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Old
09-10-2012, 09:29 AM
  #76
CREW99AW
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Originally Posted by Choralone View Post
I don't care if people want to talk trades. It's what this board is for.

However, the tone of your replies in particular have come across as sort of indignant. If anything, I get the impression from your posts that the Isles have everything they need and there's no point in discussing things.

My point as a Kings fan is that Kings don't need to trade with the Islanders either.
Gimme a break.

King fans in this thread brush aside the isles having two top center prospects in Strome/Nelson, trying to push their Loktionov to LI suggestion.

They ignore that the isles, like the kings, have a stockpile of D prospect.

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09-10-2012, 09:35 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by tigermask48 View Post
Aren't the Isles like ~4 from the floor? They may have to pick up salary on a single roster spot from somewhere if the plan is to promote from within.

Muzzin, or Hickey to the Isles makes little sense since if the neither makes the Kings, the Isles would be close to getting first crack at them on waivers. What about something like Gagne and Clifford for picks or a prospect? The trouble with the Kings right now is that if they take any NHL ready player back they'd need to send a body out to make room. I think moving a couple forwards would open up spots for King and Nolan fulltime on the Kings. Of course not sure what the value for two players with concussion histories nets in trade...
Snow is one several gms who expect the cap floor to drop, in the new cba.

According to Newsday, Snow expects teams near the ceiling to have to made salary dump trades like the James Wisniewski trade a few seasons ago..

Isles got a top 4 d-man to replace the injured Streit. Wiz was making a reasonable $3m.The Ducks rid themselves of an unwanted salary.
I can't see any circumstance where the isles would trade for Gagne, making $4.5m and coming off a 17 pt season.

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09-10-2012, 09:36 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
Snow is one several gms who expect the cap floor to drop, in the new cba.

According to Newsday, Snow expects teams near the ceiling to have to made salary dump trades like the James Wisniewski trade a few seasons ago..

Isles got a top 4 d-man to replace the injured Streit. Wiz was making a reasonable $3m.The Ducks rid themselves of an unwanted salary.
I can't see any circumstance where the isles would trade for Gagne, making $4.5m and coming off a 17 pt season.
Gagne makes $3.5 million. He wouldn't be a bad addition either. He could be a great mentor for Grabner.

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09-10-2012, 09:58 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by SLAPSHOT723 View Post
Gagne makes $3.5 million. He wouldn't be a bad addition either. He could be a great mentor for Grabner.
C'mon. These are Wang's Isles. They left PA walk after a career high 67 pt season, in which he publicly lobbied for an extension several times. He signed in Colorado for $4m and the isles replaced him with Boyes at $1m.

I have a better chance, with my arthritic knees, of playing wing for the Isles then Gagne coming off concussion/neck surgery/lousy production and due a hefty salary.

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09-10-2012, 10:39 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
C'mon. These are Wang's Isles. They left PA walk after a career high 67 pt season, in which he publicly lobbied for an extension several times. He signed in Colorado for $4m and the isles replaced him with Boyes at $1m.

I have a better chance, with my arthritic knees, of playing wing for the Isles then Gagne coming off concussion/neck surgery/lousy production and due a hefty salary.
This is also a one year contract. They haven't really shied away from those.

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Old
09-10-2012, 12:20 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
C'mon. These are Wang's Isles. They left PA walk after a career high 67 pt season, in which he publicly lobbied for an extension several times. He signed in Colorado for $4m and the isles replaced him with Boyes at $1m.

I have a better chance, with my arthritic knees, of playing wing for the Isles then Gagne coming off concussion/neck surgery/lousy production and due a hefty salary.
If you're over 35 and are willing to sign a contract for a base salary of 600,000 with a bonus of 3.6 million if you score 65 goals; Garth says a contract can be arranged for you.
You'll be assigned number 99 and will be skating with Reasoner and Niño.

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09-10-2012, 12:51 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by SLAPSHOT723 View Post
This is also a one year contract. They haven't really shied away from those.
Those 1 yr deals have been dirt cheap.

