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Whats wrong: our line formations are horrible

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Old
05-02-2006, 11:53 AM
  #26
mcphee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
They're both lousy on the draw. Which is important.
Plus, they'd never leave the zone under any kind of control. If the whole game is reduced to mucking around, maybe, but the C has too much responsibility. Bullis won't get low in the d zone, Higgins hasn't been asked to do anything like that since Yale.

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05-02-2006, 11:55 AM
  #27
Shabutie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
They're both lousy on the draw. Which is important.
So's Begin though. Other than Weight and Brind'amour they don't have good faceoff men. It's not as big a deal as you think, as long as the matchups are good.

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05-02-2006, 12:02 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
So's Begin though. Other than Weight and Brind'amour they don't have good faceoff men. It's not as big a deal as you think, as long as the matchups are good.
Wait, so two of Carolina's four centers are good on the draw? And one of those two is the best in the NHL, and taking a large chunk of 'Canes faceoffs?

Faceoffs are important. It's not always about winning so much as it is not losing cleanly.

And as mcphee stated, Higgins hasn't had a center's responsibilities in a long time. He plays like a winger now. Putting a struggling rookie winger at center where he'd have increased responsibility isn't logical.

With Bulis, I would have been OK with the experiment a prior to Game Five. Now I've seen enough of his lackluster defensive play to want to keep him out of any increased responsibility. And considering the Habs' breakout is heavily dependent on the center, Bulis would likely struggle in a big way.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:05 PM
  #29
Shabutie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
Wait, so two of Carolina's four centers are good on the draw? And one of those two is the best in the NHL, and taking a large chunk of 'Canes faceoffs?
The Bulis line wouldn't be matched against the Brind'amour line. I don't expect Bulis to be a center, nor do I think it would be a great idea, but it wouldn't be as bad as you think.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:18 PM
  #30
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forget the lines

Quote:
Originally Posted by in gainey we trust
Im a passionate habs fan and i truly believe that we can win the series, but what i want to know is how can we win our defensemen are a bigger offensive threat than our forwards, and other than kovalev, theres really no1 producing on attack...kovalev loves the team but i feel that hes frustrated because his linemates arent good enough to play with him. I think the only way for us to win 2morow is to change our line formations abit.

ryder-ribeiro-kovalev
kostitsyn-bonk-bulis
zednik-plekanec-perezhogin
higgins-murray-downey

drastic changes such as these will not happen and ill be the 1st one to say that experimenting when ur 1 loss away from elimination is not wise, but some of these changes should occur, and for the ppl who think splitting ryder and higgins is a mistake, just look at what they have done minus koivu, a big NOTHING, they look like lost sheep out there without koivu, so before things get worse we must make some changes
I have said it before this team has NO IDENTITY , we don`t possess the defensive savy to grind it out like Calgary, we don`t have the offensive game of Ottawa , we don`t have 4 line, 6 d depth like Buffalo , to play a solid team game. Even with Huet at his best , we don`t support him enough up front . FOLKS FORGET THE FIRST 2 WINS , GERBER WAS TERRIBLE , now with Ward , all of a sudden we cant` find the net ?? The bottom line is this , and the quicker BG wakes up in the offseason and improves the center ice spot , this is as good as we do in the playoffs. YOU WILL GO NOWHERE WITH KOIVU AND RIBS AS YOUR TOP 2 CENTERS ,
WE CANT COMPETE WITH THE BIG BOYS DOWN THE MIDDLE. Without having a rock solid D like we had in 1986, and role players like BG, Carbo, etcc , this team will not win much come April. Unless we get a top end center, a shut down defender, in the offseason , this is as good as it gets . I think Kosty and Perez , can be the scorers if we decide ever to PLAY THEM . Use the THEO money
and make it happen in the offseason . JAY MCKEE, KUBINA , are legit targets on D.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:20 PM
  #31
mcphee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geeman
I have said it before this team has NO IDENTITY , we don`t possess the defensive savy to grind it out like Calgary, we don`t have the offensive game of Ottawa , we don`t have 4 line, 6 d depth like Buffalo , to play a solid team game. Even with Huet at his best , we don`t support him enough up front . FOLKS FORGET THE FIRST 2 WINS , GERBER WAS TERRIBLE , now with Ward , all of a sudden we cant` find the net ?? The bottom line is this , and the quicker BG wakes up in the offseason and improves the center ice spot , this is as good as we do in the playoffs. YOU WILL GO NOWHERE WITH KOIVU AND RIBS AS YOUR TOP 2 CENTERS ,
WE CANT COMPETE WITH THE BIG BOYS DOWN THE MIDDLE. Without having a rock solid D like we had in 1986, and role players like BG, Carbo, etcc , this team will not win much come April. Unless we get a top end center, a shut down defender, in the offseason , this is as good as it gets . I think Kosty and Perez , can be the scorers if we decide ever to PLAY THEM . Use the THEO money
and make it happen in the offseason . JAY MCKEE, KUBINA , are legit targets on D.
So, we shouldn't watch ? What's the theme on American Idol this week ?

