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The All Purpose Lu Thread (MOD WARNING IN OP)

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Old
10-30-2012, 09:19 PM
  #151
Vankiller Whale
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They're losing MASSIVE amounts of money.
We might be able to foot part of the bill. Not to mention it increases their shot at playoff revenue.

Besides, a team's main goal is to win. Minnesota handed mega deals to Suter and Parise; Dallas payed through the nose for Jagr and Whitney.

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10-30-2012, 10:20 PM
  #152
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The team could finish 30th and he could get an extension.

I highly doubt that.


"Could" being the operative word here. He could get an extension tomorrow. He could get fired at the end of the year. Or he could sprout wings and fly... I guess we'll see which one happens.

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10-30-2012, 10:46 PM
  #153
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Burke's job is fine. No chance he'll be fired.
I hope you're wrong, that's sad for the Leafs if it's true.

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10-30-2012, 10:48 PM
  #154
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I hope you're wrong, that's sad for the Leafs if it's true.
Yeah because there's so many candidates that can do a better job...

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10-30-2012, 10:53 PM
  #155
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Yeah because there's so many candidates that can do a better job...
Better than 30th? The question should be, how many candidates would be worse?

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10-30-2012, 11:19 PM
  #156
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Yeah because there's so many candidates that can do a better job...
If Nonis was promoted to GM you guys would be better off IMO.

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Old
10-30-2012, 11:21 PM
  #157
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Yeah because there's so many candidates that can do a better job...
you guys have one, his name is nonis.

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10-31-2012, 10:52 AM
  #158
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you guys have one, his name is nonis.
Don't kid yourself, Nonis is a lot worse. Burke just has never really been able to bring in a top notch goaltender anywhere he's been that hasn't already had one, or a number 1 center.

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10-31-2012, 11:01 AM
  #159
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Don't kid yourself, Nonis is a lot worse. Burke just has never really been able to bring in a top notch goaltender anywhere he's been that hasn't already had one, or a number 1 center.
Not sure but I think Burke brought Hiller in, Giggy was there before Burke arrived I believe.

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10-31-2012, 01:35 PM
  #160
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Yet that small market team phoned to inquire about Lu. Why? The same Lu they knew was going to be 33 and had a lengthy contract?


The supposition that's going on here is great and all, but we have evidence to the contrary, so why do people still choose to follow their own narrative regardless?
So, assuming you're a GM of an NHL team with budget concerns (I know, big reach) and you heard a top player was available, what would you do?

From the sounds of it, you would not even make a call about said player because you think that you couldn't get the approval.

What I think most NHL GMs would do is call to inquire about the said player. I don't care if you're NYR or NAS or LA, you do your due diligence and make that call regardless if you're interested or not.

And, for example, if you're Columbus, maybe you're told that you can take him for a 7th round pick and some sort of cap dump. Then maybe, you'll make the move. Yes, the chances are slim to none of that happening, but you are not doing your job if you don't. Who knows, you could be talking to another team about something else and get talking about that player - the team you're talking to doesn't have what other team wants, so you work it out as a 3-team deal.

I really don't think you can draw any conclusions from a team calling regarding a player that is known to be on the market.

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10-31-2012, 01:49 PM
  #161
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So, assuming you're a GM of an NHL team with budget concerns (I know, big reach) and you heard a top player was available, what would you do?
If the player had a nice cap hit I'd go after them hard

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10-31-2012, 01:55 PM
  #162
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Not sure but I think Burke brought Hiller in, Giggy was there before Burke arrived I believe.
He did.

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10-31-2012, 01:59 PM
  #163
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Not sure but I think Burke brought Hiller in, Giggy was there before Burke arrived I believe.
Oh so 1 in how many different goalies that he has traded for in his career? Take a shot in the dark & it will eventually give you something, it just takes 90 tries....

But good for him for FINALLY finding 1 goalie! He had to basically give one away in Bryz to get Hiller in the League though. Just awful goalie management.

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10-31-2012, 02:03 PM
  #164
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Don't kid yourself, Nonis is a lot worse. Burke just has never really been able to bring in a top notch goaltender anywhere he's been that hasn't already had one, or a number 1 center.
Yeah, Nonis did a terrible job in Vancouver, I don't think he'd be an upgrade.

There aren't a lot of candidates out there, but new people get hired to be a GM all the time. I don't think Burke should have stability just because there's no clear replacement in the market. It puzzles me that some TML fans are standing by him the way they are.

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Old
10-31-2012, 02:06 PM
  #165
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It puzzles me that some TML fans are standing by him the way they are.
I guess they're grading on a curve and past GM's have set the bar very, very low.

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Old
10-31-2012, 02:49 PM
  #166
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See if Mats Sundin wants the job. He's a few business courses away from being a ready, but he knows the city and knows hockey.

Seriously though, Edmonton fans have declined Luongo, guess we'd better accept Bozak as our return...

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10-31-2012, 03:39 PM
  #167
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It does not matter a single iota what the fan bases value Roberto Luongo's trade price point at. It is not "real" it is fantasy trading with posters who have very skewed visions of reality.

There are only 30 real GM's who have a far better grip on the situation. They for the most part are trying to put a winning and entertaining product on the ice. They have to account for the on ice product as well as the intangibles such as marketing and sometimes stroking their owners egos.

Tallon has apparently met face to face with Luongo and there is enough smoke in Toronto to suggest there is a fire there. That sounds like a market place to me. Who knows what the other 27 opinions that actually matter are thinking...

If any one of them were to really try to ice a pathetic line up in order to compete in 5 or more years then they ought to be fired. Sometimes the window for a team waiting for one never comes.