Boyes for $1m.
Staios for $800,000 with $800,000 in bonuses.


It's not as if Gagne is coming off an ironman season and would be dirt cheap.
He's coming off a concussion, recent neck surgery and a 17 pt season.
That's following his 40 pts in 2010-2011 and his 40 pts in 2009-2010.

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09-10-2012, 12:53 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by original islander View Post
If you're over 35 and are willing to sign a contract for a base salary of 600,000 with a bonus of 3.6 million if you score 65 goals; Garth says a contract can be arranged for you.
You'll be assigned number 99 and will be skating with Reasoner and Niño.
I'm hoping we'll see a Wiz like trade, after the new cba is agreed on.
That Wang will greenlight a reasonable payroll addition.

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09-10-2012, 01:01 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Ronk View Post
This doesn't fit needs for either side.
Who cares about needs if you're LA in this deal... They'd make this trade in a heartbeat. You'd have two NHL ready/proven young players to replace the likes of Penner/Mitchell for example over the next 5-7 years.

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09-10-2012, 01:09 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
I'm hoping we'll see a Wiz like trade, after the new cba is agreed on.
That Wang will greenlight a reasonable payroll addition.
There should be a good number of players out there.

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09-10-2012, 01:22 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
Those 1 yr deals have been dirt cheap.

Boyes for $1m.
Staios for $800,000 with $800,000 in bonuses.


It's not as if Gagne is coming off an ironman season and would be dirt cheap.
He's coming off a concussion, recent neck surgery and a 17 pt season.
That's following his 40 pts in 2010-2011 and his 40 pts in 2009-2010.
Gagne has had off season surgury and is feeling the best hes felt in years. It being reported hes a 100% heathy and ready for the season. It was reported that it was a growth on his neck that was contributing to his concusion systems with this gone he should be able to play more and contribute. The 17 points was in 34 games is good point production per game.

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09-10-2012, 01:33 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by KingCanadain1976 View Post
Gagne has had off season surgury and is feeling the best hes felt in years. It being reported hes a 100% heathy and ready for the season. It was reported that it was a growth on his neck that was contributing to his concusion systems with this gone he should be able to play more and contribute. The 17 points was in 34 games is good point production per game.
Look at Snow's trade history and ufa signing history.

With his tight team budget, he does not go out and bring in players due a hefty salary, who've been struggling. He bargain hunts.

Moulson-career ahler who became a ufa and signed cheap.
Parenteau-career ahler who became a ufa and signed cheap for 2 yrs.
Boyes-made $4m in 2011-2012 with Buffalo. Struggled. Signed for $1m by Snow.
Vis- a $5.6m caphit, but due $3m in actual salary.
Grabner- taken off waivers for the waiver fee.

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09-10-2012, 01:39 PM
  #88
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imo the islander need a vetern to help mentor the young players. Gagne is a ideal player for them He can help all ur younger players. For 3.5 million that is cheap for the experience he has. Also im not postive on this but isnt the islander needing to reach the cap floor at the moment ? If the vishnosky situation has him leaving ull need the 3.5 contract even more.

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09-10-2012, 01:47 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by KingCanadain1976 View Post
imo the islander need a vetern to help mentor the young players. Gagne is a ideal player for them He can help all ur younger players. For 3.5 million that is cheap for the experience he has. Also im not postive on this but isnt the islander needing to reach the cap floor at the moment ? If the vishnosky situation has him leaving ull need the 3.5 contract even more.
Can sign Michael Rozival and others and not give up assets.

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09-10-2012, 03:58 PM
  #90
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Can sign Michael Rozival and others and not give up assets.
If you want them to learn to dive, he's your guy

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09-10-2012, 03:59 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
Those 1 yr deals have been dirt cheap.

Boyes for $1m.
Staios for $800,000 with $800,000 in bonuses.


It's not as if Gagne is coming off an ironman season and would be dirt cheap.
He's coming off a concussion, recent neck surgery and a 17 pt season.
That's following his 40 pts in 2010-2011 and his 40 pts in 2009-2010.
Yeah, and Rolston was paid in peanuts.

