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The Luongo Thread [Mod Warning in OP]

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Old
10-23-2012, 10:01 AM
  #726
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Agreed. So Luongo must be traded for an upgrade to our top 6. Luongo in a deal for Lupul makes sense.
Don't think Toronto can do that and I'm not sure he would put up that kind of production with the Canucks.

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10-23-2012, 10:01 AM
  #727
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Agreed. So Luongo must be traded for an upgrade to our top 6. Luongo in a deal for Lupul makes sense.
im actually less crazy about that one myself

He's a year from 30, has a long injury history and hasn't played a full season since he was in Edm 6 years ago. He has limited playoff experience, has a career minus south of -50, and has only been higher than the 50s in pts once in 8 years (last year, largely thanks to Kessel.)

Don't wanna buy high on this guy, tbh ...if we're looking for the top 6 option from TO, it's JVR or bust (assuming Phil's off the table)

But assuming leaf fans don't want to do that, or Gardiner, then it's a combo of futures ...something like 1st, Kadri or Colbourne, Bozak would get it done without either side absolutely hating it.

Then the Canucks would have some cap room and futures to try and upgrade the top 6 elsewhere.
(Kadri/1st/1st/plus for Perry at the deadline, or something...)


Last edited by NYVanfan: 10-23-2012 at 10:06 AM.
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10-23-2012, 10:02 AM
  #728
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It is a good point that what he wants and what he gets are two possible outcomes.

What is worth noting though as much as it is a competitive sport Hockey is still entertainment. The teams are not autonomous entities that operate without the slightest regard for the others. If they were they would be far more predatory in their behavior. It is in the best interest for all the teams to have the best players playing. Parity is a huge initiative in the minds of the leagues offices. Look how they brag about how close the playoff races are and that 29 of the 30 teams have been in the playoffs since the salary cap was introduced.

Luongo will either find himself in Florida for his personal reasons or in Toronto for the leagues benefit.

The return will be for a fair market price as it is the right thing to do.

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10-23-2012, 10:04 AM
  #729
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im actually less crazy about that one myself

He's a year from 30, has a long injury history and hasn't played a full season since he was in Edm 6 years ago. He has limited playoff experience, has a career minus south of -50, and has only been higher than the 50s in pts once in 8 years (last year, largely thanks to Kessel.)

Don't wanna buy high on this guy, tbh ...if we're looking for the top 6 option from TO, it's JVR or bust (assuming Phil's off the table)
Yeah...no. Simply not true. He was not just a product of Kessel. JVR is off the table like Kessel is. Try again.

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10-23-2012, 10:06 AM
  #730
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Bozak + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Kulemin + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Lombardi + Colbourne + Kadri + 1st for Luongo + Raymond

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10-23-2012, 10:18 AM
  #731
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Yeah...no. Simply not true. He was not just a product of Kessel. JVR is off the table like Kessel is. Try again.
did you stop reading at that point in my post?

Last year Kessel was on the ice for 89% of Lupul's shifts and for 88% of Lupul's points (59 of 67) ...id say there's a correlation there

by comparison, 20 of PK's 81 pts were w/o Lupul

But you likely watched way more than i did ...maybe Lupul did break out all on his own. The injury risk and other factors don't make it worth the price, imo ...also, like Bozak, he's a UFA to be...


Last edited by NYVanfan: 10-23-2012 at 10:25 AM.
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10-23-2012, 10:19 AM
  #732
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Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
Bozak + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Kulemin + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Lombardi + Colbourne + Kadri + 1st for Luongo + Raymond
i could live with those i suppose
most important, since we're not getting a top 6er back, we clear some $

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10-23-2012, 10:21 AM
  #733
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Kulemin, Finn, Kadri and a first

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10-23-2012, 10:25 AM
  #734
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Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
Bozak + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Kulemin + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Lombardi + Colbourne + Kadri + 1st for Luongo + Raymond
Won't be anything close to that.

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10-23-2012, 10:31 AM
  #735
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Won't be anything close to that.
Then the Leafs won't be getting Luongo. You're not getting an elite goalie for spare parts.

