The Business of HockeyDiscuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Franchise sales, valuations, TV contracts, ratings, expansion, relocation, the CBA and work stoppage discussion goes here.
All seven games of Huskies football? And the 16 home games of of Huskies basketball?
The Mariners and Sounders (who average 33,000 fans) play in the summer.
What makes it so hard in Seattle when the exact same thing occurs in Minnesota, Boston, Denver, Detroit, Chicago, New York, Washington, and Philadelphia?
They said for years that Washington DC was a Redskins only town and nobody would support anything else. Well, MLB brought the Nats in and they draw. The Caps you can't get a ticket for (I know, I tried). Perpetually sold out. The Caps get significant media coverage in the DC metro area. Pretty much every game is on TV and radio, the newspapers devote good chunks of their sports sections to the team. People actually TALK about the Caps. If anything it's the NBA Wizards that get the snickers and eyerolls.
I'll drive a hundred miles from Tacoma to watch junior games. Everett, Tri-Cities, and Portland are all within that radius. But I wouldn't drive 26 miles to watch the Seachickens.
Btw 1.2k+ Portland timber fans disagree with you on that fans won't travel a couple hours to see a match in Seattle cause 1.2k portland fans were in Seattle last Sunday for the Sounders vs Timbers match.
All seven games of Huskies football? And the 16 home games of of Huskies basketball?
The Mariners and Sounders (who average 33,000 fans) play in the summer.
What makes it so hard in Seattle when the exact same thing occurs in Minnesota, Boston, Denver, Detroit, Chicago, New York, Washington, and Philadelphia?
Because there are people in those cities actually like hockey.
OK, a dozen or so people would. I can't see NHL hockey in Seatte as anything more than a pawn to get a new basketball arena built so they can get an NBA team.
OK, a dozen or so people would. I can't see NHL hockey in Seatte as anything more than a pawn to get a new basketball arena built so they can get an NBA team.
Umm other way around we need the NBA to get the NHL.
The arena needs the NBA to be built. NHL is just icing on the cake. Seriously give it up.
Although I'm not a big fan of expansion, it makes much more sense they would want to expand into Canada and relocate if need be (ie. phoenix) to the U.S (seattle).
Why? Well as already mentioned the canadian teams would be risk free and automatically profitable long term . But there is also another reason. Expansion teams will suffer the first few years and the NHL knows us Canadians will be patient and still shell out money to a losing team (see Toronto). But a relocated team (probably phoenix) would be more competative right off the bat.
NHL dream scenerio:
Expand into Canada within 2 years, teams struggle for a few years but still make money.
Phoenix trends towards being a contender and either stays put (unlikely) or moves to Seattle within 4 years and wins the Stanley Cup (ala Colorado Avalanche) and builds a new strong fanbase in the u.s northwest.
Although I'm not a big fan of expansion, it makes much more sense they would want to expand into Canada and relocate if need be (ie. phoenix) to the U.S (seattle).
Why? Well as already mentioned the canadian teams would be risk free and automatically profitable long term . But there is also another reason. Expansion teams will suffer the first few years and the NHL knows us Canadians will be patient and still shell out money to a losing team (see Toronto). But a relocated team (probably phoenix) would be more competative right off the bat.
NHL dream scenerio:
Expand into Canada within 2 years, teams struggle for a few years but still make money.
Phoenix trends towards being a contender and either stays put (unlikely) or moves to Seatle within 4 years and wins the Stanley Cup (ala Colorado Avalanche) and builds a new strong fanbase in the u.s nothwest.
Yea having the new Seattle team win the stanley cup will draw the fans. And actually 4 years and Win the cup would put us around the 100th anniversary of when Seattle first won the Stanley Cup.
I enjoy how we have nice long arguments about (nothing) when we all* would like to see SEA, QUE, and (insert Hamilton-Toronto general area) get hockey over Phoenix. (* except Coyotes fans).
I really need to stop arguing points apart from the actual discussion with people. Then again, if I did, I would hardly ever post. But I digress.
The "news" of this is plausible, because it would be a token to use in bargaining. The Toronto piece IS plausible (likely is another story, but plausible) only because NHL approval on the sale of the Leafs could include acceptance of a second team in the market as a condition.
No kidding people will drive from Vancouver BC to see their team play seattle in seattle cause it so darn hard to get tickets for a Canuck home game.
so true thats why i want Seattle to get a team so i don't have to pay a fortune to watch the nucks play...tickets here in the 80/90's were so cheap once immigration hit hard everything here has gone way up including the house prices
hell ppl here won't care if the nucks aren't playing they will watch seattle vs sharks, kings, hawks, ,wings, leafs, habs, pens ect...
