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The MLD 2012 Assassination Thread

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Old
08-23-2012, 06:43 PM
  #326
Canadiens1958
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PP

Quote:
Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post

Power Play 1
Horvath - Nilsson - Kehoe
Ellett - Maxwell

Power Play 2
D. Brown - Juneau - Bernier
Langlois - Guevremont


Horvath shifts to the LW slot on the first PP. This is out of position for him, but I assume that isn't going to be penalized too heavily considering the role has virtually no defensive responsibility. Nilsson now has a legitimate sniper on either wing.

On the 2nd PP, Juneau shifts to C where he will be the primary playmaker. In a bit of a surprise, to myself at least, I realized that Dustin Brown actually gets a big chunk of his offense on the PP (13 of his 17 goals in 2006-07!). I put him at LW to round out the line a bit, providing some physicality and net presence. And maybe even the occasional 5-on-3 when he div... gets tripped

Langlois takes Kiessling's spot on the second PP unit. He is not a great offensive machine, but he proved competent in a supporting offensive role. This means both the PP pairings are identical to the ES pairings, leaving the third pair intact for the post-PP momentum shift.
Your two PP units are better but you have another difficulty now. The forwards on your two PP units come from all four lines, so post PP you have to cobble together a makeshift line or play tired players against against what will probably be the other teams first line.

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08-23-2012, 08:00 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by Canadiens1958 View Post
Your two PP units are better but you have another difficulty now. The forwards on your two PP units come from all four lines, so post PP you have to cobble together a makeshift line or play tired players against against what will probably be the other teams first line.
This is a good observation. I would expect the 4th line (Henning-Yelle-Brown) to take the first shift after a failed PP, particularly when the other team is rolling out a scoring line. The only common player there is Dustin Brown, who simply has to double-shift.

I realize that's not a completely optimal situation for Brown, but he's skating 4th line minutes at even strength and can reasonably anticipate 3-4 double shifts spread out throughout the game, which isn't a taxing load all things considered. Maybe going from 15 to 18 total minutes per game.

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Old
08-23-2012, 08:10 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Have at her guys:

Chicago Blaze

Steve Thomas-Billy Taylor (A)-Ray Sheppard
Cory Stillman -Erich Kuhnhackl-Cliff Koroll
Andrew Brunette-Kelly Kisio (A)-Tony Granato
Eric Vail-Alexei Guryshev-Martin Havlat

Dave Semenko and Frank Rankin (Extras)

Jeff Brown-Joe Jerwa(C)
John Van Boxmeer-Bob Turner
Bruce Driver-Billy Coutu

Yuri Fedorov and Dave Lewis (Extras)

Ryan Miller
Gerry Mcneil

Coach: Marc Crawford

Special Teams:

PP 1: Thomas-Taylor-Sheppard-Brown-Jerwa
PP2: Vail-Kuhnhackl-Granato-Van Boxmeer-Driver

PK 1: Granato-Kisio-Jerwa-Driver
PK 2: Brunette-Koroll-Van Boxmeer-Turner
Some thoughts:
- The first line is pretty good, especially considering at which point you drafted Sheppard. Taylor-Sheppard should do a lot of damage and Thomas is a nice glue guy (although I think his fall to the MLD is probably deserved).
- Kuhnhackl is one the hardest players to place in the draft. It would be interesting to see a breakdown of where his points where coming from as the disparity in the level of competition in the 70s and 80s Olympics could be huge.
- I would switch Brunette and Koroll on the 2nd and 3rd lines to go with Granato (who can play both wings) - Kisio - Koroll as a checking line and put the more offensive minded Brunette with Kuhnhackl and Stillman (who's fine on the right side). However, the downside is this does really thin out the defensive forwards on the team
- Speaking of Brunette, he absolutely must be on a powerplay unit. His strength as a goal scorer is similar to Ryan Smyth and in his best years was scoring half of his goals on the powerplay. I don't remember him as much of a penalty killer and he never scored a SHG goal, so maybe someone like Stillman (or possibly Kuhnhackl) would be a better penalty killer
- Pretty one dimensional fourth line. Vail seems like a bit of a one-year wonder to me.
- Your forward spares are pretty weak. Rankin is okay, but Semenko is fairly useless and there were better goons available. Someone that could be a fill in defensive forward would have been a better option
- Crawford is an average coach. Not a personal favourite of mine, but adequate.
- You have a really strong top-three defence, up there with the best in the draft but I'm not sure if Turner should be in the top-4. You could elevate Driver, but Driver-Coutu is looking quite effective. I like the balancing of the pairs.
- Miller and McNeil is a very nice tandem. You should have no concerns in goal.
- Billy Taylor is the last player on the roster I'd give a letter to.


