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Old
08-24-2012, 11:46 AM
  #226
Jason Lewis
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Originally Posted by AKAY47 View Post
Toon Army baby! Newcastle is who you should be supporting, great young team
la la la la la Geooooordiiiiiies!

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Old
08-24-2012, 04:02 PM
  #227
DontgoZiggy
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Originally Posted by AKAY47 View Post
Toon Army baby! Newcastle is who you should be supporting, great young team
They need to buy Carroll back, for at least 20mill, to make me happy (A hopeful LFC fan)
If you're after entertaining sport to follow if there's a holdout, try watching the rugby. The Four nations rugby is underway, You can watch the AllBlacks Kick ass!

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Old
08-24-2012, 04:17 PM
  #228
Jason Lewis
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Originally Posted by DontgoZiggy View Post
They need to buy Carroll back, for at least 20mill, to make me happy (A hopeful LFC fan)
If you're after entertaining sport to follow if there's a holdout, try watching the rugby. The Four nations rugby is underway, You can watch the AllBlacks Kick ass!
Ba/Cisse > Carroll

end of story.

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Old
08-27-2012, 06:01 AM
  #229
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For the bored people here...
I wannt to share this ridiculous thread made at the trade deadline again.
Really good for a good laugh.

Enjoy.

Mods: Should I bump it on the trade boards - it would be entertaining to see the reaction wouldn't it?

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Old
08-27-2012, 11:32 AM
  #230
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Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
For the bored people here...
I wannt to share this ridiculous thread made at the trade deadline again.
Really good for a good laugh.

Enjoy.

Mods: Should I bump it on the trade boards - it would be entertaining to see the reaction wouldn't it?
the thread is locked so you can't bump it unfortunately

But it now makes the pens fans sound even more stupid then they were then.

Martin for Brown

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Old
08-27-2012, 11:33 AM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
For the bored people here...
I wannt to share this ridiculous thread made at the trade deadline again.
Really good for a good laugh.

Enjoy.

Mods: Should I bump it on the trade boards - it would be entertaining to see the reaction wouldn't it?
The thread is locked, so you can't bump it. But boy is there some tasty crow that could've been served. Those guys absolutely overrate their defenders. Especially Martin and that albatross of a contract he signed. What's even more hilarious is that they allowed 30 goals in 6 games and the Kings allowed 30 in 20. Those boys in the East need to stay up a little later to realize how good the Kings D-corp is. Well, I guess they all bore witness in the playoffs .

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Old
08-27-2012, 01:48 PM
  #232
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I just can't believe there is going to be another lockout. Neither side wants a lockout, so why aren't they talking everyday? Like what are they doing right now that is more important than sorting this out???

Need to treat them like children and get both sides into a room where they stay 14 hours a day every day until they get this resolved

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Old
08-27-2012, 02:23 PM
  #233
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I'm not surprised. The moment the players hired Donald Fehr, I knew it was a distinct possiblity. He was part of cancelling the World Series after all. I don't expect the whole season to be lost, but look at both the NBA and NFL last year. Both leagues locked out. NBA shortened season, NFL, shortened training time. Both resulted in a lot of injuries. I hope that doesn't happen to NHL players, most importantly, our Kings.

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Old
08-27-2012, 02:54 PM
  #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minor Boarding View Post
For the bored people here...
I wannt to share this ridiculous thread made at the trade deadline again.
Really good for a good laugh.

Enjoy.

Mods: Should I bump it on the trade boards - it would be entertaining to see the reaction wouldn't it?
its locked but you can make a new thread with the same proposal, im sure pen fans will be singing a different tune.

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Old
08-27-2012, 04:40 PM
  #235
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Owners

Can we please start laying the blame where it really belongs, the greedy owners. We missed an entire year of hockey 5 years ago, and the owners pretty much were given by the players everything they wanted. Rollbacks in salary, a hard salary cap, bigger piece of revenue. Can someone explain to me how the owners have a leg to stand on in all of this mess? What else do they want the players to give up? They want them to do ANOTHER salary rollback, and drop there revenue share from 57 down to 43%.

