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N. Kadri discussion thread v12

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Old
10-13-2012, 10:23 AM
  #76
Ricky Bobby
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
Thanks for re-posting. Yes I asked if we should move Grabo to make room for our prospects. The answer was an overwhelming "no". Kadri is considered our top prospect. No one on the board feels that Kadri is good enough to replace Grabo in the next 5 years. Based on this "vote of confidence" Kadri is considered by many to be behind in his development.

Where did you mention 5 years in the survey you refer to?

Your post asked about trading Grabo NOW so that we can tank. HF Posters didn't say that Kadri or Colborne won't ever be able to fill Grabo's spot at anytime in the next five years because that isn't the question that you asked.

The majority of HF Posters wrote that it's a bad idea to trade your best center to create room on your roster for unproven prospects in Kadri/Colborne. These same posters wrote that Connolly, Lombardi, CMac would be shown the door well before Grabo to create roster room to let prospects get ice time.

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10-13-2012, 10:28 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Ricky Bobby View Post
Where did you mention 5 years in the survey you refer to?

Your post asked about trading Grabo NOW so that we can tank. HF Posters didn't say that Kadri or Colborne won't ever be able to fill Grabo's spot at anytime in the next five years because that isn't the question that you asked.

The majority of HF Posters wrote that it's a bad idea to trade your best center to create room on your roster for unproven prospects in Kadri/Colborne. These same posters wrote that Connolly, Lombardi, CMac would be shown the door well before Grabo to create roster room to let prospects get ice time.
Grabo has signed to the leafs until 2017.

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10-13-2012, 10:29 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Ricky Bobby View Post
Where did you mention 5 years in the survey you refer to?

Your post asked about trading Grabo NOW so that we can tank. HF Posters didn't say that Kadri or Colborne won't ever be able to fill Grabo's spot at anytime in the next five years because that isn't the question that you asked.

The majority of HF Posters wrote that it's a bad idea to trade your best center to create room on your roster for unproven prospects in Kadri/Colborne. These same posters wrote that Connolly, Lombardi, CMac would be shown the door well before Grabo to create roster room to let prospects get ice time.

i didn't mention anything about tanking, but tanking seems to be the result with Grabo in the line-up.

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10-13-2012, 10:35 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
i didn't mention anything about tanking, but tanking seems to be the result with Grabo in the line-up.
it was also the result of a second overall with steven stamkos in the line up for the bolts.
rick nash with the jackets.
crosby with the penguins.
hall with the oilers.
rnh with the oilers as well.
Lecavalier with the bolts.
etc...

So...are we going to trade them now too?

It's not one person's blame to take, just like few games lost wasn't Jake Gardiner's fault either.

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10-13-2012, 10:37 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
Grabo has signed to the leafs until 2017.
Oh right, right. Forgot players couldn't be traded.

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10-13-2012, 10:48 AM
  #81
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Oh right, right. Forgot players couldn't be traded.
this is what i was suggesting in the first place!

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10-13-2012, 11:13 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
this is what i was suggesting in the first place!
No, you said either Grabovski gets traded STAT to make room for our prospects or we're stuck with him and Kadri won't be good enough to replace him for five seasons. In addition to being faulty reasoning, that's also a false dilemma; having Grabovski and developing our centre prospects are not two mutually exclusive events.

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10-13-2012, 11:15 AM
  #83
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No.

"This kid will be a star.." was ahead of reality.We always over hype our first rounders.With Reilly the new shiny toy,Kadri should be able to quietly develop with Aucoin on the Marlies.I think the kid can be a 50 pt. top 6 flashy guy if used properly,such as p.p but not equal strength unless we are behind.He will challenge MaCarthur soon.

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10-13-2012, 11:20 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by darrylsittler27 View Post
"This kid will be a star.." was ahead of reality.We always over hype our first rounders.With Reilly the new shiny toy,Kadri should be able to quietly develop with Aucoin on the Marlies.I think the kid can be a 50 pt. top 6 flashy guy if used properly,such as p.p but not equal strength unless we are behind.He will challenge MaCarthur soon.
Those are my expectations as well. Can't wait to see him at Ricoh today, I hope the media lit a fire under his ass with their usual sensationalism of stories (Kadri's bf%)

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Old
10-13-2012, 11:24 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Those are my expectations as well. Can't wait to see him at Ricoh today, I hope the media lit a fire under his ass with their usual sensationalism of stories (Kadri's bf%)
Well he was on fire on the pre-season game the goalie was the only reason he was shut out. So hopefully he racks up insane amount of points.

