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08-19-2012, 10:16 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Looks okay, alhough due to Toronto's lack of expendable assets, I think their 1st would have to be in play. Also, Kadri also plays centre, which adds to versatility in our lineup, as he could challenge either Schroeder or Kassian for their spot. What I'd expect from each team:

Chi:Bolland, Saad, 1st(overpayment)
Tor:Lombardi/Connolly, Kadri, 1st
Fla:Goc, Petrovic, 1st.
I'd probably take MacA over Lombardi/Connolly, he can give you good scoring depth on the wing especially if someone goes down due to injury(he's very capable of 20-25 goals on a high-speed team)

But I dont see how you'd be unhappy with any of these packages. Both Florida and Toronto would give you a mid-round 1st pick, a very solid prospect(canucks are pretty low on prospect depth) that is fairly ready for the NHL and a decent roster player.

I seriously cant see you guys getting a hossa or lupul or something like that simply because the market for him is so narrow.(I.E Joe thornton went for alot less than value due to lack of competition from bidders).

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08-19-2012, 10:37 PM
  #52
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Well, I'd prefer Connolly/Lombardi simply because they can push for the 2/3C role. Macarthur is another 2/3 tweener winger, which we have no more need of at the moment.

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08-19-2012, 10:40 PM
  #53
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The fact we did not trade him at the draft means we wont move him til after the new CBA is in place

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08-19-2012, 11:12 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Well, I'd prefer Connolly/Lombardi simply because they can push for the 2/3C role. Macarthur is another 2/3 tweener winger, which we have no more need of at the moment.
Lombardi can't handle being a 3C in Toronto and Connolly is like Hemsky but with less talent. Why on earth would we take on either of them? McA is the best player of the three of them.

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08-19-2012, 11:18 PM
  #55
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Lombardi can't handle being a 3C in Toronto and Connolly is like Hemsky but with less talent. Why on earth would we take on either of them? McA is the best player of the three of them.
Agreed, but he doesn't address our problems either so I hope we have no interest.

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08-20-2012, 12:07 AM
  #56
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The fact we did not trade him at the draft means we wont move him til after the new CBA is in place
You don't think Mike Gillis tried like crazy to get him moved at the draft? He was only spotted with Burke and Tallon every few minutes...

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08-20-2012, 12:14 AM
  #57
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You don't think Mike Gillis tried like crazy to get him moved at the draft? He was only spotted with Burke and Tallon every few minutes...
Wat.

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08-20-2012, 12:16 AM
  #58
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If only.

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Old
08-20-2012, 12:29 AM
  #59
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Agreed, but he doesn't address our problems either so I hope we have no interest.
What are the canucks holes? a top 6 winger?

I mean you guys do lack prospects too so maybe gillis should use Luongo for that instead,if the team is going to be competitive for a long time it needs a steady flow of new young guys as well.

I dont see, barring additions from the canucks, Luongo straight up going for a big top 6 ready now piece or defensemen.

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08-20-2012, 12:43 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
What are the canucks holes? a top 6 winger?

I mean you guys do lack prospects too so maybe gillis should use Luongo for that instead,if the team is going to be competitive for a long time it needs a steady flow of new young guys as well.

I dont see, barring additions from the canucks, Luongo straight up going for a big top 6 ready now piece or defensemen.
Ideally we should get a top-6 winger, but if it's not doable, then a third line centre with a good prospect and a 1st is a satisfactory return, imo.

There are enough possibilities to fill the top 6 spot that I don't mind futures. Kassian could break out, Raymond could bounce back, we might acquire someone(*cough*Perry*cough*) at the deadline if need be. We have a good team, I think now it's more about finding the right chemistry that will make all the difference.

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08-20-2012, 01:37 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Ideally we should get a top-6 winger, but if it's not doable, then a third line centre with a good prospect and a 1st is a satisfactory return, imo.

There are enough possibilities to fill the top 6 spot that I don't mind futures. Kassian could break out, Raymond could bounce back, we might acquire someone(*cough*Perry*cough*) at the deadline if need be. We have a good team, I think now it's more about finding the right chemistry that will make all the difference.

I agree. There are more than enough in house solutions for the top 6 spot. If Luongo is traded, it should ideally be for a quality roster player, top prospect and a pick (probably a 1st rounder). Anything less and it's not worth trading him. A 'good' prospect isn't quality return, it has to be a top prospect (within the top 3 of their orgs rankings IMO).

