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I'm Gonna Make You An Offer You Can't Refuse (CBA & Lockout Discussion) - Part VIII ‎

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:32 PM
  #76
Jedgi
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Stephen Whyno ‏@SWhyno
Judging from @JSportsnet's report of new #NHL CBA offer, owners dropped to 50-50 but asked for everything else they wanted.

4 year ELCs, 5 year contracts, arbitration would still exist...

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10-16-2012, 12:32 PM
  #77
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The only thing I could see the PA doing with this is countering with a 51/49 offer. I think 50/50 is the ballpark I expected it to end up in when this all started. I'm confident about this offer, I really hope they can get something done soon.

The only thing I could see being a bit of an issue is the proposed 82 game season. The season was supposed to start on the 11th, so that's a solid 3 weeks lost out of the schedule. There'll have to be some creative scheduling, there'll be some long weeks for a few teams I bet.

EDIT: Thinking more, 82 games=more HRR so disregard that.

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10-16-2012, 12:32 PM
  #78
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Concessions on contracts? As in they aren't going to get rid if the cap circumventing contacts or at least close the damn loophole?
Nope. And don't honestly expect to see this changed any time soon. The most realistic thing that could get changed would be ELC's to 4 years (because it's easier to toss someone under the bus who doesn't play yet).

As for the offer. PA will not accept it. Their reason will be they do not like the salary protection aspect (vs the PA asking for a 2% raise), and that they do not believe the issue actually corrects the problem the league is having (revenue disparity vs high player costs).

If the PA wants, it's something they could build off of... but to date they have not been willing to do so (see last NHL offer). There's no real reason to expect a different response today.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:33 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
you're... talking about the NHLPA, right?
You don't understand the far reaching consequences of an 82 game schedule in 82 games after a 1 week training camp with no preseason. This season is going to be whack and dangerous. Just shave off 8-10 games and also give the players and extra 5-6 days training.

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10-16-2012, 12:33 PM
  #80
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John Shannon ‏@JSportsnet

If the players take 50-50...offers on other keys issues as follows...

Free Agency would be at 28 and 8 years of service

Entry Level Contracts would be 4 years in Length

Revenue sharing would be at or near 200 million dollars

Contract Lengths would be 5 years.

Arbitration would still exist

The only core issue that remains intact from previous NHL offers is the length on contracts (on all new deals)

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10-16-2012, 12:34 PM
  #81
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I like this offer from the NHL. I think the PA has to accept it to save face. Think they could shorten the season by 6-8 games though.
That might not be a bad idea. 82 games from the start of November is too much.

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10-16-2012, 12:34 PM
  #82
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I don't see the NHLPA accepting the offer outright, but hopefully they can tinker with it only slightly.

EDIT: Never mind. If the NHL wants concessions on all the other points, I don't see the NHLPA tinkering "slightly."

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10-16-2012, 12:34 PM
  #83
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woo look at em owners making concessions. I'm excited to read about how the PA is pissed and Fehr thinks this is a scorched tree offer or something...

I expect them to ask for a few things on the PA side, but this appears to be a monumental step at the moment.

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10-16-2012, 12:36 PM
  #84
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Might be getting too far ahead of things here, but if the NHLPA comes back with a 51-49 deal, will the NHL accept it or tell them to f off?

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10-16-2012, 12:36 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
82 games crammed into 5 months was my biggest fear. This season is going to be such a cluster ****, tons of injuries, tons of back to backs. The greed continues.
I don't see why this would be a problem...for fans at least. I'd love to watch Flyers hockey every day.

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10-16-2012, 12:36 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
82 games crammed into 5 months was my biggest fear. This season is going to be such a cluster ****, tons of injuries, tons of back to backs. The greed continues.
Might sound harsh but **** the players. 82 games means less boredom. I could really care less about the injuries. I want to see ahl players anyways.

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10-16-2012, 12:36 PM
  #87
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Nope. And don't honestly expect to see this changed any time soon. The most realistic thing that could get changed would be ELC's to 4 years (because it's easier to toss someone under the bus who doesn't play yet).

As for the offer. PA will not accept it. Their reason will be they do not like the salary protection aspect (vs the PA asking for a 2% raise), and that they do not believe the issue actually corrects the problem the league is having (revenue disparity vs high player costs).

