HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

2012-2013 CHL/NCAA/Euro Prospects thread 2.0

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-30-2012, 03:59 PM
  #276
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 20,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
You know guys, i like our prospects pool, but i have something that's pissing me off... I don't like that we still don't have that big forward who can play that big power, tough game. We have a lot of small, speedy and skill in our forward prospect, but we don't have that big, tough winger that could great havoc by playing that kind of style. We need to develop that kind of player.

We had a guy like Alexandre Mallet in our backyard in rimouski. That kid is good offensively and he's just a beast in physicality. Just watch his first pro fight with that big hit:



And there's a guy like Stefan Matteau Jr. We could have drafted that kid last summer. I was hoping for it. He's that kind of guy that we need. He has 11 pts in 13 games with 31 PIMS.



I just can't wait anymore until we draft a forward like that. Every team has at least one of those guy in their system.

End rant.
1 : We couldn't have drafted Matteau, unless you're suggesting that the Habs should have taken him 3rd overall. In which case, there's nothing I can do for you.

2 : Alexandre Mallet was possibly the guy with the lowest upside amongst all picks taken in the first three rounds, with the possible exception of the goon picked by the Edmonton Oilers in the beginning of round two. Mallet is two "draft" years older than Gally and should never, ever have been picked in the 2nd round. Tye McGinn was picked in the 4th by the Flyers two years ago, and he's a better player than Mallet.


Last edited by MXD: 10-30-2012 at 04:04 PM.
MXD is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 04:01 PM
  #277
Analyzer
#WeAreBoston
 
Analyzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Renfrew, ON.
Country: Canada
Posts: 40,667
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
No, I think the argument is "don't waste your first rounder trying to find the next Lucic, because they're so rare you're better off looking in the 2nd round or later".

It's too soon to call Beach a bust, but he hasn't shown much scoring ability in the AHL, and I know a lot of Hawk fans are pretty down on him.

Meanwhile, look at where some of the best power forwards currently in the game were drafted: Lucic (50th), Clowe (175th), Clarkson (ND), Backes (62nd)...

We do seem to be deficient in finding players who can mix it up in addition to their skill game, but once you start drafting big guys who can fight and hoping they can figure out their skill game afterwards (rather than the other way around) - then you're picking career AHLers.
That's pretty much what happened with those players. Draft them for their somewhat skill (or rather, in Clarkson's case, sign) and then see if they develop some offensive skill.

Any player who slightly resembles that will be gobbled very early. It is possible to find one of them later on in the rounds, but not very likely.

Iginla is another. 1st rounder. Lucic and Backes are 2nd rounders. Lucic's draft year he scored 9 goals, 19 points in 62 games. Backes was over a ppg in the USHL his draft year, but that's the USHL.

These type of players you can't hope to get lucky. You gotta be aggressive and take them earlier than they're projected

5th rounder, Cody Beach put up 56 points with 229 pims in 58 games in the WHL Kyle may not be that top 6, 20+ goal scorer, but he has the size and aggressiveness to be a useful bottom 6 who can chip in offensively.

This draft has a lot of big guys. We could get one, or two with potential to be like that.

Analyzer is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 04:06 PM
  #278
That
Registered User
 
That's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,961
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
I haven't watched the Blades since early in the year when they were a trainwreck - are they starting to put together some wins these days? Or at least looking semi-competent when they lose even?
Saskatoon had a 3 game win streak at one point, but lost a few close games after that. I've only seen 4 games since they got smoked by Swift Current 10-1 at the beginning of the month, but in all four of them they were very solid. Kept the shots close and their defence was solid. Makarov also looked good.

I'd say they are most definitely playing solid when they lose. That Swift Current game seemed to be a big wake up call.

That is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 04:42 PM
  #279
crakced
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Saskatoon
Posts: 269
vCash: 500
The Blades had a weird 10 day break in their schedule. They finally play again tonight in Regina.

crakced is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 05:20 PM
  #280
Habaddict
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 827
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
That's pretty much what happened with those players. Draft them for their somewhat skill (or rather, in Clarkson's case, sign) and then see if they develop some offensive skill.

Any player who slightly resembles that will be gobbled very early. It is possible to find one of them later on in the rounds, but not very likely.