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:23 PM
  #32
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Carolina, in the regular season, ranked 5th on faceoffs. The Habs ranked 21st. However, I think after game 4, the Habs had won 54% of the draws in the series. But, the Canes won more draws in game 5.

Faceoffs are huge. Don't kid yourself. Every draw is important, though those in either zone are even more important. When a team wins the draw, it gets possession of the puck which means it puts the other team in a position to go get the puck. If it is in the neutral zone, it allows the team to enter the attacking zone, either with a smart dump-in (and pressure on the D) or with passing and speed. It can put the defensive team on its heels, playing a reactionary game of just getting the puck out. Obviously, I need not discuss the importance of draws in either zone (e.g. Stillman's goal in game 2) What is also important is understanding what to do when you lose a draw, especially in the defensive zone.

A center is the most important forward position, with responsibilities down low in the defensive end, as well as the breakout. Typically, a good breakout should result in a short pass from a winger to the centreman, who will carry it through the neutral zone with options to headman the puck to an open winger. A centreman needs to be a good passer with good stickhandling and vision. Also, the centreman needs to be a good skater, be calm and have patience. While I think Bulis has the physical skills to be a good centre, I am not sure he has the personality, calmness and hockey instinct to play centre. At least not in game 6, at this point.

But please don't underestimate the importance of any face-off.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:33 PM
  #33
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I don't think I have to add anything that hasn't already been said by others. Our inability to compete down the middle at the same level as we were with Koivu is pretty clear.

I also agree that we are in need of an upgrade at that position as I don't think Koivu / Ribeiro is a strong enough 1-2 punch. We make up for it with Plekanec and Begin being our 3-4 punch and arguably one of the best 3-4 punch in the league which is probably why we are where we are right now. When healthy, we are ok down the middle but without a big presence to go to the net, it's hard to get a goalie off his game.

We haven't been blown out of the series and we still have a chance to pull off a series upset but it will take a few guys to truly step up their game and limit their mistakes if we are going to advance.

If I were to make one recommendation to Gainey, it would be to find someone willing to sacrifice his body and stand in front of Ward. Preferably someone like Downey or Begin but we could definitely use someone to take a bit of punishment to take him off his game by preventing him from having clear sight of the puck all the time.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:39 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
They aren't though. The only line that shouldn't be split up, is the Plek line. Imo, we definitely need either Higgins or Ryder on the Ribs line. My lines would be;

Higgins - Ribs - Kovalev
Perez - Plek - Zed
Kost - Begin - Ryder
Murray - Bonk - Downey/Sunny

Imo, Gainey has to work with what we've got and since Koivu was injured, he hasn't. It's time to mix it up a little.
Good lines, if only Bob wasn't blinded by his motto "The best change is the change you don't make"... I hope they will wake up tonight even if the line up is quite bad.

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Old
05-02-2006, 12:56 PM
  #35
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I think these lines would be safe and it would probably work. But it has no chance to happen and when I think about it... it's a deciding game and it's not really the time to try new combinations.

Higgins - Ribs - Kovalev
Perez - Plek - Zed
Sundstrom - Bulis - Ryder
Murray - Bonk - Begin

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Old
05-02-2006, 02:44 PM
  #36
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Look, any formation might work for one game, and there are surprising goals in every playoff series. However, at the moment I'm not crazy about the options available for Gainey to use against the Canes. For example, the only center in reserve is Lapierre, and I'd rather not insert him. And would dressing Kostitsyn increase the Habs' scoring chances or the Canes'?

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