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Phoenix LXIII: I Have Become Comfortably Numb

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Old
10-24-2012, 10:49 PM
  #526
Whileee
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Originally Posted by blues10 View Post
OK there are a few players in the game but where isn't there?

Hasn't the cast of characters in Arizona remained constant since August 2011 when GJ 1st publicly surfaced? Where's David Bowie when you need him? ccchhhhaaangggges

Yes, change is on the horizon in January 2013. C'mon - this thing has been Konstant for 14 months.

1. COG mayor the same - Scruggs
2. council the same
3. major figurehead GJ the same
4. L'ill Gary and willy d. the same
5. 29 of 30 NHL owners the same??? or are they still all the same???
6. Beasley substituted for Skeete who had already been working for the COG
7. City attorney the same (tindall)
8. Saunders switched to Halverstadt switched to Munshi - this has no siginificance
9. Ken Jones the same
10. Arena manager the same

Where are all the movin' parts?
Exactly right. Jamison has been around for more than a year, and the COG has been prepared to pay a hefty "arena management fee" to subsidize the operations for months.

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10-24-2012, 11:08 PM
  #527
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Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
Video now up from last evenings meeting... skip to 43:00 mark

http://glendale-az.granicus.com/Medi...publish_id=580
Just... Thank you!

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10-24-2012, 11:22 PM
  #528
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Are recalls so common that a politician wouldn't be surprised by an attempted one?

Quote:
sonu munshi‏@smunshi

Spoke with Councilwoman Knaack today. Says she's disappointed but not surprised over the recall effort against her.

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10-24-2012, 11:49 PM
  #529
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Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
Video now up from last evenings meeting... skip to 43:00 mark

http://glendale-az.granicus.com/Medi...publish_id=580
Ken Jones gives a good speech, he is the third guy up.

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10-25-2012, 07:25 AM
  #530
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Originally Posted by viper0220 View Post
If the season gets shortened(which is likely, they need to get a deal done by Oct 25), will they relocate the team? I mean they will have at least 2 months(if the season is shortened, I don't think that they will play until January) to get things in order. And if they are relocated which city, will the team relocate to Quebec City or Seattle?(just your opinion). The reason I ask this question is because I was watching a video on TSN, they were talking about the Islanders moving to Barclay Center and they bought up the Coyotes situation, where Dutchie asked if Coyotes would relocate and Ferrao and Dreger said that "Seattle would be the best option". I always thought that Quebec City would be the best option(reading at hfboards), Why are they saying Seattle will be the best option(where they don't have a arena ready right now(at least to my knowledge) and to get a arena they need a NBA Team, and the NHL team will have to compete with NFL, MLB, NBA, college sports). Why did they not say that Quebec City would be the best option or do they know something we don't, I mean they saw the success Winnipeg had. I will post the video.


http://watch.tsn.ca/featured/#clip791587
That's because Dreger is a borderline idiot (can't believe I share the same last name with this guy).

Quebec will be building a new arena with the NHL as it's main tenant. The Colisee can (or already has) been upgraded to house a franchise temporarily.

Seattle has the Key arena which from what I've heard would be brutal for hockey. They are building a new arena but for an NBA tenant... the NHL would be secondary.

I'm not saying Seattle wouldn't be a good hockey market but it takes a huge back seat to Quebec when judging viable and profitable hockey markets.

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10-25-2012, 08:10 AM
  #531
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I'm not saying Seattle wouldn't be a good hockey market but it takes a huge back seat to Quebec when judging viable and profitable hockey markets.
More for the Seattle thread, but since it was mentioned here...

Seattle may all in well be a good hockey market, but there are two little issues that have to be resolved before an NHL team can go to Seattle... they need a place to play and more importantly, they want an NBA team first and won't look at the NHL until that is in place.

And according to recent reports about teams that might have moved to Seattle ( Memphis is close to finalizing a deal to stay in Tennessee and the Milwaukee Bucks reportedly has agreed to a six-year extension to stay in Wisconsin) and comments from Stern ( NBA Commissioner David Stern has said the league has no plans to expand, so moving a current team to Seattle is the only option for Hansen ) it is looking more like a longer shot each day.

http://www.krem.com/news/northwest-news/175713041.html


Last edited by cbcwpg: 10-25-2012 at 08:15 AM.
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Old
10-25-2012, 08:14 AM
  #532
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Ken Jones gives a good speech, he is the third guy up.
He starts at about 47:00. He almost made me cry. And I hope they have medical staff in the room, Jones might need it, he's so old.

