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Lockout Thread: Games thru Nov. 30th to be cancelled| Part III.

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Old
10-05-2012, 04:31 AM
  #1
Leaf Rocket
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Lockout Thread: Games thru Nov. 30th to be cancelled| Part III.

go on.

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Last edited by ULF_55: 10-19-2012 at 03:40 PM.
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10-05-2012, 04:34 AM
  #2
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Bummer, raptors are supposed to be legit this year at least, Casey said so.

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10-05-2012, 04:56 AM
  #3
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Apparently, GB has the Winter classic and the ASG in his sights next......when will the madness end? But on a separate note read Bobby Ryan speaking out about "running away from the problem" is classic.

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10-05-2012, 05:49 AM
  #4
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The reluctance of either side to do any actual negotiating is painful. Very disappointing.

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10-05-2012, 07:30 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmart21 View Post
The reluctance of either side to do any actual negotiating is painful. Very disappointing.
I understand the NHLPA wants to get a good deal, but the fact that they just simply refuse to negotiate is aggravating. The NHL should throw out one last salvo with a proposal that's similar to the one they last gave. Then set a series of deadlines for the NHLPA to make one of their own, lest the following events be cancelled:

-Winter Classic
-All Star Game
-Season

Just say straight-up that it's your move, NHLPA. We're done throwing out proposals and getting nothing back. We're done smashing our heads against a brick wall.

I would love to be a fly on the wall at one of the League or NHLPA meetings. Just to know WTF these idiots are thinking.

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10-05-2012, 07:58 AM
  #6
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http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/10/04...n-of-nhl-games

Quote:
CALGARY - The latest in a string of sleep-inducing press releases from the National Hockey League announced Thursday the first two weeks of the regular season have been cancelled.

Yawn.

Apparently, there is some sort of labour strife going on, and the result is that well over 9,000 people will now be denied their summer-long dream of watching the New York Islanders host the Buffalo Sabres or the Tampa Bay Lightning visit the Florida Panthers.

Itís a shame too because you can bet dozens more had penciled the highly-anticipated Dallas Stars/Phoenix Coyotes matchup into their plans, unless, of course, theyíve got a tee-time that day instead.
...

It has been replaced with apathy ó the most dangerous fallout from all this.

The masses in hockey-mad Calgary have tuned it out and could care less right now about the game we call our own.

Just imagine how all this is playing out south of the border, where, for the most part, the NHL has been ignored anyway.
...
Both the owners and the players appear united in their fronts, but itís evident the most consolidated group is the fanbase that agrees wholeheartedly all this nonsense is no longer worth its time or energy.

After all, this just seems to keep happening.

Given the rampant indifference in town, it would be surprising if many had the stomach to read this far as it all seems blah blah blah, blah blah blah, blah blah blah.

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Old
10-05-2012, 08:07 AM
  #7
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http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/10/03...kout-live-chat

Quote:
Poll: Which side needs to compromise to avoid a prolonged lockout?
NHL (22%)
NHLPA (23%)
Both sides (54%)
Q&A at the link.

Nothing really new.

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Old
10-05-2012, 08:23 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disgruntled Observer View Post
The old CBA didnlt work well for about half of the NHL teams.
The rich teams prospered under it. The players prospered under it.
So you would think that the obvious answer would be for the rich teams (by increased revenue sharing) and the players (by taking a smaller % of revenues) bothyo do their part.
But when th players refuse to make a counter offer...
http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/10/04...-its-your-move

Quote:
Talks broke down between the two sides Tuesday in New York with no formal discussions planned. The belief is NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr has been working on a new offer but isn't ready to table it.
...
Daly refused to reveal how much teams are losing except to say the NHL wasn't trying to snow anybody.

"I could (quantify the losses). I'm choosing not to for a host of reasons," he said. "I'm not sure it advances the debate all that much and then it gets into their (the union's) interpretation of financials versus our interpretation of financials. I just don't think that's constructive to the process.
Yes, just believe what they are saying, it isn't like they'd stretch the truth or anything.

