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2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part IV (UPDATE: "The Union took a step backward")

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10-16-2012, 01:24 PM
  #226
Ola
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
They'd almost certainly have to allow amnesty buyouts if that's the case. Perhaps more than one per team. I doubt that'll fly with the players though.
How many other well prized players are there in the AHL besides Redden???

Wouldn't be suprised if we get Redden on the books when everything is said and done, but Philly gets away from Pronger lol.

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10-16-2012, 01:24 PM
  #227
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This HAS to get done now. 50/50 is a great start now just iron out the minor details and play some hockey already

Also yea Redden will be bought out. Actually a ton of guys all over the league will be . They should allow a one time buyout period thats not on the cap.

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10-16-2012, 01:26 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Why? Isn't that a huge win for the players?
Or is it the exact opposite???

How much is a the pay-roll for a AHL team? I mean, if its 10m the NHL team gets 10m less to spend. Or?

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10-16-2012, 01:26 PM
  #229
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
How many other well prized players are there in the AHL besides Redden???

Wouldn't be suprised if we get Redden on the books when everything is said and done, but Philly gets away from Pronger lol.
I can't imagine any scenario where the Rangers can't get rid of Redden but the Flyers can ditch Pronger, but stranger things have happened.

I imagine Redden would definitely be the Rangers buyout choice and then they'd have to tweak their roster a bit to fit in a new contract for Del Zotto. Sauer being on LTIR will probably help with that though

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10-16-2012, 01:26 PM
  #230
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Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBobMcKenzie

My take: Too early to say how NHLPA will react to NHL offer but I suspect we're in for 7 to 10 days of really intense bargaining sessions.

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10-16-2012, 01:27 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
Not sure exactly how it would work...but 57% to 50% is a 12.2% drop.

A 12.2% reduction in the $70.2M cap is $61.6M.
I thought I read a post stating 50% of the revenue would be ~1.73B. Dividing that by 30 teams got me the 57.7M figure for the cap.

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10-16-2012, 01:28 PM
  #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Or is it the exact opposite???

How much is a the pay-roll for a AHL team? I mean, if its 10m the NHL team gets 10m less to spend. Or?
Yeah, I thought he was referring to amnesty buy-outs, not carrying AHL contracts on the cap.

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10-16-2012, 01:28 PM
  #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I'm still piecing together all of the tweets, but this looks pretty damn significant on the part of the NHL.
The Frank Luntz fiasco blew this one up. The owners knew they had to act, and make a significant offer so they weren't totally demonized.

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10-16-2012, 01:32 PM
  #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KreiMeARiver View Post
Frank Luntz blew this one up. The owners knew they had to act, and make a significant offer so they weren't totally demonized.
And it was cleverly worded. What exactly constitutes "hockey-related"?

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10-16-2012, 01:32 PM
  #235
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“@walsha: Don Fehr: ''Would like to believe after we are done [with review], that it's an excellent starting point and there's a deal to be made.''”

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10-16-2012, 01:35 PM
  #236
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In my haste,may have noted 4 years for entry level. Told that I am wrong with that number..it appears to be remaining at 3 years
https://twitter.com/JSportsnet/statu...74777523949568

So the entry level system and arbitration remains intact according to the NHL offer.

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10-16-2012, 01:35 PM
  #237
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@JSportsnet: In my haste,may have noted 4 years for entry level. Told that I am wrong with that number..it appears to be remaining at 3 years

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10-16-2012, 01:36 PM
  #238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRangers88 View Post
Redden can/will be bought out.
What do I know, but I never really understood the beauty of a amnesty buyout. Like why should one be expected?

We can trade Redden, just like NJD could trade Malakhov... My point is just, it is not a must. Last time around, a whole bunch of teams had to cut a hole lot of money. At like 62-64m, few teams are even in that much trouble. Nobody will feel bad for a team that spent up to 70m this summer -- Brooks wrote in February or something that teams would have to spend wisely this summer.

From the owners point of view, why have a amnesty buyout? How many of the owners are in favor of it? 4-5?

If you are the players, why put it on the table and give the owners leverege in the negotiations? How many would by bought out? 10-15 guys? Who do they save to get it? I recon its "free money" for their memembers, that counts twice (if a player with a 6m contract is bought out, that player gets like 4m and the team can spend 6m on another player), but still. That's nothing compared to if they have to give in in another area...