The owners decided they wanted to continue to overpay the lower calibre players, which in turn brought salaries up across the board. The salary cap has continued to go up, but only because hockey related revenue has also gone up considerably. Players are not going to accept non-guaranteed contracts, and I do not expect the owners to put forth such a proposal. What really needs to happen in all of this mess is the owners themselves need to establish a better system of sharing revenue. Make it a 50/50 split of hockey related revenue, which would be a 7% drop for the players (a SIGNIFICANT concession), allow the players to play in the upcoming Olympics (which benefits the league as hockey is the biggest sport arguably at the winter olympics) and create a better revenue system. Why is this so difficult you ask? Because the OWNERS are GREEDY.

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Old
08-27-2012, 05:09 PM
  #236
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As a business grows, it's percentage spent on labor has to drop.

The game has grown faster than anticipated (largely due to the TV contract, NHL network, and my Mom)and the floor is now higher than the cap was post lockout

Here are the percentages spent on labor in
The NFL- 48%
NBA-50%


Most people believe the league will want to meet in the middle between 57% and 43% at around 50%

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Old
08-27-2012, 05:21 PM
  #237
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This is so laughable.

18 of the 30 teams lost money, some to the point of bankruptcy, and you want to call the owners greedy for trying to fix things.

And for the love of god can people stop bringing up the last CBA. They signed a 7 year deal, the owners honored the deal and took an absolute bath in the deal. As LBFF said, the current salary floor is higher than the cap was seven years ago, that is unrealistic and unsustainable. And just because the owners got what they wanted in the last negotiations doesn't mean they should keep things the same, as many teams continue to drown in red ink.

Teams like Toronto, Montreal, Boston, Philly, Chicago and the Rangers should not be expected to prop up the rest of the league. Revenue sharing is one thing, subsidizing is another.

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Old
08-27-2012, 05:46 PM
  #238
jonrazor12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyCA View Post
Can we please start laying the blame where it really belongs, the greedy owners. We missed an entire year of hockey 5 years ago, and the owners pretty much were given by the players everything they wanted. Rollbacks in salary, a hard salary cap, bigger piece of revenue. Can someone explain to me how the owners have a leg to stand on in all of this mess? What else do they want the players to give up? They want them to do ANOTHER salary rollback, and drop there revenue share from 57 down to 43%.

The owners decided they wanted to continue to overpay the lower calibre players, which in turn brought salaries up across the board. The salary cap has continued to go up, but only because hockey related revenue has also gone up considerably. Players are not going to accept non-guaranteed contracts, and I do not expect the owners to put forth such a proposal. What really needs to happen in all of this mess is the owners themselves need to establish a better system of sharing revenue. Make it a 50/50 split of hockey related revenue, which would be a 7% drop for the players (a SIGNIFICANT concession), allow the players to play in the upcoming Olympics (which benefits the league as hockey is the biggest sport arguably at the winter olympics) and create a better revenue system. Why is this so difficult you ask? Because the OWNERS are GREEDY.

Please explain how the owners are greedy. I frequently research the value of each team and their respective net profits. Only a handful of teams are actually profitable. How is that greedy? Its as if owning a hockey franchise is nothing more than a hobby for owners. They actually pay money each year to own the team as opposed to take salary or dividends out. I dont mean to be rude but you have no idea what you are talking about. Sport franchises need to be ran like a business. A business is supposed to make money. Players are vastly overpaid and the owner/player split should be 90/10. Teams need to be profitable and they arent. You would think the players would respect the owners enough to recognize this and allow changes that would help owners actually make money.

THE PLAYERS ARE THE GREEDY ONES

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Old
08-27-2012, 06:21 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by jonrazor12 View Post
players are vastly overpaid and the owner/player split should be 90/10.
lol!

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Old
08-27-2012, 06:48 PM
  #240
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Players are the ones putting their health on the line. Without owners, hockey still exists, without players, hockey doesn't

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08-27-2012, 07:13 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by sw1tch View Post
Players are the ones putting their health on the line. Without owners, hockey still exists, without players, hockey doesn't
There is no NHL without both, it's a joint venture.