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10-25-2012, 08:14 AM
  #533
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The NHL in Seattle: Can Key Arena provide a temporary home? http://sciencewitness.com/news/687.html

Right now, I'd say no... maybe in a few years...

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Old
10-25-2012, 08:46 AM
  #534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blues10 View Post
OK there are a few players in the game but where isn't there?

Hasn't the cast of characters in Arizona remained constant since August 2011 when GJ 1st publicly surfaced? Where's David Bowie when you need him? ccchhhhaaangggges

Yes, change is on the horizon in January 2013. C'mon - this thing has been Konstant for 14 months.

1. COG mayor the same - Scruggs
2. council the same
3. major figurehead GJ the same
4. L'ill Gary and willy d. the same
5. 29 of 30 NHL owners the same??? or are they still all the same???
6. Beasley substituted for Skeete who had already been working for the COG
7. City attorney the same (tindall)
8. Saunders switched to Halverstadt switched to Munshi - this has no siginificance
9. Ken Jones the same
10. Arena manager the same

Where are all the movin' parts?

Edit - Hocking - the same
Pollack using Hocking numbers the same
Colson -fled the sinking ship like Beasley
I assume you mean mlse ownership has changed. I believe this to be a very consequential change with respect to the options on the table for the league. It has been speculated that one of the conditions for approval of belgers might have been that they drop any opposition to another team in the GTA/Hammer. That would presumably open up the easier possibility of a rather immediate relocation option of the yotes to the hammer (in addition to the option of QC). Of course that would have to be pushed by the bog, not by bettman himself who presumably would sooner cut off his toes than see the team he has suffered to keep in phoenix end up in the very city he fought so hard in BK to prevent from getting the team, notwithstanding the different cast of pro-hammer characters at that time.

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Old
10-25-2012, 10:14 AM
  #535
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Ken Jones gives a good speech, he is the third guy up.
I thought so too, while Ken may be old and senile the guy seems to be level headed when it comes to cutting civil services to fund a hockey team.

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10-25-2012, 02:18 PM
  #536
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So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?

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10-25-2012, 02:33 PM
  #537
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Originally Posted by Tinalera View Post
So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?
My own opinion but they Yotes are moving.

I know where I would like them to move but I cannot say where or when will they move, but they are not staying in Glendale.

I think they are a 2nd point on the NHL's agenda with CBA being the first, and NHL won't touch that point before its done with the first one. They might merge it tho.

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10-25-2012, 02:33 PM
  #538
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinalera View Post
So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?
totally unknown, Regardless of what Glendale does approving the lease, that cannot supersede the league as a whole, Tinalera, the franchise cannot be turned over to GJ, FOR League approval, until the CBA is solved, unlike what just happened w/ Memphis being sold and the new owner approved by the NBA BOG...

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10-25-2012, 02:38 PM
  #539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinalera View Post
So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?
25/75

Looks as if they are waiting for Nov 6th. After which it's all about the Tax initiative (Dead or not). Tax initiative stricken, it's all but over.

Tax initiative stays, there's the framework for the deal with JIG to proceed but it depends on new council members. So the initiative can live, but Anti-Coyotes AMF council can kill that part. It all comes down to who wins Frate's seat, as

Pro - Coyotes AMF JIG
Clark - Most likely to win - incumbent
Martinez

Fate/Seats to be determined
Knaack - Under threat of recall
Frate - New Council member TBD

Against - Coyotes AMF JIG
Scruggs - New Mayor - Both candidates oppose
Lieberman - Cactus Dist. - oppose
Alvarez

So as I understand it, Frates seat is key. New council member taking vacant Frate seat in favor of JIG/AMF, Knaack survives recall - Majority stays

New council member taking vacant Frate seat not in favor of JIG/AMF - Majority swings to No AMF

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10-25-2012, 02:39 PM
  #540
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Originally Posted by CHRDANHUTCH View Post
totally unknown, Regardless of what Glendale does approving the lease, that cannot supersede the league as a whole, Tinalera, the franchise cannot be turned over to GJ, FOR League approval, until the CBA is solved, unlike what just happened w/ Memphis being sold and the new owner approved by the NBA BOG...
Thanks to you and powerstruck

I agree, that the CBA is the big issue right now-and I agree that has to be taken of first. Heck depending on how the CBA turns out-and what sort of tone the various owners take afterwards-I agree that it might make the whole process of Glendale approving moot.

