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St. Louis - Calgary 2.0

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Old
10-20-2012, 01:25 PM
  #1
flameaholic
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St. Louis - Calgary 2.0

Just wanted to gauge what the reaction would be to this proposal. The Blues are looking for a gritty top-4 d-man to play with Pietrangelo, while the Flames biggest need is obviously at centre.

Judging by the importance of both players to their respective teams - and perhaps reluctance of each team's fan base to give him up, here goes (feel free to add prospects/picks on either side):


Mark Giordano


Patrick Berglund

Reasoning? I think the Flames could roll with a top-4 D of Bouwmeester, Wideman, Brodie, and Butler, plus get a top line center to play with Iginla. Blues get the top-pairing d-man they need to play with Pietrangelo.

3.. 2.. 1..


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Old
10-20-2012, 01:33 PM
  #2
bleedblue1223
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Our hole at center would become a crater, while our hole at defense is currently what a dog would dig to bury its bone.

And no, adding Backlund won't do anything for us. Giordano is one of the ideal targets for us IMO though.

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Old
10-20-2012, 01:34 PM
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Kid Dynamite
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The value seems about right, at least to me. I don't know if the Blues can really give up Berglund though. Seems to me they would be filling one hole while creating another.

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10-20-2012, 01:41 PM
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flameaholic
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Originally Posted by BrokeBackBulin View Post
The value seems about right, at least to me. I don't know if the Blues can really give up Berglund though. Seems to me they would be filling one hole while creating another.
Well, you're not going to get something without giving up something. If the Blues want a d-man like Giordano and the Flames want a center like Berglund, that's what it's going to cost.

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10-20-2012, 01:46 PM
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bleedblue1223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Well, you're not going to get something without giving up something. If the Blues want a d-man like Giordano and the Flames want a center like Berglund, that's what it's going to cost.
You also don't trade from other areas of weakness, you trade from areas of strength.

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10-20-2012, 01:53 PM
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flameaholic
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
You also don't trade from other areas of weakness, you trade from areas of strength.
Yes, but you're missing the point. To get the player you want you have to be willing to give up what the other team needs. You can't just say, "I want this guy, but this is all I'm going to offer you. Take it or leave it!"

9/10 the other team will walk.

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10-20-2012, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Well, you're not going to get something without giving up something. If the Blues want a d-man like Giordano and the Flames want a center like Berglund, that's what it's going to cost.
If Flames want a center then we're already bad trading partners.

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Old
10-20-2012, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Yes, but you're missing the point. To get the player you want you have to be willing to give up what the other team needs. You can't just say, "I want this guy, but this is all I'm going to offer you. Take it or leave it!"

9/10 the other team will walk.
You don't understand, the Blues have an excess in wingers, not centres.

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Old
10-20-2012, 01:57 PM
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flameaholic
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Originally Posted by couture23 View Post
You don't understand, the Blues have an excess in wingers, not centres.
We don't need wingers, we need a centre.

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10-20-2012, 01:57 PM
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bleedblue1223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Yes, but you're missing the point. To get the player you want you have to be willing to give up what the other team needs. You can't just say, "I want this guy, but this is all I'm going to offer you. Take it or leave it!"

9/10 the other team will walk.
You don't understand, there are 28 other teams around the league, and you started this, not a Blues fan. If a Blues fan started this, then off course you guys demand Berglund. GMs don't call other GMs and say if you want this guy, then you must give up that guy.

If you want Berglund, you start the thread, what would Berglund cost? We would then respond, he is not available, even for Giordano.

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Old
10-20-2012, 01:58 PM
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flameaholic
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Originally Posted by bacheesh View Post
If Flames want a center then we're already bad trading partners.
I guess so.

Looks like the Flames will be stuck without a center for Iginla and the Blues will be stuck without a top-pairing d-man to play with Pietrangelo.

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10-20-2012, 02:00 PM
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bleedblue1223
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Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
We don't need wingers, we need a centre.
Then start a thread with a team that can fill your needs. Have you noticed how Blues fans don't start threads about Giordano, even though we have interest in him.

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10-20-2012, 02:04 PM
  #13
flameaholic
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Then start a thread with a team that can fill your needs. Have you noticed how Blues fans don't start threads about Giordano, even though we have interest in him.
Because they know they can't get him?

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10-20-2012, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Because they know they can't get him?
Exactly.

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10-20-2012, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
I guess so.

