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09-17-2012, 11:49 AM
  #151
InglewoodJack
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The NHL makes a lot of money, and the players want their fair share because they're the ones who generate that money.

Really don't know why anyone thinks the players are at fault here. Anyways, I hope this is done up quickly. I wanna see hockey soon.

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09-17-2012, 11:57 AM
  #152
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Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
The NHL makes a lot of money, and the players want their fair share because they're the ones who generate that money.

Really don't know why anyone thinks the players are at fault here. Anyways, I hope this is done up quickly. I wanna see hockey soon.
Fair share is one thing, 57% of league revenue is another.

No pro league in the world pays their players that much, it just doesn't make sense.

That being said, it was the owners who drafted up the last CBA, so I'm not crying for them by any means.

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Old
09-17-2012, 12:08 PM
  #153
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The big losers are the fans...

For anybody who is taking side, Owners or Players, is wrong. It always been a money fight (since 1900...(players were not paid, Until a league did it). The only fact that explain the size teh revenus and the salaries... is rarety (pro player are rare the surgeon, high level research...) They income generating by the games is Big, the owner want to have the best players to bring more fans, sale more stuff. They paying big money to get them cause they are making big money with them (in average)

The fact that more than 1/2 of the teams are losing money is the main argument of the owner. The players asking more revenu sharing and is not going to append...

Sad both true, if I was a player, I would fight. If I would be one of the losing money team, I would fight for sure to. Here it is, I'm a fan so:

I want to see hockey on TV, stop million complain and get me some hockey!

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Old
09-17-2012, 12:08 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
He was a rep in the past, he is very well informed.
Why are they all signing in Europe right now then?

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Old
09-17-2012, 12:09 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
The NHL makes a lot of money, and the players want their fair share because they're the ones who generate that money.

Really don't know why anyone thinks the players are at fault here. Anyways, I hope this is done up quickly. I wanna see hockey soon.
They make 57% of league revenue and pay 0% of league costs. That being said I would not blame the players or say its their fault. I would ask them to be realistic though. Staying at 57% of league revenue could mean the difference between bankruptcy or breaking even for small market teams.

A 50-50 split is more than fair to both sides.

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Old
09-17-2012, 12:18 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
They make 57% of league revenue and pay 0% of league costs. That being said I would not blame the players or say its their fault. I would ask them to be realistic though. Staying at 57% of league revenue could mean the difference between bankruptcy or breaking even for small market teams.

A 50-50 split is more than fair to both sides.
except owners want more than 50/50.

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Old
09-17-2012, 12:22 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Ashley View Post
except owners want more than 50/50.

I think they are asking for more so when they negotiate to a 50/50 split the players wont feel so burned

I hope anyways.....

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Old
09-17-2012, 01:15 PM
  #158
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Raphael Diaz signs back with Ev Zug of the NLA-Swiss League. ONly two habs are going overseas so far, Plekanec and now Diaz.

Yannick Weber should be the next Hab to go overseas. Two teams being rumored are: Geneve-Servette and ZSC both Swiss league.

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Old
09-17-2012, 01:27 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
Why are they all signing in Europe right now then?
All seriously ? We are talking about very few players compared to the last lockout. The Habs have two players as we speak Pleks, who has just chosen to stay at home for an extended period of time and Diaz ( who cares ) who is only making nickles and dimes here.

If it were serious like the last one you would have players signing left right and center. You don't remember the last lockout ????

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Old
09-17-2012, 01:59 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
All seriously ? We are talking about very few players compared to the last lockout. The Habs have two players as we speak Pleks, who has just chosen to stay at home for an extended period of time and Diaz ( who cares ) who is only making nickles and dimes here.

If it were serious like the last one you would have players signing left right and center. You don't remember the last lockout ????
I don't remember the details of when players signed no. But seems to me none would have signed if they knew this was only very temporary.

