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Lockout discussion thread 2.0

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:15 PM
  #76
CN_paladin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
His tweets today have been just all-around.

The PA doesn't seem to realize what type of damage they are doing with their players tweeting away like this.
With idiots like Prust thinking Fehr is a genius and that the MLB is the most successful league in NA, the negotiations won't go anywhere.

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11-01-2012, 04:16 PM
  #77
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He mad.

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:18 PM
  #78
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If you want to know why baseball is making money the first place I would look is what players make during their RFA years in baseball and compare that to what hockey players make during their RFA years.

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:29 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
Comparing NHL to MLB is the problem. Twice as many games to make $ and stadiums sometimes three times bigger than NHL arenas.

The NBA is the most comparable sport to the NHL in terms of economics.
i'm not looking to compare; only pointing out that MLB didn't get 'killed' by fehr and obviously is in good shape right now; comparatively to the NHL, which has to jeopardize an NHL season to fix it's numbers. Prust was just responding to Paladin who said Fehr is going to kill the NHL like he killed the MLB, which is obviously not true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
If you want to know why baseball is making money the first place I would look is what players make during their RFA years in baseball and compare that to what hockey players make during their RFA years.
Or you can just look at their market share when it comes to entertainment sports. Something the NHL doesn't have, and needs. The NHL has been basically running the books in the Red just to potentially grab some of that market share.

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:35 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
How the top 4 teams are guaranteed to make the playoffs every year because they are rich?
As a Habs fan one would think you would welcome this type of scenario in the NHL... No?

We are a Top-3 team in the NHL in terms of money. Let the good times roll!


What is retarded is the fact they are playing chicken with a group of elite's, for instance the Molson's in themselves are worth more in dollars than all of the players yearly salaries combined. That's just Molson, there is still 29 other owners out there. What is retarded is the hardline stance that the PA has taken, when clearly the NHL sent out the olive branch with they're latest offer. It wasn't perfect, but clearly it was a step in the right direction and more concessions should have been put in place in the PA's counter-offer.

At this rate, any difference in salaries the PA is able to salvage over the course of a 5-6 year CBA will have already been lost by the players during the lockout. Talk about your all-time bone headed moves.. right?

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:40 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JGRB View Post
As a Habs fan one would think you would welcome this type of scenario in the NHL... No?

We are a Top-3 team in the NHL in terms of money. Let the good times roll!


What is retarded is the fact they are playing chicken with a group of elite's, for instance the Molson's in themselves are worth more in dollars than all of the players yearly salaries combined. That's just Molson, there is still 29 other owners out there. What is retarded is the hardline stance that the PA has taken, when clearly the NHL sent out the olive branch with they're latest offer. It wasn't perfect, but clearly it was a step in the right direction and more concessions should have been put in place in the PA's counter-offer.

At this rate, any difference in salaries the PA is able to salvage over the course of a 5-6 year CBA will have already been lost by the players during the lockout. Talk about your all-time bone headed moves.. right?
You could argue it the other way, the owners have lost more money that they stand to gain from getting their current proposal agreed too. At this point both sides are losing money because of ideology rather than pragmitism.

The hilarious thing is that the hardliners seem to be the small market teams, whose real enemy is either the salary cap floor or lack of revenue sharing, not the player's percentage of the cap. They can't realistically bring the players' salary down low enough to make themselves profitable. What they should be fighting for is either more money given to them and less money given to rich teams or the right to spend less money.

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Old
11-01-2012, 04:52 PM
  #82
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Anybody else thought that this tidbit was interesting?

Quote:
Cole en a contre les positions de la LNH, mais demeure empathique à la situation de son propre patron.

«Je sais que nous avons un propriétaire qui préférerait nous voir jouer plutôt que de nous mettre en lock-out», a-t-il dit à propos de Geoff Molson.
Quick translation/interpretation : Cole thinks Molson didn't push for the lockout and doesn't push for the continuation of the lockout.


Last edited by MXD: 11-01-2012 at 04:56 PM. Reason: (Added obvious past tense)
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Old
11-01-2012, 05:16 PM
  #83
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Unprobable but if ever he retires, let say Hi to another top 3 pick..

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:16 PM
  #84
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Sounds like a frustrated player, no more no less.

As I said right from the start, both parties are imbeciles.

This lockout was not a necessity. A few tweaks, perhaps, but that's it.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:26 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drydenwasthebest View Post
While I agree with this post, you missed part of the point of what Hickey proposed: the cap would be $60 million for the next 10 years. He wants it to be the same no matter what happens to league revenue or if there is contraction or expansion. His solution included a simple static amount on the cap. So, contraction would NOT increase the cap in his system. That is what you missed.
Yes that's true, but my point was more in reference to the general issue of contraction.

Hickey's system is even less likely to happen than contraction.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:26 PM
  #86
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Please consider the title . How many people think this very thought every day.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:33 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
So I tweeted Prust that a certain cancer killed the MLB and our Expos.

Brandon Prust ‏@BrandonPrust8
@JasonHM and now baseball is the best running league in North America.. Everybody is winning there. Thanks to Fehr n cooperating owners

**** this idiot!
The idiots are the people who blame Donald Fehr for Montreal losing the Expos.

After the 1994 strike, the Montreal Expos had one of the richest ownership groups in the league, including the Royal Bank of Canada and Bell Canada Enterprises. They had 25,000 fans/game in the late part of the 1994 season, a good base to build on. And then... they didn't even offer contracts to Larry Walker, Marquis Grissom, John Wetteland, and Ken Hill. They walked for nothing. In subsequent seasons, Moises Alou and Pedro Martinez would walk as well, and later on Javier Vasquez and Vladimir Guerrero. All they had to do was swallow losses for one summer and they would have made tons of money, but they didn't want to.

