Who is the starting goaltender of the Vancouver Canucks?
Now that it seems as though Luongo's not going anywhere, it appears Luongo and Schneider are the Canucks two goaltenders. I know what I'm walking into here, as Schneider as an unproven young goalie with endless potential is an hf darling, while the over 30 Luongo, also the incumbent starter, which he has been for 6 years, is hf public enemy #1. I know this, but hear me out. In 2008, Chicago signed Cristobal Huet intending to make him their starter and move Nikolai Khabibulin, for whom it just was not working out in Chi-town. Like Luongo now, Khabibulin had a humungous big contract that made him immovable. Therefore, Chicago were stuck with two expensive goaltenders, but against the odds, Khabibulin had a great season and was able to retain the starting job. Yes, unlike Luongo, 'bulin was in his last year under contract, and was able to get himself the vacant starting job in Edmonton(also not going well, interesting), and then Chicago were able to go through with their plan to make Huet the starter in 09-10. Yes, we know Huet blew that, too, and after a while, Niemi supplanted him. Here though, Luongo has a decade to go, which we all thought would have made Schneider trade bait, but now Schneider is getting paid like a starter, too. Unless one goes, what happens, and how does Vigneault handle this?
Now that it seems as though Luongo's not going anywhere, it appears Luongo and Schneider are the Canucks two goaltenders. I know what I'm walking into here, as Schneider as an unproven young goalie with endless potential is an hf darling, while the over 30 Luongo, also the incumbent starter, which he has been for 6 years, is hf public enemy #1. I know this, but hear me out. In 2008, Chicago signed Cristobal Huet intending to make him their starter and move Nikolai Khabibulin, for whom it just was not working out in Chi-town. Like Luongo now, Khabibulin had a humungous big contract that made him immovable. Therefore, Chicago were stuck with two expensive goaltenders, but against the odds, Khabibulin had a great season and was able to retain the starting job. Yes, unlike Luongo, 'bulin was in his last year under contract, and was able to get himself the vacant starting job in Edmonton(also not going well, interesting), and then Chicago were able to go through with their plan to make Huet the starter in 09-10. Yes, we know Huet blew that, too, and after a while, Niemi supplanted him. Here though, Luongo has a decade to go, which we all thought would have made Schneider trade bait, but now Schneider is getting paid like a starter, too. Unless one goes, what happens, and how does Vigneault handle this?
First of all, I realize I'm very biased here, but I think the Chicago analogy is very poor. I'm quite confident that Luongo is in a higher tier than Bulin, and I'm quite confident that his career thus far is factual vindication of that. The numbers he's put up on both good and poor teams are historically impressive.
And I feel Schneider is also in a higher tier than Huet. I suggest you look at some goalie scouting sites or talk to some goaltending scouts/coaches. I believe you will find that Schneider gives every appearance of being a rare type of talent.
As for what Vancouver will do, they really can't go wrong here. They have two starting goalies, as they did last year. One of them has proven, in my opinion, he is an elite starting goaltender. The other one, in my opinion, has elite talent, and is capable of being a starting goaltender.
What does Vigneault do? Probably split their games. Until a team in need of high-end goaltending help makes a very substantial offer for one of the two tenders, I expect we will see them continue to split games. Having an extra starting goalie is a pretty great injury insurance policy to have for the team.
They'll be starting both. Lu needs starts to showcase himself to other teams and build some trade value. Cory Schneider isn't exactly a proven commodity, Luongo's had seasons where he's started more games than Schneider has played in his career. It will probably be "play the hot hand" in Vancovuer if Roberto is still around to start the season.
Now that it seems as though Luongo's not going anywhere, it appears Luongo and Schneider are the Canucks two goaltenders. I know what I'm walking into here, as Schneider as an unproven young goalie with endless potential is an hf darling, while the over 30 Luongo, also the incumbent starter, which he has been for 6 years, is hf public enemy #1. I know this, but hear me out. In 2008, Chicago signed Cristobal Huet intending to make him their starter and move Nikolai Khabibulin, for whom it just was not working out in Chi-town. Like Luongo now, Khabibulin had a humungous big contract that made him immovable. Therefore, Chicago were stuck with two expensive goaltenders, but against the odds, Khabibulin had a great season and was able to retain the starting job. Yes, unlike Luongo, 'bulin was in his last year under contract, and was able to get himself the vacant starting job in Edmonton(also not going well, interesting), and then Chicago were able to go through with their plan to make Huet the starter in 09-10. Yes, we know Huet blew that, too, and after a while, Niemi supplanted him. Here though, Luongo has a decade to go, which we all thought would have made Schneider trade bait, but now Schneider is getting paid like a starter, too. Unless one goes, what happens, and how does Vigneault handle this?
chicago is a horrible comparison.
and i don't think that Luongo isn't going anywhere. i think it's obvious that there's going to be a lockout so moving Luongo isn't quite as pressing.
