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2014 - Canada Roster Discussion (Part III)

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09-15-2012, 03:33 AM
  #376
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Playing for a crappy team like Columbus over the past several years has an impact on a guy's stats and overall drive. Nash being traded to New York, will prove once again why he is one of the best players in the game. He was one of Canada's best players in Vancouver and will be there once again in Sochi. I just do not get all hate for Nash and Perry. People have short memories. Perry lead the league in goals and won the Rocket Richard Trophy for the 2010-2011 season. One off year, and people are counting him out. SMH.
re: Perry 2010-11 is a long way removed from 2014... I basically don't care what he did in 2010 in Vancouver or in the 2010-11 NHL season. The most important question will be where's his game at in December 2013 when the team is named? As of right now, he's off my team. There's no hate here...he's either got to produce or step aside. And I say that because his game is more ideally suited for an NHL rink. Nash and Staal are the other two vets that get a little more rope because at least they can skate.

And to throw even more fuel on to the fire, I'd even take David Perron to Sochi before I'd take Perry. If numbers are more or less equal between the two then it's Parron over Perry.


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09-15-2012, 07:58 AM
  #377
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Personally, I'd get rid of E. Staal, Richards, and Nash. Eberle moves up into one of the top 3 RW positions.
When it came to the somewhat controversial guys on my team, I basically went for what I expect HC to do. I highly doubt that they will cut many players from 2010 who are still performing at a high level. Clearly for my projections both Nash and E. Staal have to pick their games up this year, but I think Nash moving to New York and Staal moving to LW boosts the chances for both of them.

As far as Perry, he has been a consistently strong goal scorer and provides something different for the team. If he fails to perform, Eberle easily steps up and replaces him.

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I know others will say 1976 but...

I believe that if we had goaltending, the 2012 team would be the best Canada has ever produced.
Sorry, but 1976 is the most talented international hockey team ever produced. Just looking at defence alone, the only Canadian defenceman today who would definitely make the 1976 team is Weber. Forwards are close, but the defence gap is massive.

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09-15-2012, 11:25 AM
  #378
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re: Perry 2010-11 is a long way removed from 2014... I basically don't care what he did in 2010 in Vancouver or in the 2010-11 NHL season. The most important question will be where's his game at in December 2013 when the team is named? As of right now, he's off my team. There's no hate here...he's either got to produce or step aside. And I say that because his game is more ideally suited for an NHL rink. Nash and Staal are the other two vets that get a little more rope because at least they can skate.

And to throw even more fuel on to the fire, I'd even take David Perron to Sochi before I'd take Perry. If numbers are more or less equal between the two then it's Parron over Perry.
All I have to say i am glad you are not the GM of Team Canada. David Perron (LOL). He is a decent player, but should not even be the discussion for Sochi. What is next? You are going to put Joffrey Lupul on the team? Perry also has speed, and is not a guy who can not skate to save his life like some others. The guy scored 37 goals last year, and somehow you and others think because he did not lead the league in goals, that he should be off the team. Glad you are not the GM. Perry will be on the team in Sochi. Yzerman mentioned the same thing in the summer how he liked what Perry, Nash, Richards and Toews did in 2010 to help Canada win GOLD.

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09-15-2012, 12:02 PM
  #379
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All I have to say i am glad you are not the GM of Team Canada. David Perron (LOL). He is a decent player, but should not even be the discussion for Sochi. What is next? You are going to put Joffrey Lupul on the team? Perry also has speed, and is not a guy who can not skate to save his life like some others. The guy scored 37 goals last year, and somehow you and others think because he did not lead the league in goals, that he should be off the team. Glad you are not the GM. Perry will be on the team in Sochi. Yzerman mentioned the same thing in the summer how he liked what Perry, Nash, Richards and Toews did in 2010 to help Canada win GOLD.
If this were NHL ice, then Perry sure! Big ice? No! I think he takes too many penalties, and even worse too many dumb penalties. Hey I'm not in the Perry camp! you are! that's fine. Like I said, 20 million hockey fans in Canada you'll get 20 million opinions. Perron is a better than decent player, can play either side LW/RW is a better skater, better defensive player and in a year and a half his stats should be equal to Perry's stats...making him a better fit on my Team Canada. When stats are equal, I'll always opt for the younger, faster, better defensively and all round better player. If Perry is not a 40 goal 40 assist player come selection time, then Team Canada should move on.


