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Madison Square Garden Renovations (Part IV)

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10-18-2012, 12:35 PM
  #926
islandxtreme26
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Originally Posted by Blue Seat Spartan View Post
Sweet pics, islandextreme26 , the transformed Garden looks REALLY impressive!!!

I noticed something about the newly-laid ice surface - it's not even 5 days old and cracks are showing in the rink. Saw something similar when I went to Adam Graves Night back in 2009... fresh sheet of ice, cracks appearing. Here's a photo:

Is this one of the flaws of the current refrigeration system? And will the new rink system technology reduce the problems & incidents associated with the QUALITY ice at the World's Most Famous Arena?
Thanks! I agree, it looks great inside - hard to tell from only 46 pictures on a cell camera and while walking (hence why some are blurred, had to be discreet with the photos). But I am definitely stoked to see the completely finished Phase Two product. I'll reserve judgement on the bridges until next summer.

As for the ice - yes, I noticed the cracks too. This has long been an issue at the Garden. One of the last items on the list of renovations for next summer is the entire refrigeration system. The entire system is being replaced. The chillers, all the associated piping, and the actual floor are being removed and replaced. The new refrigeration system will be a reverse osmosis (RO) system, which removes 95% of minerals and impurities in the water and allows the ice to be kept a slightly warmer temperature. This type of system is being incorporated into many arenas now and produces water that is basically drinkable (although I heard last night that it is not recommended - something about the body not being meant to absorb that type of water that is so pure or without any minerals. Not sure of the exact explanation but it made sense). As a result of the new chillers, piping, flooring, and upgraded system, the Garden ice is wholly expected to no longer have the issues that have plagued it for years. Time will tell, but if it works in other places that host multiple sports/teams, then I like others affiliated with the project fully expect it to work here.

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10-18-2012, 12:39 PM
  #927
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For more on the type of system being installed at MSG next summer, check out this information from NYC.gov in their "WasteLe$$ - Stadiums, Arenas, and Convention Centers - Newsletter". The newsletter can be found at: http://www.nyc.gov/html/nycwasteless...ium1energy.pdf

"Improving water quality using one of several demineralization methods, such as reverse osmosis or deionization, can increase energy efficiency. Through reverse osmosis, 95 percent of minerals, salts, and other impurities are removed. The resulting, relatively
pure water allows the ice pad to operate about 4F warmer. Every 1F rise of the ice pad temperature yields an estimated six percent savings in cooling costs, according to On Ice, an ice arena industry newsletter"

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10-18-2012, 12:52 PM
  #928
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Originally Posted by islandxtreme26 View Post
This type of system is being incorporated into many arenas now and produces water that is basically drinkable (although I heard last night that it is not recommended - something about the body not being meant to absorb that type of water that is so pure or without any minerals.
There's no problem with drinking mineral free water, I drank distilled water at home for years growing up and there are no ill effects. Your body does need some of the minerals found in regular tap or source water but you should be able to get those in a typical diet.

My guess is you wouldn't want to drink that water because of the ammonia used in the refrigeration process

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10-18-2012, 01:39 PM
  #929
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There's no problem with drinking mineral free water, I drank distilled water at home for years growing up and there are no ill effects. Your body does need some of the minerals found in regular tap or source water but you should be able to get those in a typical diet.

My guess is you wouldn't want to drink that water because of the ammonia used in the refrigeration process
That's exactly what I figured - I'm assuming that's what he meant or he misheard. Maybe something along the lines of "you couldn't survive on this water alone" b/c of the lack of minerals. Who knows. All I know is that it can only help the ice quality at the Garden. If it does, it will be well worth the cost and the wait for the final year.

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10-18-2012, 01:42 PM
  #930
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As long as no one is trying to live in MSG and survive on the rink's water alone, then I'll be happy with the new rink.


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10-18-2012, 04:07 PM
  #931
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Thanks for the photos...

