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Theodore to Toronto

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Old
09-23-2012, 04:19 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Darkhorse1280 View Post
Ron Wilson.
Can only blame so much on the guy.

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Old
09-23-2012, 04:30 PM
  #27
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Well, in the locked thread I valued Theodore at Ashton + 2nd. Florida adds a physical forward prospect and likely a mid second. Just ballparking though.

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09-23-2012, 04:33 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Darkhorse1280 View Post
Ron Wilson.

Bruce Boudreau
Claude Julien
Lindy Ruff
Bob Hartley
Kirk Muller
Joel Quenneville
Joe Sacco
Todd Richards
Glen Gulutzan
Mike Babock
Ralph Krueger
Kevin Dineen
Darryl Sutter
Mike Yeo
Michel Therrien

Barry Trotz
Peter DeBoer
Jack Capuano
John Tortorella
Paul MacLean
Peter Laviolette
Dave Tippett
Dan Bylsma
Todd McLellan
Ken Hitchcock
Guy Boucher
Randy Carlyle
Alain Vigneault
Adam Oates
Claude Noel

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Old
09-23-2012, 04:37 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Can only blame so much on the guy.
So his whole slipshod "throw **** at the wall and hopefully some of it sticks" approach to coaching had nothing to do with his goaltenders performance and their overall lack of confidence?

Got it.

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Old
09-23-2012, 04:40 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baarle View Post
Bruce Boudreau
Claude Julien
Lindy Ruff
Bob Hartley
Kirk Muller
Joel Quenneville
Joe Sacco
Todd Richards
Glen Gulutzan
Mike Babock
Ralph Krueger
Kevin Dineen
Darryl Sutter
Mike Yeo
Michel Therrien

Barry Trotz
Peter DeBoer
Jack Capuano
John Tortorella
Paul MacLean
Peter Laviolette
Dave Tippett
Dan Bylsma
Todd McLellan
Ken Hitchcock
Guy Boucher
Randy Carlyle
Alain Vigneault
Adam Oates
Claude Noel

Most of these coaches know how to implement a sound defensive system within their offense.

Can you say the same about Ronnie and his coaching methods?

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Old
09-23-2012, 04:53 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by stryfe604 View Post
I think that is where the idea came from. It is an interesting idea actually for Theodore to Toronto if take away the logistics behind the trade. He would be a good stop-gap for them actually IMO. I think Toronto doesn't need a long-term goalie right now. They need to give Reimer/Scrivens some time. Hell look at Vancouver, they were patient with Schneider's growth and that worked out for them. Scrivens might end up being the next Schneider. Being a Tampa fan I have the same hopes for Lindback/Tokarski/Helenius/Janus.
I think signing a different starting goalie to a decade long contract is beyond being patient with Schneider. He has all the time in the world to develop.

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Old
09-23-2012, 05:32 PM
  #32
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I think signing a different starting goalie to a decade long contract is beyond being patient with Schneider. He has all the time in the world to develop.
Keep in my I am going under the assumption Lou gets moved. Also still doesn't take away from the fact Schneider is a fantastic goalie.

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Old
09-23-2012, 05:42 PM
  #33
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Theo has a NTC and has stated multiple times that he wants to end his career here. Louie or not, Theo could remain a Panther.

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Old
09-23-2012, 06:02 PM
  #34
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Just a habs fan suggesting something, don't flame:

Theodore <> Komisarek + 2nd

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09-23-2012, 06:16 PM
  #35
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Just a habs fan suggesting something, don't flame:

Theodore <> Komisarek + 2nd
Why would Florida want, or have any need for, Komi?

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Old
09-23-2012, 06:24 PM
  #36
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Why would Florida want, or have any need for, Komi?
The second is the main piece.

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Old
09-23-2012, 06:25 PM
  #37
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The second is the main piece.
2nd round pick - Mike Komisarek = 0

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Old
09-23-2012, 06:34 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Well, in the locked thread I valued Theodore at Ashton + 2nd. Florida adds a physical forward prospect and likely a mid second. Just ballparking though.
That's not bad I guess. I don't know if the Panthers are ready to ship Theodore out with no goaltending coming back though.

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Old
09-23-2012, 07:01 PM
  #39
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Looking at winning records over save percentage. Blaming offensive style of the coach. Brian Burke seems to be blindly confident in sub-par goal tending wherever he goes. Because the way Reimer is defended around here is starting to sound a hell of a lot like Dan Cloutier.

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09-23-2012, 07:52 PM
  #40
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The second is the main piece.
There's no positive, Panthers don't need him an sure don't need or want to add that salary.

