact he didn't like the TB system and said he never adjusted to it, he was one of the best players on the ice for the Lightning in the deep playoff run they had.

He's a very skilled player, fast and smart. He didn't look all that rusty after being out six months in the devils games. That feed to Lewis was a beauty. He's really exicted about this year, because he's healthy for the first time in 3 years.
Sutter's a smart guy, and he knows hockey. He'll do the right thing here.
I agree and that was what I was saying when I said that he was one of the best snipers in the game prior to 3 years ago. That is why I am so interested to see how he turns out this season. While he will be healthy in many ways he has had other injuries in his career and his age will also have to be taken into consideration as well but I think that he is set for a big season for us which is what I meant when I said that if he comes back to his solid play that he could have a big season for us.

I am really interested to see his play. I will disagree however with the idea that he didn't look all that rusty when he returned during the playoffs, he is a much much better player then he showed us when healthy during the playoffs and that means to me that he looked pretty rusty.

I'd give him a dozen healthy games before I would expect too much from him and then watch him go. Fingers crossed.

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08-18-2012, 12:56 PM
  #91
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How could anyone not want to keep Gagne? He got chances even though he had been out almost 6 months. He also was on pace to finish 5th in scoring(or 7th if King/Carter play full years at same pace). He still can play and is surely a great power play option let alone at 5 on 5.

Him with King/Penner and Stoll would be quite a 3rd line.
Its not that i dont want to keep gagne I just feel that theres more value in keeping clifford and king in 3 4th line roles there used to. Gagne is a top 6 player needing the linemates and mins that u get playing it. Now that penner resigned he had cemistry with richard and carter i cant see them getting rid of him. We have 6 nhl level lw wingers one must go and gagne is the odd one out imo

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08-18-2012, 01:52 PM
  #92
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Really scratching my head at why people think Westgarth will hang around. He played in just 7 of the Kings final 49 games following the Sutter hire. What good is the guy?

Nobody in this day and age needs a fighter that can't play any hockey, it is a complete waste of a roster spot. The Kings and Devils were both in the finals in LARGE part due to their ability to roll four lines at you night after night, and have all four coming at you hard. When you put a Westgarth on a line, it completely ruins any chance of that. His being in the lineup hurts the Kings, it's that simple.

Suggestions that Clifford (who can fight AND play hockey, what a nice combination) and the very versatile Richardson might go to Manchester make no sense at all for me. Both are nice role players. And get rid of Gagne? No chance, he will can be very effective in a 3rd line role, adds twoway awareness and scoring punch to a 3rd line, that would be huge.

Anything other than Richardson, Clifford and Hickey/Muzzin as the 3 extra players is not going to make me happy at all. I think it's pretty clear that Drewiske and Westgarth have no place on the Kings anymore, there are better players available now.
Couldn't be more wrong.

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08-18-2012, 02:15 PM
  #93
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Couldn't be more wrong.
In what way could he not be more wrong?

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08-18-2012, 02:21 PM
  #94
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Couldn't be more wrong.
He makes a post with multiple paragraphs explaining why Westgarth and players of his ilk are worthless and this is your reply?

The Kings played their best hockey down the stretch and into the playoffs by having a balanced lineup and rolling 4 lines, something not possible with Westgarth. You'll have to look to another team to get your cheap high out of watching guys destroy each others brains in staged fights that contribute nothing to the game. The Kings will roll with 12 hockey players, it seemed to work last spring.

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08-18-2012, 02:28 PM
  #95
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He makes a post with multiple paragraphs explaining why Westgarth and players of his ilk are worthless and this is your reply?

The Kings played their best hockey down the stretch and into the playoffs by having a balanced lineup and rolling 4 lines, something not possible with Westgarth. You'll have to look to another team to get your cheap high out of watching guys destroy each others brains in staged fights that contribute nothing to the game. The Kings will roll with 12 hockey players, it seemed to work last spring.
I will take a go at the Westgarth part.

To start with when Westgarth is given time he can actually play hockey. It seems to me that there were some very unrealistic expectations regarding Westgarths ability to develop into a solid bottom 6er when only receiving 3 mins a game are where the majority of his critics find their fuel.

Once Westgarth was given more time he started playing allot better and imo would be an adequate to reasonably solid 4rth liner who could play pretty good two way hockey while throwing his weight around.

At worst we haven't any way of really knowing until we see him get enough ice time to make an honest assessment of his abilities at the NHL level. Of course our new coaching staff is more than capable of identifying rather or not he belongs with us.

That said I would rather he be waived in place of Hickey or Muzzin et al.

My only point was that he isn't as talentless and one dimensional as allot of people seem to think.

We simply have better options. See G Parros.

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08-18-2012, 02:30 PM
  #96
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I'll believe it when more players sign here.
What are our biggest free agent signings of the last 15 years?
We haven't signed any "in their prime" big name free agents.

I'll go with Willie Mitchell & Rob Scuderi to answer the question. Thought Handzus was a good signing as well.

Regardless, your point is well taken that we had to overpay for Scuds and zus and give an extra year to Mitchell (over the Caps/Sharks offers).

It should be noted that Scuderi said that he had multiple offers from other clubs that were the same as the Kings, but he thought the Kings were up and coming- he chose the Kings because we gave him the best chance to win.

Also, with Dean in charge with one eye towards the cap, we will never be the high bid on free agents. Look at Kovi and Parise. We weren't even close in terms of the money. All things considered, I'm OK with this approach, as it allows us to be competitive for the long term.

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08-18-2012, 03:14 PM
  #97
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Massive flaws.

The most obvious is Hasek. Really? He was done 5 years ago, that is just painful bad. If Bernier is traded, I'd rather Jones or any number of other available options. Hasek is nowhere close to an NHL goalie at this point.

Why is the name of hell would we trade Gagne? He will be HUGE on the 2nd or 3rd line, with a full off-season to train for the first time in a long time. At very least he is a 15-15 type player with very very solid defensive awareness, why trade that?

Westgarth should be nowhere near LA. I've said that ad nauseum, he is simply not even close to an NHL player. Clifford can actually play the game of hockey, he will be the extra guy we put in if we need more size and toughness in the corners/out front. NOBODY needs a fighter in today's game.

Clifford will NOT clear waivers.

Drewiske should be replaced by the winner of Hickey/Muzzin training camp battle. Hickey and Muzzin have much more upside, Hickey likely would not clear waivers (possibility Muzzin won't clear as well), one of them needs to be in the NHL, neither will benefit from any more time in AHL. Give the winner the roster spot, probably get 35-50 games this year, the Kings run of defensive healthiness is bound to break soon. Drewiske should clear waivers and can be the #8 in case of injuries.
Couldn't be more right.

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08-18-2012, 03:18 PM
  #98
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I don't think Hasek is a DL type of player. He's was once a great goalie but anyone who goes in and out of retirement like that is annoying.

I didn't like the way he announced he was retiring before the season even started. It puts added pressure on the team and puts more of the attention on yourself rather than the team.

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08-18-2012, 03:23 PM
  #99
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Gagne was still 5th among Fs with TOI because he plays PP and PK. I'd like to keep him in there and he can play the 3rd line, or jump to the second line if Penner struggles again or fill in for injuries. He's a great two-way forward and a smart veteran player, and if he feels the best he has in a long time I'd love to see how he does.

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08-18-2012, 05:12 PM
  #100
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That's a decision for the GM and coaching staff, and I think Suter will surprise you a little. I think there's a bit more going on behind the scenes then we know about and buying Westgarth out would have made more sense if they had no intent to play him at all.

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