Winning now is the single most important step a team can do to ensure long term success. It is infectious and leads to future prosperity.

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10-31-2012, 04:39 PM
  #168
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I don't understand. They wouldn't pay any salary if he retires. If anything that makes him more appealing to cap floor teams.
I honestly don't think it does.

The problem with this theory is when you are wary of a contract's cost the potential of Luongo continuing to play past the "planned" date has to be taken into consideration. Additionally (and correct me if I'm wrong) I believe Luongo's contract is more expensive in real dollars at the beginning which means more of the total money is paid out even if he retires as planned.

When you think about it from that perspective it may actually make it less appealing for a "cap floor" team as you put it.

To me this contract is more appealing to a bigger team such as the Leafs because its built for cap flexibility. Big teams, however, should still be wary of the length of his contract at least until the rules for such contracts as well as the amount of total cap space is decided in the new CBA. Even if the receiving team is absolved of any contract responsibility after retirement, the potential for Luongo to play longer than scheduled must be considered and the fact that it will be harder to move him near the end of his contract must also be considered.

I have no idea what Luongo will eventually be moved for but I will be surprised if it is what someone of his playing ability would normally warrant simply because of the contract. My two cents.

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10-31-2012, 04:53 PM
  #169
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I honestly don't think it does.

The problem with this theory is when you are wary of a contract's cost the potential of Luongo continuing to play past the "planned" date has to be taken into consideration. Additionally (and correct me if I'm wrong) I believe Luongo's contract is more expensive in real dollars at the beginning which means more of the total money is paid out even if he retires as planned.

When you think about it from that perspective it may actually make it less appealing for a "cap floor" team as you put it.

To me this contract is more appealing to a bigger team such as the Leafs because its built for cap flexibility. Big teams, however, should still be wary of the length of his contract at least until the rules for such contracts as well as the amount of total cap space is decided in the new CBA. Even if the receiving team is absolved of any contract responsibility after retirement, the potential for Luongo to play longer than scheduled must be considered and the fact that it will be harder to move him near the end of his contract must also be considered.

I have no idea what Luongo will eventually be moved for but I will be surprised if it is what someone of his playing ability would normally warrant simply because of the contract. My two cents.
What do you mean by planned date, and longer than scheduled?

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Old
10-31-2012, 04:59 PM
  #170
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What do you mean by planned date, and longer than scheduled?
Well, you've all been telling us that he isn't going to play the whole contract.

As for his value with that CBA change, I would put it higher, but only as Dan said, to bigger market teams.

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10-31-2012, 05:08 PM
  #171
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Well, you've all been telling us that he isn't going to play the whole contract.

As for his value with that CBA change, I would put it higher, but only as Dan said, to bigger market teams.
What about the clause in the proposed CBA that lets the trading team keep up to $3mil per year of the contract? You don't think Luongo would be more desirable to a small market team with a $5.3mil dollar caphit, at $3.7mil in real dollars, with the caphit guaranteed to come off their books when he retires?

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10-31-2012, 05:43 PM
  #172
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What about the clause in the proposed CBA that lets the trading team keep up to $3mil per year of the contract? You don't think Luongo would be more desirable to a small market team with a $5.3mil dollar caphit, at $3.7mil in real dollars, with the caphit guaranteed to come off their books when he retires?
I must have missed that one. I thought it was two options, of up to 3 million each in extra cap hit.

If what you say is the case, then I could see a lot more teams being willing to do that. But would Vancouver?

I do find it hard to believe that this wouldn't be tied to a cap hit in any way.

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10-31-2012, 06:51 PM
  #173
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Of course not, but do you think they have the same direction today? No.


How has their direction changed? They wanted to make the playoffs with Nash and Carter, and now they still want to make the playoffs with Dubinsky, Anismov, Erixon and Johnson.



A rebuilding team traditionally sells off NHL assets to try and draft high. Is this happening in CLB? No. LA's pick isn't likely to be high. Same goes for NYR's pick. These picks are just currency. The real assets coming back are NHLers that can contribute now.



They brought in Dubinsky, Foligno, Johnson and Anisimov to try and compete. They brought Carter in for the same reason. Only difference is, now CLB is trying to win with 2way depth instead of 2 high profile scorers on the top line. It doesn't mean they aren't trying win now at all, which is what you would expect from a clearly rebuilding club.

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10-31-2012, 08:53 PM
  #174
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Don't kid yourself, Nonis is a lot worse. Burke just has never really been able to bring in a top notch goaltender anywhere he's been that hasn't already had one, or a number 1 center.
Nonis first moves were what? draft Schneider and acquire Luongo. While Burke was signing goalies like Cloutier and Martin Brochu. The guy has no clue when it comes to goalies.

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10-31-2012, 09:34 PM
  #175
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How has their direction changed? They wanted to make the playoffs with Nash and Carter, and now they still want to make the playoffs with Dubinsky, Anismov, Erixon and Johnson.



A rebuilding team traditionally sells off NHL assets to try and draft high. Is this happening in CLB? No. LA's pick isn't likely to be high. Same goes for NYR's pick. These picks are just currency. The real assets coming back are NHLers that can contribute now.



They brought in Dubinsky, Foligno, Johnson and Anisimov to try and compete. They brought Carter in for the same reason. Only difference is, now CLB is trying to win with 2way depth instead of 2 high profile scorers on the top line. It doesn't mean they aren't trying win now at all, which is what you would expect from a clearly rebuilding club.
They had no idea L.A's pick would be that low.

And you name Dubinsky, Anismov, Erixon and Johnson like it's an impressive list. It's not.

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