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10-25-2012, 02:48 PM
  #541
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Originally Posted by Tinalera View Post
So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?
Is there such a thing as realistic odds on this? Every time this saga seems to be heading in one direction, something happens that veers it in the opposite one.

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10-25-2012, 02:54 PM
  #542
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
25/75

Looks as if they are waiting for Nov 6th. After which it's all about the Tax initiative (Dead or not). Tax initiative stricken, it's all but over.

Tax initiative stays, there's the framework for the deal with JIG to proceed but it depends on new council members. So the initiative can live, but Anti-Coyotes AMF council can kill that part. It all comes down to who wins Frate's seat, as

Pro - Coyotes AMF JIG
Clark - Most likely to win - incumbent
Martinez

Fate/Seats to be determined
Knaack - Under threat of recall
Frate - New Council member TBD

Against - Coyotes AMF JIG
Scruggs - New Mayor - Both candidates oppose
Lieberman - Cactus Dist. - oppose
Alvarez

So as I understand it, Frates seat is key. New council member taking vacant Frate seat in favor of JIG/AMF, Knaack survives recall - Majority stays

New council member taking vacant Frate seat not in favor of JIG/AMF - Majority swings to No AMF
I think you have the bolded wrong, Clark has taken major scrutiny lately with her racism and comments. I wouldn't be surprised to see her uprooted from her seat with Martinez taking over, this would make this seat a likely against the Coyotes.


Last edited by ajmidd12: 10-25-2012 at 03:09 PM.
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10-25-2012, 03:06 PM
  #543
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
25/75

Looks as if they are waiting for Nov 6th. After which it's all about the Tax initiative (Dead or not). Tax initiative stricken, it's all but over.

Tax initiative stays, there's the framework for the deal with JIG to proceed but it depends on new council members. So the initiative can live, but Anti-Coyotes AMF council can kill that part. It all comes down to who wins Frate's seat, as

Pro - Coyotes AMF JIG
Clark - Most likely to win - incumbentMartinez

Fate/Seats to be determined
Knaack - Under threat of recall
Frate - New Council member TBD

Against - Coyotes AMF JIG
Scruggs - New Mayor - Both candidates oppose
Lieberman - Cactus Dist. - oppose
Alvarez

So as I understand it, Frates seat is key. New council member taking vacant Frate seat in favor of JIG/AMF, Knaack survives recall - Majority stays

New council member taking vacant Frate seat not in favor of JIG/AMF - Majority swings to No AMF
I don't know about Clark winning. If I am recollecting the primary election she could of won with 50% of the vote. Sam Chavira got the most votes in the three way primary, Clark 2nd and Kolodzieg was third. This caused Clark to face Chavira in the general election, and I believe Chavira is anti Yote, and Kolodzieg also. If Kolodzieg's support goes to Chavira, Joyce might be outside looking in after it is all said and done.

Primaries are one thing and the general elections another, and after a few months weeks of commercials and political ads things can swing, but I am going to watch this closely to see if Joyce and her undying devotion to the Canis latrans wins or loses.

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10-25-2012, 03:09 PM
  #544
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Then that would make Frate/Knaack moot. Understood. Thank you

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10-25-2012, 03:16 PM
  #545
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As for Tinalera's question about how we feel and percentage of moving/staying.

Initially I look at this and think, there is little chance of them staying, for a 10/90%, but

We've been in situations before were all we thought needed to be done was turn out the lights and let the ice melt, soooo.

I think it is a 40/60 of staying/moving. My eyes say they go, but my beat down emotions feel they might stay.