Last edited by Hedberg: 08-23-2012 at 09:27 PM.
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Old
08-23-2012, 08:20 PM
  #329
BillyShoe1721
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Against the real hockey powers in the Olympics(Finland, Sweden, USSR, Czechoslovakia), Kuhnhackl had 5 goals and 4 assists in 6 games. In those games, the Germans had a total of 19 goals. 4 goals and 2 assists came against the 2 games vs. Finland though.

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Old
08-23-2012, 09:25 PM
  #330
tony d
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Many thanks Hedberg for the review, I'll review yours over the weekend and yes Turner is going to be benched I think for Dave Lewis. Also think I'll give the A to one of Thomas or Koroll in place of Taylor.

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Old
08-23-2012, 09:39 PM
  #331
tony d
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Updated Roster Post:


Have at her guys:

Chicago Blaze

Steve Thomas(A)-Billy Taylor-Ray Sheppard
Cory Stillman-Erich Kuhnhackl-Cliff Koroll
Andrew Brunette-Kelly Kisio (A)-Tony Granato
Eric Vail-Alexei Guryshev-Martin Havlat

Dave Semenko and Frank Rankin (Extras)

Jeff Brown-Joe Jerwa(C)
John Van Boxmeer-Dave Lewis
Bruce Driver-Billy Coutu

Yuri Fedorov and Bob Turner (Extras)

Ryan Miller
Gerry Mcneil

Coach: Marc Crawford

Special Teams:

PP 1: Thomas-Taylor-Sheppard-Brown-Jerwa
PP2: Brunette-Kuhnhackl-Granato-Van Boxmeer-Driver

PK 1: Granato-Kisio-Jerwa-Driver
PK 2: Koroll-Kuchnachl-Van Boxmeer-Lewis

Era Requirements:

pre-1917: Billy Coutu, Frank Rankin
1917-1942: Joe Jerwa, Billy Taylor
1943-1965: Bob Turner, Gerry Mcneil, Alexei Guryshev
1966-1979: Erich Kuhnhackl, Cliff Koroll, John Van Boxmeer, Eric Vail, Dave Semenko, Dave Lewis, Yuri Fedorov
1980-1994: Steve Thomas, Ray Sheppard, Jeff Brown, Kelly Kisio, Tony Granato, Bruce Driver
1995-2004: Ryan Miller, Cory Stillman, Andrew Brunette
active 2012: Martin Havlat

Bios:

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...1&postcount=77 (Billy Taylor)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...1&postcount=83 (Jeff Brown)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=135 (Joe Jerwa)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=136 (steve Thomas)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=138 (ryan Miller)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=139 (Erich Kuhnhackl)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=140 (Cliff Koroll)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=142 (john Van Boxmeer)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=146 (Ray Sheppard)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=147 (Cory Stillman)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=148 (Marc Crawford)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=149 (Gerry Mcneil)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=154 (billy Coutu)http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=155 (Bruce Driver)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=157 (Bob Turner)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=159 (Andrew Brunette)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=160 (Kelly Kisio)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=162 (Tony Granato)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=163 (Eric Vail)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=164 (Alexei Guryshev)
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=166 (Martin Havlat)

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Old
08-24-2012, 01:22 AM
  #332
seventieslord
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Billy Taylor originally had a letter and Stumpy didn't? That was obviously just a typo.

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Old
08-24-2012, 09:18 AM
  #333
tony d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post


18 Craig Simpson - 4 André Lacroix - 9 Allan "Scotty" Davidson (C)
19 George Richardson - 7 Normie Himes - 23 Brian Bellows
10 Jack McDonald - 13 Lorne Campbell - 17 Cecil Blachford
14 Gaétan Duchesne - 12 Ted Hampson (A) - 16 Rich Preston
15 Cully Dahlstrom - 24 Arthur Farrell

29 Kenny Jönsson (A) - 2 Anders Eldebrink
26 Dave Maloney - 8 Willie Mitchell
6 James Stewart - 27 Fredrik Olausson
3 Eric Brewer - 5 Jack Ruttan

1 Billy Nicholson
37 TomᚠVokoun

Coach: Pete Muldoon

PP1: Craig Simpson - André Lacroix - Scotty Davidson - Anders Eldebrink - Fredrik Olausson
PP2: George Richardson/Jack McDonald - Normie Himes - Brian Bellows - Dave Maloney - Kenny Jönsson
PK1: Ted Hampson - Rich Preston - Willie Mitchell - James Stewart
PK2: Cecil Blachford - Gaetan Duchesne - Dave Maloney - Kenny Jonsson

