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Autumn Thunder: Standing On the Shoulders of Giants

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Old
10-12-2012, 07:42 AM
  #251
Dupree13
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The Todd Haley experiment is a clear failure. The reason Art II got rid of Bruce was not because the offense was underachieving. It was strictly as a means of "reigning in" Ben to protect the franchise's investment. This was to be done by putting more emphasis on the run game and more designed quick passes.

Problem is that while keeping Ben healthy is a worthy goal, this method of doing it was never going to work. The tiger can't change his stripes. Ben is a playground player, that will never change. The reality is that Bruce's offense of giving Ben a lot of freedom and running the offense as an equal partner was the best system, however imperfect it was. Now with Haley we have the same thing with a lot more garbage plays mixed in.

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10-12-2012, 07:49 AM
  #252
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I have no idea why this team is so injury prone every single year. It doesn't seem like any other team has huge names in key positions fall like we do.
Dude, seriously (ok well only a little bit)... It has to be something in the water. This is just getting ridiculous. Between the Steelers and the Pens, we always have lineups decimated by injuries.

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10-12-2012, 08:04 AM
  #253
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Ike Taylor was never recovered since Denver playoff game last year. Absolutely horrible performance by him last night. 3 friggin' pass interferences and constantly get beat.

It's a shame that Ben might be playing his best year so far. His interceptions and sacks are much less than any of his previous years.

I would absolutely love to draft Manti Te'o if he's available. I agree with JTG, I wouldn't give a lot of money to Wallace. We need some space cap for rebuild our defense. Hampton will be gone for sure but Harrison, Foote, Taylor may not be back.
The way he is getting his pass interferences is bothering me. They are stupid, and on the one in particular down by the 1...grabbing the wideouts jersey was completely unnecessary. Ike's pass interference calls tend to be like Geno's hooking calls. Completely dumb, unnecessary, and lazy penalties.

In years past, we in Pittsburgh have always predicted down years, and years where we thought the team wouldn't be as good as years past. You have also always had those in Pittsburgh who want to blow any team up that performs poorly, but IMO, those people may be on to something with this team. As we all have been saying for years, we have guys at key positions who are old by football standards. Blowing this team up and retooling may not be the worst thing we can do as it'd quickly inject some youth into the lineup, I'd create a core, and build from there out. There aren't many redeemable pieces on that defense currently. Who do you build around?

Timmons? Even during this season, I'd question that notion. Woodley? Even during this season AND last, I'd question that notion. Heyward? Maybe? Hood? Absolutely not. Troy? Not so much anymore. Certainly no corner you can really build around. Harrison? A shot knee and definitely on the wrong side of 30.

At least on offense we have something to work with there. We have competent wideouts, a great tight end, and a line that can potentially sort itself out. Mendenhall needs to get healthy, as I think he will be a good runner for us if we get the blockers for at least another 3-4 years. Ben is playing some of the best QB I've seen him play.

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Originally Posted by Dupree13 View Post
The Todd Haley experiment is a clear failure. The reason Art II got rid of Bruce was not because the offense was underachieving. It was strictly as a means of "reigning in" Ben to protect the franchise's investment. This was to be done by putting more emphasis on the run game and more designed quick passes.

Problem is that while keeping Ben healthy is a worthy goal, this method of doing it was never going to work. The tiger can't change his stripes. Ben is a playground player, that will never change. The reality is that Bruce's offense of giving Ben a lot of freedom and running the offense as an equal partner was the best system, however imperfect it was. Now with Haley we have the same thing with a lot more garbage plays mixed in.
I don't know if it's been a failure. I think Todd has done some stuff that I personally like. I won't say it has worked though. There has been zero rhythm with the play calling, IMO. It's sort of hard to watch.

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Dude, seriously (ok well only a little bit)... It has to be something in the water. This is just getting ridiculous. Between the Steelers and the Pens, we always have lineups decimated by injuries.
Yeah, it's very, very odd.

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10-12-2012, 08:36 AM
  #254
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The play calling last night was too predictable. We ran the ball on first downs a lot. We threw a lot of swing passes. How many Ben did throw a deep pass last night? I think it's 2. Haley really needs to mix it up. I guess it's hard to do that when running game isn't working.

There is no one on defense that you can build around right now. Manti Te'o is a perfect guy you can build around. I read about him on SI last month. Just a great guy off the field. Very high character and great leadership.

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10-12-2012, 08:52 AM
  #255
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I have very little doubt that Te'o could provide to this defense what Patrick Wills provides to San Francisco's defense. And Te'o just screams Pittsburgh to me. He'd fit like a glove.