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10-25-2012, 03:25 PM
  #546
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I would bet on them moving but then again I would have made that bet after each of the past 3 seasons. Especially after the 2010-2011 season, I totally did not see a second season of Glendale picking up losses. Then I figured we would see a deadline this year. So this has defied all logic

That being said the two candidates for Frate's seat are split on the Coyotes. Douglas is the one against it but she was second in the primary. If she wins or Clark loses I think its over for them. The only question is how does the league pull the plug. If there is no CBA deal on the horizon they could relo on the spot. If there is then they may have to play out a lame suck season

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10-25-2012, 03:36 PM
  #547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major4Boarding View Post
25/75

Looks as if they are waiting for Nov 6th. After which it's all about the Tax initiative (Dead or not). Tax initiative stricken, it's all but over.

Tax initiative stays, there's the framework for the deal with JIG to proceed but it depends on new council members. So the initiative can live, but Anti-Coyotes AMF council can kill that part. It all comes down to who wins Frate's seat, as

Pro - Coyotes AMF JIG
Clark - Most likely to win - incumbent
Martinez

Fate/Seats to be determined
Knaack - Under threat of recall
Frate - New Council member TBD

Against - Coyotes AMF JIG
Scruggs - New Mayor - Both candidates oppose
Lieberman - Cactus Dist. - oppose
Alvarez

So as I understand it, Frates seat is key. New council member taking vacant Frate seat in favor of JIG/AMF, Knaack survives recall - Majority stays

New council member taking vacant Frate seat not in favor of JIG/AMF - Majority swings to No AMF
Lierberman is retired and vacating his seat by months end I believe. There was an article wondering if the newly elected member will be able to take the seat earlier as it will lay vacant for a few months.

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10-25-2012, 03:43 PM
  #548
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Originally Posted by cbcwpg View Post
More for the Seattle thread, but since it was mentioned here...

Seattle may all in well be a good hockey market, but there are two little issues that have to be resolved before an NHL team can go to Seattle... they need a place to play and more importantly, they want an NBA team first and won't look at the NHL until that is in place.

And according to recent reports about teams that might have moved to Seattle ( Memphis is close to finalizing a deal to stay in Tennessee and the Milwaukee Bucks reportedly has agreed to a six-year extension to stay in Wisconsin) and comments from Stern ( NBA Commissioner David Stern has said the league has no plans to expand, so moving a current team to Seattle is the only option for Hansen ) it is looking more like a longer shot each day.

http://www.krem.com/news/northwest-news/175713041.html
What in the world is stern suppose to say in the public that yes seattle is getting a team back when Hansen has yet to acquire one.

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10-25-2012, 03:52 PM
  #549
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Lierberman is retired and vacating his seat by months end I believe. There was an article wondering if the newly elected member will be able to take the seat earlier as it will lay vacant for a few months.
Well Council appoints someone to fill out the term. If they try to leave the seat vacant someone from the Cactus district could sue claiming they aren't being represented. It would make sense to appoint whoever wins but the council could be spiteful if they choose to be.

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10-25-2012, 04:27 PM
  #550
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Originally Posted by Tinalera View Post
So, I kind of lost track for a bit the current business. Read the past few pages. Between that and what little I'm hearing from sportsmedia (IE TSN AND Sportsnet lol), the "speculation" seems to be strongly insinuating that the Yotes time really has just about run out.

I'm reading about the old deal being dead in the water, ect ect, and waiting for November Vote, but as it stands right now, based on the most recent information, what are the realistic odds right now of the Yotes staying in Glendale? I mean are we still at a 50/50 stage, or are we closer to a 30/70 (Leaning towards Yotes leaving) right now?
Realistically... who knows.

There has been as of yet, no signed deal, so it hasn't even gotten to the point where the GWI would challenge it to see if it passes the Gift Clause yet. In fact, this is taking so long the GWI might have already forgotten what they were going to be arguing against.

Some posters on various forums claim that the CoG is sitting on some massive emergency reserve fund that they could tap into so they could cut a cheque for Jamison.

Maybe Joyce Clark will go "postal" at the thought of Shane Doan having to move and barricade herself in city hall until the lease is signed.

Maybe Bettman will retire from being the commish and buy the Coyotes from himself just to prove his point.

... Just saying that ANYTHING is possible at this point. Trying to guess what will happen or put odds on it... Better odds in predicting when the CBA will get signed.

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