Can anyone tell me where the 'teal' seats were installed?

from the pictures I don't see them.

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10-18-2012, 04:15 PM
  #932
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Thanks for the photos...

Can anyone tell me where the 'teal' seats were installed?

from the pictures I don't see them.
You mean the blue seats? They're in the 400's underneath the West Balcony.

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10-18-2012, 04:45 PM
  #933
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You mean the blue seats? They're in the 400's underneath the West Balcony.
I'm so confused. Where are the 400's now? I thought the sections were getting new numbers, no?

My seats that I use were in 425 before the upper bowl was renovated.... Will my seats be dark navy or teal?

I couldn't see them in any of those photos.

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10-18-2012, 04:51 PM
  #934
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I'm so confused. Where are the 400's now? I thought the sections were getting new numbers, no?

My seats that I use were in 425 before the upper bowl was renovated.... Will my seats be dark navy or teal?

I couldn't see them in any of those photos.
They're going to be that dark navy. Those are the new 200's which are part of the upper bowl. The only 400's that remain from before the renovation are directly under the West Balcony. Those were renumbered but are still the 400's and are blue seats as opposed to the dark navy throughout the building.

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10-18-2012, 05:35 PM
  #935
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
They're going to be that dark navy. Those are the new 200's which are part of the upper bowl. The only 400's that remain from before the renovation are directly under the West Balcony. Those were renumbered but are still the 400's and are blue seats as opposed to the dark navy throughout the building.
Thanks for the clarification friend. I'm glad the majority of the seats in the arena will be that dark navy color as I think it looks very sharp!

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10-18-2012, 08:48 PM
  #936
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I believe the bridges will be higher than they would look in that picture since they are building a new roof, which is higher up.
I think they're just resurfacing the roof, not building a new, higher one...

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10-18-2012, 08:50 PM
  #937
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I believe the bridges will be higher than they would look in that picture since they are building a new roof, which is higher up.
Bridges will be on the 10th floor. Doesn't matter what they do with the roof because they have to connect to the fan decks on each end of the arena. Once you're inside the arena this year, you'll get a sense of exactly where the bridges will run.

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10-18-2012, 09:36 PM
  #938
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What do you mean?
Those are all season tickets right?

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10-18-2012, 09:47 PM
  #939
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Those are all season tickets right?
They always have tickets in every price point set aside for group sales and individual tickets.

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10-18-2012, 10:03 PM
  #940
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Originally Posted by nyrmetros View Post
Those are all season tickets right?
arent season ticket holders "diehard supporters"?

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10-19-2012, 07:45 AM
  #941
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OMG, the skywalks are gonna be terrible, just leave it like that ffs.
I agree 100000000000000000000000%

That view is outstanding as it is right now.

The bridges are going ruin the experience and view for thousands of people.

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10-19-2012, 08:42 AM
  #942
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Whats the average ticket price range for the upper bowl?

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10-19-2012, 08:51 AM
  #943
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Whats the average ticket price range for the upper bowl?
Face values are different for full season and partial plan holders, and then the Rangers are now selling individual tickets using dynamic pricing. So that $29 ticket could be sold at the box office for $100 to opening night


As for full season face values:

$29 - 400s Top 2 rows (obstructed)
$47 - 400s All other
$50 - 200s Corner rows 15+
$53 - 200s Center rows 15+
$64 - West Balcony
$73 - 200s Corner rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Center rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Corner row 2
$90 - 200s Center row 2
$125 - 200s Corner front row
$150 - 200s Center front row

That puts the average probably around ~$70 (FULL season price)

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10-19-2012, 09:00 AM
  #944
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Because of the humidity, relatively warm winters and hundreds of events that are scheduled I'm still skeptical about the quality of the ice. If we're expecting Edmonton quality glass we're being delusional. I suspect it'll be average at best, which is an improvement so please don't misinterpret.

I had really hoped they included a lighting improvement in the plans.