People seem to think Canucks need another 50 point player in the top 6. But realistically, a 1st line NHL player puts up 50+ points. A 2nd line player puts up between 34-49 pts. Last yr, Chris Higgins would have been considered a 1st line player had he played a full 82 games. Had Raymond played the full season, he was almost a 2nd line player - considering he couldn't train that's a pretty good season. With an actual summer to train, the entire team will have a better yr - I have no doubt about it. Considering this team got the most points in the league last yr with their top players having horrific seasons, the league better watch out for 2012-13.

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08-20-2012, 01:54 AM
  #62
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I agree. There are more than enough in house solutions for the top 6 spot. If Luongo is traded, it should ideally be for a quality roster player, top prospect and a pick (probably a 1st rounder). Anything less and it's not worth trading him. A 'good' prospect isn't quality return, it has to be a top prospect (within the top 3 of their orgs rankings IMO).

People seem to think Canucks need another 50 point player in the top 6. But realistically, a 1st line NHL player puts up 50+ points. A 2nd line player puts up between 34-49 pts. Last yr, Chris Higgins would have been considered a 1st line player had he played a full 82 games. Had Raymond played the full season, he was almost a 2nd line player - considering he couldn't train that's a pretty good season. With an actual summer to train, the entire team will have a better yr - I have no doubt about it. Considering this team got the most points in the league last yr with their top players having horrific seasons, the league better watch out for 2012-13.
So essentially you expect MacA, Gardiner and a 1st or 2nd or Huberdeau/bjugstad, Goc and a 1st?

Maybe Gillis expects that but I dont think any of the teams interested are willing to part with their top prospects no matter what happens.

a 1st rounder isn't out of the question but lets not put Luongo's value over guys like Rick Nash(traded for alot of 2nd/3rd liners), Mike Richards(traded for top prospect, and top 9 player+2nd rounder) Jeff Carter(cond. 1st and 2nd pairing d-man) Or even more than what Luongo went for 7 years ago.

I'm not saying he's not WORTH that but I am saying the market wont pay that much just due to numerous factors(big contract which Florida/Toronto dont like, older in age, lack of competition from buyers etc.

I'm just not sure what this is gonna be like if Luongo is still around come trade deadline. The awkwardness of still having him on the team when the season starts will be weird too, I have no idea what it's like to have a goalie that knows he's going to be leaving the team anyday.

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Old
08-20-2012, 02:03 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineRays View Post
I agree. There are more than enough in house solutions for the top 6 spot. If Luongo is traded, it should ideally be for a quality roster player, top prospect and a pick (probably a 1st rounder). Anything less and it's not worth trading him. A 'good' prospect isn't quality return, it has to be a top prospect (within the top 3 of their orgs rankings IMO).

People seem to think Canucks need another 50 point player in the top 6. But realistically, a 1st line NHL player puts up 50+ points. A 2nd line player puts up between 34-49 pts. Last yr, Chris Higgins would have been considered a 1st line player had he played a full 82 games. Had Raymond played the full season, he was almost a 2nd line player - considering he couldn't train that's a pretty good season. With an actual summer to train, the entire team will have a better yr - I have no doubt about it. Considering this team got the most points in the league last yr with their top players having horrific seasons, the league better watch out for 2012-13.
No there's not. If there were then our offense in the playoffs wouldn't have been as bad as it has been for two straight years. Who are our in house solutions? Raymond? Higgins? Hansen? These guys have proven they aren't good enough to be counted on for consistent top 6 production in the playoffs. So who else? Jensen? Kassian? Jensen hasn't played a single NHL game, and Kassian didn't look good at all last year and may not even make it as a 4th liner this year.

No, the Canucks do NOT have in-house solutions for the hole in the top 6.

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Old
08-20-2012, 02:21 AM
  #64
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So essentially you expect MacA, Gardiner and a 1st or 2nd or Huberdeau/bjugstad, Goc and a 1st?

Maybe Gillis expects that but I dont think any of the teams interested are willing to part with their top prospects no matter what happens.

a 1st rounder isn't out of the question but lets not put Luongo's value over guys like Rick Nash(traded for alot of 2nd/3rd liners), Mike Richards(traded for top prospect, and top 9 player+2nd rounder) Jeff Carter(cond. 1st and 2nd pairing d-man) Or even more than what Luongo went for 7 years ago.

I'm not saying he's not WORTH that but I am saying the market wont pay that much just due to numerous factors(big contract which Florida/Toronto dont like, older in age, lack of competition from buyers etc.