I've also been reading some draft stuff recently. Jake Matthews is a guy I'd be highly interested in. He's a RT out of A&M. Has started every game since his freshman year, though he's only a Jr. I could see him sticking around College Station for another year, as he still has some development to do, specifically in the weight gaining dept.

Oh, and if his name sounds familiar, his Dad made 14 Pro Bowls in 19 years as a player, and is the current offensive line coach for the Tennessee Titans. If Matthews stays, he'll probably be slotted as a top 15 pick for 2014. He currently has a 2nd-3rd round grade on him. I fully expect him to stay.

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10-12-2012, 09:19 AM
  #256
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This is how I want the draft to go, yes, I'm already talking about the draft. Considering we go 6-10 and pick between 11-13.

1. Manti Te'o (ILB)
2. John Simon (DE)
3. Matt Elam (S)
4. Desmond Trufant (CB)
5. defense
6. defense
7. defense
I would be ecstatic with a draft result like that, which probably means there's absolutely no chance of it happening.

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10-12-2012, 09:35 AM
  #257
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If we draft Te'o, Troy would be a perfect guy to mentor him even though they play different positions. They seem to have similar personalities. Both are also in same ethnic backgrounds.

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10-12-2012, 09:41 AM
  #258
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I would be ecstatic with a draft result like that, which probably means there's absolutely no chance of it happening.
So would I. Like you said, no chance most likely. This team really needs to switch to a 4-3 with a stand up DE. (Hypothetical lineup with Te'o and Simon being drafted)

Woodley-McClendon-Heyward-Simon

Worilds-Te'o-Timmons

Seems pretty good to me.

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10-12-2012, 09:43 AM
  #259
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So would I. Like you said, no chance most likely. This team really needs to switch to a 4-3 with a stand up DE. (Hypothetical lineup with Te'o and Simon being drafted)

Woodley-McClendon-Heyward-Simon

Worilds-Te'o-Timmons

Seems pretty good to me.
No Hood?

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10-12-2012, 09:46 AM
  #260
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Mine would probably be...

1. Te'o/Warmack
2. Amerson/Shawn Williams
3. Justin Pugh/Jake Matthews

If it came down to Warmack and Te'o, I'd have a hard time with that. I'd love to have a guy like Justin Pugh on our right side and get Gilbert the **** out of there. Pugh would also be a good insurance policy if Mike Adams doesn't develop. Jake Matthews, is way more likely to be a 3rd round pick than Pugh, but he is a project, and I expect him to be back in school.

Amerson is a ball hawking corner...Williams is a hard hitting safety.

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10-12-2012, 09:47 AM
  #261
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No Hood?
He really hasn't done anything. 8 tackles all year...

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10-12-2012, 09:50 AM
  #262
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He really hasn't done anything. 8 tackles all year...
He may have not done much but I rather spend a 2nd on an area that we are much weaker on. I'd rather pick up a CB that can play press well and put him next to Ike. We can't keep drafting corners in the 4th round because season after season they are just letdowns.

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10-12-2012, 09:53 AM
  #263
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He may have not done much but I rather spend a 2nd on an area that we are much weaker on. I'd rather pick up a CB that can play press well and put him next to Ike. We can't keep drafting corners in the 4th round because season after season they are just letdowns.
Almost all the corners this year are juniors and who knows which ones are staying and leaving for the draft. That's why I'm hesitant on putting a CB high on my list right now.

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10-12-2012, 09:58 AM
  #264
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Cole, thought you might enjoy this.


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10-12-2012, 10:24 AM
  #265
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Pathetic display.

Ike Taylor has been beyond pathetic. I've never thought Ike was as good as some here thought, but I'd gladly take Ike of the past over this piece of trash that we're seeing right now.

I have no idea why this team is so injury prone every single year. It doesn't seem like any other team has huge names in key positions fall like we do.

Ben Roethlisberger has been incredible, and Heath Miller has been just as good. I'd be shocked if Heath wasn't in the top 5 TE's in receiving this season. Speaking of wideouts, I'm beginning to question if I'd want to give Mike Wallace huge money. Sure, he's good for those 1 or 2 big plays a game, but 2 receptions tonight, 2 receptions last game. I think if someone offered a 1st rounder for him, I'd take it, and just retool this next draft as we'll probably be picking in the top half if this keeps up.

We need a running back. We obviously can't spend a 1st round pick on one, but we need a running back somewhere in the to part of the draft.
Absolutely. You deal him and pick up someone in the draft. If I had to guess right now Stedman Bailey will go pro and be a later pick. Perfect candidate.