The Expos had a bad ownership group, and Montreal lost out, that's all there is. There's 29 other teams that survived Donald Fehr.


Last edited by DAChampion: 11-01-2012 at 05:41 PM.
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Old
11-01-2012, 05:39 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Please consider the title . How many people think this very thought every day.
No doubt many. Almost none of them make 4.5 million a year, but
have only 2-3 more years of that kind of earning power left. It's very
unlikely that anything he does after hockey will be similar.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:40 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uiCk View Post
dunno, MLB is far from dead, and MLB is a successful league.
It took years for the MLB to come back to glory. Along the way a franchise was lost and many older players ended up on the outside looking in after those Fehr induced wasted days.

Donald Fehr does not care about the Coles in the NHL. He does not care if this ends their careers because of age. No, he is cementing his legacy as the hardass who brought down the MLB and the NHL.

Looks good on his resume when he enters the gates of hell one day.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:44 PM
  #90
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Laughed out loud at this one.

Erik Coles ultimatum to the NHL.

Hilarious. Bettman probably said Erik who ?


These players are delusional ignorant morons. Maybe because few go past high school they are so dumb.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:46 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Sounds like a frustrated player, no more no less.

As I said right from the start, both parties are imbeciles.

This lockout was not a necessity. A few tweaks, perhaps, but that's it.
The change from 43 % of revenue, to 50% , is around 16% of money coming
in for the owners. And for many teams, it would more than double profits. I'm
sure they don't see this as a tweak.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:48 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRealist View Post
These players are delusional ignorant morons. Maybe because few go past high school they are so dumb.
Part of the reason Erik Cole came to Montreal is that he is completing a degree at nearby Clarkson College, or maybe has completed at this point. You'll get a better education there than at Concordia or UQAM.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cole is smarter than most of this forum.

Erik Cole is a hardworking, productive player who has put in the time to excel. He came off a career year at age 33 and probably just wanted to get back on the ice. He is probably tired of having a lockout every five years. You would be too.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:52 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
relax guys, there is no way he will walk away from 8 million(assuming the whole season is lost)
Patrick roy did in Colorado so anything is possible

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:52 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
It took years for the MLB to come back to glory. Along the way a franchise was lost and many older players ended up on the outside looking in after those Fehr induced wasted days.
In most of the business world, it is considered a success to make record profits 4 years after a restructuring, and to continue making record profits for 14 years afterwards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Looks good on his resume when he enters the gates of hell one day.
Yes, the magical man with the white beard in the sky is going to point his finger at Fehr and say "I don't want you with me, you transferred money from billionaires to millionaires".

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:54 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Part of the reason Erik Cole came to Montreal is that he is completing a degree at nearby Clarkson College, or maybe has completed at this point. You'll get a better education there than at Concordia or UQAM.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cole is smarter than most of this forum.

Erik Cole is a hardworking, productive player who has put in the time to excel. He came off a career year at age 33 and probably just wanted to get back on the ice. He is probably tired of having a lockout every five years. You would be too.
Clarkson College is in Nebraska not New York.

You seem to assume a lot of things. Unless he runs some big business franchise on the side or is part of Mensa, it's like Couture throwing random numbers like 25% out there.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:57 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Part of the reason Erik Cole came to Montreal is that he is completing a degree at nearby Clarkson College, or maybe has completed at this point. You'll get a better education there than at Concordia or UQAM.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cole is smarter than most of this forum.

Erik Cole is a hardworking, productive player who has put in the time to excel. He came off a career year at age 33 and probably just wanted to get back on the ice. He is probably tired of having a lockout every five years. You would be too.
Good point. But I think many smart, and well educated people, can
be blinded when self interest is involved.
And also this is a fanbase that routinely referred to Hal Gill as dumb.
Gill had already graduated from an ivy league school.

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:57 PM
  #97
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I think it's just frustration, he seems like a regular Joe & we all get like that.

Hey if he does walk from 8 Million, so be it! That's a lot of cap space... I hope not though!

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Old
11-01-2012, 05:59 PM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
Clarkson College is in Nebraska not New York.

You seem to assume a lot of things. Unless he runs some big business franchise on the side or is part of Mensa, it's like Couture throwing random numbers like 25% out there.
My mistake. I meant Clarkson University, not Clarkson College.

It is located in upstate New York:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarkson_University

I don't know who Couture is.

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Old
11-01-2012, 06:01 PM
  #99
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tbh I haven't developped an attachement to Cole as much as other fans. I did like watching him last season and maybe Pacioretty wouldn't be the same player if it wasn't for Cole, but it wouldn't bother "that" much if he left.

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Old
11-01-2012, 06:04 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaddict View Post
Good point. But I think many smart, and well educated people, can
be blinded when self interest is involved.
And also this is a fanbase that routinely referred to Hal Gill as dumb.
Gill had already graduated from an ivy league school.
There's a stereotype that jocks are stupid, it's surprising that it is ingrained in people's minds on a... hockey forum.

I'm sure some of the 700 NHL players are dim, as there are 700 of them. But honestly I'd expect the average IQ to be at 105-110.

Among other things, it's very expensive to become a hockey player, you need rich parents if you're too be trained to become a hockey player as a boy, which means most of the players from Canada and the USA were well-nourished as children and were raised in stimulating, upper-middle class environments.

Some people like to mock the tweets of hockey players, but what hockey players write in tweets and in articles is actually at a higher level than what most sports journalists are writing, or even what a lot of this forum is writing.

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