Looks like the Flames will be stuck without a center for Iginla and the Blues will be stuck without a top-pairing d-man to play with Pietrangelo.
Cammalleri.

The Flames are much better of keeping Giordano and giving Cammalleri another run at center.

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10-20-2012, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flameaholic View Post
Yes, but you're missing the point. To get the player you want you have to be willing to give up what the other team needs. You can't just say, "I want this guy, but this is all I'm going to offer you. Take it or leave it!"

9/10 the other team will walk.
And that's fine. The Blues won't trade for the sake of making a trade. They're not going to fill one hole up by opening another, which is what this trade does. The value is right, and everyone recognizes that, but the Blues just aren't in a position to trade a center.

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Old
10-20-2012, 02:25 PM
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I think this proposal has good value for both sides, but leaves a big hole down the middle for St.Louis.

I think Calgary under Feaster/Weisbrod are finally heading in the right direction. We shouldn't build through trade (unless its an offer we couldn't refuse.) We need to start building through the draft... Baertschi, Gaudreau, Brossoit, Gillies, Sieloff, Jankowski, etc have all been solid picks. We have to be patient/smart.

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10-20-2012, 02:48 PM
  #18
ThirdManIn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
You don't understand, there are 28 other teams around the league, and you started this, not a Blues fan. If a Blues fan started this, then off course you guys demand Berglund. GMs don't call other GMs and say if you want this guy, then you must give up that guy.

If you want Berglund, you start the thread, what would Berglund cost? We would then respond, he is not available, even for Giordano.
Is that how it's done? I thought we had proposal prefixes for a reason

Actually the way it is supposed to work is if you don't like the proposal you either offer a counterproposal or you simply say "no thanks" preferably with some substance.

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10-20-2012, 02:58 PM
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bleedblue1223
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Is that how it's done? I thought we had proposal prefixes for a reason

Actually the way it is supposed to work is if you don't like the proposal you either offer a counterproposal or you simply say "no thanks" preferably with some substance.
Well, if you look at my first post, you'll see the substance that apparently the OP also didn't look at.

It's not like this is the first Flames-Blues thread, so we have a good idea of wants and needs.

Love how you pick my post out and not his. We say moving Berglund would create a bigger hole, and the response is you have to give to get. We know that, and that's why we haven't started a thread for Giordano. The Flames aren't the only team with a player that would fit our need, so we aren't going to create a bigger hole just to get Giordano. Congrats on being the third man in though.

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10-20-2012, 02:59 PM
  #20
ThirdManIn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Well, if you look at my first post, you'll see the substance that apparently the OP also didn't look at.

It's not like this is the first Flames-Blues thread, so we have a good idea of wants and needs.

Love how you pick my post out and not his. We say moving Berglund would create a bigger hole, and the response is you have to give to get. We know that, and that's why we haven't started a thread for Giordano. The Flames aren't the only team with a player that would fit our need, so we aren't going to create a bigger hole just to get Giordano. Congrats on being the third man in though.
I was speaking in general terms. I've read every post in this thread.

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10-20-2012, 03:07 PM
  #21
IHaveNoCreativity
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Value's decent... Not sure this helps either team, seems like a lateral move at best.

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Old
10-20-2012, 03:26 PM
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I'd love to have Giordano but can't do it at the price of Berglund. Totally get why Calgary would ask for him.

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Old
10-20-2012, 03:55 PM
  #23
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No thanks.

Berglund has yet to show that he can be anything more then a 40-50 point center.

Not to mention the Flames cant afford to trade Giordano without getting a d-man in return.

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10-20-2012, 05:56 PM
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flameaholic
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Originally Posted by IHaveNoCreativity View Post
Value's decent... Not sure this helps either team, seems like a lateral move at best.
Not sure if I would call it a 'lateral' move, it's a trade that addresses a need for both teams - Blues top 2 d-man; Flames top 2 center. Question is, are the Blues better off with Berglund and are the Flames better off keeping Giordano?

The answer so far appears to be "yes."

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10-20-2012, 05:57 PM
  #25
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No thanks.

Berglund has yet to show that he can be anything more then a 40-50 point center.

Not to mention the Flames cant afford to trade Giordano without getting a d-man in return.
I don't understand why STL fans think Berglund is untouchable. If you are lucky he gets 45 points and is a 48.7% FO. What is so great about him. He is like a Horcoff in EDM a 3rd line player.

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