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Old
10-05-2012, 09:07 AM
  #1
HockeyGuruPitka
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Tor - Col

To Toronto

Matt Duchene
Joey Hishon

To Colorado
Phil Kessel
Tyler Bozak/cody franson

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:10 AM
  #2
TieClark
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No way leafs would do this.

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:11 AM
  #3
Mystlyfe
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This thread is gonna be fun.

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:11 AM
  #4
Hans Landaskog
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyGuruPitka View Post
To Toronto

Matt Duchene
Joey Hishon

To Colorado
Phil Kessel
Tyler Bozak/cody franson
Umm, i'll give you credit for it being different, that's for sure. Not sure who I'd want playing with Kessel though; however, Bozak is the centerpiece of this deal.

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:46 AM
  #5
cgf
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Atleast it's not Bozak and a 2nd for Staz, Avs still wouldn't do it, but at least it's new.

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:50 AM
  #6
Yarbles02
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I'm not a leafs fan but they have always said they need size up the middle. This deal truly seems to address that need.

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Old
10-05-2012, 09:57 AM
  #7
frankthetank91
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I probably would have pulled the trigger a couple of seasons ago but now Duchene turned into a country boy fishing hick and had a bad season. Kessel is much better right now.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:17 AM
  #8
Avs44
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Points for being original OP. Thought it would be something like MacArthur, Franson, 2nd, for Stastny. Avs still say no.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:18 AM
  #9
WarriorOfGandhi
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counteroffer: Bozak, Komisarek, 4th for Stastny

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:25 AM
  #10
Pierce Hawthorne
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Well, was very surprised to not see Paul Stastny in this proposal so its already a huge + in my books.

As for the deal, the value isnt horrible, its just one of those, you'll never see it actually happen type deals.

Personally as an Avs fan, I just dont think I could pull the trigger on it, and likewise I dont think the Leafs would be able to pull the trigger.


Too much risk for a team to get screwed in the long run.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:26 AM
  #11
Vankiller Whale
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Yeah, neither team does it.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:30 AM
  #12
handyj
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Not a chance the Leafs would be interested in this, for several reasons:

1. We need a top centerman to play with Kessel, so trading Kessel for a center doesn't make a lot of sense. We'd just be filling one hole by creating another.

2. Duchene is very talented but had a horrible year last year. Sure he has the talent to produce more, but are we getting the Duchene that had 67 points two years ago, the 28 points from last year, someone who will thrive and exceed his career bests? Too many question marks to let go a consistent 30+ goal scorer and a PPG player from last year.

3. Avs fans will have a fit about this, but how much better is Duchene than Bozak? By the numbers not a whole lot. Bozak had a much better PPG avg last year than Duchene, and Bozak's PPG from last season (his second full year) is pretty close to Duchene's career PPG. I know that's kind of cherry picking stats, and I'm not necessarily trying to argue that Bozak is better or equal to Duchene, just trying to say the difference isn't that large to warrant anyone even close to Kessel being added on.

4. I liked Hishon in his run a couple years back with Owen Sound, but he missed last year and a smallish forward with concussion issues is not exactly a blue chipper in my books. I hope he turns out but he's nowhere worth the gamble or value in this trade.

Kessel >> Duchene
Bozak > Hishon

or

Bozak < Duchene
Kessel >>> Hishon

Either way doesn't add up. And any Avs fan saying they wouldn't do this deal is being homer to the max.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:36 AM
  #13
handyj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs44 View Post
Points for being original OP. Thought it would be something like MacArthur, Franson, 2nd, for Stastny. Avs still say no.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avsare1 View Post
Well, was very surprised to not see Paul Stastny in this proposal so its already a huge + in my books.

As for the deal, the value isnt horrible, its just one of those, you'll never see it actually happen type deals.

Personally as an Avs fan, I just dont think I could pull the trigger on it, and likewise I dont think the Leafs would be able to pull the trigger.

Too much risk for a team to get screwed in the long run.
So you end up with top 3C's of Stastny, O'Reilly, and Bozak, and add one of the top offensive RWers in the game and you wouldn't do it? Duchene is talented, but come on, he will never put up Kessel's numbers and you're dealing from an area of strength to help a weaker area. No brainer.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:43 AM
  #14
Oates2Neely
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Leafs - Avs (Duchene - Gardiner)

With Statsny & O'Reilly Colorado has a solid 1-2 center punch. They do have a need for another crafty smooth skating dman, Jake Gardiner would fit in well on the Avs blueline.

Besides a starting goaltender the Leafs obvious need is for a top-6 center. Duchene has the talent level to fill that role. And with Morgan Reilly in the pipeline, the Leafs can absorb the loss of Gardiner.

To TOR:
Matt Duchene

To COL:
Jake Gardiner
Tor 2nd

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:44 AM
  #15
Ceremony
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Duchene goes nowhere thank you.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:44 AM
  #16
HockeyGuruPitka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handyj View Post
Not a chance the Leafs would be interested in this, for several reasons:

1. We need a top center man to play with Kessel, so trading Kessel for a center doesn't make a lot of sense. We'd just be filling one hole by creating another.