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Old
09-23-2012, 08:57 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by teddygmr View Post
as a longtime Leaf fan, I have NO interest in Theodore OR Luongo. I'm very comfortable with Reimer and Scrivens. Worst case scenario: Leafs get another top 5 pick in an even stronger draft!
In the new salary cap world, having two goalies with LOW cap hits will be very valuable.
For the Canucks to dump Luongo's contract on someone, they will need to add at least a
2nd round pick or a decent prospect like Schroeder PLUS take on a contract like Komisarek or Connolly.


And people say Luongo would get eaten alive in Toronto? If Leafs fans are generally as patient as this guy, he'd love it there. Worst case scenario is another top 5 pick! Awesome! Of course, than means another bottom 5 finish, but hey, there's draft picks to be had! Screw winning! I guess if that's what you're going for, having 2 goalies with LOW cap hits might actually be better than having 2 good goalies. Or even one.

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Old
09-23-2012, 10:43 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Howboutthempanthers View Post
That's not bad I guess. I don't know if the Panthers are ready to ship Theodore out with no goaltending coming back though.
That's obvious... I think the whole premise of this thread is what Toronto would give to Florida, which would then in turn allow them to make the move for the goalie who shall not be named.

I'll give the Vancouver fan who suggested Ashton + a 2nd some credit... that's probably close / the right package. Theodore fits almost exactly what the Leafs need to tandem with Reimer (veteran, 1 year deal, low cost, recent success, a long list of accomplishments); and while it's tough to lose those 2 pieces for a 1-year stop gap solution, that stop-gap solution may just be what Reimer needs to develop, and comes with absolutely zero risk. Heck, if things go wrong again in Toronto, the Leafs could probably re-acquire 1/2 of that package at the deadline from a team who wants an insurance policy.

I would also consider Scrivens to be available, not necessarily in addition to Ashton + a 2nd, but workable. If a certain team wants Clemmensen to back up a certain goalie with a similar quantity of experience to Reimer, then Scrivens could be an ideal fit for Florida as a young guy who can put some pressure on Markstrom's development, but also minimize the risk of letting a highly valuable asset rot on the bench while Luongo plays.

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Old
09-24-2012, 01:09 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
That's obvious... I think the whole premise of this thread is what Toronto would give to Florida, which would then in turn allow them to make the move for the goalie who shall not be named.

I'll give the Vancouver fan who suggested Ashton + a 2nd some credit... that's probably close / the right package. Theodore fits almost exactly what the Leafs need to tandem with Reimer (veteran, 1 year deal, low cost, recent success, a long list of accomplishments); and while it's tough to lose those 2 pieces for a 1-year stop gap solution, that stop-gap solution may just be what Reimer needs to develop, and comes with absolutely zero risk. Heck, if things go wrong again in Toronto, the Leafs could probably re-acquire 1/2 of that package at the deadline from a team who wants an insurance policy.

I would also consider Scrivens to be available, not necessarily in addition to Ashton + a 2nd, but workable. If a certain team wants Clemmensen to back up a certain goalie with a similar quantity of experience to Reimer, then Scrivens could be an ideal fit for Florida as a young guy who can put some pressure on Markstrom's development, but also minimize the risk of letting a highly valuable asset rot on the bench while Luongo plays.
I get that Scrivens had a good year in the A. But Florida needs a decent starting goalie in return if we trade Theodore and honestly, I don't see why a team with a good starting goalie would need him considering his career is at the end of its road.

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09-24-2012, 01:21 AM
  #44
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Toronto shouldn't be chasing Theodore!

Burke is noted for goalie issues, Nonis is not. Let Nonis address the issue and Toronto will be okay in net. I do not think Theodore is starter material and will not be improving.

If Toronto had any goalie aspirations at all why are they not overpaying Boston? Thomas is one of the best in the game and his year off is pretty obviously a ploy, given the CBA sitch. Aquiring Thomas should cost very little, since he seems finished with Boston. Add in his ancientness and I think he might be a bargain!

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Old
09-24-2012, 01:28 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by nhlfan9191 View Post
But Florida needs a decent starting goalie in return if we trade Theodore
It would be part of making room for Luongo.

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09-24-2012, 02:39 AM
  #46
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Toronto shouldn't be chasing Theodore!

Burke is noted for goalie issues, Nonis is not. Let Nonis address the issue and Toronto will be okay in net. I do not think Theodore is starter material and will not be improving.

If Toronto had any goalie aspirations at all why are they not overpaying Boston? Thomas is one of the best in the game and his year off is pretty obviously a ploy, given the CBA sitch. Aquiring Thomas should cost very little, since he seems finished with Boston. Add in his ancientness and I think he might be a bargain!
So your mind set is forget Theodore, who proved last season he is capable of helping a team end a playoff drought in a starting role and go after a goalie who isn't playing next year and has made it known he wants nothing to do with a Canadian market team? Makes sense. Even if there was a chance of Thomas playing, do you really think Boston would trade a guy who won a vezina\smyth/stanley cup for their team just a little over a year ago to a rival like Toronto?