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10-05-2012, 09:48 AM
  #9
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/10/04...-its-your-move



Yes, just believe what they are saying, it isn't like they'd stretch the truth or anything.
The poor teams in the NHL have pathetic tv contracts, they sell their tickets at ridiculously low prices, and they're stadiums are like half full. Then they have to spend to the like 50 million cap floor.

So there's only two choices of what to believe...
1) these teams really are losing lots and lots of money
Or
2) these teams use magic, cast spells to get their money, and then lie to the nhlpa.
Is this actually your current argument? That these teams with half empty arenas cast magical spells to make money? Because I don't think that's a rational stance ulf. I personally don't believe that these teams are casting money making magic spells. But I guess we're all entitled to our opinions.

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10-05-2012, 09:53 AM
  #10
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Said it months ago, everyone (Players and Owners) are fully prepared to lockout the entire year.

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10-05-2012, 09:55 AM
  #11
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Not even like cancelling these first games matters. It's just ridiculous how casual both sides have been about this. No urgency at all. Both sides are probably fine with cancelling a season since it seems like they couldn't care less.

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10-05-2012, 10:37 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckWoods View Post
Said it months ago, everyone (Players and Owners) are fully prepared to lockout the entire year.
I forgave both sides last lockout, I came back and watched, and even went to a few Leaf games when I got the opportunity. But if they lock-out a whole season for a second time I am done with the NHL and I mean it. I didn't say this back in 04-05, but now I am! I will be done with NHL hockey if they have another loss season. Whats the point!! Every time the CBA expires Gary and his select 8 owners just dictate what the rest of the owners and players should do! It's sickening. I love hockey with a passion but I'm also a huge football fan, basketball fan, and baseball fan. I have the college bowl season to get my sports fix, I have the MLB playoffs, and I have the NBA and world juniors. The NHL can suck my **** if they lockout the whole season a second time.

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10-05-2012, 10:39 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post

It may just be anger and frustration setting in but I'm losing patience with the entire league. I'm beginning to question myself as to whether I will actually tune in when this is all over. Beyond pathetic now.

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10-05-2012, 11:05 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorityRules View Post
It may just be anger and frustration setting in but I'm losing patience with the entire league. I'm beginning to question myself as to whether I will actually tune in when this is all over. Beyond pathetic now.
I wish we could form our own lockout. For every game they cancel, fans should refuse to attend/watch as many games after the greedy SOB's decide to end this childish crap. As a season ticket holder for many years, i have actually had my letters to both the NHL and MLSE answered. Both have supported their stance by saying essentially "the fans are going to have to live with the lockout as we NEED to fix things". My response to both is this, without we "fans", you have nothing to fix. We are the reason tv contracts are so great. We are the reason there was a 3 plus billion dollar profit. Any union in any trade knows enough to begin negotiating a contract well before a lockout date, and well before they alienate the people who give them a reason to excist...except this one.

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10-05-2012, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
I wish we could form our own lockout. For every game they cancel, fans should refuse to attend/watch as many games after the greedy SOB's decide to end this childish crap. As a season ticket holder for many years, i have actually had my letters to both the NHL and MLSE answered. Both have supported their stance by saying essentially "the fans are going to have to live with the lockout as we NEED to fix things". My response to both is this, without we "fans", you have nothing to fix. We are the reason tv contracts are so great. We are the reason there was a 3 plus billion dollar profit. Any union in any trade knows enough to begin negotiating a contract well before a lockout date, and well before they alienate the people who give them a reason to excist...except this one.
I just think that both sides are way out of touch with reality.