This is without the hockey specific lighting turned on I believe (which was directly above the suites on the sides of the arena). Even with those on there are still several dark patches on the ice, specifically in the 4 corners and center ice. Not to mention the low color temp which makes the ice look piss yellow in person. The arrangement does work well for Basketball and boxing thought due to the small focus area.


Last edited by ChipAyten: 10-19-2012 at 09:05 AM.
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10-19-2012, 09:02 AM
  #945
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Anything is an improvement ice-wise.

Always envied the ice and lighting of other arenas.

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10-19-2012, 09:04 AM
  #946
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Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
$29 - 400s Top 2 rows (obstructed)
$47 - 400s All other
$50 - 200s Corner rows 15+
$53 - 200s Center rows 15+
$64 - West Balcony
$73 - 200s Corner rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Center rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Corner row 2
$90 - 200s Center row 2
$125 - 200s Corner front row
$150 - 200s Center front row
Probably the best value for your dollar, only 6 bucks more than a full view 400s seat and much closer to the ice. You'd be able to flip them for ~$100. That's of course not considering the twits that undersell everyone on stubhub 2-3 hours before the game.

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10-19-2012, 09:05 AM
  #947
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http://vimeo.com/50828678" allowScriptAccess="sameDomain" quality="best" bgcolor="#ffffff" scale="noScale" salign="TL" FlashVars="playerMode=embedded">



Edit: I can't get this to embed properly, the video is at:
http://vimeo.com/50828678

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10-19-2012, 09:07 AM
  #948
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Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
Face values are different for full season and partial plan holders, and then the Rangers are now selling individual tickets using dynamic pricing. So that $29 ticket could be sold at the box office for $100 to opening night


As for full season face values:

$29 - 400s Top 2 rows (obstructed)
$47 - 400s All other
$50 - 200s Corner rows 15+
$53 - 200s Center rows 15+
$64 - West Balcony
$73 - 200s Corner rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Center rows 3-14
$79 - 200s Corner row 2
$90 - 200s Center row 2
$125 - 200s Corner front row
$150 - 200s Center front row

That puts the average probably around ~$70 (FULL season price)

Which is actually much less than I originally thought.


Also, the city views means the facade has changed I would assume.

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10-19-2012, 09:12 AM
  #949
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Originally Posted by ChipAyten View Post
Probably the best value for your dollar, only 6 bucks more than a full view 400s seat and much closer to the ice.
Yeah, assuming you can even touch those seats. If you don't already have the tickets chances of ever having a chance depend heavily on Sather making a package trade of Lundqvist+Callahan+McDonagh+Del Zotto for Scott Gomez and a player to be named later

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10-19-2012, 10:30 AM
  #950
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Originally Posted by ChipAyten View Post
I had really hoped they included a lighting improvement in the plans.

This is without the hockey specific lighting turned on I believe (which was directly above the suites on the sides of the arena). Even with those on there are still several dark patches on the ice, specifically in the 4 corners and center ice. Not to mention the low color temp which makes the ice look piss yellow in person. The arrangement does work well for Basketball and boxing thought due to the small focus area.
The entire event lighting system is brand new. The A-Ring, B-Ring, and C-Ring lights all feature different packages for different events (hockey, basketball, concert, wrestling, convention, tennis, etc.) Yes, right now you can see the ridiculous shadows on the ice. That is because the lighting system still needs to be balanced and set up for hockey. While certain alignment can be done to each individual spot with the base floor in place, the reflections on the ice cannot be reproduced...part of the reason why the ice was put in place so early. Starting the night I was there (Wednesday), they were in the process of adjusting A-ring lighting. (FYI: There are three rings to the roof - the innermost ring closest to the scoreboard is the A-Ring, the C-ring is the outermost ring above the middle/back of the 200 level.) If you look at the picture from the Madison Suites, you can see the A-ring of lights is lit but the B-ring is not lit, and that is directly above the shadow seen on the ice.


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