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10-16-2012, 01:38 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
@JSportsnet: In my haste,may have noted 4 years for entry level. Told that I am wrong with that number..it appears to be remaining at 3 years
Bummer.

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10-16-2012, 01:39 PM
  #240
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Quote:
Another interesting tidbit from NHL offer... Players' Salaries for those NHLers playing in the AHL would be part of the cap.
https://twitter.com/JSportsnet/statu...65823557328896

The PA fought against this last time.

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10-16-2012, 01:39 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by BroadwayBlues View Post
Bummer.
Meh. The extra year to UFA is a bigger deal in terms of keeping good talent longer. Longer ELCs could actually incentivize European players to stay home and get paid in the SEL/KHL.

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10-16-2012, 01:40 PM
  #242
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On the question of Redden's status in the organization--I know we owe him two more years. That being said he's not on the Connecticut AHL roster--is he injured?--other injured players like Bourque, Hrivik, McIlrath etc. are on the official roster. Is it the one way contract? and he can't be sent down yet ?

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10-16-2012, 01:40 PM
  #243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
From the owners point of view, why have a amnesty buyout? How many of the owners are in favor of it? 4-5?
The only selling point I can see is that it is an inter-owner piece, a concession to some of the big market teams who are going to have to pony up a lot more in revenue sharing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
If you are the players, why put it on the table and give the owners leverege in the negotiations? How many would by bought out? 10-15 guys?
I agree that it does not have a broad impact on the players, but how much leverage are they really shifting with this one piece?

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10-16-2012, 01:41 PM
  #244
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Chris Botta ‏@ChrisBottaNHL

The tweet that changed 1,000 blog posts RT @JSportsnet Noted 4 years for entry level. Told I am wrong. Remaining at 3 years.

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Old
10-16-2012, 01:42 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
MLB players don't share rooms. All players have single rooms. They share hotel rooms in the minor leagues. Some players(cough,cough AROD)gets a suite. NBA players get their own rooms.
I can confirm this.

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10-16-2012, 01:42 PM
  #246
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
On the question of Redden's status in the organization--I know we owe him two more years. That being said he's not on the Connecticut AHL roster--is he injured?--other injured players like Bourque, Hrivik, McIlrath etc. are on the official roster. Is it the one way contract? and he can't be sent down yet ?
They didn't send him to the AHL so he can't play there. They didn't want him getting injured and have to pay his salary while there's a lockout

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10-16-2012, 01:42 PM
  #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
On the question of Redden's status in the organization--I know we owe him two more years. That being said he's not on the Connecticut AHL roster--is he injured?--other injured players like Bourque, Hrivik, McIlrath etc. are on the official roster. Is it the one way contract? and he can't be sent down yet ?
I think he technically was not "sent down" for this year. I don't know how it was done specifically, but basically the Rangers didn't want him to play and risk injury, because if he's injured he can't be bought out.

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10-16-2012, 01:47 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by NyRangers2047 View Post
I agree with a few of the posters above if the NHLPA just throws this out right away we as fans may lose the season.... however if they just tweek somethings they maybe able to get this agreed on and start playing.
Its professionals negotiating with other professionals.

Its unprofessional for these guys not to be able to work something out against the background of this offer.

Like, we have two options at hand. 1. The NHL puts this offer on the table and won't back away one inch from it. 2. The NHL put this offer on the table fully aware that the PA will counter with something inbetween with the result that the parties meet somewhere in the middle. While the NHL possibly intending to at least not give up that much.

If the NHL puts itself in position 1. its just amaturish.

We have only heard the NHL's propagande on this offer so far, the NHLPA will probably note a few sour pts for them that makes this offer seem worse than it is. Then the PA will counter and with hopefully a decent offer and the two parties can take out an pen and with a few strikes take away the diffrences.

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10-16-2012, 01:47 PM
  #249
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If entry level remains at 3 years for players 18-21 and arbitration remains the same,teams will still be looking to tie up their players coming off ELCs for long term dollars. Regardless of group III being moved back 1 year. The NHL offered 8 years and 28. Its now 7 or 27. The PA won't accept 8 and 28. Even if contracts are capped at 7 years(NHL wants 5),you will still have teams tying up their players to 7 year extensions coming off entry level for big dollars because arbitration is expensive.

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10-16-2012, 01:48 PM
  #250
Ola
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Who are "NHLers in the AHL"?

Players on 1-way contracts?

Anyone know how much money they account for combined? Is it 15 or 30 or 60 m?

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