2. Duchene is very talented but had a horrible year last year. Sure he has the talent to produce more, but are we getting the Duchene that had 67 points two years ago, the 28 points from last year, someone who will thrive and exceed his career bests? Too many question marks to let go a consistent 30+ goal scorer and a PPG player from last year.

3. Avs fans will have a fit about this, but how much better is Duchene than Bozak? By the numbers not a whole lot. Bozak had a much better PPG avg last year than Duchene, and Bozak's PPG from last season (his second full year) is pretty close to Duchene's career PPG. I know that's kind of cherry picking stats, and I'm not necessarily trying to argue that Bozak is better or equal to Duchene, just trying to say the difference isn't that large to warrant anyone even close to Kessel being added on.

4. I liked Hishon in his run a couple years back with Owen Sound, but he missed last year and a smallish forward with concussion issues is not exactly a blue chipper in my books. I hope he turns out but he's nowhere worth the gamble or value in this trade.

Kessel >> Duchene
Bozak > Hishon

or

Bozak < Duchene
Kessel >>> Hishon

Either way doesn't add up. And any Avs fan saying they wouldn't do this deal is being homer to the max.
1. We have a ton of winger depth in Toronto, lupul would switch to the right and the top line would be something like

JVR - Duchene - Lupul

we have
Frattin
Kulemin
MacArthur
Lupul
Kadri
JVR

all fighting for top 6 spots. Kessel may just be expendable, if the right center is coming back.

2. Duchene was injury riddled last season. Terrible luck. Do not judge him off of last season

3. Completely disagree

4. Agreed

Is kessel alone going to win us a cup? Are we ever going to get him a center to play with? Maybe building around a winger is not the right formula. Kessel moves into Colorado who currently have 2 other top 6 centers. Add Bozak Kessel's good buddy and it may just be a good fit.

Bring Duchene back closer to home, who knows this could be a win win.

I love Kessel. Just look at those who win cups, all of them have horses down the middle.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:45 AM
  #17
tfong
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Not enuf from TOR side.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:45 AM
  #18
Avs71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handyj View Post
Either way doesn't add up. And any Avs fan saying they wouldn't do this deal is being homer to the max.
Really? Because the Avs wouldn't trade their 21 year old center for who put up 122 points in his first 2 years in the league, we are homers to the max? Even with Duchene's poor year, he still averages 0.033 less points per game than Kessel. That's 58 points to 56 points over an entire season.

It's like you think Kessel is flawless. Great scorer, but poor defensively, easily intimidated according to the players poll, as well as rumours surrounding bad attitude and poor work ethic. Would I still consider trading Duchene for him? Yes. Would I actually agree to it? Probably not.

edit: Just saw that you said Duchene is barely better than Bozak. You may as well ignore this response. Enjoy having Bozak as a #1 center, and we will enjoy keeping Duchene.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:46 AM
  #19
Ceremony
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Avs don't have anyone called Duschene, sorry.

And this is still a hell no for anyone on the Avs called Duchene. This is worse than the other one.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:51 AM
  #20
Avs44
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Duschene for Gardiner? Done. Duchene for Gardiner? Lol no

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:53 AM
  #21
Vankiller Whale
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Toronto adds. Maybe a 1st+?

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:53 AM
  #22
spiny norman
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Thread title has been fixed.

Now back to the discussion of the proposal's merits ...

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:54 AM
  #23
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As a Leaf fan, I would definitely consider it.

1 - Wingers are the least important players in hockey

2- We have pretty solid wing depth both now and for the future. JVR/Lupul/Kadri could all potentially be top line wingers for us

3 - Our centre depth is horrendous. No current or longterm option for a #1 C

4 - Comparing Duchene to Kessel head to head, Duchene. Duchene put up 67 points as a 19 year old, Kessel put up 37 points. When Kessel was 20, he put up 60, but that was while playing with Savard who had almost 90 points that year. Duchene was the offensive leader on his team as a 19 year old. Meaning Duchene raised the stats of his linemates, whereas Kessel had his stats inflated by Savard.

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Old
10-05-2012, 10:58 AM
  #24
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If Avs would be able to extend Stastny before (which they can't), I wouldn't mind a trade like this.

Risking going from Stastny-Duchene-O'Reilly down the middle to O'Reilly-Bozak in two years is a bit too scary.

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Old
10-05-2012, 11:03 AM
  #25
Pierce Hawthorne
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2 Duchene to the LEafs proposal today and no Stastnys, not sure Im a fan of were this is headed.

The other proposal had potential, this one does not.

Leafs need to add, probably alot, as other(Non Leafs/Avs) fans have already pointed out.


Duchene also goes nowere barring an overpayment, this is far from that.

***I dont even think the LEafs have what it would take for this to happen either, Grabovski is paid to much, Kulemin and Macarthur are meh, Bozak is Bozak, and the Avs arent really interested in prospects anymore, but rather young NHL talent similar to the rest of the Avs squad.

*** - This statement is made excluding guys like Kessel, and Phaneuf, as they would be Centerpieces in a deal, not addons, Gardiner is the Centerpiece in this deal.

MAYBE, MAYBE Gardiner + Kulemin + Tor 1st and 2nd, but even then I dont think the Avs pull the trigger.

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