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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

St. Louis - Calgary

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Old
10-18-2012, 09:36 PM
  #26
kimzey59
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As a Blues fan; I'd do this. IMO it solves a lot of the Blues current problems(top pairing D man) and keeps us from putting players into positions that I don't believe they can handle(Steen won't do well at center IMO and Cole scares the **** out of me as Pietrangelo's partner). McDonald may be our best offensive forward, but he's currently projected to start on the 3rd line. I have no problem trading a 3rd line forward(even if he does score at a 60+ point pace) for a legit top pairing D man and natural 3rd line center. It's time for our younger forwards(Perron, Stewart, Berglund) to take over the offensive burden of the team.

The problem is those pesky NTC/NMC's that McDonald and Bouwmeester have.

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Old
10-18-2012, 09:37 PM
  #27
SmellOfVictory
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deen View Post
To St Louis : Jay Bouwmeester + Backlund

To Calgary: Ty Rattie + Andy McDonald

Flames want Rattie in the worst way to play with Baertschi. Blues get someone to log huge minutes and give the Blues Defensive line some diversity. Backlund fills the C void that McDonald would leave and St. Louis gets a young asset back.
No, we're really okay with not having Rattie, thanks.

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Old
10-18-2012, 09:39 PM
  #28
h22prelude93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilspuppet666 View Post
really?.... does it matter that much to you???? its the internet... not some grammar test
Well if you want people to take you serious of your knowledge of a certain player it usually helps to at least spell his name right. BTW there's a player in the NHL named Andy MacDonald, but he definitely does not play for the Blues.

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Old
10-18-2012, 09:39 PM
  #29
bleedblue1223
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I love how the Calgary fanbase is split on the extremes with Rattie.

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Old
10-18-2012, 09:59 PM
  #30
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JBo is a #2 defense in a 1st pairing. Backlund we have no idea what he will be but IMO I figure a 2/3 center that is defensively responsible.

McDonald is an often injured LW ( the Flames are loaded @ LW) & Sven seems to be doing quite well without Rattie while playing in the AHL.

The Flames would lose the proposed trade.

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Old
10-18-2012, 10:05 PM
  #31
Noori
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Rattie isn't exactly tearing it up. 12 points in 10 games a 19 year old junior? The Flames had three prospects in the Dub last year who far out produced what Rattie has done so far (Holland -traded-, Ferland, and Reinhart). Rattie is a pretty overrated prospect and not nearly as good without Sven.

McDonald is interesting, but risky. With one year on his contract, the whole negotiation thing would have to play out first.

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Old
10-18-2012, 10:12 PM
  #32
bleedblue1223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noori View Post
Rattie isn't exactly tearing it up. 12 points in 10 games a 19 year old junior? The Flames had three prospects in the Dub last year who far out produced what Rattie has done so far (Holland -traded-, Ferland, and Reinhart). Rattie is a pretty overrated prospect and not nearly as good without Sven.
Rattie had a slow start to the season, but in October he has 11 points and 7 goals in 6 games. You know what's even better than that, his point per game average was better with out Sven last season, but yeah he totally can't play without Sven.

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Old
10-18-2012, 10:19 PM
  #33
Oberyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noori View Post
Rattie isn't exactly tearing it up. 12 points in 10 games a 19 year old junior? The Flames had three prospects in the Dub last year who far out produced what Rattie has done so far (Holland -traded-, Ferland, and Reinhart). Rattie is a pretty overrated prospect and not nearly as good without Sven.

McDonald is interesting, but risky. With one year on his contract, the whole negotiation thing would have to play out first.
Far out produced what Rattie has done so far?

Last season:

Rattie: 69GP 57-64-121
Holland: 72GP 25-84-109
Ferland: 68GP 47-49-96
Reinhart: 61GP 28-50-78

Rattie has the highest PPG by far, and this was when all 3 of them were one year older than Rattie.

