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Houston Aeros @ OKC Barons, Friday 10/26 6PM MDT

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10-27-2012, 01:25 PM
  #326
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No matter how you slice it an 0.887 save % from Danis doesn't cut it, time to get Roy in there and see what he can do.
Yeah but Danis is the only reason they held on for the 4-3 win in the previous game. The Barons got stormed for the last 10mins in that game like the ice was tilted. Danis was very solid. Amazed really the tying goal never came.

But that said I like Roy as well.

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10-27-2012, 01:26 PM
  #327
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I'm not trashing Nelson on the basis of 6 games. I haven't liked his contribution to the parent teams interests from last season. This is a guy building his own resume only. Its not a guy thats properly developing players for the real team.

Really I could care less about the record of the farm team. What I do care about is development of NHL players at the actual positions and situation that they would find themselve in an NHL game. Nelson doesn't do that. He puts NHL bottom 6 on the OKC PP for whatever reason instead of acclimatizing them to their NHL role as expected.

What one player in the org improved his NHL game on the basis of spending time on the farm? Maybe too early to tell but from Nelson's comments player usage its seems not even to be his focus. There should only be one goal. Helping the parent team.
Does he have 6-8 top 6 NHL forwards down there? That's a bizarre statement IMO. The organization obviously would like to grow guys like Paajarvi's, Hartikainen's, Pitlick's, and Martindale's games and it's not like Yakupov and Hall are currently playing for the club. My only gripe is that Paajarvi isn't getting more PK ice, IMO he was very good in that role early on this season and he was creating offense as well on the PK. Also learning how to win at the pro level does help the parent team, see the Senators and Binghampton.

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10-27-2012, 01:29 PM
  #328
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Yeah but Danis is the only reason they held on for the 4-3 win in the previous game. The Barons got stormed for the last 10mins in that game like the ice was tilted. Danis was very solid. Amazed really the tying goal never came.

But that said I like Roy as well.
Reigning AHL goalie of the year, he was outplayed in the playoffs last year by Scrivens as well, he needs to get it together. This is the AHL's version of the defending Vezina winner IMO we should expect more from him. IMO he has yet to win us a game based mostly on his play like great goalies do. Give Roy a game, if he runs with it then Danis can keep the bench warm while he works on his game.

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10-27-2012, 01:30 PM
  #329
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I'm not trashing Nelson on the basis of 6 games. I haven't liked his contribution to the parent teams interests from last season. This is a guy building his own resume only. Its not a guy thats properly developing players for the real team.

Really I could care less about the record of the farm team. What I do care about is development of NHL players at the actual positions and situation that they would find themselve in an NHL game. Nelson doesn't do that. He puts NHL bottom 6 on the OKC PP for whatever reason instead of acclimatizing them to their NHL role as expected.

What one player in the org improved his NHL game on the basis of spending time on the farm? Maybe too early to tell but from Nelson's comments player usage its seems not even to be his focus. There should only be one goal. Helping the parent team.
Actually, winning is a huge part of the equation. Just ask the players that came up from a successful Binghamton farm team to the parent Sens. The Oilers have had a losing mentality for so long at every level in the organization, that it needs to be reversed. And the first place it usually starts is at the minor league levels. Both Stockton and OKC had nice reversals last year, and the expectations are higher this year. I see that as a good thing. Teach the players, and get them into proper roles of course, but at the same time, just as importantly, get them used to winning, so it becomes a habit, and losing is unacceptable.

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10-27-2012, 01:45 PM
  #330
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Does he have 6-8 top 6 NHL forwards down there? That's a bizarre statement IMO. The organization obviously would like to grow guys like Paajarvi's, Hartikainen's, Pitlick's, and Martindale's games and it's not like Yakupov and Hall are currently playing for the club. My only gripe is that Paajarvi isn't getting more PK ice, IMO he was very good in that role early on this season and he was creating offense as well on the PK. Also learning how to win at the pro level does help the parent team, see the Senators and Binghampton.
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Actually, winning is a huge part of the equation. Just ask the players that came up from a successful Binghamton farm team to the parent Sens. The Oilers have had a losing mentality for so long at every level in the organization, that it needs to be reversed. And the first place it usually starts is at the minor league levels. Both Stockton and OKC had nice reversals last year, and the expectations are higher this year. I see that as a good thing. Teach the players, and get them into proper roles of course, but at the same time, just as importantly, get them used to winning, so it becomes a habit, and losing is unacceptable.
Thanks for the replies. I can see it both ways and see what you guys are stating with this.
I'm old school on this though. I expect the Farm clubs actions to foremost express the needs of the parent teams at all times. Several times last season I observed a player getting sent down and not getting what they required to develop their NHL game.