First off thanks for the review, allow me a few minutes to review yours:

Line 1:

Simpson was always a solid scorer but due to injuries he had a very short peak. Still a good player if injuries don't get in the way. Lacroix is a very able playmaker, say all you will about the WHA, when you think of the WHA's best players Lacroix is up there. Him and Simpson should make for a really good 1st line. Davidson is a very good pick here, reads as more of an offensive player which fits in well here. Solid 1st line that will play more of an offensive game.

Line 2:

Richardson is a very good pick, he might be a little soft but other than that he's a fine player. Himes is a good pick here, the guy was a very good playmaker. Bellows is another player I've always liked, he's equally as good at scoring goals as he is at setting them up. That will work well here playing with Himes. This is one of my favourite 2nd lines in this draft, good line.

Line 3:

Jack Mcdonald is another good pick, the guy reads as a power forward who can score goals, that is something that every lineup always needs, solid pick. Lorne Campbell was a widely-recieved pick and rightly so, the guy reads as one of the top stars of the early days of hockey. Blachford is another fine pick, good 3rd line.

Line 4:

Duschene is a very fine defensive player, won't score you many goals but still he's a solid defensive guy, good pick. I picked Hampson last year, the guy was someone that did it all on the ice, he'll be asked to play a defensive role here which is something I think he'll have no problem with. Preston rounds out your 4th line, another solid defensive player, he'll fit in well with Duschene and Hampson.

Extra Forwards:

Dahlstrom is a good player who should add some offense off the bench. Farrell was a player I looked at picking as well, solid player.

Defensive Pairing 1:

Jonsson is very deserving of a letter, the guy is perhaps one of the better defensive defensemen in this draft, solid pick. Eldebrink was a player me and Dave picked back in 2010, he was considered a good find for us back then. The guy is more of an offensive guy but that'll work well here. This should be a good pairing for your team, solid all around.

Defensive Pairing 2:

A good 2-way defenseman Maloney should fit in very well with your team, good to see him on the PP as well. Willie Mitchell went way to early last year but he's a good selection where you got him at this point in this year's series of drafts. I would almost call him one of the best defensive defenseman in the league. Solid pairing.

Defensive Pairing 3:

James Stewart reads as a very interesting player, seems like he was more of a defensive guy which works well on a 3rd pairing, should be a good shutdown guy for you. Olausson is a fine pick here as well, a player I've always liked, good offensively and adequate defensively, solid pairing.

Extra Defensemen:

Eric Brewer works well as an extra here but nothing more, he had a couple really good years in the NHL but other than that's he's been average. Jack Ruttan reads as a fine pick as well.

Goaltending:

Nicholson is going to be one of the better #1's in this whole draft, solid pick. Tomas Vokoun would be a believable #1 in this draft, as it is he might be in consideration for best backup. Solid pairing that was rightly lauded by other GM's.

Coaching:

Have never been a big fan of Muldoon but with the talent on this team he should be fine.

Final Thoughts:

I really like this team, you have great goaltending, a very good defense and a solid offense. Maybe you could switch Olausson and Mitchell around on your d pairings to have a great shutdown pairing in Stewart and Mitchell. Also a defensive forward in your top 6 might not hurt either. Other than that this is a good lineup and 1 that should do well once we get to the playoffs.

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Old
08-24-2012, 10:39 AM
  #334
Velociraptor
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When do we start voting? And All-Star procedures, etc.

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08-24-2012, 10:46 AM
  #335
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
When do we start voting? And All-Star procedures, etc.
Ask seventieslord and TDMM, they seem to be charge of the process. This lollygagging is not how I ever have run drafts myself before, but all three of my attempts to expediate the process have been quickly shot down. Imo there should be a clear schedule posted and PM'd to each GM, a clear understanding of procedure and expectations. But there's a thousand ways to do management, and theirs is more relaxed and tentative. So be it. I await their decision like everyone else.