I'm just not sure what this is gonna be like if Luongo is still around come trade deadline. The awkwardness of still having him on the team when the season starts will be weird too, I have no idea what it's like to have a goalie that knows he's going to be leaving the team anyday.
That's not what I said. Quality roster player does not mean a top 6 player. In this case, it's more likely a Matthias (bottom 6 player) instead of Goc (top 6 player). And more likely a Bjugstad instead of a Huberdeau.

Nash was traded for:
2 above quality roster players (both considered top 6 forwards in NHL). A top prospect (top 3 ranking). 1st round pick.

Richards was traded for:
1 above quality top 6 forward. A top prospect deemed 'untouchable'. 2nd round pick.

Luongo should easily garner:
1 quality roster player. Top prospect (top 3 ranking). 1st round pick.

As for contract comparisons: Both Richards and Nash have long, expensive contracts - both with higher cap hits than Lu.
Competition: There are more top line forwards in the league (approx 90) than #1 goalies (approx 30). By sample size alone, there's a higher price placed on a smaller market (#1 goalies) - cause they are theoretically harder to acquire. As far as we know, there is only one #1 goalie available on the market place. That's what you call a monopoly. Meaning, seller sets asking price cause there's no competition.
Age: Richards and Nash are younger, hence a lower asking price for an older commodity (Lu).

Ya, not sure how Luongo would feel. But Gillis made it clear since day 1 there's a good chance we see both goalies in net next yr - something Schneiders agent affirmed. Lu's a big boy, he signed a decade long contract with this team. Like anyone who signs a bonded contract, you have to fulfill the obligation.

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Old
08-20-2012, 02:33 AM
  #65
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Fair points,
but yea this is kind of a side note but it's gonna suck to see a guy like him sit on the bench for a month or two or however long it takes. He's a true #1 guy and I doubt they'll want to play him much given the whole situation.

Luongo has stated he wants to move on publicly and i'm sure privately he's even more frustrated it hasn't happened yet.

Surely this will get done before the deadline though, otherwise his value will only drop.

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08-20-2012, 08:14 AM
  #66
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Fair points,
but yea this is kind of a side note but it's gonna suck to see a guy like him sit on the bench for a month or two or however long it takes. He's a true #1 guy and I doubt they'll want to play him much given the whole situation.

Luongo has stated he wants to move on publicly and i'm sure privately he's even more frustrated it hasn't happened yet.

Surely this will get done before the deadline though, otherwise his value will only drop.
How do you know he doesn't win the job back with us?

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08-20-2012, 08:21 AM
  #67
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How do you know he doesn't win the job back with us?
I think it would be best for the Canucks if one were traded at some point before the deadline...and with Cory's brand new mask, it would be a shame to let that go to waste

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08-20-2012, 09:20 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by SunshineRays View Post
Luongo should easily garner:
1 quality roster player. Top prospect (top 3 ranking). 1st round pick.
Well, that clearly hasn't happened, so it clearly isn't "easily", which brings "should" into considerable doubt.

 
Old
08-20-2012, 09:23 AM
  #69
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Well, that clearly hasn't happened, so it clearly isn't "easily", which brings "should" into considerable doubt.
Maybe Gillis wants more, or maybe he's waiting to see where Doan signs, or maybe other GMs are waiting to see the results of the new CBA.

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08-20-2012, 09:54 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Maybe Gillis wants more, or maybe he's waiting to see where Doan signs, or maybe other GMs are waiting to see the results of the new CBA.
Or maybe we don't deal him until someone meets our asking price.

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08-20-2012, 09:59 AM
  #71
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Or maybe we don't deal him until someone meets our asking price.
I said, "Maybe Gillis wants more."

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08-20-2012, 10:59 AM
  #72
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Luongo + Schroeder + 1st


FOR


Marcel Goc + 6th round pick

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08-20-2012, 11:00 AM
  #73
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Luongo + Schroeder + 1st


FOR


Marcel Goc + 6th round pick
What?
Are you being serious?

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Old
08-20-2012, 11:05 AM
  #74
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Or maybe we don't deal him until someone meets our asking price.
Yeah, maybe Luongo can score goals from the bench come playoff time. Bring on the cup!

When will some of you learn we need more offense.

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08-20-2012, 11:06 AM
  #75
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Luongo + Schroeder + 1st


FOR


Marcel Goc + 6th round pick
You don't often trade a legit #1 all-star goalie, a former 1st round prospect who has impressed at the pro level, and another 1st round pick for a 3rd line centerman. I certainly hope you simply excluded the . With 18k posts, this certainly *can't* be your first rodeo haha.

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