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Old
09-18-2012, 02:19 PM
  #26
hockeydoug
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handyj View Post
This is a nice idea in theory, but us Leaf fans have been trying to peddle a similar trade for a long time now. I know maybe the guys offered aren't equal to Hjalmarsson, but the idea is the same. Trade a 2/3rd line tweener and/or a middle of the pack D-man plus prospects and picks for a 2nd line center. Unfortunately at this time it doesn't seem to be a package that's very appealing to many other teams.

Teams might be more willing to make deals like this towards the trade deadline when there are more defined buyers and sellers. Right now everyone thinks they're contenders and aren't really looking for futures.
Geez I need to proofread. I meant that "I don't think that combo lands a 2C" but I mistakenly typed the opposite. We are in agreement. More gms would have pulled off a similar trade if that's all it took to land a 2c.

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Old
09-18-2012, 02:30 PM
  #27
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If we have to trade Krejci, Krejci-Sharp is very interesting and I'd look into that big time.

But we're just not trading Hamilton. Sorry.

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Old
09-18-2012, 02:40 PM
  #28
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think Hamilton gets a bit overvalued here but I wouldn't take that deal as BOS too. Value seems about right.

Sharp won't get traded just like Krejci and Hamilton. They will stay with their teams

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Old
09-18-2012, 02:48 PM
  #29
Oates2Neely
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
think Hamilton gets a bit overvalued here but I wouldn't take that deal as BOS too. Value seems about right.

Sharp won't get traded just like Krejci and Hamilton. They will stay with their teams
How so? Boston fans value Krejci to Sharp..

soo, that leaves:
Hjarlmasson
McNeil
2nd

for Hamilton.. Sorry but that package will not land you a 6'5" OHL/ CHL 'Dman of the year' blue-chipper. Especially considering Bostons' need for a bluechip D prospect.

I think if theres any overvaluing going on here its Hjarlmasson. He's an average mid-pairing dman.

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Old
09-18-2012, 02:51 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Kishire View Post
****ing brutal for Boston. Krejci is just as good as Sharp IMO.
That's the point of the trade. Chicago needs a C and Boston has a surplus.

Where they get hosed is the Hamilton return. Take it out and the deal makes plenty of sense.

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Old
09-18-2012, 03:02 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
How so? Boston fans value Krejci to Sharp..

soo, that leaves:
Hjarlmasson
McNeil
2nd

for Hamilton.. Sorry but that package will not land you a 6'5" OHL/ CHL 'Dman of the year' blue-chipper. Especially considering Bostons' need for a bluechip D prospect.

I think if theres any overvaluing going on here its Hjarlmasson. He's an average mid-pairing dman.
Big Krejci fan, but Sharp has slightly better value although I guess you could argue age. I don't see Sharp really ever being moved, he is a Hawk from here on out. I think Kane is more likely to be sacrificed by the Hawks in the event of needing moves than Sharp. I also don't think Sharp waives his NMC, even for a team like Boston.

I agree that Hamilton has more value than what is being offered for him, but a Krejci for Sharp swap is going to need a plus coming from Boston. An interesting one would be if the Hawks were interested in trying to talk Thomas out of retirement/year layoff. But that has huge salary implications. It does not have to be a huge plus, but it would likely take more to move the Hawks into anything involving Sharp than Krejci alone.

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Old
09-18-2012, 06:51 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Big Krejci fan, but Sharp has slightly better value although I guess you could argue age. I don't see Sharp really ever being moved, he is a Hawk from here on out. I think Kane is more likely to be sacrificed by the Hawks in the event of needing moves than Sharp. I also don't think Sharp waives his NMC, even for a team like Boston.

I agree that Hamilton has more value than what is being offered for him, but a Krejci for Sharp swap is going to need a plus coming from Boston. An interesting one would be if the Hawks were interested in trying to talk Thomas out of retirement/year layoff. But that has huge salary implications. It does not have to be a huge plus, but it would likely take more to move the Hawks into anything involving Sharp than Krejci alone.
Yup^^

Sharp is a Chicago athlete now, don't see him leaving.

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Old
09-18-2012, 07:22 PM
  #33
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Somebody asked Chiarelli last trading deadline if he'd consider trading Hamilton. His response: "No. No-no-no. No."

As for Krejci, nobody has a "surplus of centers." The moment you start thinking that way, you're in trouble.

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Old
09-18-2012, 07:25 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by SoupNazi View Post
I don't think Boston goes down Trade Hamilton street at any time in the near future.
Yup - that street has a big DO NOT ENTER sign on it.