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Old
08-24-2012, 10:54 AM
  #336
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
When do we start voting? And All-Star procedures, etc.
TDMM and I have briefly touched on how we should do the voting for the all-star teams, but there hasn't been any other input. Let us know:

- should we do it just like last year? 10, 10, 10, 5, 5, 5, 5? Or double that for greater depth?
- are we all going to take some time to pimp 5 players of our choice? If we do, that's likely a week of good discussion right there while everyone jockeys for position.
- Does anyone mind if I make my preliminary votes public, to generate discussion and refine my votes? Or will that cause too much influence on the process? (believe me, from a selfish standpoint I am not eager to do this because it will promote everyone's players except my own - but I do take the AS votes seriously)

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08-24-2012, 10:58 AM
  #337
VanIslander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
-Does anyone mind if I make my preliminary votes public, to generate discussion and refine my votes?
I don't like it at all. Why not invite people to PM you if you're unsure about whom to vote for in a given category or two.

We ALL have opinions and a vote is a snapshot of all of our opinions amassed equally. The process has worked for countless drafts. Why suddenly introduce a new wrinkle, especially when it'll slow down the process? No one's opinion is worth a hair more than any others: that's what a vote represents.

Let's not add a SuperPAC element to this draft.

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Old
08-24-2012, 11:00 AM
  #338
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i say go ahead 70s

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08-24-2012, 11:04 AM
  #339
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
I don't like it at all. Why not invite people to PM you if you're unsure about whom to vote for in a given category or two.

We ALL have opinions and a vote is a snapshot of all of our opinions amassed equally. The process has worked for countless drafts. Why suddenly introduce a new wrinkle, especially when it'll slow down the process? No one's opinion is worth a hair more than any others: that's what a vote represents.

Let's not add a SuperPAC element to this draft.
just to be clear, I would say "here are the 10 forwards I am thinking of voting for". and vecens would come in and say "hey, wait a second, why Drozdetsky and not Kamensky?" and make his case and maybe even change my mind. presumably a number of other GMs would also make a case for a player and it would involve a lot of head to head comparisons which will help to "sort out" some players. what is wrong with that?

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08-24-2012, 11:06 AM
  #340
VanIslander
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(Just don't force us to consider your opinion in our voiting. We never have before and I personally don't like it unless everyone does it.)

PM me when it is time to submit our lists.

OUT.

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08-24-2012, 11:08 AM
  #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
I don't like it at all. Why not invite people to PM you if you're unsure about whom to vote for in a given category or two.

We ALL have opinions and a vote is a snapshot of all of our opinions amassed equally. The process has worked for countless drafts. Why suddenly introduce a new wrinkle, especially when it'll slow down the process? No one's opinion is worth a hair more than any others: that's what a vote represents.

Let's not add a SuperPAC element to this draft.
If we're having a discussion on the players before voting, there's no reason for somebody not to share their opinions... However they wish to do so.

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Old
08-24-2012, 11:21 AM
  #342
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Stalling

Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
TDMM and I have briefly touched on how we should do the voting for the all-star teams, but there hasn't been any other input. Let us know:

- should we do it just like last year? 10, 10, 10, 5, 5, 5, 5? Or double that for greater depth?
- are we all going to take some time to pimp 5 players of our choice? If we do, that's likely a week of good discussion right there while everyone jockeys for position.
- Does anyone mind if I make my preliminary votes public, to generate discussion and refine my votes? Or will that cause too much influence on the process? (believe me, from a selfish standpoint I am not eager to do this because it will promote everyone's players except my own - but I do take the AS votes seriously)
No reason to stall. Systems have been in place for a number of years. Changes should have been in place before starting the draft and associations. Juggling procedures now after the rosters are known except for one team is not appropriate.

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08-24-2012, 11:22 AM
  #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Ask seventieslord and TDMM, they seem to be charge of the process. This lollygagging is not how I ever have run drafts myself before, but all three of my attempts to expediate the process have been quickly shot down. Imo there should be a clear schedule posted and PM'd to each GM, a clear understanding of procedure and expectations. But there's a thousand ways to do management, and theirs is more relaxed and tentative. So be it. I await their decision like everyone else.
Speaking of lollygagging, have you posted your roster to be assassinated yet?

As for raptor's question, for the last few years, we have tried not to move on until every team has been assassinated at least once. I'll hit up Farkas' team this afternoon since he hasn't gotten a full one yet.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 08-24-2012 at 11:28 AM.
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08-24-2012, 11:31 AM
  #344
VanIslander
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seventieslord's Capitals only had a 1/2 review. He posted his squad, so that assumes he wants it assassinated. It deserves a full assassination.

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Old
08-24-2012, 11:32 AM
  #345
seventieslord
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Originally Posted by Canadiens1958 View Post
No reason to stall. Systems have been in place for a number of years. Changes should have been in place before starting the draft and associations. Juggling procedures now after the rosters are known except for one team is not appropriate.
we always decide this stuff on the fly based on how people are feeling and what kind of work they're willing to do.

the last two parts don't represent a "change" to any "system".