If the PA wants, it's something they could build off of... but to date they have not been willing to do so (see last NHL offer). There's no real reason to expect a different response today.
I agree that this deal doesn't address the fundamental issues of why some teams are struggling. The Leafs and rangers don't need salary relief. IF I was the PA i would coutner with a 50-50 but the 7% of HRR that was roll backed all goes into revenue sharing. An extra $230 million ontop of what's already there.

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10-16-2012, 12:37 PM
  #88
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This is pure speculation on my part but I can see the NHLPA rejecting this one, and counter-proposing with something along the lines of 53/47 Year 1, 50/50 Years 2-7, with provisions for more meaningful revenue sharing. This gives them the soft landing they want (assuming league continues to grow at rates the NHLPA used for their proposal) and ensures the monies saved by the owners go towards the health of the small market teams.

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10-16-2012, 12:37 PM
  #89
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82 games is completely doable. Eliminate the all star break, and extend the season a week and you're just fitting one weeks worth of games into the rest of the season.

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10-16-2012, 12:38 PM
  #90
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Honestly,if it was anyone but Fehr as head of the NHLPA,I would have much more faith in this offer getting accepted by the NHLPA.

I don't like Fehr, but without him in charge I don't think the NHLPA even gets this offer. Now he might over extend himself here, but I think the reason the NHL broke from its original position of waiting until he came back has to point to how strong they think he is at negotiations and an admission of how they view him as an opponent.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:38 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YWG View Post
John Shannon ‏@JSportsnet

If the players take 50-50...offers on other keys issues as follows...

Free Agency would be at 28 and 8 years of service

Entry Level Contracts would be 4 years in Length

Revenue sharing would be at or near 200 million dollars

Contract Lengths would be 5 years.

Arbitration would still exist

The only core issue that remains intact from previous NHL offers is the length on contracts (on all new deals)
The owners care about the 50-50 clause . The rest is there so that the PA can counter rather than immediately capitulating.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:38 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noob616 View Post
The only thing I could see the PA doing with this is countering with a 51/49 offer. I think 50/50 is the ballpark I expected it to end up in when this all started. I'm confident about this offer, I really hope they can get something done soon.
The PA hasn't countered with ANY % at any time during these negotiations. To think they'll change their tune now is a fantasy.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YWG View Post
John Shannon ‏@JSportsnet

If the players take 50-50...offers on other keys issues as follows...

Free Agency would be at 28 and 8 years of service

Entry Level Contracts would be 4 years in Length

Revenue sharing would be at or near 200 million dollars

Contract Lengths would be 5 years.


Arbitration would still exist

The only core issue that remains intact from previous NHL offers is the length on contracts (on all new deals)
PA won't like this but it CAN be negotiated

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
82 games crammed into 5 months was my biggest fear. This season is going to be such a cluster ****, tons of injuries, tons of back to backs. The greed continues.

Greed is on both sides, dont kid yourself. The 82 games is to make sure that the owners get full revenues but also to make sure that the players get thier full contracts too.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #95
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So if players share drops from 57% to 50%, does that mean the salary cap will immediately drop by 12.3%? In other words, cap was $70M, representing 57% of revenue (meaning revenue was $123M). If salaries are limited to 50%, wouldn't cap drop to $62M?

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10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #96
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Players aren't accepting that with the 5 year contract length and the age for free agency. This is hopeless. This was a good offer from the league but it won't go through and there will be no season.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
Might sound harsh but **** the players. 82 games means less boredom. I could really care less about the injuries. I want to see ahl players anyways.
Yeah, players owe it to us to give us 82 games, I want to see hockey, and I want to see the most that I can. This will also give AHL players a chance to shine.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:39 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
I don't like Fehr, but without him in charge I don't think the NHLPA even gets this offer. Now he might over extend himself here, but I think the reason the NHL broke from its original position of waiting until he came back has to point to how strong they think he is at negotiations and an admission of how they view him as an opponent.
I also think the owners are scared of losing fans permanently. Especially in a league where gate revenue is so important because they don't have a big TV deal.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:40 PM
  #99
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At the very least, it's a much better starting point.

I'd think, factoring in another couple days of meetings, and fitting in some sort of camps, it'll be a 65-game season at best.

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Old
10-16-2012, 12:40 PM
  #100
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I for one do not want a 82 game season. People are gonna be dead.

Any news on how the teams will be aligned in this CBA? There is no way the owners would forget to address that.

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