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09-15-2012, 09:35 PM
  #380
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If this were NHL ice, then Perry sure! Big ice? No! I think he takes too many penalties, and even worse too many dumb penalties. Hey I'm not in the Perry camp! you are! that's fine. Like I said, 20 million hockey fans in Canada you'll get 20 million opinions. Perron is a better than decent player, can play either side LW/RW is a better skater, better defensive player and in a year and a half his stats should be equal to Perry's stats...making him a better fit on my Team Canada. When stats are equal, I'll always opt for the younger, faster, better defensively and all round better player. If Perry is not a 40 goal 40 assist player come selection time, then Team Canada should move on.
The discussion is about today, and not a year and a half from now. Nobody knows what can happen in a year and a half. As of right now, Perry should be on the team. Forget about Perron. I have others rated ahead of him, and the guy's track record is nowhere near Perry's. We agree to disagree. Perry is 27 years old. He is not an old guy by any means. I have seen Perry at his best, and people make it seem like he is a nobody. I guess people forgot about 2010. Go watch some of the games and how well Perry played in Vancouver. He has played on the big ice before, and was arguably Canada's best player in the 2010 World Hockey Championships on the BIG ICE. Go watch the 2010 WHC again. Canada finished 7th, but Perry and John Tavares were the best players, and the leading goal scorers for the team two years ago, with Perry being second to Tavares. On the big ice, he might not be the fastest skater, but by no means is he a liability.

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09-16-2012, 05:06 AM
  #381
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The discussion is about today, and not a year and a half from now. Nobody knows what can happen in a year and a half. As of right now, Perry should be on the team. Forget about Perron. I have others rated ahead of him, and the guy's track record is nowhere near Perry's. We agree to disagree. Perry is 27 years old. He is not an old guy by any means. I have seen Perry at his best, and people make it seem like he is a nobody. I guess people forgot about 2010. Go watch some of the games and how well Perry played in Vancouver. He has played on the big ice before, and was arguably Canada's best player in the 2010 World Hockey Championships on the BIG ICE. Go watch the 2010 WHC again. Canada finished 7th, but Perry and John Tavares were the best players, and the leading goal scorers for the team two years ago, with Perry being second to Tavares. On the big ice, he might not be the fastest skater, but by no means is he a liability.
Again, if his numbers are there a year and a half from now, and he's selected, then I won't argue. I don't agree on your assessment of him as a player...sure! we'll agree to disagree.


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09-16-2012, 10:11 AM
  #382
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He's played awfully well for us internationally for a guy with no heart.

Are we talking about the same guy?
That's what I'm wondering, too.

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09-16-2012, 10:19 AM
  #383
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Originally Posted by Mehar View Post
Playing for a crappy team like Columbus over the past several years has an impact on a guy's stats and overall drive. Nash being traded to New York, will prove once again why he is one of the best players in the game. He was one of Canada's best players in Vancouver and will be there once again in Sochi. I just do not get all hate for Nash and Perry. People have short memories. Perry lead the league in goals and won the Rocket Richard Trophy for the 2010-2011 season. One off year, and people are counting him out. SMH.
He wasn't, but people seem to like to think that.

Should every player on the Oilers or Leafs play like they have zero drive because their teams suck?


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09-16-2012, 10:22 AM
  #384
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When it came to the somewhat controversial guys on my team, I basically went for what I expect HC to do. I highly doubt that they will cut many players from 2010 who are still performing at a high level. Clearly for my projections both Nash and E. Staal have to pick their games up this year, but I think Nash moving to New York and Staal moving to LW boosts the chances for both of them.

As far as Perry, he has been a consistently strong goal scorer and provides something different for the team. If he fails to perform, Eberle easily steps up and replaces him.
Agreed completely.

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09-16-2012, 11:25 AM
  #385
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Nash will be there.

Seems like hes the only player that doesn't have to play at high level every year to be considered a lock. Doesn't matter how he plays in New York, HC will take him.

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09-16-2012, 03:01 PM
  #386
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Nash will be there.

Seems like hes the only player that doesn't have to play at high level every year to be considered a lock. Doesn't matter how he plays in New York, HC will take him.
I would also include Sidney Crosby with a guaranteed roster spot no matter how he's playing, assuming he is not injured when Canada announces the team.

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09-16-2012, 10:06 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
He wasn't, but people seem to like to think that.
Let me clarify, the Richards-Toews-Nash line was the best line in Vancouver. Rick Nash was one of Canada's best players. He was the best player on the ice in the Quarter Final thrashing of the Russians. After that game, Igor Larionov said the same thing, and I agreed with him. He was a force that game. Nash should and will be there in 2014. You might disagree, but playing for Columbus, which has been one of the worst teams in the NHL, does have a negative effect on your stats and overall drive. At least in Toronto, you are playing in a hockey Mecca. In Columbus, it is nowhere near a hockey mecca, and the Blue Jackets are dead last in coverage. That is the difference. Nash playing in New York will be lights out. He will have great teammates to play with, and playing in a big market in New York will bring the best out of him.


Last edited by ColePens: 09-17-2012 at 01:46 PM. Reason: fixed quote
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09-18-2012, 12:52 AM
  #388
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Nash will be there.