I always lol when I hear about another team in Ontario, who would actually cheer for them?
Isn't everyone a TML or Sens fan?
I imagine that winning would help a lot.
If they moved Phoenix over I bet that team would make the playoffs, as a result, they would be the only show in town during the playoffs and would garner a lot of interest and fans that way.
I always lol when I hear about another team in Ontario, who would actually cheer for them?
Isn't everyone a TML or Sens fan?
Not really. The Sens aren't big anywhere west of Kingston really. Ottawa and Toronto aren't like Baltimore and Washington or even Edmonton and Calgary. It's a 5 hour drive between the two cities. The Leafs and Sens are completely different markets.
A new team would be competing directly against the Leafs though. It will no doubt be challenge for the team to gain a footing, as we've seen with Clippers in LA. The market, however, should be able to not only support the team in the long-team but allow it to be one of the most profitable in the league.
They don't even have a new CBA yet so how can they guess this? Also, this assumes Phoenix-->Seattle? BecausE I think Seattle gets a team before another in the Toronto area. Hell even Hamilton before another in the Toronto area.
Haha, that's cute. That would require Bettman to admit the Phoenix idea was a mistake. You will see the Leafs, Habs, Rangers, Flyers, Red Wings, Blackhawks and Bruins move before you see Phoenix move.
In the next CBA, Bettman will insist that 100% of the revenue sharing be given to Phoenix and Phoenix will not be subject to the salary cap. In addition, regardless of where they finish in the standings/play-offs, Phoenix will receive the first two picks of each round of every draft.
To watch hockey, most Americans won't drive that far. To watch football, they will walk 20 miles over broken glass with bare feet.
We are talking hockey here not the NBA. It will be funny to watch one night the Sonics sell out, the next night the Seattle Coyotes are half empty.
I live in NYC, and I have driven to the following places to watch the Rangers:
Ottawa (twice), MOntreal (twice), Philadelphia (about 20 times), Pittsburgh (8 times), Carolina, Washington, Boston (3 times), New Jersey, Long Island (last 2 dont really count). I have flown to Detroit, Toronto, and Florida (twice).
They said for years that Washington DC was a Redskins only town and nobody would support anything else. Well, MLB brought the Nats in and they draw. The Caps you can't get a ticket for (I know, I tried). Perpetually sold out. The Caps get significant media coverage in the DC metro area. Pretty much every game is on TV and radio, the newspapers devote good chunks of their sports sections to the team. People actually TALK about the Caps. If anything it's the NBA Wizards that get the snickers and eyerolls.
The Nats are FINALLY drawing and it took a division title and the two biggest phenoms to come along in 30 years to do so. The Caps have the biggest band-wagon fan base in the league. 10 years ago, when they played the Pens, Flyers, Rangers, the place was 1/2 full with opposing fans.
The idea if I remember it was (under a conference format) teams 7-10 would have a "mini playoff" (not unlike Wild Card) to determine the 7th and 8th seeds.
I don't necessarily agree with it, but I could see the sell job being that 9th and 10 place teams get at least some "playoff" monies in a 3 or 5 game series.
Part of the re-alignment plan was a return to divisional play-offs. Could be top-5 in the division with the 4 and 5 seed having a play-in game or best of 3. Can't see it being much more than that.
I remember when the AHL tried the 7-10, 8-9 thing and from what I recall (could be wrong) that it wasn't received very well.
Because there are people in those cities actually like hockey.
I recently worked at a large technology company in the area. Just in my small department, there were at least 5 hockey fans that I knew of. When I was walking by a different department one morning, I eavesdropped on a conversation two people were having about hockey during the playoffs.
Then there's the GSHL. -- http://gshockey.com -- There are dozens upon dozens of teams registered each season. Take into account all of those players registered, plus the friends and family that they would bring along to an NHL game.
Then think of all of the Vancouverites who would travel down to see hockey, as has been mentioned already.
Just because minor league hockey doesn't sell out in the area doesn't mean NHL hockey couldn't. They are two different calibers of play. I would definitely travel 30 miles to see the NHL team (I already did this drive 2x a week to play hockey). I would not travel 30 miles to see a minor league team. But that's just me.
Many people in this area DO like hockey. If there were a team there, I'm pretty sure they'd check it out.
The Nats are FINALLY drawing and it took a division title and the two biggest phenoms to come along in 30 years to do so. The Caps have the biggest band-wagon fan base in the league. 10 years ago, when they played the Pens, Flyers, Rangers, the place was 1/2 full with opposing fans.
The Nationals aren't drawing much. They were only about 70 percent attendance..
