HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Number 1 defenceman to Edmonton

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-30-2012, 06:46 PM
  #126
5RingsAndABeer
John MacKinnon Fan
 
5RingsAndABeer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 10,715
vCash: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martini View Post
It honestly doesnt matter what Oiler fans on HF think in the big picture. What matters is actually making the Oilers better. I place all of the blame on a GM who has no clue on how to use the draft, and this is with three number one overall picks at his disposal, to rebuild a team.

This situation reminds me of the Detroit Lions taking three wide recievers three years in a row when there were more important positions that could have used an upgrade. Didnt work then and its questionable if this situation would work now and their excuse was they took the BPA.

Time will tell.
You post completely contradicts itself.

The Detroit Lions took WRs because Matt Millen felt they were a few playmakers away from being a competitive team. If they had taken BPA picks (o-line, d-line) over the flashier WRs, they would have had the foundation for a great team.

The Green Bay Packers took Aaron Rodgers in the first round when they already had future HOFer Brett Favre. The New York Giants took JPP in the first round when they already had Tuck, Umenyiora, etc...

Good teams always take BPA at the top of the draft or trade down. The Oilers actually handled the three 1st overalls perfectly - take the BPA every time or trade out. You can disagree with it if you want, but most professional scouts had the players they picked ranked #1. As an Oiler fan, I have no problem whatsoever with they way they picked. In fact, if they had forgone BPA to pick for need, I would have been very angry.

5RingsAndABeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 06:47 PM
  #127
Oilin Toronto
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoKingsGoo View Post


If I was St. Louis, if you threw in RNH in that trade, I still wouldn't take it for Pietrangelo.
I wouldn't give RNH in a 1 for 1 swap for Pietrangelo.

Oilin Toronto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 06:49 PM
  #128
5RingsAndABeer
John MacKinnon Fan
 
5RingsAndABeer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 10,715
vCash: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
at C: RNH > Seguin
Wing: Yak > Landeskog
D: Klefbom > Murray

+ you also have Hall and Eberle left over.

No thanks...I'll take the Oilers' lineup any day of the week.
I agree with all of that except Klefbom > Murray. I think most scouts would have had Murray > Klefbom in the long run.

Anyways, the people arguing for the second overall picks don't realize how much value they are giving up to fit their idealized notions of what your starting line-up should be. If you took Landeskog over RNH in their draft year, you'd probably have lost your job. Same with anyone over Yakupov.

5RingsAndABeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 06:51 PM
  #129
MW6
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Halland
Country: Sweden
Posts: 758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
at C: RNH > Seguin
Wing: Yak > Landeskog
D: Klefbom > Murray

+ you also have Hall and Eberle left over.

No thanks...I'll take the Oilers' lineup any day of the week.
It would be either or from the drafts obviously..

Draft '10 Hall-Seguin
Draft '11 Nugent-Hopkins-Landeskog
Draft '12 Yakupov-Murray

MW6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 06:53 PM
  #130
Oilin Toronto
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MW6 View Post
It would be either or from the drafts obviously..

Draft '10 Hall-Seguin
Draft '11 Nugent-Hopkins-Landeskog
Draft '12 Yakupov-Murray
In my opinion, they made the right choice very time.

Oilin Toronto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 06:56 PM
  #131
MW6
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Halland
Country: Sweden
Posts: 758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
In my opinion, they made the right choice very time.
Yes, I would've made the same choices, player for player. But, I would rather build my team around the five I first posted as the starting 5 with Paajarvi, Gagner, Klefbom, Marincin etc as the supporting cast.

MW6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:04 PM
  #132
lakai17
Registered User
 
lakai17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,729
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martini View Post
Honestly? Yes and no. I dont see a turn around and only see a franchise stuck with a half empty glass and a front office which seems content that the glass is half full. I think the choices they made are questionable, but thats just my opinion.

And while I do see talent, to get the actual players needed to compete will take some of that talent away, which puts them back at square one. If they stay committed to a rebuild by drafting, sooner or later they will need to trade some of that away to get some vetrans in there who can teach those kids the one thing they have no clue how to do, and thats win at the NHL level.

I see a cluster****, thats all right now.
Edmonton can afford to trade with all these valuable assets definitely. The kids have not filled out quite yet one would agree, people say defence is an issue but some are going under the radar minus J.Schultz but Petry and Klefbom are still young, then look at the size the d possess in the minor leagues today with potential, the odd one will fill out. Olivier Roy and Tyler Bunz are no slouches either. Paajarvi is improving as we speak, Gagner actually has second line wingers today. Ralph Krueger knows hockey. The Oilers are a dynasty in the making today.

lakai17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:05 PM
  #133
eskies4life
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 283
vCash: 535
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blank View Post
Larsson wont move unless the big4 is involved.. So talking about hypothetical values is pointless.