It's only 10 games into the season, pretty small sample size to be making claims like that. Schiefele has 13 points in 10 games, Strome has 14 points in 11 games, Ryan Murphy has a whopping 1 point in 8 games, yet these guys are all top prospects.

Maybe wait until we're 30 games into the season before we start judging players.

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Old
10-18-2012, 11:25 PM
  #34
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Flames want Rattie in the worst way? This is news to me.

Some fans might ... but only because they overrate Junior chemistry.

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Old
10-18-2012, 11:29 PM
  #35
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Big no from the Blues, don't need a bad contract like that while giving up our best offensive forward and prospect.

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Old
10-18-2012, 11:44 PM
  #36
Devilspuppet666
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h22prelude93 View Post
Well if you want people to take you serious of your knowledge of a certain player it usually helps to at least spell his name right. BTW there's a player in the NHL named Andy MacDonald, but he definitely does not play for the Blues.
typos never happen.... good to know

and thats not completely true... someone who has watched him but spell's his name wrong could most likely will know more than someone who has never seen him and can spell his name

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Old
10-19-2012, 12:40 AM
  #37
Dr Danglefest
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Not what the blues would want at all. You might be able to eat rattie but not andy Mac.

Rattie + ? for Backlund + Howse

Idk not saying that trade does anything to improve anyone, just trying to work with what was there

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Old
10-19-2012, 12:58 AM
  #38
SmellOfVictory
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I love how the Calgary fanbase is split on the extremes with Rattie.
No offense to the kid, he could end up being a solid NHLer. There is a strong contingent of Flames fans who put way too much stock into 'chemistry' (in Junior, of all things), though.

I see the original proposal as: confirmed young above average 3rd line C (possible top 6 C) + mid-aged top pairing defenceman for ageing top 6 C + potential 2nd line winger. The value just doesn't look good to me at all. Especially because I don't have a ton of faith in Rattie's transitionability to the NHL.

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Old
10-19-2012, 03:37 AM
  #39
EastonBlues22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilspuppet666 View Post
typos never happen.... good to know

and thats not completely true... someone who has watched him but spell's his name wrong could most likely will know more than someone who has never seen him and can spell his name
I can vouch that PavelDatsyuk is an informed poster. One might not agree with him, but he's not someone who spews uninformed opinions.

On this particular deal, I don't think his take is that far off. I'm not a huge fan of Bouwmeester personally, but his skill set would fit in well here and adequately address by far the Blues biggest need. The salary is what stings more than anything else.

I'm pretty "meh" on Backlund. There's still room for growth there, but I don't think bringing him aboard upgrades the team in any significant way over their current plan.

I agree with PD that McDonald requires some support from his linemates defensively, but I think he under-states McDonald's importance offensively. IMO, McDonald drives the play forward in transition better and faster than any other Blues forward. He's also the Blues biggest scoring threat off the rush. His presence on the ice applies pressure to the other team's defense in ways that no other Blues forward can, which is a valuable strategic tool. The Blues are simply a more dynamic team with him in the lineup.

Beyond that, McDonald's presence on the PP half-wall is also a huge key for our PP's success. His patience/puck skills and ability to penetrate the middle of the ice, get the puck to the net, and accurately distribute the puck demand respect. When teams overplay the points to take away Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk, McDonald exploits the openings in the defense with aplomb. When he's overplayed in turn, he's able to move the puck to the open man or get it on net while opening lanes for others to exploit. The Blues PP is much, much easier to defend without him on the ice.

Adding Bouwmeester to the current Blues team makes them significantly better, but I think losing McDonald in the process basically undoes most of the good that might otherwise be done. Unfortunately, moving McDonald in the process is probably the only way the finances have have even the slimmest prayer of working out.

I wouldn't do the deal personally, at least before I had a chance to see how the defensive pairings played with Cole in the top 6 and how the McDonald-Steen-Tarasenko 3rd line performed. I could easily change my mind 20 games into the season.

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Old
10-19-2012, 08:47 AM
  #40
SheasRebellion6
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Jbo for Rattie + salary dump + 2nd (most likely going to be a low 2nd)?