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09-10-2012, 04:27 PM
  #92
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Yeah, and Rolston was paid in peanuts.
You know as well as I do, that Rolston's 1 yr/$5m contract was flipped for Hunter's 2 yr/$4m contract. Isles were out $1m in that exchange.

What struggling NYI player, making $2.5m to $3.5m will Snow flip for a struggling Gagne and his $3.5m contract?

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09-10-2012, 04:30 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by KingCanadain1976 View Post
imo the islander need a vetern to help mentor the young players. Gagne is a ideal player for them He can help all ur younger players. For 3.5 million that is cheap for the experience he has. Also im not postive on this but isnt the islander needing to reach the cap floor at the moment ? If the vishnosky situation has him leaving ull need the 3.5 contract even more.

No, the isles don't believe they will have trouble reaching the cap floor.


I'd rather see Snow wait until the new cba kicks in. See if there are not vets who can be had, who'll bring better bang for the buck then Gagne, who's trying to bounce back from three straight disappointing seasons and due a hefty salary(by NYI standards).

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09-10-2012, 04:31 PM
  #94
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You know as well as I do, that Rolston's 1 yr/$5m contract was flipped for Hunter's 2 yr/$4m contract. Isles were out $1m in that exchange.

What struggling NYI player, making $2.5m to $3.5m will Snow flip for a struggling Gagne and his $3.5m contract?
Only one I can think of is Reasoner, but then that leaves a hole in the roster.

But, they took in $3mil increase in the cap. They gave up an extra year in Hunter's contract, though.

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09-10-2012, 09:32 PM
  #95
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Yeah, one day...I'd say he will be a number two easy next season, if he isn't already.


LA takes this and runs. I know there is a cap and roster part to it, but they take this and laugh.
Yeah. Isles get hosed badly here. Bernier has not done well enough for the Isles to move all those pieces for a guy who is barely an upgrade over Poulin IMO.

Hamonic is a stud. Id kill to have him on the Rangers. Personally I think he would be our #2 in a year or two over both Staal and Girardi.

McDonagh - Hamonic

it would just be un fair.

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09-10-2012, 10:54 PM
  #96
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1.Frans Nielsen's good for 45-47 pts on the 2nd line. Isles would rather have him keeping the seat warm for Strome/Brock Nelson, then trade for an unproven prospect and put that prospect on the 2nd line.

20 yr old Brock Nelson's headed to the AHL for his first pro season and there has been speculation in the press, that the AHL might allow 19 yr olds like Strome to play in the AHL for the 2012-2013 season.


2.The isles have major budget woes.No way would trade Hamonic who is 5 yrs from unrestricted free agency, to land Scuderi, who's a yr away from unrestricted free agency. Check's Snow's trade M.O. He doesn't give up his top youngsters or 1st rounders for soon to be ufas. Hasn't in 5 yrs.
And that is why I didn't include Scuderi at the end of my post. It's useless for the Kings to make any deal for a defenseman projected to play in their top-6 without including Scuderi's last year in the deal, and there is no reason for a cheap team stuck in the doldrums like the Islanders to pay him - just like it was exceedingly stupid for them to deal a quality pick for one year of Visnovsky.

The one advantage would be that he could be flipped at the deadline for quality picks or a prospect.

And I have seen plenty of Hamonic, and he is likely going to be a suspect top pairing, but good top-4 defenseman. There is a lot to like there, but even if he maxes out his potential its not as though he is a world beater. He's just a nice defenseman - and this isn't an exact style match, but the guy he keeps reminding me of is Tim Gleason, maybe with a dash of a younger Adrian Aucoin. Good player, but if that is top-pairing, you'll be rolling in top picks for years to come.