IMO we don't need to use are assets to acquire a number 1 Dman... I think we have potential players that can become number 1 Dmen... We are still growing and developing them so until we are dead certain we would be a playoff team if we had a number 1 Dman we don't need to acquire one.

(My first post was saying that wasn't enough for Piets not the other way around... On top of that I would not trade any of the big 4 for Piets. )


Last edited by eskies4life: 10-30-2012 at 09:14 PM.
eskies4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:24 PM
  #134
StringerBell
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
D: Klefbom > Murray
Too funny.

StringerBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:34 PM
  #135
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,777
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
In my opinion, they made the right choice very time.

Meh, personally I think they made a mistake taking Yakupov. They had such a glaring need on D that they should have been able to trade down a few spots and pick up an extra d prospect and a pick. Then take riley or Murray or Reinhart. Maybe the asking price was just too high, who knows.....

IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:42 PM
  #136
ManyIdeas
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 1,891
vCash: 1152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
Point is neither should be mentioned when talking about stacked D units.
He should be when he is pushed down to the 3rd pairing because Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk are taking the first two pairings. He and Russell make up one hell of a 3rd pairing.

ManyIdeas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 07:53 PM
  #137
5RingsAndABeer
John MacKinnon Fan
 
5RingsAndABeer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 10,715
vCash: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Meh, personally I think they made a mistake taking Yakupov. They had such a glaring need on D that they should have been able to trade down a few spots and pick up an extra d prospect and a pick. Then take riley or Murray or Reinhart. Maybe the asking price was just too high, who knows.....
I agree with this, but I don't think it was a mistake.

Yakupov was the least debatable pick they had. He was ranked first by virtually every scout, scouting agency, and professional observer in the hockey world. Taking Rielly or Murray or Reinhart is a classic terrible management mistake of drafting need over BPA.

So yea, they'd have to trade down like you suggested, but what if no suitable offers presented themselves? They'd need to get considerable value to make up for the difference between Yakupov and whoever they were targeting.

The only way it would have been a mistake is if someone had offered a deal worth more than Yakupov which was rejected. Just drafting Yakupov wasn't a mistake, IMO.

5RingsAndABeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 08:00 PM
  #138
Sergei Berezin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 6,026
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MW6 View Post
I would rather build a team around Seguin/Landeskog/Murray than Hall/Nugent-Hopkins/Yakupov.
And had the Oilers went that direction they would be looking at a starting line-up for the next 10-15 years looking something like this:

Landeskog-Seguin-Eberle
Murray-Schultz
You'd probably say the exact same about the 3 non-Oilers if they were taken by the Oilers. They just seem better to you right now because they didn't play on the 2nd worst team last year. And Murray doesn't have the same potential as Yakupov.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
at C: RNH > Seguin
Wing: Yak > Landeskog
D: Klefbom > Murray

+ you also have Hall and Eberle left over.

No thanks...I'll take the Oilers' lineup any day of the week.
Not even close.

Sergei Berezin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 08:15 PM
  #139
Oilin Toronto
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sergei Berezin View Post
You'd probably say the exact same about the 3 non-Oilers if they were taken by the Oilers. They just seem better to you right now because they didn't play on the 2nd worst team last year. And Murray doesn't have the same potential as Yakupov.




Not even close.
Not even close...are you serious!!!

Klef is only a couple of months older than Murray. He was chosen as the top D of the WJC, and prior to getting hurt this year, he was arguably one of the best D in the SEL.

Murray is a good D, but to say that it's not even close is not right.

Oilin Toronto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 08:15 PM
  #140
Sojourn
Global Moderator
Where's the kaboom?
 
Sojourn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 24,315
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskies4life View Post
If we were going to move one of the big four for Larsson we would of drafted Larsson when we had the chance.

IMO we don't need to use are assets to acquire a number 1 Dman... I think we have potential players that can become number 1 Dmen... We are still growing and developing them so until we are dead certain we would be a playoff team if we had a number 1 Dman we don't need to acquire one.

(My first post was saying that wasn't enough for Piets not the other way around)
The Larsson being talked about is Oliver Ekman-Larsson, and Edmonton never had the opportunity to draft him.

Sojourn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 08:20 PM
  #141
Sojourn
Global Moderator
Where's the kaboom?
 
Sojourn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 24,315
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
Not even close...are you serious!!!

Klef is only a couple of months older than Murray. He was chosen as the top D of the WJC, and prior to getting hurt this year, he was arguably one of the best D in the SEL.

