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NHL to Expand 2 teams in Canada - THN

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10-11-2012, 02:44 PM
  #51
gstommylee
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Originally Posted by KevFu View Post
I would have to think that given Seattle's arena deal (NBA tam required to build), Seattle could dip below QUE/SEA if the NHL is using expansion as a CBA negotiating tool.

Expansion creates a big bargaining chip. They'd be trading an item from their CBA wish list for three players 19-25 on their organizational depth chart.

What's the interest level in Montreal (Canadiens ownership, fans, etc) in an NBA team?
Seattle will get a NBA team. Why would Hansen be doing what he has done: buying land that's costing him 50m+ US dollars and giving everything Seattle city council wants if he has no idea on his chances of landing a NBA team.

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10-11-2012, 02:45 PM
  #52
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Not sure why it'd be expansion and not moving two of the lame duck franchises to Canada, but it doesn't matter too much. If 2 more teams are placed in Canada, those are two successful teams without question.

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10-11-2012, 02:48 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
Seattle will get a NBA team. Why would Hansen be doing what he has done: buying land that's costing him 50m+ US dollars and giving everything Seattle city council wants if he has no idea on his chances of landing a NBA team.
Yeah, but you can't expand into Seattle until he does.

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10-11-2012, 02:50 PM
  #54
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Because teams in Canada will make more money then a team in Seattle
That makes it more likely that there would be expansion into Canada and relocation of a current team in Seattle.

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10-11-2012, 02:50 PM
  #55
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It could very well be how the owners plan on getting to the 50% split. They offer to include the expansion fees in HRR in exchange for a lower rate and announce that they already have two deals ready for approval. The PA get 46 new jobs and current players get a nice expansion check now for selling out future players with a lower rate. Edit: On top of that with two more teams in highly profitable market the NHL will offer a serious revenue sharing expansion.


Last edited by madhi19: 10-11-2012 at 02:55 PM.
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10-11-2012, 02:52 PM
  #56
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And tick off NBC in the process? I don't think so.
I say who cares what NBC might think if the NHL add's two more Canadian teams. Most of the time they only show Red Wings vs Blackhawks, Penguins vs Flyers, Penguins vs Capitals, Rangers vs Devils and Rangers vs Bruins.

If they had broadcast more games of other United States based NHL teams you might have a point, but based on who they show the majority of the time is why I don't agree with it.

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10-11-2012, 02:54 PM
  #57
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#1 on any "teams go here" agenda has to be that Phx moves to here: ____likely QC____.

Anything extra after that, is... well... extra.

2 new teams? do not want.

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10-11-2012, 02:55 PM
  #58
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I'm all for this. More Canadian Franchises are good. 32 teams is a good # (provided they align the teams properly.

If anything, it will hopefully shut up the bloodthirsty "relocate everyone south of Detroit" gang. Who am I kidding, as soon as Markham and Quebec get teams, we'll start to see the "Move Dallas to Medicine Hat" posts.

I don't see 2 more teams diluting the talent pool all that much. If at all.

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10-11-2012, 02:56 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by KevFu View Post
Yeah, but you can't expand into Seattle until he does.
True we are at least a year and half away from shovel meets ground from permit perspective anyways due to environmental review.

Its not a matter of IF we get a NBA team but when.

Plus we still are looking at 2-3 years before said arena is finished which will bring up the question of will said owner of Seattle NHL team want to play at the Key Arena until new arena is built.

So question remains relocation and owner loses money until new arena is done or relocation/expansion once new arena is done.

It is what it is. There is no way an arena is going to built in Seattle using public funds if its going to be empty never mind it'll be illegal per I-91.

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10-11-2012, 03:02 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by LEAFS FAN 4 EVER View Post
I say who cares what NBC might think if the NHL add's two more Canadian teams. Most of the time they only show Red Wings vs Blackhawks, Penguins vs Flyers, Penguins vs Capitals, Rangers vs Devils and Rangers vs Bruins.

If they had broadcast more games of other United States based NHL teams you might have a point, but based on who they show the majority of the time is why I don't agree with it.
Plus the NBC contract is already locked for the next decade while the Canadian contract is up soon. Expand or relocate to Canada and that contract value will be even bigger. Also with more than 150 new "Canadian Games" I can see the NHL dividing the contract between bidders and ending Saturday night exclusivity.