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Old
09-24-2012, 03:33 AM
  #47
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Looking at winning records over save percentage. Blaming offensive style of the coach. Brian Burke seems to be blindly confident in sub-par goal tending wherever he goes. Because the way Reimer is defended around here is starting to sound a hell of a lot like Dan Cloutier.
I'd blame a few things. First would be Ron Wilson. The man clearly had no clue how to coach a defensive system, all about offense. There's a reason why he got the boot in San Jose, he doesn't get the job done. Yes, I am aware he had some solid PK years in San Jose btw. Second, the defense. On paper over the years the Leafs haven't looked that bad. Middle of the pack. to potentially a top 10 defense in the league(on paper). third is the actualy goaltending. When you combine the first two and their lack of success, odds are you'll stink in net no matter who you have. I'm not going to sit here and praise Reimer or whomever we've had between the pipes but I understand that watching game after game that the coaching and defense has been awful for several years.

No goalie can survive this. I do know one thing, it's a hell of a lot easier to blame the goalie(s) than it is to blame an entire defensiv system or the entire dman crew. Randy Carlyle should fix most of this all be it while sacrificing some offense which is fine. The Leafs have been pretty damn good post-lockout scoring goals despite popular belief and how all these morons yell that we need a "number one center" and that's all they have to say. What this team needs is a defensive system.

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09-24-2012, 03:37 AM
  #48
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So your mind set is forget Theodore, who proved last season he is capable of helping a team end a playoff drought in a starting role and go after a goalie who isn't playing next year and has made it known he wants nothing to do with a Canadian market team? Makes sense. Even if there was a chance of Thomas playing, do you really think Boston would trade a guy who won a vezina\smyth/stanley cup for their team just a little over a year ago to a rival like Toronto?
Boston would rid themselves of TT the first chance they got. The guys a cancer. A great goalie yes, but in Toronto he would only serve as a distraction. There's already enough of a distraction here between the pipes. I feel bad for goalies in Toronto, we have some awful media here. Almost as bad as Montreal which is saying something.

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Old
09-24-2012, 06:34 AM
  #49
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I get that Scrivens had a good year in the A. But Florida needs a decent starting goalie in return if we trade Theodore and honestly, I don't see why a team with a good starting goalie would need him considering his career is at the end of its road.
As I mentioned, Scrivens wouldn't be the #1 goalie you're trading for. He'd be the backup if Clemmensen were to go for the new #1 goalie.

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Originally Posted by JuniorNelson View Post
Toronto shouldn't be chasing Theodore!

Burke is noted for goalie issues, Nonis is not. Let Nonis address the issue and Toronto will be okay in net. I do not think Theodore is starter material and will not be improving.

If Toronto had any goalie aspirations at all why are they not overpaying Boston? Thomas is one of the best in the game and his year off is pretty obviously a ploy, given the CBA sitch. Aquiring Thomas should cost very little, since he seems finished with Boston. Add in his ancientness and I think he might be a bargain!
Because Thomas isn't in the game. He's said he doesn't want to play this year, and there's no reason to take that as anything less than face value. If he truly wanted out of Boston and was prepared to play, he'd have either said that, or something along the lines of what Luongo said... so his team won't have a problem moving him.

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Old
09-24-2012, 10:38 AM
  #50
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Looking at winning records over save percentage. Blaming offensive style of the coach. Brian Burke seems to be blindly confident in sub-par goal tending wherever he goes. Because the way Reimer is defended around here is starting to sound a hell of a lot like Dan Cloutier.
I think it's a little early to start making Reimer to Cloutier comparisons. Give the guy a chance, he came on halfway through the season before last as an injury call-up basically and played great and almost got the Leafs to the playoffs. Started out last season where he left off, got hurt, and had a tough time after that. I think he deserves atleast one more full season where he can start out fresh and healthy and then we'll know which is the true Reimer.

Also in similar amounts of playing time in the AHL Reimer has put up very similar numbers (SV%-wise) to Markstrom and Bernier, yet Reimer is thought to be some turd goalie being propped up by Leaf fans on these boards, and Markstrom and Bernier are the second comings of Brodeur and Roy. I'm not saying all three are identical or anything, but the double standards on here are ridiculous.

That all being said, if Theodore came virtually free (like as a UFA after the lockout) then I wouldn't mind seeing him split some time with Reimer. But I don't think he does nearly enough to warrant trading actual assets like 2nd's or guys like Ashton. He was decent in FLA but he by no means carried them to the playoffs or anything.

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