I don't see a big possibility Van tries to run with both players on the team by the time the season opens - while I'd love it to happen for the comic relief and the awkwardness it would cause, Van isn't a stupid organization - at least part of the time - and I can't see a Lu/Schneider double up in the cards.
I only brought up 08-09 Chicago up because it involves the seemingly disgraced veteran incumbent starter with an expensive contract, with their heir apparent also raring to go, with his own slightly less expensive contract. That's where the comparison ends. I say this because I think many are assuming that if it comes to be like that, Schneider will outplay Luongo and directly take it from him. I think it's possible though, that Luongo will fight like hell to remain the starter, and succeed. Of course this is all moot if Vancouver finds someone willing to take the Luongo deal off their hands, big if though.
Gillis isn't going to trade Luongo for peanuts. His career numbers are consistent and comparable to Brodeur's numbers. If Luongo had better teams in front of him than NYI, Florida and pre-president's trophy Canucks, he'd likely have some cup rings already. We can debate whether he should have had the 2011 cup all day, but that was the first time the team he was playing on was good enough to go deep.
As for last playoffs, he was hardly to blame for the two losses. He played well in game 1, was average like the rest of the team in game 2.
Game 3, they go with Schneider which was change for the sake of change. Schneider had a hard-luck loss in game 3, and by then the series was a complete write-off. Daniel's return came too late in the series. They rode Schneider the rest of the way because they wanted to get him some playoff ice-time. He barely saw the ice in the 2011 playoffs. In Game 4 he was sharp. In game 5, he had an average game, making a positional error in the 3rd and playing the pass instead of the shooter even though Salo had the passing lane tied up on the series winner.
Luongo wants out, I don't think there's any doubt of that anymore. I think he feels a bit betrayed by AV and team management. He had to bail this team out in the rough times, like 2007 against Dallas, and was great vs Nashville and San Jose last year. AV kind of trashed on Luongo, calling Schneider the better goalie, etc. What have you done for me lately? Whichever team gets Luongo will have no question marks in net for several seasons to come.
Gillis will find the right place for him. The urgency isn't there, the Canucks have cap room to carry both if necessary. Schneider's numbers are going to regress next year slightly, but they've already made their bed, they have to ride with Schneider now. He'll be considered a top 10 or even a top 5 goaltender within the next couple seasons.
Gillis isn't going to trade Luongo for peanuts. His career numbers are consistent and comparable to Brodeur's numbers. If Luongo had better teams in front of him than NYI, Florida and pre-president's trophy Canucks, he'd likely have some cup rings already. We can debate whether he should have had the 2011 cup all day, but that was the first time the team he was playing on was good enough to go deep.
As for last playoffs, he was hardly to blame for the two losses. He played well in game 1, was average like the rest of the team in game 2.
Game 3, they go with Schneider which was change for the sake of change. Schneider had a hard-luck loss in game 3, and by then the series was a complete write-off. Daniel's return came too late in the series. They rode Schneider the rest of the way because they wanted to get him some playoff ice-time. He barely saw the ice in the 2011 playoffs. In Game 4 he was sharp. In game 5, he had an average game, making a positional error in the 3rd and playing the pass instead of the shooter even though Salo had the passing lane tied up on the series winner.
Luongo wants out, I don't think there's any doubt of that anymore. I think he feels a bit betrayed by AV and team management. He had to bail this team out in the rough times, like 2007 against Dallas, and was great vs Nashville and San Jose last year. AV kind of trashed on Luongo, calling Schneider the better goalie, etc. What have you done for me lately? Whichever team gets Luongo will have no question marks in net for several seasons to come.
Gillis will find the right place for him. The urgency isn't there, the Canucks have cap room to carry both if necessary. Schneider's numbers are going to regress next year slightly, but they've already made their bed, they have to ride with Schneider now. He'll be considered a top 10 or even a top 5 goaltender within the next couple seasons.
I agree with pretty much everything you said, but what if Gillis can't find a place for him within the next season? Open competition? Put Schneider back on the shelf? Let Luongo rot on the bench? Hard to believe we're talking about the Canadian national goalie here.