Anyway, when it comes down to it I have no clue and if you talked to a player who thinks it'll be short then great. It's just rather odd because it seems you are the only person I have heard say anything remotely close to that. Every possible other person in the know says the opposite, I.E that we could be in for a very long work stoppage.

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Old
09-17-2012, 02:03 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
I don't remember the details of when players signed no. But seems to me none would have signed if they knew this was only very temporary.

Anyway, when it comes down to it I have no clue and if you talked to a player who thinks it'll be short then great. It's just rather odd because it seems you are the only person I have heard say anything remotely close to that. Every possible other person in the know says the opposite, I.E that we could be in for a very long work stoppage.
I don't care honestly whether you believe me or not. I don't claim to know this as fact. This is what a current NHL'r told me this morning. I live in the hockey world myself. Of course the media talk about it being long. That's what people like to read.

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Old
09-17-2012, 02:13 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
After a long discussion with an NHL player this morning, the feeling the players have right now is the the season is far from a loss, and that some are even talking about the season actually starting as usual with a shortened pre season. The two sides are actually alot closer than the media has been reporting. In fact he is NOT even looking for another league or team to play with. Looks like it's going to be a short one folks. Great news on this Monday morning.
Oh please....

Tell a mod who you are and who the player is or this did not happen.

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Old
09-17-2012, 02:43 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Oh please....

Tell a mod who you are and who the player is or this did not happen.
I work in and around hockey ( work with JC Lajoie and our AA Junior team ). I know the Mods here know who i am. I was just telling you what i heard. This is a hockey forum, and i related hockey info. That's it.

And before the jokes, i am on the left hahaha !


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Old
09-17-2012, 02:47 PM
  #164
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third time's a charm.

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Old
09-17-2012, 02:51 PM
  #165
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third time's a charm.
Fourth actually. No ?

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Old
09-17-2012, 03:05 PM
  #166
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Regarding the lock-out, I hear talking about players and owners. Whose fault is it? The situation is presented as if we NEED to choose a side. Some are pro-owners, some are pro-players and some are pro-fans (or, if you prefer, just seriously pissed-off), asking for a boycott.

Obviously, the big picture is more complex than that. I don’t pretend to bring anything really new to the debate, but we need to think more about the role of players’ agents.

To a lesser extent, they are the “regular season Donald Fehr”. They are the ones, within the limits of the CBA (and sometimes beyond), that wage a war with the GMs for get the longest and/or most expensive contracts possible.

That being said, the players can put the blame on the owners for the expensiveness and the length of the contracts, but what is itching me is they pretend they are innocent in the process. Like if the fact that they are represented by agents (So, in a way, not explicitly involved in the day-to-day negotiation process) exempt them from any liability.

Some players said the owners are not acting like they are serious:
“It’s a farce, owners are giving away multi-year multi-million dollars contracts while they negotiate a new CBA and asking for salary rollbacks!” Yeah. And I guess you didn’t negotiate for these contracts, right?

The association says that if a team has some financial difficulties, they should be more responsible with their expenses. So, GMs should let go of greedy players just for the sake of financial discipline? And then lose their job because the team isn’t competitive anymore? For this to work, all teams should be disciplined at the same time. But it’ll never happen, because which team will be dumb enough to let go a top player?

It’s a big, well oiled, turning wheel and it’s not that easy to stop.

I read Renaud Lavoie today and he talks about “La taxe de luxe”
Here is the link: http://legrandclub.rds.ca/profils/60.../147970/public

I seriously hope it won’t get there, because even if MLB is the league with the less CBA conflicts, they is absolutely no parity either. Year after year, the same team are powerful. When a small market team gets close to the World Series, their top players are bought by big market teams right away.

Obviously I’m on the side of the owners, but I think they are asking too much. Players have to get their fair share too. If Fehr threatens to let go of the salary cap, owners should threaten to let go of guaranteed contracts.

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Old
09-17-2012, 03:12 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
Fair share is one thing, 57% of league revenue is another.

No pro league in the world pays their players that much, it just doesn't make sense.