I guess I don't buy into the notion of the Binghampton/Sens connection but probably because I have such contempt for the Sens and don't think they'll ever amount to anything anyway. I guess if one see's the Sens as a great NHL team you get a different view.

The bolded is an interesting statement. I'm not convinced its accurate. I think winning at the NHL level happens through winning at the NHL level.

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10-27-2012, 01:51 PM
  #331
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Thanks for the replies. I can see it both ways and see what you guys are stating with this.
I'm old school on this though. I expect the Farm clubs actions to foremost express the needs of the parent teams at all times. Several times last season I observed a player getting sent down and not getting what they required to develop their NHL game.

I guess I don't buy into the notion of the Binghampton/Sens connection but probably because I have such contempt for the Sens and don't think they'll ever amount to anything anyway. I guess if one see's the Sens as a great NHL team you get a different view.
IMO we have really 2 legit top 6 NHLers/prospects in the AHL this year, can you guess who they are? Then you have Hartikainen and maybe Paajarvi if he can continue to improve his game, the rest all look like bottom 6 players to me at this point. Our only offensive players are Arcobello (will never have an NHL career with us) and Green (see Arcobello). Now this is where it gets interesting, we have 4 dynamic players in our NHL top 6 so we can afford to have a Hartikainen, Paajarvi, or Pitlick in the top 6 if need be down the road, so in this sense I'm fine with giving them time in offensive roles.

As for Binghampton they had alot of players graduate to the big club last year after a Calder Cup championship and the Send went from one of the worst teams the year before to a much better team last season.

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10-27-2012, 02:25 PM
  #332
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Thanks for the replies. I can see it both ways and see what you guys are stating with this.
I'm old school on this though. I expect the Farm clubs actions to foremost express the needs of the parent teams at all times. Several times last season I observed a player getting sent down and not getting what they required to develop their NHL game.

I guess I don't buy into the notion of the Binghampton/Sens connection but probably because I have such contempt for the Sens and don't think they'll ever amount to anything anyway. I guess if one see's the Sens as a great NHL team you get a different view.

The bolded is an interesting statement. I'm not convinced its accurate. I think winning at the NHL level happens through winning at the NHL level.

If it were only that easy. Can't start a fire without a spark. The house needs a solid foundation in order for it not to crumble after a short time.

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10-27-2012, 03:05 PM
  #333
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If it were only that easy. Can't start a fire without a spark. The house needs a solid foundation in order for it not to crumble after a short time.
Its outside of this conversation but a lot of good teams, even Stanley Cup winning teams, seemed to go from middle of the road to winning team in a hurry and with this often being parlayed into a SC run.

Confidence is confidence and once it ignites at the NHL level the difference is often sudden and pronounced.

If anything the Sens kind of confirm for me that success at the AHL level isn't really related to success at the NHL level. Unless one thinks that the Sens had a successful team building season last year. All they really succeeded in doing is being good enough to avoid good draftpicks.
A lot of pundits had the Sens finishing out of the playoffs this year and I'd agree.

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10-27-2012, 06:31 PM
  #334
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I don't get it. Last season, there were games that Eberle dominated. Games that you knew he would score. I know its an early season, but I can barely even tell when he's on the ice sometimes. Frustrating. BUT I think it has to do with the AHL not being as structured as the NHL.
Bob Mckenzie was saying in the beginning of October that he was told by an NHL player that the AHL is harder than you think for NHL players, because in the NHL, everyone (teammates and opponents) are exactly where they're supposed to be, and in the AHL, nobody is where they're supposed to be, which can lead to inconsistent stats. You might see a stretch of games where they don't get points or very little points (first few games) , then a stretch of a game or a few games where they explode for a lot of points (The game where Schultz, RNH and Eberle combined for 9 points).