Murray is a good D, but to say that it's not even close is not right.
You said Klefbom > Murray. That isn't close to being true right now, so his statement is accurate.

Sojourn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 08:31 PM
  #142
Oilin Toronto
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
You said Klefbom > Murray. That isn't close to being true right now, so his statement is accurate.
How is his statement accurate!!!

I've just outlined some of Klefbom's accomplishments in the last year.

Can I ask you...who do think was better at the WJC last year between the two?
Who do you think is having a better year so far this year?

Based on your answers, we can determine why I have a valid argument as to who I think is better right now...and it's not even close!!!

Oilin Toronto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 09:02 PM
  #143
SDig14
Registered User
 
SDig14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,568
vCash: 500
I'd be shocked if the Oilers went after a bonafide #1 guy.

IMO, they will look to try to get a solid 2-3 guy, let Klefbom and Schultz earn their way on the team, and potentially look to draft someone this year if they are picking in a range where some D are available and are BPA.

SDig14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 09:07 PM
  #144
Sojourn
Global Moderator
Where's the kaboom?
 
Sojourn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 24,315
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
How is his statement accurate!!!

I've just outlined some of Klefbom's accomplishments in the last year.

Can I ask you...who do think was better at the WJC last year between the two?
Who do you think is having a better year so far this year?

Based on your answers, we can determine why I have a valid argument as to who I think is better right now...and it's not even close!!!
None of that really has anything to do with the discussion. The argument was which players would you rather build around, and Murray is a fairly easy pick right now as a better option than Klefbom. Murray projects to be the better defenseman. Trying to argue that Klefbom, being a year older, might be the better of the two right now(which is debatable) doesn't really apply.

Sojourn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 10:53 PM
  #145
Flyerfan52
Registered User
 
Flyerfan52's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 557
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Oilers are going to develop Schultz and Klefbom into their eventual top pairing. If they can get a veteran d-man to fill that role temporarily for a few years without breaking the bank they may look into that, but I don't see them being too desperate.

They have a potentially great core and they know it. They're not going to blow it up without letting the kids gel together first.
How many years until this "eventual" top pairing?

3 years of picking 1st overall while missing the playoffs for 6 without even coming close must gnaw @ even the most avid Oilers fan.

Flyerfan52 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-30-2012, 11:24 PM
  #146
SDig14
Registered User
 
SDig14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyerfan52 View Post
How many years until this "eventual" top pairing?

3 years of picking 1st overall while missing the playoffs for 6 without even coming close must gnaw @ even the most avid Oilers fan.
Well, if we had our choice we would make the playoffs every year, beer rebuild, and wins cup every 5 years. However, since that's not the case, fans have to accept the rebuild and hope for the best since in the end we have zero input.

Sometimes I think some people on HF see Oiler fans happy about our future and think we somehow love the idea of a long rebuild, when in actuality we are just trying to get through it without losing our minds.

SDig14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-31-2012, 12:09 AM
  #147
lakai17
Registered User
 
lakai17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,729
vCash: 50
Smid and Petry are going under the radar, they are part of the rebuild with Klefbom and Schultz on defence.

lakai17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-31-2012, 12:10 AM
  #148
Crede777
Deputized
 
Crede777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 7,160
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilin Toronto View Post
How is his statement accurate!!!

I've just outlined some of Klefbom's accomplishments in the last year.

Can I ask you...who do think was better at the WJC last year between the two?
Who do you think is having a better year so far this year?

Based on your answers, we can determine why I have a valid argument as to who I think is better right now...and it's not even close!!!
You're not being serious, are you?

I want to see if any other Edmonton fans agree with you.

Crede777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-31-2012, 12:27 AM
  #149
Eskimo44
Registered User
 
Eskimo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,399
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
None of that really has anything to do with the discussion. The argument was which players would you rather build around, and Murray is a fairly easy pick right now as a better option than Klefbom. Murray projects to be the better defenseman. Trying to argue that Klefbom, being a year older, might be the better of the two right now(which is debatable) doesn't really apply.
I understand the confusion and it's an easy assumption to make but Klefbom is actually only 2 months older. He was young in his draft year and Murray was old in his. They are pretty much the same age.

Eskimo44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-31-2012, 01:05 AM
  #150
Frodo Baggins
Registered User
 
Frodo Baggins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 421
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socratic Method Man View Post
I'm sure if you package MPS with Gagner, maybe throw in a 3rd round pick, St Louis would be happy to give you Alex Pietrangelo, or Pheonix would send you Yandle (if he meets your standards of #1D).
That would be an awful trade for STL.......

That's the oilers packaging two players that struggle to live up to their hype and a 3rd round pick for one of the top defensemen in the league...


Yikes.

Frodo Baggins is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:02 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.