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Old
09-18-2012, 07:46 PM
  #35
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Probably the biggest weakness in the Bruins organization is defense and specifically legit dman prospects. Boston won't deal Hamilton. Sharp would be nice and fit in well but they have quite a few wingers anyway.

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Old
09-18-2012, 07:51 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
I'd rather keep Sharp.

We can trade Hjalmarsson + whatever prospect/picks for a 2nd line C I'm sure.
I still don't see why you don't pick up a second line tweener and put him betweeen Sharp/Hossa. I mean both are of similar calibre of Kessel, Lupul. (Edge going to Chicago.) And we have done okay putting the likes of Bozak between those two so I highly doubt you need a 1B 2A center for those guys. Grab yourselves a Nik Antropov in the next off season or Deadline and watch things happen.

EDIT: Another option would be Wilson out of Nashville. With the loss of Suter they could look to replace him.

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Old
09-18-2012, 07:56 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Mystifo View Post
EDIT: Another option would be Wilson out of Nashville. With the loss of Suter they could look to replace him.
There's no way that Nashville trades Wilson inter-division to the Blackhawks.

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Old
09-18-2012, 08:11 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
I'd rather keep Sharp.

We can trade Hjalmarsson + whatever prospect/picks for a 2nd line C I'm sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PayItForward View Post
There's no way that Nashville trades Wilson inter-division to the Blackhawks.
Yeah true. Sorry I still stand by Nik Antropov be a good place holder while you wait on McNeil.

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Old
09-19-2012, 06:18 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
True, but you did unload Schenn alone for JVR, I think Hjalmarsson holds similar value to Schenn.

Ribiero went for a lessar package, so it is possible.

I think our prospects are of slightly higher value than Torontos as well, like McNeill, Danault, Pirri, and TT.

I think Toronto is looking more for a #1 C, than a #2. You already have a #2 C in Grabo.
I think Schenn holds slightly higher value just because he's a bit younger and more physical, but they certainly are comparable. But that JVR deal was a bit of a unique case in that it was a one-for-one deal trading two young guys with untapped potential and some disappointing seasons. Also the brother thing with Philly.

Not to be argumentative, but given the choice I'd stick with our prospects like Kadri, Colborne, Ross, Frattin, Biggs, Rielly, Blacker, etc over the Hawks'. That's not to say you guys don't have a good prospect pool, but I think the fact that Kadri and some others get unfairly criticized on here leads to the impression our prospects stink. I actually like the group.

And it would be great if we could add a #1 C, but in reality I think we'd be happy with any upgrade on Bozak. Ideally we would have tried to make a run at guys like Derek Roy or Ribiero like you mentioned who were already dealt for relatively cheap, but at this point it seems like the market is fairly dried up. There are a lot of buyers and not many sellers, and those with excess C's are like the Bruins and are contenders that are more than happy going into a season with a surplus.

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Old
09-19-2012, 07:41 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Something based on Krejci for Sharp could be managed.. perhaps a lil tweaking.. But the rest of the proposal would not happen. Hamilton wouldnt go for that package.
Totally agreed

As for Hamilton even if it's a 1st from Chicago it's a NO

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Old
09-19-2012, 08:44 AM
  #41
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No to Krejci-Sharp.

If trading Sharp is our solution to the 2C problem, then we should just play Sharp as our 2C.

Especially since we've already won a Cup with him playing there. Really there's no excuse for why he hasn't been playing there already.

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Old
09-19-2012, 09:07 AM
  #42
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Forget the defense part of the trade, center it around Sharp and Krejci and you've got me interested.

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Old
09-19-2012, 09:40 AM
  #43
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Sharp is better than Krejci. Their trade values are not equal.

That said, the rest of the deal makes it a no from Boston's POV.

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Old
09-19-2012, 09:53 AM
  #44
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Why do people (ESPECIALLY Hawks fans) continue to include Sharp in any trades whatsoever? He has a NMC. He's a 70 point winger with an amazing shot, nice two-way pay, and is the Assistant Captain of his team. He's not being moved to fill a hole.

The only way a guy like Sharp is being moved is if Bowman is just completely blown away by an offer that he absolutely cannot say "no" to and is forced to ASK Sharp to waive his NMC. Any trade like this is totally unrealistic so it will never happen. Subsequently Sharp will never be traded.

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Old
09-19-2012, 10:30 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Hansen View Post
Sharp is better than Krejci. Their trade values are not equal.