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10-23-2012, 10:32 AM
  #736
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Won't be anything close to that.
i guess we'll find out.

at the very least, these threads have kept some semblance of discourse going thru the dark days of no hockey...

(though fans of 28 teams growing increasingly stupified at fans of the other 2...)

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10-23-2012, 10:33 AM
  #737
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With all of the rumblings about Kadri not being happy in Toronto and the criticisms of his conditioning from the Marlies' coach you have to think that he would be offered by Toronto in any package for Luongo.

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10-23-2012, 10:34 AM
  #738
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
im actually less crazy about that one myself

He's a year from 30, has a long injury history and hasn't played a full season since he was in Edm 6 years ago. He has limited playoff experience, has a career minus south of -50, and has only been higher than the 50s in pts once in 8 years (last year, largely thanks to Kessel.)

Don't wanna buy high on this guy, tbh ...if we're looking for the top 6 option from TO, it's JVR or bust (assuming Phil's off the table)

But assuming leaf fans don't want to do that, or Gardiner, then it's a combo of futures ...something like 1st, Kadri or Colbourne, Bozak would get it done without either side absolutely hating it.

Then the Canucks would have some cap room and futures to try and upgrade the top 6 elsewhere.
(Kadri/1st/1st/plus for Perry at the deadline, or something...)

burke isnt moving our 1st for a goalie on the wrong side of 30.

burke might move bozak but ONLY if has a deal in place that would bring a upgrade at center back

burke might move kadri but he would be the big piece going back i would think, i cant see him moving kadri + something substantial for luo.

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10-23-2012, 10:37 AM
  #739
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
Bozak + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Kulemin + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Lombardi + Colbourne + Kadri + 1st for Luongo + Raymond
Not a chance on any of those deals happening. VAN would be fortunate to get either Colbourne or a top-10 protected 1st from TOR, let alone both PLUS a roster player.

The bottom line is that VAN is dealing Luongo from a weak position. They need to get rid of him - end of story. Sure, they could hold on to him this season (if they have one), but they can't afford his salary for the 2013-2014 season and ice a full, competitive roster. Plus, they would be dealing from an even weaker position next summer if they kept him.

My fair offer would be somewhere along the lines of MacArthur + 3rd round pick.

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10-23-2012, 10:38 AM
  #740
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
burke isnt moving our 1st for a goalie on the wrong side of 30.

burke might move bozak but ONLY if has a deal in place that would bring a upgrade at center back

burke might move kadri but he would be the big piece going back i would think, i cant see him moving kadri + something substantial for luo.
And I honestly can't see Gillis moving Luongo for a player that doesn't address any of our team needs.

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10-23-2012, 10:39 AM
  #741
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
Bozak + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Kulemin + Colbourne + 1st for Luongo

Or

Lombardi + Colbourne + Kadri + 1st for Luongo + Raymond
I'd take the third one I think. But all three address in part our needs.

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10-23-2012, 10:39 AM
  #742
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
i guess we'll find out.

at the very least, these threads have kept some semblance of discourse going thru the dark days of no hockey...

(though fans of 28 teams growing increasingly stupified at fans of the other 2...)
We will but it may not be until he's another year older and worth even less.

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10-23-2012, 10:40 AM
  #743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crustacean View Post
Not a chance on any of those deals happening. VAN would be fortunate to get either Colbourne or a top-10 protected 1st from TOR, let alone both PLUS a roster player.

The bottom line is that VAN is dealing Luongo from a weak position. They need to get rid of him - end of story. Sure, they could hold on to him this season (if they have one), but they can't afford his salary for the 2013-2014 season and ice a full, competitive roster. Plus, they would be dealing from an even weaker position next summer if they kept him.

My fair offer would be somewhere along the lines of MacArthur + 3rd round pick.
I think Gillis would wait if that's the best offer. That doesn't help us at all. We would just wait for a team to get desperate for a goalie and make a better trade. Who knows, maybe Burke grows desperate when Reimer and Scrivens don't play well, like last year, and comes to his senses that his team is good enough to make the playoffs if it had a legitimate top goalie.