Iginla is another. 1st rounder. Lucic and Backes are 2nd rounders. Lucic's draft year he scored 9 goals, 19 points in 62 games. Backes was over a ppg in the USHL his draft year, but that's the USHL.

These type of players you can't hope to get lucky. You gotta be aggressive and take them earlier than they're projected

5th rounder, Cody Beach put up 56 points with 229 pims in 58 games in the WHL Kyle may not be that top 6, 20+ goal scorer, but he has the size and aggressiveness to be a useful bottom 6 who can chip in offensively.

This draft has a lot of big guys. We could get one, or two with potential to be like that.
Ingala is a bit of a unusual case. I think he went 11 over all, in a fairly
deep draft. But 2 players with some of the same attributes went higher, and this
probably caused him to drop a little. ( Shane Doan, and unfortunately Terry Ryan)

Habaddict is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 05:26 PM
  #281
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,616
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
That's pretty much what happened with those players. Draft them for their somewhat skill (or rather, in Clarkson's case, sign) and then see if they develop some offensive skill.

Any player who slightly resembles that will be gobbled very early. It is possible to find one of them later on in the rounds, but not very likely.

Iginla is another. 1st rounder. Lucic and Backes are 2nd rounders. Lucic's draft year he scored 9 goals, 19 points in 62 games. Backes was over a ppg in the USHL his draft year, but that's the USHL.

These type of players you can't hope to get lucky. You gotta be aggressive and take them earlier than they're projected

5th rounder, Cody Beach put up 56 points with 229 pims in 58 games in the WHL Kyle may not be that top 6, 20+ goal scorer, but he has the size and aggressiveness to be a useful bottom 6 who can chip in offensively.

This draft has a lot of big guys. We could get one, or two with potential to be like that.
The problem is these guys can't be projected that easily. Lucic and Backes fell exactly because people were skeptical of their offensive upside, while all these "clones" drafted - Beach, Wilson, Biggs, whoever, 90% of them will by grinders at best in the NHL level.

On the other hand there's some fringe prospects who will end up developing later and end up just as good if not better than those names.

Iginla was a legitimate high end prospect, not really the same situation at all. If everyone thought Lucic would be a regular 20+ goalscorer in the NHL he wouldn't have fallen as far as he did. Making that gamble in the 2nd round is one thing. In the first? You should go with skill unless your team is already a contender and want physically developed roleplayers.

Et le But is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 05:38 PM
  #282
S Bah
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 4,520
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MXD View Post
1 : We couldn't have drafted Matteau, unless you're suggesting that the Habs should have taken him 3rd overall. In which case, there's nothing I can do for you.

2 : Alexandre Mallet was possibly the guy with the lowest upside amongst all picks taken in the first three rounds, with the possible exception of the goon picked by the Edmonton Oilers in the beginning of round two. Mallet is two "draft" years older than Gally and should never, ever have been picked in the 2nd round. Tye McGinn was picked in the 4th by the Flyers two years ago, and he's a better player than Mallet.
Boston had Cam Neely scouting throughout the NA juniors the AHL and NHL and hand-picked the players they wanted,then proceeded to draft or sign them.It wasn't by fluke the Bruins had some of the best bigger players by position.When they get Nathan Horton back in their lineup,they will once again be a threat to take it all once again.This time with an experienced Tyler Seguin to take some of the load from Bergeron and the other veterans.The Habs finally have a GM that is aware of what is necessary to win in the new salary cap era of the NHL.Molson has the right man in charge to take the team by the skatelaces to the lofty heights the Habs enjoyed for many decades.It won't happen overnight,just as it took the Bruins 4-5 yrs. to build a winner Bergevin & Co. need time to get the right mix of players.They have already amassed a great front office staff,scouting team and a support team for their prospects.Now it's up to the expertise of Bergevin,Dudley,Timmins to assemble the best talent in each position and with three of the best at evaluating talent the Habs are in great hands.Much the same as building a construction Company,have the best people in all facets;financial,engineering,trades and building materials,only then can they achieve something special.The framing crew has only just started up and the lockout is the first hurdle to clear,before the team can show what they are capable of accomplishing.