I agree with pretty much everything you said, but what if Gillis can't find a place for him within the next season? Open competition? Put Schneider back on the shelf? Let Luongo rot on the bench? Hard to believe we're talking about the Canadian national goalie here.
They'll split duties close to 50/50 until a trade is made. MG will want to keep Luongo active so that he isn't cold when they try to move him. Both are professionals, and they seem to get along fine. Luongo's problems have more to do with management and AV, he doesn't hold a grudge against Schneider. If a trade isn't made by the trade deadline, things could get really interesting for the 2013 playoffs. AV will ride whoever is hot at the time.
I don't think it will happen though. I think that some team out there is going to be unhappy with their goaltending by the trade deadline and make a reasonable offer for Luongo's services.
I agree with pretty much everything you said, but what if Gillis can't find a place for him within the next season? Open competition? Put Schneider back on the shelf? Let Luongo rot on the bench? Hard to believe we're talking about the Canadian national goalie here.
The reality is, both goalies have played at about a 0.925 or better save% for the last two years (if you ignore the 1st month of last year for Luongo). There is a pretty valid reason to give Luongo that month too, the team decided to rest the regulars for all but two preseason games to rest them after the Finals (as in key regulars only played 2 preseason games each - and not together) so the team wasn't ready to go in the 1st month of the season, it was their preseason.
Cory Schneider has finished in the top 3 in save% (0.929 then 0.937) in both the last two years while Luongo has been Veizna calibur in both.
Luongo's problem isn't that he's sucked, he's been very good, it's that he's playing against a guy the team thinks might be the best goalie in the NHL. Despite that, a lot of fans see the fact that the Canucks are seemingly picking Schneider over Luongo as a sign that Luongo has sucked, which he clearly hasn't. I personally hope the Canucks hang onto Luongo until Schneider shows he can play 70 games in this league...hell, I'd hang on to him so that neither of our goalies has to play 70 games.
The most recent time this scenario occured was in Boston. Rask won the starting job from Thomas in 2009-10 (with amazing stats, particularly the 0.931 save%). Fans wanted to dump Thomas but Thomas ended up staying in Boston, won the starting job back, won the Veizna, and won the Conn Smythe and Stanley Cup that year.
I think he feels a bit betrayed by AV and team management. He had to bail this team out in the rough times, like 2007 against Dallas, and was great vs Nashville and San Jose last year. AV kind of trashed on Luongo, calling Schneider the better goalie, etc. What have you done for me lately?
That's an interesting theory, but it isn't a fact. None of us have any reason to think that Lou has any issue with AV or the head office of the Canucks. I don't remember AV saying Schneids the better goalie, either, so if someone has a link to that quote, please pass it along so I can check it out.
I think it'll be Cory Scheidner with Luongo getting traded early in the season.
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Exhibit A as to how hockey doesn't matter on ESPN:
Last night an ESPN program was discussing how the Detroit Pistons needed a hero citing the heroes on the Detroit Tigers, Detroit Lions and no mention of the Detroit Red Wings. All this despite the Red Wings probably being the most succesful team in Detroit right now.
Luongo will get the start but as soon as he hits a rough patch , Schneider is in. Quite a nice ''problem'' to have actually, Luongo is still a top tier goalie and Schneider has given all indication he can be a #1. They are the strongest tandem in the league in my opinion.
That's an interesting theory, but it isn't a fact. None of us have any reason to think that Lou has any issue with AV or the head office of the Canucks. I don't remember AV saying Schneids the better goalie, either, so if someone has a link to that quote, please pass it along so I can check it out.
It was during the pressers between games. They asked before game 4 who he was going to start, and AV said he was starting the better goalie. When he was asked who he was starting before game 5, AV replied with 'are you kidding?!'
AV had clearly turned on Luongo. When you think back to all the times Luongo had to bail out this team, it's not a stretch to think he feels slighted.
Now, if he blows up, things get interesting in a hurry...
If he blows up, and Luongo is already traded, there is no backup plan. Lack hasn't played a NHL game yet, and the UFA options are weak. The blame would be all on management, because they had a #1 under contract already and let him walk in favour of Schneider.
If he blows up, and Luongo is already traded, there is no backup plan. Lack hasn't played a NHL game yet, and the UFA options are weak. The blame would be all on management, because they had a #1 under contract already and let him walk in favour of Schneider.
I don't think people would blame management. Everyone basically agrees at this point that he's the goaltender of the present and future. He's already played in some really big games. It's likely that we won't be able to keep his fantastic GAA/SV% up for a full season, but he'll give the same or better goaltending as Luongo.