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10-23-2012, 10:45 AM
  #744
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Originally Posted by Crustacean View Post
Not a chance on any of those deals happening. VAN would be fortunate to get either Colbourne or a top-10 protected 1st from TOR, let alone both PLUS a roster player.

The bottom line is that VAN is dealing Luongo from a weak position. They need to get rid of him - end of story. Sure, they could hold on to him this season (if they have one), but they can't afford his salary for the 2013-2014 season and ice a full, competitive roster. Plus, they would be dealing from an even weaker position next summer if they kept him.

My fair offer would be somewhere along the lines of MacArthur + 3rd round pick.

I can guarantee that Burke won't get Luongo at that price.
Gillis will likely hang onto him if that is the best offer and deal him later. I'm betting that Burke would up the price after a few months of watching his current goalies flounder like last year.
One thing for sure is that it will be an interesting game of chicken.

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10-23-2012, 10:45 AM
  #745
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We will but it may not be until he's another year older and worth even less.
On the plus side, he would be helping VAN in the meantime.


Also, hopefully, FLA's goaltending situation becomes more clear then, so we can send Lu to his first choice destination, or another team that wants an upgrade comes calling with a better offer... A lot can happen in a year.

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10-23-2012, 10:48 AM
  #746
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did you stop reading at that point in my post?

Last year Kessel was on the ice for 89% of Lupul's shifts and for 88% of Lupul's points (59 of 67) ...id say there's a correlation there

by comparison, 20 of PK's 81 pts were w/o Lupul

But you likely watched way more than i did ...maybe Lupul did break out all on his own. The injury risk and other factors don't make it worth the price, imo ...also, like Bozak, he's a UFA to be...
It was actually the opposite, Lupul seemed to spark Kessel. Hell, it was Phils best season to date and largely due to Joffrey. They definitely have chemistry. Lupuls had all kinds of issues over his career, some pretty horrible injuries(he actually thought he may have to retire) and of course, not getting along well with Carlyle who refused to play him on on the left side. Carlyle of course, is in Toronto now and basically publicly apologized for doubting Lupul. Add in the fact that he's just coming into his prime and he's highly skilled...you've got a lot of reasons why he broke out last year. I just don't think it makes sense to trade him when he and our top forward clearly work off each other.

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10-23-2012, 10:49 AM
  #747
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And I honestly can't see Gillis moving Luongo for a player that doesn't address any of our team needs.
what are your team needs?

what is the absolute number 1 priority to push you over the edge into a big time contender?

what are secondary needs that could use filling/ upgrading?

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10-23-2012, 10:50 AM
  #748
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And I honestly can't see Gillis moving Luongo for a player that doesn't address any of our team needs.
Yet you continue to ask for Gardiner. How does a rookie help you right now exactly?

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10-23-2012, 10:53 AM
  #749
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Yet you continue to ask for Gardiner. How does a rookie help you right now exactly?
Would you say Gardiner is better than Ballard? If so, he improves the team.

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10-23-2012, 10:56 AM
  #750
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Not a chance on any of those deals happening. VAN would be fortunate to get either Colbourne or a top-10 protected 1st from TOR, let alone both PLUS a roster player.

The bottom line is that VAN is dealing Luongo from a weak position. They need to get rid of him - end of story. Sure, they could hold on to him this season (if they have one), but they can't afford his salary for the 2013-2014 season and ice a full, competitive roster. Plus, they would be dealing from an even weaker position next summer if they kept him.

My fair offer would be somewhere along the lines of MacArthur + 3rd round pick.
Sigh, and we have gone full circle again.

- No, we are not dealing from a position of weakness. We have the better player.
- No, we do not need to be rid of him.
- We have no idea the terms of the CBA.
- Why would we trade him for your trash in lieu of chancing a deadline acquisition? Your trash will still be there.
- We can simply trade Schneider, especially if Lack looks continues to develop.

Just some food for thought. We have a better understanding of the Canucks than you do.

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