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All Purpose Luongo Trade Discussion (New news) MOD WARNING IN OP

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Old
10-18-2012, 12:02 AM
  #26
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I think with the addition of Rielly,I would think Gardiner becomes a little expendable, I don't see him as untouchable as he was before the draft.
I don't think so. Gardiner is still more valuable then Rielly until Rielly plays in the NHL IMO. Wouldn't trade either but the addition of Rielly doesn't make Gardiner trade bait. It makes Gunnarson expandable if anything

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10-18-2012, 12:02 AM
  #27
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Canuck fans are crazy if they think they're getting a legit top player back like Lupul or Gardiner.

It would most likely be MacArthur+Franson for Lu.

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10-18-2012, 12:04 AM
  #28
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Canuck fans are crazy if they think they're getting a legit top player back like Lupul or Gardiner.

It would most likely be MacArthur+Franson for Lu.
MacArthur isn't a legit player ?

also the leafs are acquiring a top goalie, who's contract doesn't look as bad anymore, it won't be a soft deal anymore IMO

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10-18-2012, 12:05 AM
  #29
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I don't like getting ripped off in trades for the sake of cap space.
I highly doubt Leaf fans would agree the canucks are getting 'ripped off'. Gunnarsson isn't flashy but his contract status, age and performance make him an attractive commodity. Kulemin as well for the same reasons.

The West isn't about running and gunning and playing exciting hockey like it was 2-3 years ago. Being able to win battles, clog up the middle of the ice and grind out wins seems to be the way the league is heading. If we're moving back into another dead puck era, adding a couple big, strong, defensive minded players to the mix could go a long way. These are the type of players you need to beat the Kings, Blues etc. at their own game...

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10-18-2012, 12:06 AM
  #30
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I don't think so. Gardiner is still more valuable then Rielly until Rielly plays in the NHL IMO. Wouldn't trade either but the addition of Rielly doesn't make Gardiner trade bait. It makes Gunnarson expandable if anything
Gardiner and Rielly are both young offensive minded defensemen. Gunnarsson is about the only defensive one on the Leafs unless you count Komisarek.

I don't think he will be traded, but I don't think Gardiner is out of the question, either, simply due to the depth of offensive defensemen the Leafs have.

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10-18-2012, 12:07 AM
  #31
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MacArthur isn't a legit player ?

also the leafs are acquiring a top goalie, who's contract doesn't look as bad anymore, it won't be a soft deal anymore IMO
The contract looks no different to the Leafs whatsoever though. It looks worse for Vancouver, but has no impact on the Leafs. Luongo could just have easily retired without the new development for the potential CBA. In that situation, the Leafs, nor the Canucks, are on the hook for the rest of the term. In this situation, its the same for the Leafs. The only difference is Vancouver can/would be on the hook for the remaining term of Lu's deal should he retire.

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10-18-2012, 12:07 AM
  #32
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as a sens fan, this scares me.

short of giving up kessel, i cant imagine a luongo trade that isnt a win for the leafs in the short term.

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10-18-2012, 12:08 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
I highly doubt Leaf fans would agree the canucks are getting 'ripped off'. Gunnarsson isn't flashy but his contract status, age and performance make him an attractive commodity. Kulemin as well for the same reasons.

The West isn't about running and gunning and playing exciting hockey like it was 2-3 years ago. Being able to win battles, clog up the middle of the ice and grind out wins seems to be the way the league is heading. If we're moving back into another dead puck era, adding a couple big, strong, defensive minded players to the mix could go a long way. These are the type of players you need to beat the Kings, Blues etc. at their own game...
Jack-of-all trades, master at none. We can't go changing the entire team identity. We've already gotten tougher through the draft and Hodgson trade. We can't eliminate skill/scoring altogether.

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10-18-2012, 12:08 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Gardiner and Rielly are both young offensive minded defensemen. Gunnarsson is about the only defensive one on the Leafs unless you count Komisarek.

I don't think he will be traded, but I don't think Gardiner is out of the question, either, simply due to the depth of offensive defensemen the Leafs have.
Gardiner is more a TWD, same with Gunnarson. Neither hit and its not like Gunnarson is so positionally sound that it makes him an elite shut down guy. Gardiner is completely off the table. If he wasn't getting traded for Nash he won't for Lu.

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10-18-2012, 12:08 AM
  #35
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Friedman also had an article up on Wednesday with a sub-section titled "Luongo Less Attractive?"
What could possibly have lowered Luongo's value that came out yesterday?

Seems like Friedman didn't understand the stipulation that it's the Canucks that would be on the hook for Luongo's cap hit if he retires.

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10-18-2012, 12:09 AM
  #36
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I don't like getting ripped off in trades for the sake of cap space.

Nobody but DTS does...

