HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Buffalo Sabres
Notices

Interesting Stats

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
09-04-2012, 04:22 AM
  #51
RazielMoshman
Ever hopeful
 
RazielMoshman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kent, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
delete


Last edited by RazielMoshman: 09-04-2012 at 04:37 AM.
RazielMoshman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 09:57 AM
  #52
Tyler2829
Registered User
 
Tyler2829's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 308
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazielMoshman View Post
How can you field a successful team with no money to spend? Pittsburgh, NYI couldn't manage it. Regier should have built a better team after the Drury-Briere fiasco, that much is true. We certainly cant ask any more of Miller or Vanek, I'm sorry thats not even opinion, it's fact. If we had better centers maybe, or Regier had built a better team over the last 5 years we'd have done better. Either way who cares? It's the past. Learn and move on, at least Regier seems to be doing that.

As far as our veterans go I have bigger questions about Leino, Ennis, Foligno, Stafford, Leopold, Weber and Miller. Vanek is the least of my worries.
You're not worried about paying a 30g scorer $7mil even when/if the salary cap drops significantly?

Tyler2829 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 10:43 AM
  #53
RazielMoshman
Ever hopeful
 
RazielMoshman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kent, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler2829 View Post
You're not worried about paying a 30g scorer $7mil even when/if the salary cap drops significantly?
We didn't have much choice in that contact, plus it only goes on for a couple of years. He is overpaid at that price, but as I say I blame Edmonton for that, not him. Why worry about something I can't change?

RazielMoshman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 11:13 AM
  #54
pigpen65
Registered User
 
pigpen65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,066
vCash: 500
Vanek is very underrated as a player IMO. There's a lot of reasons for that. Some of it is due to his contract. Some of it is because he just has a very quiet personality on the ice. The majority of it is that Ruff just doesn't use him like other premier players in the league are used. He doesn't get the ice time other coaches would be giving him.

pigpen65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 02:51 PM
  #55
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pigpen65 View Post
Vanek is very underrated as a player IMO. There's a lot of reasons for that. Some of it is due to his contract. Some of it is because he just has a very quiet personality on the ice. The majority of it is that Ruff just doesn't use him like other premier players in the league are used. He doesn't get the ice time other coaches would be giving him.
maybe it's because he's not a premier player...

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 04:32 PM
  #56
McTank
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,820
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Do you think Vanek is even tradeable in a world where the cap is below 60 million? half the league is going to be over the cap.

Do you think anyone would give up anything for a 30/60 player who accounts for 12% of your cap space?
Yes I think thomas vanek is tradeable... But I dont wanna trade him so it doesnt matter. Not that our team needs 30 goal scorers though we can just pray stafford explodes right?

McTank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 05:31 PM
  #57
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Yes I think thomas vanek is tradeable... But I dont wanna trade him so it doesnt matter. Not that our team needs 30 goal scorers though we can just pray stafford explodes right?
compare vanek to another NHLer... im curious, who do see Vanek as most similar to?

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 06:59 PM
  #58
McTank
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,820
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
compare vanek to another NHLer... im curious, who do see Vanek as most similar to?
Somewhere between Rick Nash and Jeff Carter

McTank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 07:09 PM
  #59
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Somewhere between Rick Nash and Jeff Carter
That's pretty weak. I mean, scoring production... Yea it's spot on. There's a bit more to the game though. When you "watch" them play do you think they are similar? Really? I'm talking about style of play, skating, skills, physical play, qualities, etc...

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 07:14 PM
  #60
McTank
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,820
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
That's pretty weak. I mean, scoring production... Yea it's spot on. There's a bit more to the game though. When you "watch" them play do you think they are similar? Really? I'm talking about style of play, skating, skills, physical play, qualities, etc...
What the hell does jeff carter bring that vanek doesnt? Sure nash might bring a bit more physicality or leadership qualities but he also has a worse contract

McTank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 07:18 PM
  #61
Myllz
Pavelski Lite
 
Myllz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Seattle
Country: United States
Posts: 12,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
What the hell does jeff carter bring that vanek doesnt? Sure nash might bring a bit more physicality or leadership qualities but he also has a worse contract
Groupies.

Myllz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 07:36 PM
  #62
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
What the hell does jeff carter bring that vanek doesnt? Sure nash might bring a bit more physicality or leadership qualities but he also has a worse contract
skate very well for for a big man
go to the net WITH the puck
create his own shot in the slot
play center
play respectably in his own zone

i think vanek resembles is olli jokinen on the ice..
passive player
lack of enthusiasm
questionable work ethic
sloppy skater
scores lots of garbage goals
turns the puck over a lot
not a pker
not adequate defensively
past pp production not possible in todays league
excuses about linemates always prominent
not producing the same offense over the last 3 years as he did in the first 4 post lockout years

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 07:38 PM
  #63
Zip15
Registered User
 
Zip15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,028
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
What the hell does jeff carter bring that vanek doesnt? Sure nash might bring a bit more physicality or leadership qualities but he also has a worse contract
Besides the ability to play against top competition (forward v forward), the ability to play center, elite penalty-killing, and a Cup ring? Not much.

Zip15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 10:15 PM
  #64
Der Jaeger
Registered User
 
Der Jaeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Northern Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 1,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
compare vanek to another NHLer... im curious, who do see Vanek as most similar to?
I see what you're saying about Jokinen, and agree on most of the points.