That said, the rest of the deal makes it a no from Boston's POV.
I love how some fans just type these broad statements backed up by zero facts or stats "Sharp is better than Krejci".. please explain WHY.

I'll use the past 4 seasons stats, as thats when both players were actually full time NHL'ers.

Sharp
08-09 GP: 61, G: 26, A: 18, PTS: 44
09-10 GP: 82, G: 25, A: 41, PTS: 66
10-11 GP: 74, G: 34, A: 37, PTS: 71
11-12 GP: 74, G: 33, A: 36, PTS: 69


Krejci
08-09 GP: 82, G: 22, A: 51, PTS: 73
09-10 GP: 79, G: 17, A: 49, PTS: 52
10-11 GP: 75, G: 13, A: 49, PTS: 62
11-12: GP: 79, G: 23, A: 39, PTS: 62

So please explain to me how "their trade values are not equal". Krejci will be age 27 after regular season ends 4/28. Sharp will be age 31 in a few months 12/27. (over 4 year age gap). Krejci plays center, Sharp plays wing. Krejci's cap hit is less than Sharps.

I'd say these two players are as close in value as it gets.

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Old
09-19-2012, 10:51 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
I love how some fans just type these broad statements backed up by zero facts or stats "Sharp is better than Krejci".. please explain WHY.

I'll use the past 4 seasons stats, as thats when both players were actually full time NHL'ers.

Sharp
08-09 GP: 61, G: 26, A: 18, PTS: 44
09-10 GP: 82, G: 25, A: 41, PTS: 66
10-11 GP: 74, G: 34, A: 37, PTS: 71
11-12 GP: 74, G: 33, A: 36, PTS: 69


Krejci
08-09 GP: 82, G: 22, A: 51, PTS: 73
09-10 GP: 79, G: 17, A: 49, PTS: 52
10-11 GP: 75, G: 13, A: 49, PTS: 62
11-12: GP: 79, G: 23, A: 39, PTS: 62

So please explain to me how "their trade values are not equal". Krejci will be age 27 after regular season ends 4/28. Sharp will be age 31 in a few months 12/27. (over 4 year age gap). Krejci plays center, Sharp plays wing. Krejci's cap hit is less than Sharps.

I'd say these two players are as close in value as it gets.
Sharp scores more than Krejci by at least 7 points in 3 of those 4 seasons -- while playing fewer games in two of those seasons -- and you can't see why someone would say he's better?

In terms of value, age is the only valid argument, as Sharp can easily shift over to center. That's where he was playing when we won the Cup, and that's where he should've been playing ever since our hole at 2C became apparent in January.

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Old
09-19-2012, 10:56 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
I love how some fans just type these broad statements backed up by zero facts or stats "Sharp is better than Krejci".. please explain WHY.

I'll use the past 4 seasons stats, as thats when both players were actually full time NHL'ers.

Sharp
08-09 GP: 61, G: 26, A: 18, PTS: 44
09-10 GP: 82, G: 25, A: 41, PTS: 66
10-11 GP: 74, G: 34, A: 37, PTS: 71
11-12 GP: 74, G: 33, A: 36, PTS: 69


Krejci
08-09 GP: 82, G: 22, A: 51, PTS: 73
09-10 GP: 79, G: 17, A: 49, PTS: 52
10-11 GP: 75, G: 13, A: 49, PTS: 62
11-12: GP: 79, G: 23, A: 39, PTS: 62

So please explain to me how "their trade values are not equal". Krejci will be age 27 after regular season ends 4/28. Sharp will be age 31 in a few months 12/27. (over 4 year age gap). Krejci plays center, Sharp plays wing. Krejci's cap hit is less than Sharps.

I'd say these two players are as close in value as it gets.
exactly and we need a RW if we trade krejci not a LW .. sure I like sharp but he's going to bump loooch and marchy down the lineup doesn't make as much sense as people think

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Old
09-19-2012, 11:19 AM
  #48
coldsteelonice84
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Sharp is better. I don't see how you can argue that.

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Old
09-19-2012, 11:22 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by The Red Line View Post
Who, exactly?

Cause I've sat through a whole summer of absurd trade proposals based around Hjalmarsson + for a second line C and they have all been terrible.
Hjalmarsson is vastly overrated by many Blackhawks fans. He's a non-physical defenseman who puts up little in the way of points and doesn't really use his size. He's good at blocking shots, but he's by no means a standout defender.

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Old
09-19-2012, 11:25 AM
  #50
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Hammer is one of the best in the league at blocking shots. Simply saying, "he's good", is not accurate.

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