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10-13-2012, 11:28 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by darrylsittler27 View Post
"This kid will be a star.." was ahead of reality.We always over hype our first rounders.With Reilly the new shiny toy,Kadri should be able to quietly develop with Aucoin on the Marlies.I think the kid can be a 50 pt. top 6 flashy guy if used properly,such as p.p but not equal strength unless we are behind.He will challenge MaCarthur soon.
Yep. I wish people would learn from Kadri and temper their expectations of Reilly. If he develops into a top 4 PP guy with holes in his game that make him a detriment to top pairing and shut down details, so be it. Some are so excited like we were with Kadri that the "coming down" effect of the new shiny toy can equate to calling him a bust.

We didnt draft Tavares, Yakupov, or Hall. We got guys with obvious skill and extreme talent that also have areas of concern. Let them develop and take up to 5 years to be what they could be.

The truth is we don't have an NHL team that is worthy of much hype so all we can do is hope and argue about the future.

For the record, I think Kadri tops out as a 65 pt 2nd line center. That'd be great, IMO.

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10-13-2012, 11:44 AM
  #87
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Yep. I wish people would learn from Kadri and temper their expectations of Reilly. If he develops into a top 4 PP guy with holes in his game that make him a detriment to top pairing and shut down details, so be it. Some are so excited like we were with Kadri that the "coming down" effect of the new shiny toy can equate to calling him a bust.

We didnt draft Tavares, Yakupov, or Hall. We got guys with obvious skill and extreme talent that also have areas of concern. Let them develop and take up to 5 years to be what they could be.

The truth is we don't have an NHL team that is worthy of much hype so all we can do is hope and argue about the future.

For the record, I think Kadri tops out as a 65 pt 2nd line center. That'd be great, IMO.
Only 4-3 forward prospects after top four I believe have beaten the odds after being passed by several GMs. In Ryan O' Reilly, Marcus Johannson and Kyle Clifford of the top of my head.

As for the Defensemen I think Kullikov and OEL are the ones that have truly made impacts where we can be like wow.

So he is fine, he has skill that are god's gift if he fixes the other aspects of the game, he'll be just fine.

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10-13-2012, 12:01 PM
  #88
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He is exactly where he should be for someone selected in his range, if not slightly ahead.

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Old
10-13-2012, 12:38 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Leaf Rocket View Post
Well he was on fire on the pre-season game the goalie was the only reason he was shut out. So hopefully he racks up insane amount of points.
So are we looking for a Jason Spezza last lock-out performance? Spezza was a year younger though.

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10-13-2012, 12:39 PM
  #90
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So are we looking for a Jason Spezza last lock-out performance? Spezza was a year younger though.
Unfair to compare the two really. Spezza a freaking beast in the CHL and a phenom.

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10-13-2012, 02:50 PM
  #91
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No, you said either Grabovski gets traded STAT to make room for our prospects or we're stuck with him and Kadri won't be good enough to replace him for five seasons. In addition to being faulty reasoning, that's also a false dilemma; having Grabovski and developing our centre prospects are not two mutually exclusive events.
nope. until this moment (this post) i have never typed "STAT" in my life.

everyone is so deliberately black and white all the time. i never said "right now. it's got to happen right now!" that being said i actually think that fans really do think Grabs and Kadri are mutually exclusive. people panic when i mention Kadri. people panic when i mention Grabo. if Kadri was actually good, and fans didn't have a love affair with Grabo we wouldn't be saying such weak things as: "that's also a false dilemma; having Grabovski and developing our centre prospects are not two mutually exclusive events."

how could Bobby Ryan developing and some day playing 1C over Getz be a problem for Anaheim? how could anyone say that the two players are mutually exclusive? Ana might not be able to afford Getz' pay raise next season. the franchise will not feel forced to pay Getz big money knowing that they have Ryan signed until 2015. unlike Burke who's 2x2C prospects have shown zero promise, and was forced to pay Grabo more then Kessel

if Kadri's development wasn't so stunted we would have put him in the 2C spot and not overpay Grabo.



i just think fans are fans. they have their crushes despite how detrimental it is to an organization:

keep:

Lupul
Grabo
Kadri
Reimer
Gardiner
Reilly
Kessel
Bozak
Brown
Steckel
McClement (not even a single game as a leaf and i'm sure the fans will be angry about moving him)
Armstong
Komarov
Kuli

at all costs!!!!!


meanwhile we end up 25th place in the standings.

WTF?!

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Old
10-13-2012, 02:58 PM
  #92
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Kadri has the skill to be a 40 point guy in the NHL, but he isn't a good enough player that he'd ever get enough ice time to collect those 40 points. It's why he'll always be a minor league star. He's not going to be on the penalty kill, he's not good enough to be on the top line, if he's on your second line he'll put you at a severe disadvantage against all but the weakest teams, and he doesn't have the physical components to be worth using in the bottom 6. Where do you play him? If he had a better hockey IQ he's got the skills to probably be an elite scoring forward, but he doesn't. He's got a bit of stickhandling ability, whoop de do. He's basically a poor man's Nik Borschevski. (at best, if he figures it out)

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10-13-2012, 03:43 PM
  #93
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His development is fine, It's his attitude and discipline that worries me, especially his defensive abilities.

