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Top 6 Center to Anaheim

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09-30-2012, 01:22 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Yes, but one is in his late 30's and one only has one year left on his contract.
There's a good chance Getzlaf re-signs, but even after that, the center depth lacks. It hasn't been great since the Ducks had McDonald-Getzlaf-Pahlsson-Marchant down the middle, and it seems to be the Ducks biggest weakness every year.

I think adding someone like Grabovski, Gagner, Marleau, Zajac, Laich, Brassard, etc.; re-signing Getzlaf; and then ushering in a prospect like Holland or Rakell, that weakness turns into a strength. The Ducks have a surplus of good wing prospects, so I figured I'd try my hand to see what other centers are available according to HF posters. That's all.

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09-30-2012, 01:23 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
Sounds like a good reason to keep a top 15 pick.
Okay, but that top 15 pick will be 2-3 years away from making the team, so it makes sense if they are looking like they are doing well to get a good 2nd line center. Just offers in the thread: Top 6 Center to Anaheim.

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09-30-2012, 01:27 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Okay, but that top 15 pick will be 2-3 years away from making the team, so it makes sense if they are looking like they are doing well to get a good 2nd line center. Just offers in the thread: Top 6 Center to Anaheim.
If we lose Getzlaf, waiting 2 to 3 years isn't going to matter.

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09-30-2012, 01:27 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
There's a good chance Getzlaf re-signs, but even after that, the center depth lacks. It hasn't been great since the Ducks had McDonald-Getzlaf-Pahlsson-Marchant down the middle, and it seems to be the Ducks biggest weakness every year.

I think adding someone like Grabovski, Gagner, Marleau, Zajac, Laich, Brassard, etc.; re-signing Getzlaf; and then ushering in a prospect like Holland or Rakell, that weakness turns into a strength. The Ducks have a surplus of good wing prospects, so I figured I'd try my hand to see what other centers are available according to HF posters. That's all.
Yes, but you never know if he will be next years' big fish in the UFA pool. I offered Grabo because we have enough people that can play 2nd line, and this year it would make sense to put Holland/Rakell on the 3rd line where they can grow, instead of being put on 2nd to fail. Could always acquire Connolly for a 2nd at the trade deadline.

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09-30-2012, 01:28 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
If we lose Getzlaf, waiting 2 to 3 years isn't going to matter.
Okay, but you can still work on a contract with Getzlaf to resign.. so with Perry and Getzlaf UFAs next summer, it'd be smart to make it look like you guys are trying to win.

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09-30-2012, 02:12 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
How do you automatically jump to the conclusion that we couldn't re-sign Zajac?

EDIT: I think if the Ducks were to mortgage the future so they could fill a void, they'd have the foresight to have the necessary cap space to keep that player. Cap space is somewhere around $37M once the 2013 off-season begins, IIRC.
You would probably havee to let go Selanne+Koivu/resign for 1M/they retire, as you'll need the money for Getz, Perry, Zajac, and Ryan after.

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09-30-2012, 02:20 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
You would probably havee to let go Selanne+Koivu/resign for 1M/they retire, as you'll need the money for Getz, Perry, Zajac, and Ryan after.
Yeah, it's probably the last go 'round for the Finns, meaning that $8.3M comes off the books; Ryan is already re-signed through 2015; and then you attribute $7M-$7.5M to each of Getzlaf and Perry (if Perry wants to re-sign).

Apart from that, Deslauriers/Lydman won't be back, and you have that chunk of space left to re-sign Beleskey to his contract, and Guenin/McMillan to their two-way deals (or tender McMillan). Let's say Zajac goes for $4M, then yeah, it's easy to re-sign him. I don't see how it's impossible, unless Zajac really doesn't want to continue playing in Anaheim.

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09-30-2012, 02:42 PM
  #33
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I'm pretty sure our next 2C will be either Holland, Bonino or Rakell. Actually, they'll probably all be our centers along with Getzlaf in the coming years. Should I've bet on which one of them to make the 2nd line, I'd go for Rakell.

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09-30-2012, 02:43 PM
  #34
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We didn't spend all this time developing Palmieri just to ship him out right before he got his shot. I don't know why anyone would think he isn't ready for the NHL, seeing as he basically earned that at the end of last season.