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10-11-2012, 03:06 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by madhi19 View Post
Plus the NBC contract is already locked for the next decade while the Canadian contract is up soon. Expand or relocate to Canada and that contract value will be even bigger. Also with more than 150 new "Canadian Games" I can see the NHL dividing the contract between bidders and ending Saturday night exclusivity.
There is that. But wouldn't expansion be even better than relocation. Quebec and toronto would bring more money expansion wise than Seattle/Quebec or Seattle/toronto.

But if you do the relocations to canada and seattle gets the arena built the league would be essentially screwing Seattle thus making seattle wait even longer.

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10-11-2012, 03:08 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by madhi19 View Post
It could very well be how the owners plan on getting to the 50% split. They offer to include the expansion fees in HRR in exchange for a lower rate and announce that they already have two deals ready for approval. The PA get 46 new jobs and current players get a nice expansion check now for selling out future players with a lower rate. Edit: On top of that with two more teams in highly profitable market the NHL will offer a serious revenue sharing expansion.
expansion fees?! Are you really talking about expansion fees?!

The league can't find a buyer for a pretty good Phoenix playoff team - where are they gonna find not one, but TWO more suckers... er I mean owners... that want to join this club?

So now they'd need to find 3 new owners to join this group whose main source of income is currently locked out. Man, it doesn't get any better than this!

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10-11-2012, 03:08 PM
  #63
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Gary Bettman does not seem to me like a guy who's gonna do these type of moves at once. The NHL would at the moment rather than dealing with the Phx situation just keep pushing it back because they're concetrated on CBA negotiations. So if there is a full yr lockout which doesn't get resolved till the summer like last time then I really doubt that Bettman will have the prep or time to move two separate teams to Canada or to expand 2 to Canada.

Also I'm a huge fan of having expansion and a large league but the NHL is just stupid if it wants to do this considering the other franchises being in distress. Their best bet now would be to relocate when the opportunity is there and not expand.

And also this was just lunch radio speculation.
Disagree completely. There's going to be a lot of remaining ill-will toward Bettman and the league once this is over. Most of it will come out of Canada. If not only one, but TWO new teams are announced in Canada on the day the CBA is signed, the discussion is changed. "Two new teams in Canada" is a much bigger story for would be critics and rabble-rousers than "the NHL and Bettman are jerks."

This is exactly something Bettman would do. Smart media tactic.

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10-11-2012, 03:08 PM
  #64
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Are Houston and Kansas City still in play?

Obviously Quebec is going to happen, either the Coyotes or expansion. Markham is also likely. So then it's up to Seattle, Hamilton or one that nobody is talking about right now.

I think it's fantastic because you would of course get the expansion fees, I think part of the CBA would have to include language that EXCLUDES expansion fees from being included in HRR, so as not to artificially inflate the cap (assuming it's still linked).

Also, adding teams in Canada bumps league revenue which adds more to revenue sharing to help build the non-traditional markets.

As for the talent pool, you're looking at 40 regular spots for two teams. 1.5 players per team, that's not a big difference. At first of course it would be, but most of the disparity would be on the expansion teams themselves. Over time it would even out and at that point it doesn't matter because all teams would be affected equally.

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10-11-2012, 03:10 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by LEAFS FAN 4 EVER View Post
I say who cares what NBC might think if the NHL add's two more Canadian teams. Most of the time they only show Red Wings vs Blackhawks, Penguins vs Flyers, Penguins vs Capitals, Rangers vs Devils and Rangers vs Bruins.

If they had broadcast more games of other United States based NHL teams you might have a point, but based on who they show the majority of the time is why I don't agree with it.
Blame Nielsen Media Research. That's a 'them' thing, not an NBC thing.

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10-11-2012, 03:10 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire11 View Post
Are Houston and Kansas City still in play?

Obviously Quebec is going to happen, either the Coyotes or expansion. Markham is also likely. So then it's up to Seattle, Hamilton or one that nobody is talking about right now.