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10-13-2012, 03:48 PM
  #94
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It was a good move by management to sign Aucoin. Now that the lockout is on it gives Kadri a chance to play with a proven point producer on the top line to see if he can put up some big numbers

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10-13-2012, 03:54 PM
  #95
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It was a good move by management to sign Aucoin. Now that the lockout is on it gives Kadri a chance to play with a proven point producer on the top line to see if he can put up some big numbers
Agreed no lambo to fan on his sexy passes no crabb who couldn't finish the beautiful set ups. Kadri has skilled AHL talent so let's hope he thrives with him and along with ashton who has untapped offense in his game.

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10-13-2012, 03:58 PM
  #96
7even
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Originally Posted by darrylsittler27 View Post
"This kid will be a star.." was ahead of reality.We always over hype our first rounders.With Reilly the new shiny toy,Kadri should be able to quietly develop with Aucoin on the Marlies.I think the kid can be a 50 pt. top 6 flashy guy if used properly,such as p.p but not equal strength unless we are behind.He will challenge MaCarthur soon.
I think this is the first time I've ever agreed with you. My expectations as well.

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10-13-2012, 04:00 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
nope. until this moment (this post) i have never typed "STAT" in my life.

everyone is so deliberately black and white all the time. i never said "right now. it's got to happen right now!" that being said i actually think that fans really do think Grabs and Kadri are mutually exclusive. people panic when i mention Kadri. people panic when i mention Grabo. if Kadri was actually good, and fans didn't have a love affair with Grabo we wouldn't be saying such weak things as: "that's also a false dilemma; having Grabovski and developing our centre prospects are not two mutually exclusive events."

how could Bobby Ryan developing and some day playing 1C over Getz be a problem for Anaheim? how could anyone say that the two players are mutually exclusive? Ana might not be able to afford Getz' pay raise next season. the franchise will not feel forced to pay Getz big money knowing that they have Ryan signed until 2015. unlike Burke who's 2x2C prospects have shown zero promise, and was forced to pay Grabo more then Kessel

if Kadri's development wasn't so stunted we would have put him in the 2C spot and not overpay Grabo.



i just think fans are fans. they have their crushes despite how detrimental it is to an organization:

keep:

Lupul
Grabo
Kadri
Reimer
Gardiner
Reilly
Kessel
Bozak
Brown
Steckel
McClement (not even a single game as a leaf and i'm sure the fans will be angry about moving him)
Armstong
Komarov
Kuli

at all costs!!!!!


meanwhile we end up 25th place in the standings.

WTF?!
I want to apologize. I tried really hard, but I can't understand anything you're trying to say in this post.

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Old
10-13-2012, 04:50 PM
  #98
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He looks good enough to fool another scout. Trade him fast!!!!

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10-13-2012, 05:07 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
nope. until this moment (this post) i have never typed "STAT" in my life.

everyone is so deliberately black and white all the time. i never said "right now. it's got to happen right now!" that being said i actually think that fans really do think Grabs and Kadri are mutually exclusive. people panic when i mention Kadri. people panic when i mention Grabo. if Kadri was actually good, and fans didn't have a love affair with Grabo we wouldn't be saying such weak things as: "that's also a false dilemma; having Grabovski and developing our centre prospects are not two mutually exclusive events."
If you didn't mean "right now" then what was the point of your post. If Grabo wasn't traded right now or soon, how would it open up space for prospects. Were we supposed to debate the merits of trading Grabo 2.5 years from now?

Anyone would reasonably infer that's what you meant and I have no doubt that's what you intended to convey. Now, you're just back tracking.

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10-13-2012, 05:08 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Tyler McIntosh View Post
http://thehockeywriters.com/maplelea...s-development/

Not my article, just read it and thought I would post it for anyone interested...
He absolutely is.... no question about it.

OHL-drafted players generally take the shortest amount of time to reach the NHL, on par with guys from the WHL. Forwards also generally take less time than defencemen, who take less time than goaltenders.

With Kadri, you've got a guy who played three years in the OHL prior to being drafted, and was a top-of-the-lineup guy in 2 of those years. Most high picks only play 2 years, and only end up being a top-of-the-lineup guy in the 2nd year.

The fact that it's been 3 full years since being drafted and he hasn't found a permanent spot is terrible. Playing right after being drafted (like Skinner did) would've been exceeding reasonable expectations, although not as much as Skinner because Kadri had more professional experience. By 2010-2011, the reasonable expectation should've been for him to platoon between the Marlies and Leafs. Likely start his way with the Leafs, go down to the Marlies for a 15-20 game set mid year when he struggles, finish with the Leafs, and have a permanent spot where he's working his way up the lineup in 2011-12.

The fact that he didn't even finish the year with the Leafs, just goes to show you how far he's fallen behind.

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