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09-11-2012, 12:54 AM
  #97
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it was exceedingly stupid for them to deal a quality pick for one year of Visnovsky.
it is stupid to improve a team trying to get back to the play offs with a 1 year stop gap for one of there younger d-men? i guess they should've let nabby play else where too

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09-11-2012, 08:18 AM
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And that is why I didn't include Scuderi at the end of my post. It's useless for the Kings to make any deal for a defenseman projected to play in their top-6 without including Scuderi's last year in the deal, and there is no reason for a cheap team stuck in the doldrums like the Islanders to pay him - just like it was exceedingly stupid for them to deal a quality pick for one year of Visnovsky.

The one advantage would be that he could be flipped at the deadline for quality picks or a prospect.

And I have seen plenty of Hamonic, and he is likely going to be a suspect top pairing, but good top-4 defenseman. There is a lot to like there, but even if he maxes out his potential its not as though he is a world beater. He's just a nice defenseman - and this isn't an exact style match, but the guy he keeps reminding me of is Tim Gleason, maybe with a dash of a younger Adrian Aucoin. Good player, but if that is top-pairing, you'll be rolling in top picks for years to come.
I won't try to sell you on Hamonic. It's enough that the isles and many NYI fans, think he's developing into a stud for them.

As for trading a 2nd for Vis... would it have been better to rush 21 yr old rookie Cal De Haan into a top 4 role? Or maybe 18 yr old Reinhart?

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09-11-2012, 08:57 AM
  #99
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And that is why I didn't include Scuderi at the end of my post. It's useless for the Kings to make any deal for a defenseman projected to play in their top-6 without including Scuderi's last year in the deal, and there is no reason for a cheap team stuck in the doldrums like the Islanders to pay him - just like it was exceedingly stupid for them to deal a quality pick for one year of Visnovsky.

The one advantage would be that he could be flipped at the deadline for quality picks or a prospect.

And I have seen plenty of Hamonic, and he is likely going to be a suspect top pairing, but good top-4 defenseman. There is a lot to like there, but even if he maxes out his potential its not as though he is a world beater. He's just a nice defenseman - and this isn't an exact style match, but the guy he keeps reminding me of is Tim Gleason, maybe with a dash of a younger Adrian Aucoin. Good player, but if that is top-pairing, you'll be rolling in top picks for years to come.
The Isles want to make the playoffs and they were in need of a top-4 defenseman as well as more offense from their backend and another shot from the point. They are completely stocked with 2nd-round talent in their system, to the point where most of them probably will never even get a shot with the Islanders.

IMO, that trade was anything but stupid.

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09-11-2012, 12:55 PM
  #100
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Isles are also stocked with young D prospects and want to add size/ skill to their top 9 group of forwards, which is why they gave 6'6 Joensuu a contract this summer, luring him back from Europe.

I don't see what Alec Martinez, David Drewiske, Thomas Hickey, and Jake Muzzin bring, that De Haan, Donovan, Ness, Pokka, Kitchon and Russo can't.


Hard to see Snow moving any of his big, skilled forward prospects Kabanov/Nelson/Nino/Lee for Alec Martinez, David Drewiske, Thomas Hickey, and Jake Muzzin. Imo he'll want to give his own D prospects icetime.
Martinez and Drewiskie both have SC rings, something none of those others have.

I dont like the OP, we pillage the Isles. As a Kings fan I think Bernier holds value in a trade, but I think we should focus him elsewhere. Trading high end pieces to get Hamonic does not make sense. He's a great D man, we'd make him fit, but are assets would be better served elsewhere in trades as D is a strong point. The Isles are rebuilding, seems like tough trading partners although who knows what Snow values.

Im not high on Loktionov, I could be wrong, hope Im wrong, but doubt he amounts to much at the NHL level. Toffoli being allowed to develop, or stepping in on Kopitar's wing with Brown could be awesome. Pushes Williams down, but makes 2nd line just as solid. Why trade him now unless its in a 'bluechip" type trade (ie Richards esque).

Grabner would be of interest as he's a sniper (something we could use) and adds speed (something we could use). I doubt the Isles trade him.

Im sure there is a trade Dean and Garth could work out, just doubt its something that would excite either fan base or one that would occur at the present time.

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