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10-18-2012, 12:12 AM
  #37
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The contract looks no different to the Leafs whatsoever though. It looks worse for Vancouver, but has no impact on the Leafs. Luongo could just have easily retired without the new development for the potential CBA. In that situation, the Leafs, nor the Canucks, are on the hook for the rest of the term. In this situation, its the same for the Leafs. The only difference is Vancouver can/would be on the hook for the remaining term of Lu's deal should he retire.
I guess in some ways your right. But I imagine Luongo might retire on top instead of playing out his contract now, knowing Vancouver is due to pay him... Unless Van is only responsible for cap, in which case I don't see how this whole article is breaking news at all.

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10-18-2012, 12:12 AM
  #38
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After what came out yesterday in regards to the original team being on the hook... (IF it even comes true)

The Canucks lose, likely want more in a deal for Luongo

The Leafs/Any Team acquiring Luongo have no rise or decrease when they look at Lu's value. It means NOTHING to them.

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10-18-2012, 12:13 AM
  #39
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Maclean didn't say that Luongo would be cheaper, he said that Brian Burke would make a huge push for him and try to get him for less then asking price.

If Vancouver is willing to give up Lou for less than market value, which I doubt, then toronto will acquire him.

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10-18-2012, 12:13 AM
  #40
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I guess in some ways your right. But I imagine Luongo might retire on top instead of playing out his contract now, knowing Vancouver is due to pay him... Unless Van is only responsible for cap, in which case I don't see how this whole article is breaking news at all.
If he retires they are responsible for the cap, but not the salary remaining. Just to clarify. Or else, any player could just say I'd rather make money and not play, and just retire. Its bad for the Canucks, but does nothing for any other team involved.

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10-18-2012, 12:14 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Jack-of-all trades, master at none. We can't go changing the entire team identity. We've already gotten tougher through the draft and Hodgson trade. We can't eliminate skill/scoring altogether.
Kulemin has averaged 15 even strength goals a year his first 4 years in the league. Adding hom absolutely dos not 'eliminate skill/scoring. He just happens to bring the size and defensive game that is so valuable in the West.

Gunnarsson wouldn't do anything for the offense but allows the team to save $3mil in the #5 slot on defense, while also upgrading the position as well IMO. That's very attractive for a team up against the cap. Gunnarsson being a RFA at years end that won't put up the offensive numbers to justify a big raise is also a bonus. Perfect guy to anchor a bottom pairing longterm IMO - cheap, reliable and able to move into the top 4 when injuries hit.

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10-18-2012, 12:15 AM
  #42
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You'd be surprised at the number of fans who said the reason Luongo's value is low is because the CBA would make long term contract players' cap hits count when they're retired.(which essentially happened but not to a team that trades for them).

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10-18-2012, 12:15 AM
  #43
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God I hope Lupul goes to Vancouver.

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10-18-2012, 12:17 AM
  #44
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God I hope Lupul goes to Vancouver.
Don't hold your breath

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10-18-2012, 12:17 AM
  #45
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Kulemin has averaged 15 even strength goals a year his first 4 years in the league. Adding hom absolutely dos not 'eliminate skill/scoring. He just happens to bring the size and defensive game that is so valuable in the West.

Gunnarsson wouldn't do anything for the offense but allows the team to save $3mil in the #5 slot on defense, while also upgrading the position as well IMO. That's very attractive for a team up against the cap. Gunnarsson being a RFA at years end that won't put up the offensive numbers to justify a big raise is also a bonus. Perfect guy to anchor a bottom pairing longterm IMO - cheap, reliable and able to move into the top 4 when injuries hit.
They're decent players, but frankly Raymond for Kulemin is not that far off, and the difference between them is a lot less than that between Luongo and Gunnarsson. It's a worst case scenario deal that I might expect if everything went wrong in the new CBA.

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10-18-2012, 12:17 AM
  #46
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You'd be surprised at the number of fans who said the reason Luongo's value is low is because the CBA would make long term contract players' cap hits count when they're retired.(which essentially happened but not to a team that trades for them).
It doesn't lower his value at all. But, it doesn't increase it either. It may increase the asking price... But, it doesn't increase what a team is willing to give up.

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10-18-2012, 12:18 AM
  #47
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God I hope Lupul goes to Vancouver.
The Sharks couldn't stop Vancouver's offense without Lupul. Not sure why that would be a good thing for opposing teams...

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10-18-2012, 12:19 AM
  #48
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It doesn't lower his value at all. But, it doesn't increase it either. It may increase the asking price... But, it doesn't increase what a team is willing to give up.
What about the part where teams can eat money on players they're trading?

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10-18-2012, 12:21 AM
  #49
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They're decent players, but frankly Raymond for Kulemin is not that far off, and the difference between them is a lot less than that between Luongo and Gunnarsson. It's a worst case scenario deal that I might expect if everything went wrong in the new CBA.
Then take Raymond out. If he holds any value around the league move him in a separate deal.

Personally, I don't want Raymond on the team next year. He's not worthless, he's just a poor fit on any of the Canucks top 3 lines IMO.

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10-18-2012, 12:21 AM
  #50
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What about the part where teams can eat money on players they're trading?
Vancouver definitely won't "eat" any of the money/cap. It would just make it highway robbery for the leafs or whoever goes for him

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