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10-27-2012, 07:12 PM
  #335
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Its outside of this conversation but a lot of good teams, even Stanley Cup winning teams, seemed to go from middle of the road to winning team in a hurry and with this often being parlayed into a SC run.

Confidence is confidence and once it ignites at the NHL level the difference is often sudden and pronounced.

If anything the Sens kind of confirm for me that success at the AHL level isn't really related to success at the NHL level. Unless one thinks that the Sens had a successful team building season last year. All they really succeeded in doing is being good enough to avoid good draftpicks.
A lot of pundits had the Sens finishing out of the playoffs this year and I'd agree.
The above is what I would consider typical for many misinformed fans. They see a team stinking the joint out and then miraculously, shoot up the standings, and think it's some magical potion that got them there instantaneously. What they fail to notice is the years of accumulating talent and grooming it to finally produce the successful result. Los Angeles is an excellent example. Years of stinking the joint out followed by mediocrity. But seemingly overnight, many of their homegrown talent came together and others were traded away for important pieces. Ottawa was a horrible team the year before last (they were even in the running for the #1 overall pick until the Oilers managed to outsuck them and all others), but the Sens had an excellent farm system and moved several players up after a Calder Cup winning season. The winning experience those players got translated into immediate help for the existing stars like Alfredson and Phillips.


You are correct in saying that when confidence ignites, it is very powerful and immediate. What you fail to mention is the time it took to finally gain that confidence.

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10-27-2012, 10:38 PM
  #336
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Hall to my understanding has been practicing exclusively at center, draw whatever conclusions you want from that. IMO the organization and Hall want to give it a try, if so that would be a huge boost for either Paajarvi or Harski at ES, but one of them will get the boot off the top PP unit.



Yeah it went from 5.6 or so percent to 20+% in one games time Both teams have poor PK's so far (not sure why Paajarvi isn't getting more PK ice as IMO he was one of if not our best PKer early in the season). And you're welcome

You were wrong about drafting Ryan Murray
Hall will be at LW imo


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10-27-2012, 10:52 PM
  #337
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Its outside of this conversation but a lot of good teams, even Stanley Cup winning teams, seemed to go from middle of the road to winning team in a hurry and with this often being parlayed into a SC run.

Confidence is confidence and once it ignites at the NHL level the difference is often sudden and pronounced.

If anything the Sens kind of confirm for me that success at the AHL level isn't really related to success at the NHL level. Unless one thinks that the Sens had a successful team building season last year. All they really succeeded in doing is being good enough to avoid good draftpicks.
A lot of pundits had the Sens finishing out of the playoffs this year and I'd agree.
Are you serious?

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10-27-2012, 11:39 PM
  #338
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Are you serious?
Completely. What part do you take issue with.

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10-27-2012, 11:43 PM
  #339
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The above is what I would consider typical for many misinformed fans. They see a team stinking the joint out and then miraculously, shoot up the standings, and think it's some magical potion that got them there instantaneously. What they fail to notice is the years of accumulating talent and grooming it to finally produce the successful result. Los Angeles is an excellent example. Years of stinking the joint out followed by mediocrity. But seemingly overnight, many of their homegrown talent came together and others were traded away for important pieces. Ottawa was a horrible team the year before last (they were even in the running for the #1 overall pick until the Oilers managed to outsuck them and all others), but the Sens had an excellent farm system and moved several players up after a Calder Cup winning season. The winning experience those players got translated into immediate help for the existing stars like Alfredson and Phillips.


You are correct in saying that when confidence ignites, it is very powerful and immediate. What you fail to mention is the time it took to finally gain that confidence.
We don't disagree on a lot here. A lot of teams can have a lot of young talent that takes some time to bloom but once a good young team gets hot you know what happens. Often times all it takes is a good late season run, good playoffs and you never recognize the team again. As long as the talents there ignition tends to be fairly instaneous for a talented club when it does take place.

Are there critical additions that take the form of catalysts? Could be said. But theres sometimes a fine line between the team that couldn't get it done and the one that flies.

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10-28-2012, 05:07 AM
  #340
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You were wrong about drafting Ryan Murray
Hall will be at LW imo
No I wasn't, just prior to the draft I heard that the pick was going to be Nail. And I'll disagree and say that they will be trying Hall at C, however I don't have any inside info on that.

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