Seems like hes the only player that doesn't have to play at high level every year to be considered a lock. Doesn't matter how he plays in New York, HC will take him.
I agree he's there. as far as the "no heart" comments - i won't disagree with them, but i don't feel like going there. with that said ppl are kidding themselves if they think Nash won't be on the team. He will.

I don't get the loading up on 2010/11/12 draft picks on the team - a couple of them will make it, but keep in mind it's not the CHL prospects game.

I don't get those so insistent that Bergeron will make it - I don't think he has a chance.

Re: Seguin - doubt it. You'll see Skinner on the team (and that's a question) before Seguin.

Goal? If Ward is our #2 i'm going to start to cry. Hopefully Price is ready as #1. After Price i'd go with Fleury and Luongo way before I ever wanted Ward in goal at the Olympics. I mean, come on

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09-18-2012, 03:10 AM
  #389
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I agree he's there. as far as the "no heart" comments - i won't disagree with them, but i don't feel like going there. with that said ppl are kidding themselves if they think Nash won't be on the team. He will.

I don't get the loading up on 2010/11/12 draft picks on the team - a couple of them will make it, but keep in mind it's not the CHL prospects game.

I don't get those so insistent that Bergeron will make it - I don't think he has a chance.

Re: Seguin - doubt it. You'll see Skinner on the team (and that's a question) before Seguin.

Goal? If Ward is our #2 i'm going to start to cry. Hopefully Price is ready as #1. After Price i'd go with Fleury and Luongo way before I ever wanted Ward in goal at the Olympics. I mean, come on
Tell me if Bergeron doesn't make it, then which Francophone player from the province of Quebec does? You think Hockey Canada will go with a 100% team from English Canada? Not likely. Fleury sitting on the bench and Luongo in the press box. (Luongo is not French Canadian) Believe me, this crap matters to HC. Who are the other French-Canadian candidates, Letang?

I'd prefer Seguin over Skinner unless Skinner out performs him in the next year and a half...and from what I saw of Skinner at last year's WHC, I'm not so sure he can. He was terrible at the WHC except for the one pretty wrap around goal against the Finns... other than that all you saw of him is that spinorama move coming down the wing...which is pretty much his go to move..and pretty ineffective.

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09-18-2012, 08:03 AM
  #390
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Tell me if Bergeron doesn't make it, then which Francophone player from the province of Quebec does? You think Hockey Canada will go with a 100% team from English Canada? Not likely. Fleury sitting on the bench and Luongo in the press box. (Luongo is not French Canadian) Believe me, this crap matters to HC. Who are the other French-Canadian candidates, Letang?

I'd prefer Seguin over Skinner unless Skinner out performs him in the next year and a half...and from what I saw of Skinner at last year's WHC, I'm not so sure he can. He was terrible at the WHC except for the one pretty wrap around goal against the Finns... other than that all you saw of him is that spinorama move coming down the wing...which is pretty much his go to move..and pretty ineffective.
Martin St. Louis. Doesn't matter that he wasn't there last time, hes given Yzerman every reason to believe that he is of Canada's best forwards.

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09-18-2012, 08:28 AM
  #391
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I don't get those so insistent that Bergeron will make it - I don't think he has a chance.

Re: Seguin - doubt it. You'll see Skinner on the team (and that's a question) before Seguin.
Well considering Bergeron made the 2010 team when he was not yet as good as he is today, I would say that he at least has a chance. Bergeron is one of the better defensive forwards in hockey, and is pretty ideal in the fourth line centre role. That he has some experience from 2010 and is francophone certainly can't hurt his cause.

Seguin has a lot of factors in his favour. He should be comfortably into the 30+ goal and 70+ point range by 2014, is a great skater, already knows what he's doing defensively, has chemistry with Bergeron and has shown that he can play the wing.

Skinner is a great young player too, but I don't see anything that he brings to the table over Seguin. There are a bunch of young guys fighting over the same few spots (in my mind) like Seguin, Skinner, Hall, Kane, Benn and Eberle.

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Martin St. Louis. Doesn't matter that he wasn't there last time, hes given Yzerman every reason to believe that he is of Canada's best forwards.
I think St. Louis would have been on the team in 2010 had it been played on international ice. Canada went with size in 2010, which clearly St. Louis doesn't have.

I really doubt that St. Louis gets picked in 2014 though. He'll be 38 years old and Canada has lots of good candidates at wing. If he's top ten in scoring or something like that by the time the team is picked though you never know.

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09-18-2012, 12:05 PM
  #392
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09-18-2012, 12:08 PM
  #393
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Martin St. Louis. Doesn't matter that he wasn't there last time, hes given Yzerman every reason to believe that he is of Canada's best forwards.
My only advice for Stevie Y then would be is heed the lessons learned from the 2006 Gretzky/Friends of Gretzky Olympic team. Didn't work out too well.

