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Schneider to Edmonton

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Old
10-27-2012, 03:02 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I agree, but he still wouldn't net that kind of return. The whole "we'll trade Schneider for a ransom" is slightly overrated. We'd have a chance at getting a single, quality young player, but he wouldn't net the usual multi-piece return that a star player would generate.
You very well could be right.

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10-27-2012, 03:02 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
That's not the deal I was responding to chief. Try again.
You said Weber wouldn't return the equivalent of a top 6 forward, a blue chipper and a 1st which is in essence the deals you were replying to.

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10-27-2012, 03:03 PM
  #103
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For everyone poopoo'ing Luongo because of his contract lets not forget how the NHL's latest proposal looked - if he came to Edmonton and played well for 5 years then retired (by then hopefully the Oilers have FINALLY developped an elite goaltender from their system) his cap-hit would then fall on Vancouver to eat 5.3/year for the remainder (an additional 5 years).

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10-27-2012, 03:04 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by VinnyC View Post
You said Weber wouldn't return the equivalent of a top 6 forward, a blue chipper and a 1st which is in essence the deals you were replying to.
He said Lundqvist or Quick would return that, but the Philly deal goes above and beyond that.(i.e. not even for Weber)

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10-27-2012, 03:06 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by sully1410 View Post
Did you watch the LA/Van series this year? The guy is incredible.
I watched him get outplayed by Quick. But I watched almost every other opposition goalie the Kings faced get that done to them too.

Schneider played well but he's going to have to put up a Vezina calibre season before he warrants comparisons to Quick and Lundqvist.

Vankiller Whale has a good sense of Schneider's current value.

As an Oilers fan I'd happily give up Hemsky/MPS plus a draft pick for him. He might be one of the few pieces Philadelphia would consider giving up one of Schenn or Couturier for (and then hope like Hell Bryzgalov stays in Russia).

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10-27-2012, 03:08 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by jroc86 View Post
For everyone poopoo'ing Luongo because of his contract lets not forget how the NHL's latest proposal looked - if he came to Edmonton and played well for 5 years then retired (by then hopefully the Oilers have FINALLY developped an elite goaltender from their system) his cap-hit would then fall on Vancouver to eat 5.3/year for the remainder (an additional 5 years).
It's pretty risky to assume that he'll play well until he is 38 (see Khabibulin). It is also pretty risky to assume he is going to retire. I can see him wanting to hang on right up to the bitter end (I know I would).

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10-27-2012, 03:11 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
It's pretty risky to assume that he'll play well until he is 38 (see Khabibulin). It is also pretty risky to assume he is going to retire. I can see him wanting to hang on right up to the bitter end (I know I would).
He has stated though, on an interview for the Fox, that he never intended to play out his contract and it was assumed, from both sides, that the extra years were pure cap circumvention.

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10-27-2012, 03:19 PM
  #108
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Don't kid yourselves, teams have NHL scouts, they know Schneider is the real deal. People are fair to question him based on GP, but look at his numbers at every level. He's never been anything short of elite. A star goalie whenever he's been on the ice. This is a kid with a great brain, outstanding leg speed and reflexes, he also NEVER gives up on a play. Outside of puck handling he's the full package. I've watched goalies a long time. As good as I've ever seen a young goalie.

I have no interest in trading Schneider to Edmonton for any fathomable return. Especially with the 'untouchable' lists I've seen in this thread.

Schneider is the Canucks future in goal. Lets all go back to the Luongo thread now

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Old
10-27-2012, 03:21 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
He has stated though, on an interview for the Fox, that he never intended to play out his contract and it was assumed, from both sides, that the extra years were pure cap circumvention.
Duffman says a lot of things.

Seriously though, it's a lot harder to let go than players assume it will be. I remember when Gretzky used to opine about retiring in his twenties. Look out all of Jordan's and Lemieux's comebacks.

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10-27-2012, 03:41 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by VinnyC View Post
You said Weber wouldn't return the equivalent of a top 6 forward, a blue chipper and a 1st which is in essence the deals you were replying to.
No I didn't. You should try reading a thread more closely before you get yourself fired up.

I wrote that Philadelphia wouldn't give up this specific return for Shea Weber (that the poster I was replying to wanted for Schneider):

Voracek, Couturier/Schenn, 1st

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10-27-2012, 03:42 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worraps View Post
Duffman says a lot of things.

Seriously though, it's a lot harder to let go than players assume it will be. I remember when Gretzky used to opine about retiring in his twenties. Look out all of Jordan's and Lemieux's comebacks.
Worst case scenario if Luongo is desperate to play, trade him to Florida to play out the rest of his career. Everyone wins.

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10-27-2012, 03:45 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Worst case scenario if Luongo is desperate to play, trade him to Florida to play out the rest of his career. Everyone wins.
If only it were that easy to trade Luongo to Florida.

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10-27-2012, 03:51 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
If only it were that easy to trade Luongo to Florida.
There's a huge difference when Luongo's at the top of his game and we want a solid return, and 6-7 years from now when he'll be making peanuts with respect to his cap hit and he'd be best suited as a backup, and you could simply trade him for a 3rd or something.

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10-27-2012, 03:57 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
I watched him get outplayed by Quick.
Schneider did not get outplayed by Quick. Both guys let in 4 goals over the three game span they went head to head, and Schneider actually faced 3 more shots (therefore slightly better SV%). They were as equivalent as any two goalies I've ever seen. Schneider's only mistake in those three games was overcommitting to Doughty on Richardson's goal in game 5. The difference in outcome was due to LA's skaters making less mistakes than Vancouver's in the end, not Quick outperforming Cory.