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Old
10-19-2012, 08:57 AM
  #41
HANDZ 57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheasRebellion6 View Post
Jbo for Rattie + salary dump + 2nd (most likely going to be a low 2nd)?
Blues don't really have any salary dumps though. Maybe if cash could still be traded, we'd take 4 mil or so back to make it work...

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Old
10-19-2012, 08:59 AM
  #42
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JayBo for Rattie and Cole...done

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:08 AM
  #43
bleedblue1223
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We don't want Jaybo...

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:10 AM
  #44
h22prelude93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastonBlues22 View Post
I can vouch that PavelDatsyuk is an informed poster. One might not agree with him, but he's not someone who spews uninformed opinions.
Look I didn't mean to paint him as an "uninformed" poster. If that's the way it came off then I apologize. I wasn't trying to be the grammar police either...In this instance, it just makes sense to me to differentiate when there is another pro player out there with an almost identical name. That's all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastonBlues22 View Post
I agree with PD that McDonald requires some support from his linemates defensively
I would agree that he was a bit of a defensive liability while playing centre, but it seems ever since he's been playing wing his defense has improved significantly. I think this is also evident by his increased PK time. Basically with less responsibility he can now focus on other more important aspects of his game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastonBlues22 View Post
I wouldn't do the deal personally, at least before I had a chance to see how the defensive pairings played with Cole in the top 6 and how the McDonald-Steen-Tarasenko 3rd line performed. I could easily change my mind 20 games into the season.
I really am shocked that you would consider this trade. Even as a fallback. Remember we're talking about our only PPG player of our last two playoff appearances. Who exactly would fill that kind of void? And besides McDonald, would you really want to give up a prospect like Rattie for an overpaid Bouwmeester? Don't get me wrong, I think Bouwmeester would be a decent partner for Pietrangelo, but definitely not at this price.

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:47 AM
  #45
SirPaste
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Originally Posted by Flames rebuilder View Post
JayBo for Rattie and Cole...done
Not done, we cant afford his contract, for the millionth time

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:47 AM
  #46
Double Dion
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
McDonald is a better player than Bouwmeester, yes, but he's also 35 years old and has had some serious health issues over the past few years. He's not as valuable as you'd think.
Ummmm.... No he's not. And I hate JBo. JBo is a top 30 defenseman. McDonald is not even a top 60 forward, yet alone top 30.

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:48 AM
  #47
SirPaste
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Ummmm.... No he's not. And I hate JBo. JBo is a top 30 defenseman. McDonald is not even a top 60 forward, yet alone top 30.
lol alright buddy

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:50 AM
  #48
Double Dion
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Originally Posted by Noori View Post
Rattie isn't exactly tearing it up. 12 points in 10 games a 19 year old junior? The Flames had three prospects in the Dub last year who far out produced what Rattie has done so far (Holland -traded-, Ferland, and Reinhart). Rattie is a pretty overrated prospect and not nearly as good without Sven.

McDonald is interesting, but risky. With one year on his contract, the whole negotiation thing would have to play out first.
I watched Rattie live in Swift Current on Saturday. He didn't impress me at all. Then I looked at the score sheet and he had 4 goals. He's one of those guys who just needs a few opportunities to produce at a high level. He's a finisher, but he definitely wasn't the guy creating the offensive opportunities. He reminds me of a better Ryan Howse.

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:52 AM
  #49
Dolph Ziggler
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
McDonald is a better player than Bouwmeester, yes, but he's also 35 years old and has had some serious health issues over the past few years. He's not as valuable as you'd think.
This very well could be true.

If that's the case that his value isn't what some might think though, than we're just better off holding on to him.

When he's healthy, he's been close to a PPG player. I'd rather not trade him at all and certainly not for what his value most likely is.

And as always, Blues fans want nothing to do with JayBo.

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Old
10-19-2012, 09:54 AM
  #50
ComixZone
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Flames say no.

Bouwmeester > McDonald

Backlund = Rattie

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