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10-12-2012, 11:12 AM
  #266
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I would honestly contend that a corner is a fair amount more of a need than a safety. Troy and Clark are older and always banged up, but at least they are there. We have nothing at corner. And now that Ike sucks balls, we have less than nothing.

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10-12-2012, 11:54 AM
  #267
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The Todd Haley experiment is a clear failure.
Man, I love the day after Steelers losses.

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10-12-2012, 12:39 PM
  #268
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Man, I love the day after Steelers losses.
Try responding to the reasoning in my post. Haley is a hack and by some accounts a legitimate nut case who was brought in as a result of Art Rooney's Jerry Jones-like meddling. Meanwhile Bruce is off to a flying start to his head coaching career.

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10-12-2012, 12:42 PM
  #269
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I would honestly contend that a corner is a fair amount more of a need than a safety. Troy and Clark are older and always banged up, but at least they are there. We have nothing at corner. And now that Ike sucks balls, we have less than nothing.
In fact just the opposite. We actually have a stable of young corners in Lewis, Allen and Brown who look to be serviceable. Obviously another stud corner would be great to have, but the cubboard at safety is totally empty. Troy's not there, he's done as an impact player and maybe done period. Mundy stinks. They absolutely need a safety more than another corner.

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10-12-2012, 12:47 PM
  #270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dupree13 View Post
The Todd Haley experiment is a clear failure. The reason Art II got rid of Bruce was not because the offense was underachieving. It was strictly as a means of "reigning in" Ben to protect the franchise's investment. This was to be done by putting more emphasis on the run game and more designed quick passes.

Problem is that while keeping Ben healthy is a worthy goal, this method of doing it was never going to work. The tiger can't change his stripes. Ben is a playground player, that will never change. The reality is that Bruce's offense of giving Ben a lot of freedom and running the offense as an equal partner was the best system, however imperfect it was. Now with Haley we have the same thing with a lot more garbage plays mixed in.
How could you say our offense is a failure under Haley? I'll admit his Game 1 was a bit of a mess up,but he's been great. We've KILLED time of possession. We are killing it on third downs. We are killing it w/ Heath. His sets are working. Ben, actually, isn't being sacked too many times.

I really don't know how you could say that. I think Haley has been a success so far. Especially due to the injuries.

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10-12-2012, 12:49 PM
  #271
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It's a myth that this is one if the best managed franchises in sports. In reality, ever since Dan Rooney assumed his ambassadorship, this organization has been mismanaged into the ground by Art II. No time right now, but later or tomorrow, I will post my 11 point argument demonstrating the follies and fiascos that have occured directly from him or under his watch that have led this franchise to the bleak and sorry state that it finds itself in today.

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10-12-2012, 01:39 PM
  #272
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The Todd Haley experiment is a clear failure.

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10-12-2012, 01:52 PM
  #273
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It's a myth that this is one if the best managed franchises in sports. In reality, ever since Dan Rooney assumed his ambassadorship, this organization has been mismanaged into the ground by Art II. No time right now, but later or tomorrow, I will post my 11 point argument demonstrating the follies and fiascos that have occured directly from him or under his watch that have led this franchise to the bleak and sorry state that it finds itself in today.
I think Haley's done a solid job but do agree about Art doing a subtly poor job. Not anywhere close to a Jones/Snyder level but there has been a number of small things that have been hand-waved by media and fans since the Rooney family is still sort of seen as being Dan Rooney and people are under impression that Art II is the same exact guy.

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10-12-2012, 02:10 PM
  #274
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It's a myth that this is one if the best managed franchises in sports. In reality, ever since Dan Rooney assumed his ambassadorship, this organization has been mismanaged into the ground by Art II. No time right now, but later or tomorrow, I will post my 11 point argument demonstrating the follies and fiascos that have occured directly from him or under his watch that have led this franchise to the bleak and sorry state that it finds itself in today.
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I think Haley's done a solid job but do agree about Art doing a subtly poor job. Not anywhere close to a Jones/Snyder level but there has been a number of small things that have been hand-waved by media and fans since the Rooney family is still sort of seen as being Dan Rooney and people are under impression that Art II is the same exact guy.
Agree with this second sentiment (including the part about Haley's been OK). I think it's no secret and no accident the team got good when Dan assumed control of operations. Whether the family can sustain it remains to be seen.

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10-12-2012, 02:16 PM
  #275
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I've always blamed Colbert. I think the guy gets away with murder because he had 2 drafts (98, 2002). Our late round picks from the other years haven't been perfect. We've been great in the first round,but I really don't think we find all the depth we need.

And don't say other teams don't find depth either. We rely on drafts. We don't explore free agency.

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