S Bah is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 06:16 PM
  #283
Andy
Registered User
 
Andy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,646
vCash: 500
The Bruins really made habs fans insecure as a fan base. Habs need some more sand paper, not because of the Bruins though. You need to be a balanced team. Montreal lacked that aspect. They still lack some skill up front. Hopefully Bozon, Collberg and Galchenyuk will fix the skill issue in the future.

Andy is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 06:22 PM
  #284
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,616
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
The Bruins really made habs fans insecure as a fan base. Habs need some more sand paper, not because of the Bruins though. You need to be a balanced team. Montreal lacked that aspect. They still lack some skill up front. Hopefully Bozon, Collberg and Galchenyuk will fix the skill issue in the future.
It's true, it's so sad to see fans of the the Canadiens think we need to imitate the Bruins to get anywhere.

This team has been too soft recently yes but they took a step forward in the toughness department last year and if anything the Bruins were much more worried about the Habs the year before. Seriously, who cares about how tough the Bruins are? We need to do our own thing, that means more grit and more size if possible but how big or tough the Bruins are is a non-issue.

Et le But is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 06:51 PM
  #285
Habaddict
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 827
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
The Bruins really made habs fans insecure as a fan base. Habs need some more sand paper, not because of the Bruins though. You need to be a balanced team. Montreal lacked that aspect. They still lack some skill up front. Hopefully Bozon, Collberg and Galchenyuk will fix the skill issue in the future.
There are always more than one model for winning. And the one you choose
should reflect your strengths. But, that being said, you can hinder yourself by
lacking any aspect of the game. Toughness, except in 6 forwards, and 4 D's ,
is the cheapest, and most easily solved problem. It shouldn't warrant an off-season
discussion. In an ideal sense we could use a big, mean spirited forward. I'm
hoping that Emelin, and later Tinordi will provide that on D. But I'm not hoping
for an ideal team. Only a contender.

Habaddict is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 06:56 PM
  #286
Rise from the Ashes
@JoelGabbayNHL
 
Rise from the Ashes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Dollard-Des-Ormeaux
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,915
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Rise from the Ashes
Any news on Colin Sullivan? He has played 5 games and has zero's across the board. In comparison, Michael Matheson has 2 assists and 10 pims in 5 games. It appears he is at least playing smartly in his own zone. Last I saw from him, he was exuding confidence after he was drafted to the media.

Rise from the Ashes is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 07:02 PM
  #287
Habaddict
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 827
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rise from the Ashes View Post
Any news on Colin Sullivan? He has played 5 games and has zero's across the board. In comparison, Michael Matheson has 2 assists and 10 pims in 5 games. It appears he is at least playing smartly in his own zone. Last I saw from him, he was exuding confidence after he was drafted to the media.
Ice-time would be the most interesting thing to know. He is playing on a
strong team. If he can compete for ice-time that would be great.

Habaddict is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 08:12 PM
  #288
OneSharpMarble
Registered User
 
OneSharpMarble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,200
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
The Bruins really made habs fans insecure as a fan base. Habs need some more sand paper, not because of the Bruins though. You need to be a balanced team. Montreal lacked that aspect. They still lack some skill up front. Hopefully Bozon, Collberg and Galchenyuk will fix the skill issue in the future.
Dream on, the league knocking the small habs around had more to do with the culture change than the bruins who we embarrassed on a regular basis.

Too many small AND ineffective players who were not willing to stand up for themselves and the team.

OneSharpMarble is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 08:18 PM
  #289
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,616
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
Dream on, the league knocking the small habs around had more to do with the culture change than the bruins who we embarrassed on a regular basis.

Too many small AND ineffective players who were not willing to stand up for themselves and the team.
Just as bad was that a lot of those small, soft players were also highly one dimensional - guys like Cammalleri and Gomez who are good at basically only one thing and were given superstar contracts by Gainey.


A lot of even the small guys we are drafting right now aren't necessarily like that - guys like Gallagher, Collberg and Kristo won't be wrecking balls in the NHL but they are all willing to go into the corners and crash the net even if they have the skills to avoid that.

Et le But is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 08:49 PM
  #290
Hannibal
Brandon Prust FTW
 
Hannibal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,533
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
It's true, it's so sad to see fans of the the Canadiens think we need to imitate the Bruins to get anywhere.