Players are putting their health on the line, owners are putting their money, despite negative returns.

Their is no way this is going to work with Dustin Penner and Jarret Stoll combining to make close to $7 million a season. And that is just the Kings, every team has examples like this.

The salary situation has to be resolved, right now the players are making more than they ever have and certain teams are going bankrupt.

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08-27-2012, 07:16 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by sw1tch View Post
Players are the ones putting their health on the line. Without owners, hockey still exists, without players, hockey doesn't
And they get paid plenty. To play a GAME for a living. The players should have nothing to complain about.

Not that I'm taking the owners' "side" here. As far as I'm concerned both sides need to swallow their pride and get a damn deal done.

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Old
08-27-2012, 07:58 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
There is no NHL without both, it's a joint venture.

Players are putting their health on the line, owners are putting their money, despite negative returns.

Their is no way this is going to work with Dustin Penner and Jarret Stoll combining to make close to $7 million a season. And that is just the Kings, every team has examples like this.

The salary situation has to be resolved, right now the players are making more than they ever have and certain teams are going bankrupt.
How is it the players fault that these guys are making this much? Owners are the ones offering....

I think the cap needs to come down bit (which i believe players were willing to take a pay cut on their first offer), but I highly question the spending and allocation of funds by these owners. I find it hard to believe these guys know they are losing millions to keep shelling out these god-awful contracts. I mean, aren't the wild one of the 16 teams losing money yet they go out and spend all that money on parise AND suter?

Easier said than done, but it seems like the owners need something in the cba about how to build a team within a budget.

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:00 PM
  #244
Jason Lewis
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And they get paid plenty. To play a GAME for a living. The players should have nothing to complain about.

Not that I'm taking the owners' "side" here. As far as I'm concerned both sides need to swallow their pride and get a damn deal done.
You need to realize the sacrifices that these gentlemen make to play said "game".

They sacrifice their family life and social life at young age, sometimes 13-14, to play on a travel team. They live with unknown families, bypass school most times, ask their families to pay a ton of money to pay for equipment and teams and travel. THEN they play in the NHL, where they hardly see their family for long periods of the year, they have international media on them all the time, they put their bodies on the line night in and night out...injuries, fitness, relationships...everything is incredibly publicized...

It's easy to just say these guys are playing a "game" and shouldn't get a fair say in a collective bargaining agreement. But in all honesty they sacrifice more to obtain this career than you or I sacrifice to obtain ours. Not only that...this career has a time limit. Realistically none of these guys will be playing, and making as much by age 35.

So what then?

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08-27-2012, 08:23 PM
  #245
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Winger23,

The problem is the cap floor. The floor drives up the salaries for everyone. There are only so many star players in the league, and with many of them signed to long term "cap friendly" contracts, teams are forced to spend and thus you see guys like Penner and Stoll cash in because that is what their comps are getting.

I have said many times, and will say it again. It is not the money being paid to the guys who put butts in the seat that is killing the salary structure. It's the type of money Penner, Stoll, Jones, Leino, Wideman and Souray are getting. The Kings could give Kopitar 10-11 million a season and the ROI both on the ice and at the box office would still be a +. I just don't see how you are getting a positive ROI out of paying Penner and Stoll almost $7 mill a season.

That, and a 57% take for the players, in this economy is borderline ridiculous and not close to being in line with the other leagues.

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:33 PM
  #246
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You need to realize the sacrifices that these gentlemen make to play said "game".

They sacrifice their family life and social life at young age, sometimes 13-14, to play on a travel team. They live with unknown families, bypass school most times, ask their families to pay a ton of money to pay for equipment and teams and travel. THEN they play in the NHL, where they hardly see their family for long periods of the year, they have international media on them all the time, they put their bodies on the line night in and night out...injuries, fitness, relationships...everything is incredibly publicized...