For style of play, I'm going to go with Tomas Holmstrom, except that I think Vanek is better. Both score on the powerplay from in front of the net, are not the best skaters, average defense, doesn't PK.

Der Jaeger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 10:22 PM
  #65
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 8,692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
compare vanek to another NHLer... im curious, who do see Vanek as most similar to?
Cross between Holmstrom and Kovalchuck. Worse than Kovy, better than Holmstrom, but skills are somewhat of a mix between the two (great shot, good in tight in front of the net, until recently all 3 shared the same ineptitude defensively (I think Kovalchuck's impoved there somewhat), decent but nothing special passing ability, skating is closer to Holmstrom than Kovy for sure, etc.).

tsujimoto74 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 10:47 PM
  #66
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
Cross between Holmstrom and Kovalchuck. Worse than Kovy, better than Holmstrom, but skills are somewhat of a mix between the two (great shot, good in tight in front of the net, until recently all 3 shared the same ineptitude defensively (I think Kovalchuck's impoved there somewhat), decent but nothing special passing ability, skating is closer to Holmstrom than Kovy for sure, etc.).
Kovalchuk?????


Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 11:20 PM
  #67
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 8,692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Kovalchuk?????

You make a convincing argument bro. Kovalchuck is the only forward in the league who uses a slapper the way Vanek does. I said Vanek was worse and pointed out how in several areas. Don't see how any of that is facepalm worthy.

How about this:
Vanek is like a combination of Holmstrom and Scott but worse than both at everything he does. Better for you?

tsujimoto74 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-04-2012, 11:51 PM
  #68
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
You make a convincing argument bro. Kovalchuck is the only forward in the league who uses a slapper the way Vanek does. I said Vanek was worse and pointed out how in several areas. Don't see how any of that is facepalm worthy.

How about this:
Vanek is like a combination of Holmstrom and Scott but worse than both at everything he does. Better for you?
thanks for the laugh

there's pretty much nothing similar about vanek and kovalchuk... was your argument really going to be, "they both use slapshots"?


Last edited by Jame: 09-05-2012 at 12:01 AM.
Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 01:03 AM
  #69
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 8,692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
thanks for the laugh

there's pretty much nothing similar about vanek and kovalchuk... was your argument really going to be, "they both use slapshots"?
I really like how you can read full sentences.

tsujimoto74 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 03:30 AM
  #70
RazielMoshman
Ever hopeful
 
RazielMoshman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kent, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
maybe it's because he's not a premier player...
To be honest dude, you've made your point well and fairly. Was this really necessary? It will only turn the thread in to an unnecessary arguement.

RazielMoshman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 03:32 AM
  #71
RazielMoshman
Ever hopeful
 
RazielMoshman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kent, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
That's pretty weak. I mean, scoring production... Yea it's spot on. There's a bit more to the game though. When you "watch" them play do you think they are similar? Really? I'm talking about style of play, skating, skills, physical play, qualities, etc...
On a technical level Vanek brings more. Both are lazy and pay little attention to both ends of the ice, only paying attention in the offensive zone. I've watched Nash in particular and was not impressed. Both players get by on skill, like Semin.

RazielMoshman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 08:23 AM
  #72
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazielMoshman View Post
On a technical level Vanek brings more. Both are lazy and pay little attention to both ends of the ice, only paying attention in the offensive zone. I've watched Nash in particular and was not impressed. Both players get by on skill, like Semin.
I think Semin is a decent comparison. I think Semin has a higher all around skill level. But in terms on the on ice picture, style of play, etc... it's a good match

i still think Olli Jokinen is the best parallel.

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 08:27 AM
  #73
Jame
Dream '16
 
Jame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Country: Pitcairn Islands
Posts: 33,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
I really like how you can read full sentences.
i really like how you make terrible comparisons.

tell me all about the similarities you see between vanek and kovy... i'm ready for sentences. i'll help you start... with what you said before:

1. "kovalchuk is the only forward in the league who uses a slapper the way vanek does" - i lol'ed twice while typing that...
2. ?

Jame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 09:18 AM
  #74
RazielMoshman
Ever hopeful
 
RazielMoshman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kent, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I think Semin is a decent comparison. I think Semin has a higher all around skill level. But in terms on the on ice picture, style of play, etc... it's a good match

i still think Olli Jokinen is the best parallel.
Semin has a very high talent level. Elite scorers do tend to disappear and normally aren't relied on for most things other than scoring.

Look at the centres Vanek has had to work with. Roy, Hecht, Adam? Not exactly top line material. Hell Roy's the best we had and he tends to be selfish and has an attitude that stinks.

I can completely understand your opinion but it is worth mentioning that Vanek will, most likely, be one of the Sabres top scorers of all time at the end of his career and will, at current rate, have his jersey retired. Guy deserves a little credit.

RazielMoshman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2012, 09:34 AM
  #75
Tyler2829
Registered User
 
Tyler2829's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 308
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazielMoshman View Post
Semin has a very high talent level. Elite scorers do tend to disappear and normally aren't relied on for most things other than scoring.

Look at the centres Vanek has had to work with. Roy, Hecht, Adam? Not exactly top line material. Hell Roy's the best we had and he tends to be selfish and has an attitude that stinks.

I can completely understand your opinion but it is worth mentioning that Vanek will, most likely, be one of the Sabres top scorers of all time at the end of his career and will, at current rate, have his jersey retired. Guy deserves a little credit.
I would bet my life this never ever happens.

Tyler2829 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:49 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.