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09-18-2012, 04:02 PM
  #394
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My only advice for Stevie Y then would be is heed the lessons learned from the 2006 Gretzky/Friends of Gretzky Olympic team. Didn't work out too well.
Not sure what your trying to imply here...

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09-18-2012, 08:37 PM
  #395
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Tell me if Bergeron doesn't make it, then which Francophone player from the province of Quebec does? You think Hockey Canada will go with a 100% team from English Canada? Not likely. Fleury sitting on the bench and Luongo in the press box. (Luongo is not French Canadian) Believe me, this crap matters to HC. Who are the other French-Canadian candidates, Letang?

I'd prefer Seguin over Skinner unless Skinner out performs him in the next year and a half...and from what I saw of Skinner at last year's WHC, I'm not so sure he can. He was terrible at the WHC except for the one pretty wrap around goal against the Finns... other than that all you saw of him is that spinorama move coming down the wing...which is pretty much his go to move..and pretty ineffective.
Who cares if there is no Quebecer on the team. The goal is to take the best players regardless of province. I do not care if there is no Quebecer. Frankly, if every player on the team was from Ontario or Alberta, I would care less. The goal is to take the best players. Luongo is a Quebecer. Does not matter if he is French Canadian. Letang is the best bet to be the French Canadian that is there.

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09-19-2012, 12:17 AM
  #396
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Who cares if there is no Quebecer on the team. The goal is to take the best players regardless of province. I do not care if there is no Quebecer. Frankly, if every player on the team was from Ontario or Alberta, I would care less. The goal is to take the best players. Luongo is a Quebecer. Does not matter if he is French Canadian. Letang is the best bet to be the French Canadian that is there.
I don't believe the goal is to appease you, Mehar. There are politicians in Quebec who would kick up a huge fuss if there was not a single player from Quebec on the team. Luckily between Fleury, Letang, Luongo and Bergeron there is a very good chance that players from Quebec will be on the team and Hockey Canada won't have to worry about it.

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09-19-2012, 03:01 AM
  #397
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Olympic Team:
Stamkos - Crosby - Giroux
Nash - Tavares - Eberle
Benn - Getzlaf - Perry
E. Staal - Toews - M. Richards
Bergeron

Weber - Pietrangelo
Doughty - Letang
Seabrook - Keith
Hamhuis

Price
Ward
Luongo

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09-19-2012, 03:11 AM
  #398
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Who cares if there is no Quebecer on the team. The goal is to take the best players regardless of province. I do not care if there is no Quebecer. Frankly, if every player on the team was from Ontario or Alberta, I would care less. The goal is to take the best players. Luongo is a Quebecer. Does not matter if he is French Canadian. Letang is the best bet to be the French Canadian that is there.
The fact is that is not reality. Most Canadians, myself included, have the opinion it (province) doesn't and shouldn't matter....but the fact is it Matters a Great Deal to Hockey Canada. Hockey Canada would rather lose the Olympics with their version of team Canada, then win with a team comprised entirely of players from "English Canada" That is the reality.

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09-19-2012, 05:12 AM
  #399
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Not sure what your trying to imply here...
The team was old, quote from Hockey Canada " a little long in the tooth" It relied too much on players from 2002 (Gretzky) 2004 World Cup (Gretzky) and Gretzky's wish to rehab the career of Bertuzzi. Gretzky's ego believing he had the golden touch perhaps a little drunk on his own success. He basically picked a team of players (friends) he had success with and ignored the fact, that some of them just should not have been there... any normal Olympic team should have at least 50% turnover and the average age should be 25-27 years old. So, the lesson 2006 is No Legacy picks!

Now, if MSL is the top scoring right winger on December 15th 2013 and is named to the team, I won't argue... he deserves to be there. I'd certainly take him over Iginla. If he is not, then there are others to consider.

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09-19-2012, 09:07 AM
  #400
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Originally Posted by 23 17 23 View Post
Olympic Team:
Stamkos - Crosby - Giroux
Nash - Tavares - Eberle
Benn - Getzlaf - Perry
E. Staal - Toews - M. Richards
Bergeron

Weber - Pietrangelo
Doughty - Letang
Seabrook - Keith
Hamhuis

Price
Ward
Luongo

I have the same forwards, but Jamie Benn and Bergeron do not belong on the list. Bergeron was terrible in Vancouver. His minutes got slashed from the start of the tournament to the end. He was terrible in the faceoffs, looked slow, and contributed nothing. He had Crosby taken off his line and was the 13th forward by the end of the tournament. I rather have Seguin on the big ice than Bergeron. Next instead of Benn, I would put a guy like Taylor Hall or Skinner on the team. Skinner was impressive in this year's WHC. He looked great on the big ice and played much better than Jamie Benn who did not impress me that much. I frankly think there are others that are ahead of Benn right now. No disrespect to Benn.

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