It's easy to just say these guys are playing a "game" and shouldn't get a fair say in a collective bargaining agreement. But in all honesty they sacrifice more to obtain this career than you or I sacrifice to obtain ours. Not only that...this career has a time limit. Realistically none of these guys will be playing, and making as much by age 35.

So what then?
Career Minor Leaguers do it for a ton ****ing less, same in most European leagues, folks that work in the airlines, the MILITARY for ***** sake, don't give me that pitty the players ********! They aren't in line at the unemployment office or taking welfare checks. Fact is the NHL needs owners to be taking in profit, so they can pay the ****ing players and grow the game, the league, so the players and fans get a better product. Owners feed players, healthy owners will mean players still get paid, which means no lock out. Owners take the risk, if a team goes belly up the players will get paid AT LEAST for the season by the league ex. Coyotes. Owners go bankrupt. As for the concept that the players are offered a pay cut in their proposal its temporary, they have the option to go back to the current system in the 4th or 5th year, ****ing over the owners again. I love my hockey but the players are being greedy dicks, I'm with the owners on this one just like i was the last time.

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:47 PM
  #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaygokings View Post
You need to realize the sacrifices that these gentlemen make to play said "game".

They sacrifice their family life and social life at young age, sometimes 13-14, to play on a travel team. They live with unknown families, bypass school most times, ask their families to pay a ton of money to pay for equipment and teams and travel. THEN they play in the NHL, where they hardly see their family for long periods of the year, they have international media on them all the time, they put their bodies on the line night in and night out...injuries, fitness, relationships...everything is incredibly publicized...

It's easy to just say these guys are playing a "game" and shouldn't get a fair say in a collective bargaining agreement. But in all honesty they sacrifice more to obtain this career than you or I sacrifice to obtain ours. Not only that...this career has a time limit. Realistically none of these guys will be playing, and making as much by age 35.

So what then?
Booo hooo.

I was a Marine for 7 years making 35k a year, about 27 cents an hour(Marine 24 hours a day, seven days a week). Three tours to Iraq, Getting shot at on a regular basis. I still only make about 55k in my career field now....

Cry me a river...... Those poor NHL players....

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:49 PM
  #248
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So uh I know the lockout is prevelent and all, but are we gonna trade Bernier or what?

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:50 PM
  #249
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This is so laughable.

18 of the 30 teams lost money, some to the point of bankruptcy, and you want to call the owners greedy for trying to fix things.

And for the love of god can people stop bringing up the last CBA. They signed a 7 year deal, the owners honored the deal and took an absolute bath in the deal. As LBFF said, the current salary floor is higher than the cap was seven years ago, that is unrealistic and unsustainable. And just because the owners got what they wanted in the last negotiations doesn't mean they should keep things the same, as many teams continue to drown in red ink.

Teams like Toronto, Montreal, Boston, Philly, Chicago and the Rangers should not be expected to prop up the rest of the league. Revenue sharing is one thing, subsidizing is another.
Here Here!

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Old
08-27-2012, 08:50 PM
  #250
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I'm on the side of nobody. I don't think any of the proposals presented will form a real solution towards fixing anything.

In no business do all the participants rake in a profit. The NHL is the same way. Of course there are going to be have's and have not's. Then you get into what has to be done so make the have not's sustainable so that the league can grow in some fashion. Considering the losses taken on by many of the have-not's, that's simply impossible. For me, the realization hits that the NHL is not popular or profitable enough to sustain 30 teams.

The sooner the 30 team charade is stopped, the league can begin to grow and become profitable so that this doesn't happen. Until it doesn't, this will happen every time the CBA expires. The revenue split between the owners and players is not the real problem. The owners and players can argue about it all they like but it's like putting a bandaid on a gash that is in serious need of stitching. There are too many teams who have been either propped up by the NHL or encountered financial problems that were of no fault of their own, but rather because they are not supported by local residents in a way that a professional sports team should be.



That being said I do have a problem with rollback proposals on contracts that have been agreed to by both team and player. That is wrong. I know that's how things have to be done when the revenue split changes but those were agreements that both parties made in good faith.

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