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10-05-2012, 11:15 AM
  #16
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Originally Posted by Suntouchable13 View Post
I just think that both sides are way out of touch with reality.
Thats your opinion and most will probably agree with you. I do to a certain extent, but the thing is..if the league is making record revenues but still have teams losing 20-25 million dollars a year, how is that on the players? The players are attached to the record revenues they make loads of money for the league, they have no say in where teams play. Bettman and his cronies do..who put a team in Phoenix? Gary and the owners did. Who keeps propping up Phoenix? Gary and the owners. Who does Gary and the owners go to when things go wrong..the players! it's so ridiculous.

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10-05-2012, 11:44 AM
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10-05-2012, 12:13 PM
  #18
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10-05-2012, 01:54 PM
  #19
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http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=406814

Quote:
Boyle told CSN Bay Area he thinks the lockout is being controlled by a select group of owners and commissioner Gary Bettman and that the majority of owners are looking to get a deal done.

"It doesn't make any sense to me that eight teams can control the fate of 22 other ones," Boyle told CSN Bay Area. "I think when players make comments, sometimes it's directed towards 30 owners, but I think a lot of us feel that it's not across the board. It's a certain group of teams that are controlling 30 others."

Boyle believes the fact the NHL requires just eight owner votes to veto any proposals from the players allows a certain group of owners to control the process.

He said the players are willing to provide concessions and thinks the majority of owners would be willing to negotiate, but a select group of owners and commissioner Gary Bettman will not allow a deal to happen at this point.
Well, that should be obvious to most.

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10-05-2012, 02:02 PM
  #20
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This is the worst thing for hockey..

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10-05-2012, 02:12 PM
  #21
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If it's true that sometime in early November the NHL is willing to cancel the Leafs/Red Wings Winter Classic and 2013 All Star Game then I honestly think there won't be any NHL Hockey played this season.

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10-05-2012, 02:26 PM
  #22
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I wonder if it could ever be a strategy for the NHL Board to threaten the contraction of teams (namely Phoenix) in order to get a deal done. Mind you a contraction should be perceived to be extremely bad for the owners as well - as what would this mean for their valuation the fact that teams dissolve without compensation? However I think players should be more sensitive about this issue as this lowers the overall slice of their pie and of course the number of jobs available.

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10-05-2012, 03:00 PM
  #23
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Meeting today!



Quote:
Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun

Bettman/Daly and Fehr brothers were in meeting today
Quote:
Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun

So to recap: unannounced meeting between Big Four negotiators in Toronto, both sides plan to keep in touch but no formal talks planned yet
Quote:
Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun

Expectation is that D Fehr and G Bettman will speak by phone at some point this weekend... Likely same for B Daly and S Fehr
Quote:
Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun

Nothing scheduled yet for next week to resume formal talks. Both sides will chat this weekend about scheduling something for next week

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10-05-2012, 03:35 PM
  #24
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Originally Posted by dougieg93 View Post
I wonder if it could ever be a strategy for the NHL Board to threaten the contraction of teams (namely Phoenix) in order to get a deal done. Mind you a contraction should be perceived to be extremely bad for the owners as well - as what would this mean for their valuation the fact that teams dissolve without compensation? However I think players should be more sensitive about this issue as this lowers the overall slice of their pie and of course the number of jobs available.
You cannot have contraction without a cost to it. Teams being contracted would have to bought out by the remaining owners. It would be a very expensive option and would leave markets exposed for a rogue league which again would be very costly. Contraction will not happen.

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10-05-2012, 04:53 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northern Dancer View Post
You cannot have contraction without a cost to it. Teams being contracted would have to bought out by the remaining owners. It would be a very expensive option and would leave markets exposed for a rogue league which again would be very costly. Contraction will not happen.
Thanks for responding to my post, and that does make sense, but at the same time I wonder if the cost of buying out a team is that big. Judging from Daly's response that collectively the league lost 100 million in revenue from losing out the preseason, and the cost of buying out an average hockey team is around 300 million, it doesn't seem like such gargantuan expense the fact that the cost is distributed and especially that the players are asking for ~250 Million in revenue sharing per year.

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