I think it's fantastic because you would of course get the expansion fees, I think part of the CBA would have to include language that EXCLUDES expansion fees from being included in HRR, so as not to artificially inflate the cap (assuming it's still linked).

Also, adding teams in Canada bumps league revenue which adds more to revenue sharing to help build the non-traditional markets.

As for the talent pool, you're looking at 40 regular spots for two teams. 1.5 players per team, that's not a big difference. At first of course it would be, but most of the disparity would be on the expansion teams themselves. Over time it would even out and at that point it doesn't matter because all teams would be affected equally.
Kansas City needs a owner thats interested in bring a team there. Nevermind that i don't think the market is there. I'll be honest NHL needs Seattle. The pacific northwest is the last large area of the US where there is no league footprint.

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10-11-2012, 03:12 PM
  #67
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20 teams in the play-offs would be terrible to organise. 16 is perfect.
16 is too many. I'd prefer to see 12 or even 8.

 
Old
10-11-2012, 03:14 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
Kansas City needs a owner thats interested in bring a team there. Nevermind that i don't think the market is there.
I don't know who would be interested, just remember that they were in on the last round of expansion, and have been in the mix for relocation during the last decade. Having missed out on the NBA when Seattle went to Oklahoma City, I imagine there has to be some NHL interest left somewhere. But they also haven't been mentioned with the Coyotes, so maybe not.

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10-11-2012, 03:15 PM
  #69
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16 is too many. I'd prefer to see 12 or even 8.
16 is fine. Making it less would not help the league.

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10-11-2012, 03:16 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire11 View Post
I don't know who would be interested, just remember that they were in on the last round of expansion, and have been in the mix for relocation during the last decade. Having missed out on the NBA when Seattle went to Oklahoma City, I imagine there has to be some NHL interest left somewhere. But they also haven't been mentioned with the Coyotes, so maybe not.
They would already have a team now if there was an owner interested in a team. They have an arena with out a major anchor.

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10-11-2012, 03:20 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Rhiessan71 View Post
Was just out and about listening to the Fan590, Tim and Sid.
They were talking about Jason Kay of the Hockey News saying that once the CBA is finalized, the NHL will be announcing 2 new teams in Canada. Namely in Quebec and Toronto.

https://twitter.com/JKTHN/statuses/256376786852667392
So I guess this means we are going to be locked out for two more years, because neither place will be ready for a team until then.

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10-11-2012, 03:20 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
That makes it more likely that there would be expansion into Canada and relocation of a current team in Seattle.
YES gives qc an expansion because it's a canadian team they loved hockey so they'll be happy...

Of course Seattle would get the best, a fully formed competitive team

Qc lost a good team, they deserve a good team back. I know an expansion is better than nothing and I would be happy for them but I'm a bit sick of seeing canadian markets being treated as second class markets just because they love the game.

I think Seattle would be a nice hockey market but Qc will be ready before them. At the moment if a curent team needs to move it's going to Quebec. I'm pretty sure PKP would pay more for a team in a proven hockey market than any owners Seattle.

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10-11-2012, 03:22 PM
  #73
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Blame Nielsen Media Research. That's a 'them' thing, not an NBC thing.
I disagree. Other people claim NBC would hate for Canadian teams to be added, however when NBC only shows the same teams I previously mentioned it seems they don't care about the other United States based teams. So why don't they prove it by showing different teams not the same ones.

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10-11-2012, 03:24 PM
  #74
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Let's relocate some struggling teams to these better markets first before expanding further.

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10-11-2012, 03:28 PM
  #75
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YES gives qc an expansion because it's a canadian team they loved hockey so they'll be happy...

Of course Seattle would get the best, a fully formed competitive team

Qc lost a good team, they deserve a good team back. I know an expansion is better than nothing and I would be happy for them but I'm a bit sick of seeing canadian markets being treated as second class markets just because they love the game.

I think Seattle would be a nice hockey market but Qc will be ready before them. At the moment if a curent team needs to move it's going to Quebec. I'm pretty sure PKP would pay more for a team in a proven hockey market than any owners Seattle.
Yup, Quebec City should be picked over Seattle, but its a race of Arena building/renovation, although QC fans will surely support the team, its still up to who's gonna be ready when the NHL is ready. Fear not, QC has the edge.

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