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08-24-2012, 11:33 AM
  #346
seventieslord
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
seventieslord's Capitals only had a 1/2 review. He posted his squad, so that assumes he wants it assassinated. It deserves a full assassination.
I don't think I did, but here it is now:

Regina Capitals



Moose Watson - Anze Kopitar - Johnny Gagnon
Miroslav Satan - Scott Gomez - Scott Mellanby (A)
Murph Chamberlain - Patrik Sundstrom - Bob MacMillan
Baldy Cotton - Art Jackson - Jim Peplinski (A)

Bryan McCabe - Paul Shmyr (C)
Gord Fraser - Drew Doughty
Barry Gibbs - Brent Seabrook

Tom Paton
Vladimir Myshkin

Coach: Emile Francis

Spares: Marty McSorley (D/RW) - Walter Smaill (D/F) - Bob Murdoch (D) - Ron Duguay (RW/C)
PP1: Watson - Kopitar - Gagnon - McCabe - Doughty
PP2: Satan - Gomez - MacMillan - Sundstrom - Fraser
PK1: Sundstrom - Chamberlain - Gibbs - Seabrook
PK2: MacMillan - Cotton - Shmyr - McCabe

1916 or earlier: Watson, Paton, Smaill
1917-1942 Gagnon, Chamberlain, Cotton, Fraser, Jackson
1943-1965 Francis
1966-1979, MacMillan, Shmyr, Gibbs, Myshkin, Murdoch, Duguay
1980-1994, Mellanby, Sundstrom, Peplinski, McSorley
1995-2004, Satan, Gomez, McCabe
in 2012: Kopitar, Doughty, Seabrook, Gomez

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08-24-2012, 11:34 AM
  #347
VanIslander
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Lokomotiv Yaroslavl

coach Bob Hartley

Doc Romnes - Andy Blair - Robert McDougall
Don Lever (A) - Daniel Brière - Tony Gingras
Terry Ruskowski (A) - Bobby Carpenter - Pat Flatley
Steve Konowalchuk - Keith Acton - Randy McKay
Jack Findlay - Viktor Zhluktov - Bruce Ridpath

Howard McNamara (C)- Moose Goheen
Igor Romishevsky - Bill Juzda
Bob Rouse - Barney Holden
Joe Reekie

Johnny Mowers
Bert Lindsay

Special teams will be as the coach sees fit (feel free to advise him).
Signed,
GM VI

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Old
08-24-2012, 12:13 PM
  #348
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70s if you feel comfortable doing that, then by all means go for it (but I know you'd never presume to put Drozdetsky ahead of Kamensky ).

It's not a bad idea to generate discussion. I've had the most absurdly ridiculous graduate school orientation this week, and I can assassinate probably 3 or 4 teams this weekend. But by all means I think you should be entitled to your opinion as long as you back it up and go for it (as I'm sure you will)

Personally I don't really care about the whole AST process but if you guys want to I have no problem discussing it so we can gauge values on players.

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08-24-2012, 01:56 PM
  #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
just to be clear, I would say "here are the 10 forwards I am thinking of voting for". and vecens would come in and say "hey, wait a second, why Drozdetsky and not Kamensky?" and make his case and maybe even change my mind. presumably a number of other GMs would also make a case for a player and it would involve a lot of head to head comparisons which will help to "sort out" some players. what is wrong with that?
IMO, the key to this process would be for everyone to take part. As we know, groupthink is a major factor in this kind of roundtable discussion. If only one or a few lists are posted, you can very well anticipate that it will have an impact on the final votes. If everyone posts a list and critical commentary follows, then I think you are improving the final voting results quite a bit. The key being participation and discussion from all corners.

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08-24-2012, 03:29 PM
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Dreakmur
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Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post
IMO, the key to this process would be for everyone to take part. As we know, groupthink is a major factor in this kind of roundtable discussion. If only one or a few lists are posted, you can very well anticipate that it will have an impact on the final votes. If everyone posts a list and critical commentary follows, then I think you are improving the final voting results quite a bit. The key being participation and discussion from all corners.
IMO we just allow the people who want to participate do that. If people don't care, they can just ignore it.

Forcing lists is pointless. If somebody doesn't want to do it, they'll just half-ass their list, which is more damaging than not submitting one. Furthermore, the people who aren't interested in discussion are going to be the same way, so there's no point.

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