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10-27-2012, 04:24 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Thing is, if he's made it to, say, 50 games this next season, we'll have clearly made our choice and he wouldn't be available. Catch-22.
I dont want him anyways so not too bad of a catch 22 as far as im concerned

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10-27-2012, 04:27 PM
  #116
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I dont want him anyways so not too bad of a catch 22 as far as im concerned
Then why reply in the first place.

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10-27-2012, 04:37 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worraps View Post
No I didn't. You should try reading a thread more closely before you get yourself fired up.
I'm surely not the one trying to insult other posters' characters and imply that they have a lower level of intelligence and/or reading comprehension level.

---
Quote:
I wrote that Philadelphia wouldn't give up this specific return for Shea Weber (that the poster I was replying to wanted for Schneider):

Voracek, Couturier/Schenn, 1st
At first, I replied what I did because you had bolded "top 6 forward, great prospect, 1st" and therefore I assumed your reply only referenced that but I made a mistake. Big deal.

With that said, Holmgren would personally fly to Nashville to pick Weber up if all he had to give was Voracek, Schenn and a late 1st for a perennial Norris contender locked up for the rest of his playing career.

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10-27-2012, 04:38 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by gooilgo View Post
Disagree. Quick's value went up massively last year. When Schneider achieves what Quick has then he has equal value. Schneider has like 80 NHL starts and although he has done well, to say he is equal to Quick at this stage is simply ridiculous.
About as ridiculous as saying Jonathan Quick has outplayed Cory Schneider over the last 2 years. He absolutely has not. He's only played more games, for obvious reasons.

Swap these goalies and Quick is a career backup in Vancouver with under 40 starts last season and Schneider would have had the starters workload in L.A. with no competition for the role.

Cory Schneider is a career backup in the same way Jordan Staal is a career 3rd line centre.

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10-27-2012, 04:52 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
About as ridiculous as saying Jonathan Quick has outplayed Cory Schneider over the last 2 years. He absolutely has not. He's only played more games, for obvious reasons.

Swap these goalies and Quick is a career backup in Vancouver with under 40 starts last season and Schneider would have had the starters workload in L.A. with no competition for the role.

Cory Schneider is a career backup in the same way Jordan Staal is a career 3rd line centre.
1. I did not say that Quick outplayed Schneider
2. I did not say Schneider is a career backup up
3. Fact is Quick and Schneider will be valued on their body of work and Quick has a bigger body of work right now so although both have done well at this stage Quick>>Schneider, Canucks will not get the same return for Schneider as LA would get for Quick at this stage (that may change in the future)

Stop putting words in my mouth, your reply is an attempt to mislead.

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10-27-2012, 04:56 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by VinnyC View Post
I'm surely not the one trying to insult other posters' characters and imply that they have a lower level of intelligence and/or reading comprehension level.

---


At first, I replied what I did because you had bolded "top 6 forward, great prospect, 1st" and therefore I assumed your reply only referenced that but I made a mistake. Big deal.

With that said, Holmgren would personally fly to Nashville to pick Weber up if all he had to give was Voracek, Schenn and a late 1st for a perennial Norris contender locked up for the rest of his playing career.
There goes the reading comprehension again. The second piece per the poster I was replying to could have also been Couturier.

Would Holmgren have given up Voracek, Couturier, and a late 1st for Weber? No one knows for sure but it is rumored that he was happy to give up Schenn and only balked when Couturier was demanded.

In either case Cory Schneider isn't worth that type of return and I am fairly certain that he never will be.

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10-27-2012, 04:58 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
About as ridiculous as saying Jonathan Quick has outplayed Cory Schneider over the last 2 years. He absolutely has not. He's only played more games, for obvious reasons.

Swap these goalies and Quick is a career backup in Vancouver with under 40 starts last season and Schneider would have had the starters workload in L.A. with no competition for the role.

Cory Schneider is a career backup in the same way Jordan Staal is a career 3rd line centre.
If you want to maintain that Cory Schneider is on par with Jonathan Quick, I encourage you to post a poll on the main board to see what the wider world thinks of your opinion.

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10-27-2012, 05:19 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
If you want to maintain that Cory Schneider is on par with Jonathan Quick, I encourage you to post a poll on the main board to see what the wider world thinks of your opinion.
I would say they are on par. Any goalie who bumps Lu has to be considered an elite goalie.

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10-27-2012, 05:32 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
Schneider has been Jonathan Quick's equal over the last couple years. Difference being Schneider was on a team with a star goaltender and Quick had no competition for his starts.

Nothing we've seen from Schneider should lead anyone to believe he's inferior to Quick. Hence why one of the best goaltenders of our generation lost his job to the kid...
I really wouldn't call Schneider Quick's equal...

Quick has had many more starts and shown consistency through it all. Beyond that, he also isn't as sheltered in his opponents as Schneider is.

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10-27-2012, 05:42 PM
  #124
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Bottom line is that Quick IS an elite tender and Schneider IS not one.

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10-27-2012, 05:46 PM
  #125
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I would say they are on par. Any goalie who bumps Lu has to be considered an elite goalie.
When he proves himself as the starter then I am sure we will start talking about him in those terms. Until then.....

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