That being said, it was the owners who drafted up the last CBA, so I'm not crying for them by any means.
Hockey related revenue, right? I don't know all the little details about this stand-off, but isn't that one of the things the players are arguing about? The definition of "hockey related revenue" is a fighting point, no? If that's the case, then maybe the players feel they do give a lot closer to 50% rather than the 57% we know of? Either way, this is so B.S.!!

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Old
09-17-2012, 03:38 PM
  #168
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At the time 57% could have been a fair point for both parties. Since then, HRR has gone up a lot. In pure dollar figures, 57% today is way more than what it was in 04-05. It makes sense for the players to get a smaller percentage now, unless we are expecting the already financially struggling teams to have to pay more and more every year.

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Old
09-17-2012, 03:46 PM
  #169
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50-50 is good enough.

Players are NOT investing in their companies, anyway.

Who's taking the real financial risks ? Not the players.

Stop giving these long term contracts. Stop giving garanteed contracts....

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Old
09-17-2012, 03:59 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Ollie Williams View Post
At the time 57% could have been a fair point for both parties. Since then, HRR has gone up a lot. In pure dollar figures, 57% today is way more than what it was in 04-05. It makes sense for the players to get a smaller percentage now, unless we are expecting the already financially struggling teams to have to pay more and more every year.
So has the cost of running the NHL and 30 teams.

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Old
09-17-2012, 04:09 PM
  #171
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So has the cost of running the NHL and 30 teams.
Yeah?

Except for salaries which are tied to revenues, ie, revenues drives salaries, what?

Travels?
Equipment?
Front office?

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Old
09-17-2012, 04:21 PM
  #172
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In my opinion the perfect agreement would be 51% to 49% in favor of the owners but introduce a heafty luxury tax in which all revenues go directly to revenue sharing. This way it helps the poorer teams with more revenue while still getting high drasft picks and it alows the richer teams to keep spending money like lunatics but at their own expense.

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Old
09-17-2012, 04:39 PM
  #173
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The NHL and its players are a joke. Done with it. Was looking forward to this team this year, oh well.. done with it..

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Old
09-17-2012, 06:19 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by ScottyDoNot View Post
In my opinion the perfect agreement would be 51% to 49% in favor of the owners but introduce a heafty luxury tax in which all revenues go directly to revenue sharing. This way it helps the poorer teams with more revenue while still getting high drasft picks and it alows the richer teams to keep spending money like lunatics but at their own expense.
Fehr is that u?
So with that tax you want toronto - NY - montreal to fund phoenix's next acquisition of a big free agent?
Yup - I see it.

What the NHLPA does not want to accept or bring up is the wiping out of teams and the dispersal draft that goes with it. They want the teams to remain operational but the rest of the owners MUST foot the bill to keep them going, really?

How about we drop 4-6 of the weaker sisters, the league gets smaller, the nhlpa gets smaller, but what remains is healthier?!

No Fehr wont have that will he?

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Old
09-17-2012, 06:41 PM
  #175
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Fehr is that u?
So with that tax you want toronto - NY - montreal to fund phoenix's next acquisition of a big free agent?
Yup - I see it.

What the NHLPA does not want to accept or bring up is the wiping out of teams and the dispersal draft that goes with it. They want the teams to remain operational but the rest of the owners MUST foot the bill to keep them going, really?

How about we drop 4-6 of the weaker sisters, the league gets smaller, the nhlpa gets smaller, but what remains is healthier?!

No Fehr wont have that will he?
If the big teams don't want to subsidize the small ones what should happen is the new system allow the weak sisters to spend far less on payroll than the strong ones.

In the NHL's current system they can most teams make a profit, avoid revenue sharing or not having spending parity across the league but they can only have 2 of the 3 at the same time.

Even if the league gets the players to reduce their salaries by the amount they are demanding it doesn't change that. The reduction isn't big enough to make Phoenix or NYI profitable.

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