This team has been too soft recently yes but they took a step forward in the toughness department last year and if anything the Bruins were much more worried about the Habs the year before. Seriously, who cares about how tough the Bruins are? We need to do our own thing, that means more grit and more size if possible but how big or tough the Bruins are is a non-issue.
When the Habs were a dynasty, they had EVERYTHING in their lineup. When the Big Bad Bruins or the Broadstreet Bully came face-to-face with our Habs, our team didn't back down, they were going toe-to-toe with them in the toughness department.

We're not saying to imitate the Bruins. Just to be back at what the Habs were when they were succesful. And i think, with Bergevin and co, we will see that. But it has to start with the Draft. Not always draft small, speedy forward. But in the later rounds, we could draft a big mean powerforward (boom or bust) and try to develop him.

Hannibal is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 09:18 PM
  #291
Marc the Habs Fan
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Longueuil
Country: Canada
Posts: 50,009
vCash: 597
To get this thread on topic, Thrower has an assist so far tonight.

Dietz got an assist too. Blades win 3-2.


Last edited by Marc the Habs Fan: 10-30-2012 at 11:14 PM.
Marc the Habs Fan is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 09:26 PM
  #292
dackelljuneaubulis02
Registered User
 
dackelljuneaubulis02's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,169
vCash: 500
I'm predicting Kamloops' first regulation loss and Bozon's held pointless tonight.

dackelljuneaubulis02 is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 09:27 PM
  #293
Whitesnake
Habs of steel
 
Whitesnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Lorraine, QC
Country: Canada
Posts: 47,096
vCash: 500
Never was about imitating Boston, was always about having the greatest mix. Happens that Boston does have a mix. For a Khoklachev, there's a Camara. We do have a harder time finding them. Just how we had a hard time finding good offensive centermen. Like I keep saying, even the greats always have their weaknesses. Let's hope we work on them. Yet, 2013 will be so special, I sincerely hope that BPA comes into mind each and everytime in the first 2 rounds. If we do, we will be in better shape.

Whitesnake is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 09:52 PM
  #294
Gaston Gingras
Registered User
 
Gaston Gingras's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 242
vCash: 500
Good news Hudon will play tomorrow!!

Gaston Gingras is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 11:10 PM
  #295
QuebecPride
@Etienne_Pouliot
 
QuebecPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Sherbrooke , Qc
Country: Martinique
Posts: 2,446
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
We had a guy like Alexandre Mallet in our backyard in rimouski. That kid is good offensively and he's just a beast in physicality. Just watch his first pro fight with that big hit

I just can't wait anymore until we draft a forward like that. Every team has at least one of those guy in their system.

End rant.
Agreed on both cases, love the way these two play. But I'm fine with the picks we've made.

Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post

And you don't draft based on fighting ability. The biggest facepalm moment of the draft was Edmonton taking Moroz at 32. It's a real herp-a-derp way to go about things.
Man oh man was that ever funny, couldn't stop laughing.


Last edited by QuebecPride: 10-30-2012 at 11:22 PM.
QuebecPride is offline  
Old
10-30-2012, 11:17 PM
  #296
Marc the Habs Fan
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Longueuil
Country: Canada
Posts: 50,009
vCash: 597
Quote:
Originally Posted by makbowles View Post
I'm predicting Kamloops' first regulation loss and Bozon's held pointless tonight.
Primary assist on a game tying goal.

Marc the Habs Fan is offline  
Old
10-31-2012, 12:01 AM
  #297
NewHabsEra*
 
NewHabsEra*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,695
vCash: 500
Blades are back on the right track, they won 3-2 tonight and both Thrower and Dietz get an assist..

NewHabsEra* is offline  
Old
10-31-2012, 01:09 AM
  #298
habsprospects
Irresponsible User
 
habsprospects's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Sherbrooke, Québec
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,636
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaston Gingras View Post
Good news Hudon will play tomorrow!!
Not really.

__________________

Habs Prospects website
habsprospects is offline  
Old
10-31-2012, 08:09 AM
  #299
katatoniak
Registered User
 
katatoniak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Jonquiere, Qc
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,217
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by habsprospects View Post
Not really.
How this it not a good news ?

katatoniak is offline  
Old
10-31-2012, 08:36 AM
  #300
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,160
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by katatoniak View Post
How this it not a good news ?
It is possible that he is rushing back too soon......it happens all the time with concussions.

Estimated_Prophet is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:01 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.