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09-30-2012, 03:01 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by quentez View Post
I'm pretty sure our next 2C will be either Holland, Bonino or Rakell. Actually, they'll probably all be our centers along with Getzlaf in the coming years. Should I've bet on which one of them to make the 2nd line, I'd go for Rakell.
I agree that it will be Rakell.

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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
We didn't spend all this time developing Palmieri just to ship him out right before he got his shot. I don't know why anyone would think he isn't ready for the NHL, seeing as he basically earned that at the end of last season.
Couldn't you say that that argument is the same as the one that was made for Jake Gardiner? I think sometimes you can't rely solely on prospects. There needs to be some top-six support for that first-line, so that they're not overused game-after-game.

I also believe that for risk of burdening a prospect too early in his career, you need to have sort of a stop-gap or filler type of center. That's what the organization seems to be doing on defense with Allen and Souray, so that they don't need to rush Vatanen and Lindholm like they did Fowler and Sbisa. If you put Rakell or Holland in too early, not only are you burdening them with too many minutes, you're also hurting the team's chances at winning. Zajac isn't a stop-gap, he's a solution, but I think you understand my point.

As well, the organization should be catering to Bobby Ryan, considering how awry this whole trade fiasco went. By trading for a 2C that can effectively play with him, I think you can fix that problem, while also fixing the perennial 2C problem that the Ducks have year-in and year-out. It also tells Getzlaf and Perry that the Ducks will do what they need to do to win (and not just always get guys like Foster, Cogliano, etc.). It might not always seem sensible trading a top prospect, but there are myriad benefits if that's the road the Ducks choose to take.

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09-30-2012, 03:07 PM
  #36
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I'd like to see a Ducks top 9 of:
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Estabilished 2C-Palmieri
Cogliano-Koivu-Selanne

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09-30-2012, 03:18 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
I'd like to see a Ducks top 9 of:
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Estabilished 2C-Palmieri
Cogliano-Koivu-Selanne
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-2C-Selanne
Cogs-Koivu-Etem
Bels-Bones-Winnik

That's not too bad either. Always options.

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09-30-2012, 03:52 PM
  #38
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Im not down with trading any of our prospects for a 2c.

Pretty content with holland/bonino getting their chances, and if they have selanne and ryan as wingers i think it will help them ease into the position.

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09-30-2012, 04:17 PM
  #39
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I think we're set, unless the new CBA puts teams in cap hell and we can get a 2C for relatively cheap on the trade market.

Palmieri - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Holland/Bonino - Selanne
Winnik - Koivu - DSP
Beleskey - Bonino/Holland - Cogliano

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09-30-2012, 04:17 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-2C-Selanne
Cogs-Koivu-Etem
Bels-Bones-Winnik

That's not too bad either. Always options.
I'd rather have Palmieri in the top 9 ahead of both Cogs and Etem tbh.

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09-30-2012, 04:36 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Paul4587 View Post
I think we're set, unless the new CBA puts teams in cap hell and we can get a 2C for relatively cheap on the trade market.

Palmieri - Getzlaf - Perry
Ryan - Holland/Bonino - Selanne
Winnik - Koivu - DSP
Beleskey - Bonino/Holland - Cogliano
Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyquack View Post
I'd rather have Palmieri in the top 9 ahead of both Cogs and Etem tbh.
Was it just me, or was Palmieri particularly weak when he played on his off-wing? He disappeared during most of his appearances when he played on the left-side. He only really flourished when Perry was injured, and when he was suited to the right-side during the last handful of games.

And the reason I prefer Etem to Palmieri is because Etem has the ability to play in all three situations. I don't believe Palmieri played much PK at Notre Dame or in Syracuse, so Etem has the edge there (and has greater size). It's basically a coin flip between the two IMO.

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09-30-2012, 05:37 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
Was it just me, or was Palmieri particularly weak when he played on his off-wing? He disappeared during most of his appearances when he played on the left-side. He only really flourished when Perry was injured, and when he was suited to the right-side during the last handful of games.

And the reason I prefer Etem to Palmieri is because Etem has the ability to play in all three situations. I don't believe Palmieri played much PK at Notre Dame or in Syracuse, so Etem has the edge there (and has greater size). It's basically a coin flip between the two IMO.
Palmieri never played his off wing while he was up. He spent about 10 games on the 4th line playing RW and spent the rest of his time with some combination of Getzlaf/Ryan/Bonino/Cogliano. I think he played maybe 2 periods with Getzlaf and Perry and IIRC Perry moved to LW, just as he did when Lupul played on the top line. So I have no idea if he can play LW or not, I would hope he can adjust but not everyone can.

As for Etem vs Palmieri, Palmieri has already produced at the professional level. He dominated the AHL last year and looked very good in his last callup in Anaheim, especially when Perry was injured. Etem may have higher upside but Palmieri is much closer to being ready now. I don't think the PK argument is all that relevant because neither would be needed to PK this season.

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09-30-2012, 05:47 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Paul4587 View Post
Palmieri never played his off wing while he was up. He spent about 10 games on the 4th line playing RW and spent the rest of his time with some combination of Getzlaf/Ryan/Bonino/Cogliano. I think he played maybe 2 periods with Getzlaf and Perry and IIRC Perry moved to LW, just as he did when Lupul played on the top line. So I have no idea if he can play LW or not, I would hope he can adjust but not everyone can.

As for Etem vs Palmieri, Palmieri has already produced at the professional level. He dominated the AHL last year and looked very good in his last callup in Anaheim, especially when Perry was injured. Etem may have higher upside but Palmieri is much closer to being ready now. I don't think the PK argument is all that relevant because neither would be needed to PK this season.
Are you sure? I'm positive Palmieri played LW a bunch of times and only RW sparingly, and then once Perry injured his shoulder, he played it consistently, and first with Getzlaf and Ryan. From that Detroit game onwards, Boudreau played him on the right-side, in any combination of Ryan/Bonino (PBR Line) or Bonino/Smith-Pelly.

And the second part is from a long-term perspective. I don't expect either to play on the PK this season either, but in terms of long-term potential and necessity, it's better to have someone who can play PK than one who can't - although that's not even close to the deciding factor.

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09-30-2012, 05:59 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
Are you sure? I'm positive Palmieri played LW a bunch of times and only RW sparingly, and then once Perry injured his shoulder, he played it consistently, and first with Getzlaf and Ryan. From that Detroit game onwards, Boudreau played him on the right-side, in any combination of Ryan/Bonino (PBR Line) or Bonino/Smith-Pelly.
Yeah, I'm sure. I even looked up his ES TOI with other teammates to check and the only RW he spent more than 2 minutes on the ice with was Perry (who he played 16 minutes with at even strength). He didn't play at all at even strength (<2mins) with Parros, Selanne or DSP.

He did looked lost until they moved him up with Getzlaf and Ryan but that's because he was playing mostly 4th line minutes with Beleskey and Pelley, not because he was playing LW. A lot of posters on the Ducks board at the time were wondering why he was constantly being called up only to play 4th line minutes with mediocre linemates.

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09-30-2012, 06:05 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Paul4587 View Post
Yeah, I'm sure. I even looked up his ES TOI with other teammates to check and the only RW he spent more than 2 minutes on the ice with was Perry (who he played 16 minutes with at even strength). He didn't play at all at even strength (<2mins) with Parros, Selanne or DSP.

He did looked lost until they moved him up with Getzlaf and Ryan but that's because he was playing mostly 4th line minutes with Beleskey and Pelley, not because he was playing LW. A lot of posters on the Ducks board at the time were wondering why he was constantly being called up only to play 4th line minutes with mediocre linemates.
Ah, fair enough. Thanks for looking that up.

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09-30-2012, 06:08 PM
  #46
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What about Sbisa for Bolland straight up?

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09-30-2012, 06:20 PM
  #47
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What about Sbisa for Bolland straight up?
It is the old fill one hole to create another. The team still wants to compete now, and that trade wont help.

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09-30-2012, 06:33 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Sean Garrity View Post
It is the old fill one hole to create another. The team still wants to compete now, and that trade wont help.
I was under the impression the Ducks organization was loaded with talented D prospects, my mistake.

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09-30-2012, 06:39 PM
  #49
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I was under the impression the Ducks organization was loaded with talented D prospects, my mistake.
It would have to be a very good deal to part with Sbisa. Bolland isn't that guy, and I don't even really consider him a 2C, although he's one of my favorite non-Ducks.

And the Ducks have a lot of them (5 defenseman drafted in 2012), but they aren't far enough along to re-constitute Sbisa's loss.

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09-30-2012, 06:42 PM
  #50
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I'm not sure where Sbisa fits on Chicagos blueline anyway, there are 8 defenseman signed for next season. And if he were to be traded for a 2C, I would prefer they had more offensive ability than Bolland.

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